Meanwhile back in Israel

dignin

tempo_n_groove said:

Forgot to mention that I've been in the war zones...

You got me man. You're an expert in concrete, explosives and war zones. Probably an expert welder too (you left out TIG by the way) I'm a true believer, one bomb leveled that whole block. The bombing of Gaza in the summer of 2014 was a single bomb. Why is everyone getting so worked up over one bomb? Maybe Israel dropped it by accident.....because it was only one bomb after all. Why don't they just apologize for that one bomb and everyone can move on.

gimmesometruth27

please let's not forget that most quality building materials, concrete, metal bars/rebar, and cement and gravel were banned and not allowed in to gaza under the israeli embargo that was partially lifted in 2012 after israel bombed the shit out of gaza again...

this is one reason most buildings in gaza are less than 8 or 10 stories.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4326887,00.html

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/22/gaza-uninhabitable-blockade-united-nations

gimmesometruth27

dignin said:

tempo_n_groove said:

dignin said:

tempo_n_groove said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

this is an image taken from the northern gaza strip on 8/12/14.

One bomb could have done this.
No rebar in the block(cinder block). None of the block is grout filled. Common in non-seismic areas and developing areas.

I've seen buildings reduced to just brick and dust with no reinforcing.

One bomb eh? Are you also a demolition expert? Can I see those credentials too?

One bomb......oy vey.

Now I'm not trying to take away from the devastation.

Ever hear the term "brick and mortar"? Theres's not a mention of "rebar"?!? Engineering has a reason for that.

As for my "demolition" credentials… Doing steel fabrication and modular concrete for 15 years, having ACI credentials and PCI credentials should have some merit on this, but you clearly know more than I do...

I have over 18 years experience in construction. Mostly in steel....I'm a welder. I have a binder full of tickets.....so what? I have no experience in bombs or a war zone.

mickeyrat

sucks to have to wonder what his ulterior motive is......
He has barred jewish politicians from the commpound.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/10/al-aqsa-israel-netanyahu-151008002159660.html

dignin

gimmesometruth27 said:

dignin said:

tempo_n_groove said:

dignin said:

tempo_n_groove said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

this is an image taken from the northern gaza strip on 8/12/14.

One bomb could have done this.
No rebar in the block(cinder block). None of the block is grout filled. Common in non-seismic areas and developing areas.

I've seen buildings reduced to just brick and dust with no reinforcing.

One bomb eh? Are you also a demolition expert? Can I see those credentials too?

One bomb......oy vey.

Now I'm not trying to take away from the devastation.

Ever hear the term "brick and mortar"? Theres's not a mention of "rebar"?!? Engineering has a reason for that.

As for my "demolition" credentials… Doing steel fabrication and modular concrete for 15 years, having ACI credentials and PCI credentials should have some merit on this, but you clearly know more than I do...

I have over 18 years experience in construction. Mostly in steel....I'm a welder. I have a binder full of tickets.....so what? I have no experience in bombs or a war zone.

Haha.....I was wondering if that might come up. Good catch.

badbrains

BS44325 said:

I read somewhere that it was a billion bombs

I'm honored you came out of hibernation just for me. Guess those checks must be coming in again.

rr165892

tempo_n_groove said:

PJ_Soul said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Isn't that rebar sticking out of the structure to the right?

Yes.

I'm glad you are all concrete experts, those are poured in place columns and slabs. The block has nothing in it. The guy standing on the blocks up close you can clearly see that the block wasn't "filled".

Look at the rubble below and notice there isn't much rebar at all.

Again, I've seen this a lot. PM me for pics of other places if you'd like along with my credentials of concrete...

I concur.I also know my concrete and applied mixtures and building construction standards.1 bomb or 100s.Some of these structures were coming down just based on how they were constructed.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

rr165892 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

PJ_Soul said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Isn't that rebar sticking out of the structure to the right?

Yes.

I'm glad you are all concrete experts, those are poured in place columns and slabs. The block has nothing in it. The guy standing on the blocks up close you can clearly see that the block wasn't "filled".

Look at the rubble below and notice there isn't much rebar at all.

Again, I've seen this a lot. PM me for pics of other places if you'd like along with my credentials of concrete...

I concur.I also know my concrete.

You freakin' concrete guys.

rr165892

Also most the buildings in the picture seem to be roughly the same common design with just the tie beams,floors and support columns being solid.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

rr165892 said:

Also most the buildings in the picture seem to be roughly the same common design with just the tie beams,floors and support columns being solid.

You think that was the work of one bomb?

rr165892

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

rr165892 said:

Also most the buildings in the picture seem to be roughly the same common design with just the tie beams,floors and support columns being solid.

You think that was the work of one bomb?

Loaded question.One bomb could absolutely do the close up damage(complete flat adjacent building) depending on how big it was,but it actually looks more like an area that had multiple bombs/Missles/mortars at different times.Its more the "War zone" look then it is like the leveling of widespread carpet bombing.It looks like targeted hell fire missile strikes. That is apparent based on the standing buildings all around the demolished structures.Also it appears that some bobcat or loader clearing has been done.Maybe to clear debris from roadway. So you really can't see how those buildings came down.But those buildings that have the majority of the debris gone look to be older damage.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

^^^^

I'm not trying to set you up for anything. I wanted to know what you thought.

rr165892

Your always solid.I didn't think you were.Cheers buddy!

JohnnieBeBlue

The third Intifada continues:
Saturday, October 3:
Rabbi Nehemia Lavi, 41, and Aharon Banita Bennett, 21, were murdered in a stabbing attack in Jerusalem's Old City. Bennett, along with his wife and two-year-old son, were attacked by the terrorist; his wife was seriously wounded and the child lightly wounded. Rabbi Lavi, a father of seven, went out of his home with his gun to try and save Bennett and his family, but the terrorist stabbed him and took his weapon. Arab onlookers laughed, spat and kicked Bennett's wife, who had a knife stuck in her shoulder and tried to get help.

A 15-year-old Jewish teen was stabbed at a gas station near the Damascus Gate in Jerusalem’s Old City. He was listed in moderate-to-serious condition after being stabbed in the upper body. The attacker who fled the scene was shot dead by security forces.

Sunday, October 4:
Shortly after 11:00 PM, two rockets were fired from Gaza towards Israel. The first one missed the target and exploded on the Gazan side of the border. A second rocket exploded in an open area of the Eshkol Regional Council. There were no physical injuries or damages.

A terrorist threw a firebomb at security forces at the Tomb of Rachel outside Bethlehem. A Border Guard officer was injured in that attack.

Tuesday, October 6:
A 16-month-old baby was lightly wounded when Arab terrorists threw rocks at a car on Highway 60 near Ma'ale Levona in Samaria. Both she and her mother, 32, were brought a local hospital for treatment, though both are stable and fully conscious.

Wednesday, October 7
A female Arab terrorist stabbed and moderately wounded a Jewish man, aged 36, at the Lion's Gate in the Old City, on the eastern side of the Temple Mount. The man shot the terrorist, who is in serious condition. The stabber sneaked up from behind the man and stabbed him near the neck. He turned around and shot her in self defense. She tried to run away but nearby Border Police gave chase, pounced on her and neutralized her.

An Arab mob ambushed a female Jewish motorist with rocks, then proceeded to kick her and try and wrest her from the car. The woman, 38-year-old Tekoa resident Rivi Lev-Ohayon, was left wounded by rocks and kicks to her entire body, but managed to escape after other Jewish motorists intervened, with one allegedly shooting and injuring one of her attackers.

An Arab terrorist stabbed an IDF soldier and tried to steal his gun in Kiryat Gat. The Arab terrorist arrived in Kiryat Gat on a bus, spotted the soldier and stole his weapon. The soldier fought to regain his gun, at which point he was stabbed in his head. He suffered moderate injuries. Police reached the scene within minutes, and rushed into a building to which the terrorist had escaped. They opened fire and eliminated him after he fired at them.

An Arab terrorist injured at least one person in a knife attack on passersby outside Petah Tikvah's central mall close to Beilinson Hospital. The attacker drew his knife and ran towards a crowd of civilians as he and his victim left the city's #1 bus, and succeeded in stabbing at least one of them before security guards opened fire in his direction, and succeeded in overpowering him.

Thursday, October 8:
A female soldier and four civilians were stabbed and lightly wounded by a terrorist in central Tel Aviv's Begin Street. An Air Force soldier and policemen who were at the scene chased after the terrorist to nearby Mozes street, where they shot and killed him. Magen David Adom teams evacuated the soldier, 20, to hospital, along with a woman aged about 60, a man aged about 40 and another woman aged about 40. They are all conscious and were stabbed in the upper body. A fifth victim was also reported.

An Arab terrorist stabbed a 25-year-old Jewish man in Kiryat Arba, in Judea. The victim was seriously wounded with stab wounds to his back, in an attack that took place at the western gate of the town, which opens on to the Arab majority city of Hevron. Medical teams began treating the victim, who apparently is a resident of Kiryat Arba, and after initial treatment, they evacuated him to Shaare Tzedek Hospital in Jerusalem.

Earlier, a 25-year-old yeshiva student was seriously injured and another man lightly injured in a terror attack at the Jerusalem Light Rail station in front of national police headquarters near Ammunition Hill. Magen David Adom teams on scene at Haim Bar Lev Road treated the seriously injured man and brought him to Shaare Zedek Medical Center, where he arrived in critical condition, was subsequently sedated and was breathing through a respirator.

An initial police investigation revealed the terrorist, 19-year-old Subhi Abu Halifa from Shuafat in eastern Jerusalem, approached the Light Rail station, stabbed the haredi student in the neck with a knife and tried to escape. As he fled, Abu Halifa passed a light rail guard, who he attacked in an attempt to steal his weapon. Police SWAT forces chased after the terrorist, arresting him with the assistance of police reinforcements on the scene.

A Jewish man in his twenties was stabbed and moderately wounded in an Arab terror attack in the northern city of Afula. The young victim was attacked on Arlozorov Street.

Magen David Adom (MDA) and United Hatzalah crews were called to the scene and provided medical treatment, afterwards evacuating him to Haemek Hospital in the city. Initial reports indicate that the terrorist was apprehended by civilians who happened to be passing by at the time, and then arrested by police.

mickeyrat

Then get the fuck out of occupied territory. No brainer.

JohnnieBeBlue

mickeyrat said:

Then get the fuck out of occupied territory. No brainer.

See, that's the kind of response I expected around here. Here's the issues with this response as I see them:

1) Many of these attacks occurred inside Israel proper and not to "settlers" or in the occupied territories. We are talking about people, teenagers, children, walking around Jerusalem and Tel Aviv and getting stabbed in the back and in the neck.

2) Many of the attackers are Israeli Arabs. They are not under occupation.

3) Arab terror attacks began long before the 1967 war. The oft repeated trope that terrorism is due to "the occupation" is a tired one. Why did Arabs riot and murder Jewish students in Hebron in 1929? Was it the occupation? What of the thousands of attacks between 1948 and 1967? The PLO and Arab terrorism in Israel both predate the occupation.

4) The glorification of terror is sickening. The PA has praised these attacks, including the murder of two parents as their four children watched terrified in the back seat. These attacks began after Abbas's speech at the UN and have been encouraged by PA and Fatah leaders. The attackers are celebrated as martyrs and their families are paid handsomely by the PA and Hamas.

Yeah, must be the occupation.

mickeyrat

JohnnieBeBlue said:

mickeyrat said:

Then get the fuck out of occupied territory. No brainer.

See, that's the kind of response I expected around here. Here's the issues with this response as I see them:

1) Many of these attacks occurred inside Israel proper and not to "settlers" or in the occupied territories. We are talking about people, teenagers, children, walking around Jerusalem and Tel Aviv and getting stabbed in the back and in the neck.

2) Many of the attackers are Israeli Arabs. They are not under occupation.

3) Arab terror attacks began long before the 1967 war. The oft repeated trope that terrorism is due to "the occupation" is a tired one. Why did Arabs riot and murder Jewish students in Hebron in 1929? Was it the occupation? What of the thousands of attacks between 1948 and 1967? The PLO and Arab terrorism in Israel both predate the occupation.

4) The glorification of terror is sickening. The PA has praised these attacks, including the murder of two parents as their four children watched terrified in the back seat. These attacks began after Abbas's speech at the UN and have been encouraged by PA and Fatah leaders. The attackers are celebrated as martyrs and their families are paid handsomely by the PA and Hamas.

Yeah, must be the occupation.

They charge the killers who burned that family yet?

JohnnieBeBlue

mickeyrat said:

JohnnieBeBlue said:

mickeyrat said:

Then get the fuck out of occupied territory. No brainer.

See, that's the kind of response I expected around here. Here's the issues with this response as I see them:

1) Many of these attacks occurred inside Israel proper and not to "settlers" or in the occupied territories. We are talking about people, teenagers, children, walking around Jerusalem and Tel Aviv and getting stabbed in the back and in the neck.

2) Many of the attackers are Israeli Arabs. They are not under occupation.

3) Arab terror attacks began long before the 1967 war. The oft repeated trope that terrorism is due to "the occupation" is a tired one. Why did Arabs riot and murder Jewish students in Hebron in 1929? Was it the occupation? What of the thousands of attacks between 1948 and 1967? The PLO and Arab terrorism in Israel both predate the occupation.

4) The glorification of terror is sickening. The PA has praised these attacks, including the murder of two parents as their four children watched terrified in the back seat. These attacks began after Abbas's speech at the UN and have been encouraged by PA and Fatah leaders. The attackers are celebrated as martyrs and their families are paid handsomely by the PA and Hamas.

Yeah, must be the occupation.

They charge the killers who burned that family yet?

If they found out who it was, they sure as hell would. There is zero tolerance for that in a free and just society. It's pretty cynical and completely unjustified to suggest otherwise without any evidence.

You are also taking a clearly isolated event that was roundly condemned by virtually all of Israeli society and comparing it to widespread and systemic violence and hundreds of attacks over just one week. Meanwhile, PA leadership celebrates baby killers. Your moral equivalence is disturbing.

mickeyrat

JohnnieBeBlue said:

mickeyrat said:

JohnnieBeBlue said:

mickeyrat said:

Then get the fuck out of occupied territory. No brainer.

See, that's the kind of response I expected around here. Here's the issues with this response as I see them:

1) Many of these attacks occurred inside Israel proper and not to "settlers" or in the occupied territories. We are talking about people, teenagers, children, walking around Jerusalem and Tel Aviv and getting stabbed in the back and in the neck.

2) Many of the attackers are Israeli Arabs. They are not under occupation.

3) Arab terror attacks began long before the 1967 war. The oft repeated trope that terrorism is due to "the occupation" is a tired one. Why did Arabs riot and murder Jewish students in Hebron in 1929? Was it the occupation? What of the thousands of attacks between 1948 and 1967? The PLO and Arab terrorism in Israel both predate the occupation.

4) The glorification of terror is sickening. The PA has praised these attacks, including the murder of two parents as their four children watched terrified in the back seat. These attacks began after Abbas's speech at the UN and have been encouraged by PA and Fatah leaders. The attackers are celebrated as martyrs and their families are paid handsomely by the PA and Hamas.

Yeah, must be the occupation.

They charge the killers who burned that family yet?

If they found out who it was, they sure as hell would. There is zero tolerance for that in a free and just society. It's pretty cynical and completely unjustified to suggest otherwise without any evidence.

You are also taking a clearly isolated event that was roundly condemned by virtually all of Israeli society and comparing it to widespread and systemic violence and hundreds of attacks over just one week. Meanwhile, PA leadership celebrates baby killers. Your moral equivalence is disturbing.

Eh, eye for an eye and all that. They wan5 to make it a religious oriented atate then their biblical rules apply.

My suggestion is for law enforcement over there to apply the law equally and with the same zeal as they appear to apply to palestinians.

Until that occurs and other JUST changes are made to the situation I frankly dont want one goddamned red cent of the tax dollars I pay to fund the slow genocide. They cant play victim when its they who foment violence from the State and general Israeli population..

JohnnieBeBlue

mickeyrat said:

JohnnieBeBlue said:

mickeyrat said:

JohnnieBeBlue said:

mickeyrat said:

Then get the fuck out of occupied territory. No brainer.

See, that's the kind of response I expected around here. Here's the issues with this response as I see them:

1) Many of these attacks occurred inside Israel proper and not to "settlers" or in the occupied territories. We are talking about people, teenagers, children, walking around Jerusalem and Tel Aviv and getting stabbed in the back and in the neck.

2) Many of the attackers are Israeli Arabs. They are not under occupation.

3) Arab terror attacks began long before the 1967 war. The oft repeated trope that terrorism is due to "the occupation" is a tired one. Why did Arabs riot and murder Jewish students in Hebron in 1929? Was it the occupation? What of the thousands of attacks between 1948 and 1967? The PLO and Arab terrorism in Israel both predate the occupation.

4) The glorification of terror is sickening. The PA has praised these attacks, including the murder of two parents as their four children watched terrified in the back seat. These attacks began after Abbas's speech at the UN and have been encouraged by PA and Fatah leaders. The attackers are celebrated as martyrs and their families are paid handsomely by the PA and Hamas.

Yeah, must be the occupation.

They charge the killers who burned that family yet?

If they found out who it was, they sure as hell would. There is zero tolerance for that in a free and just society. It's pretty cynical and completely unjustified to suggest otherwise without any evidence.

You are also taking a clearly isolated event that was roundly condemned by virtually all of Israeli society and comparing it to widespread and systemic violence and hundreds of attacks over just one week. Meanwhile, PA leadership celebrates baby killers. Your moral equivalence is disturbing.

Eh, eye for an eye and all that. They wan5 to make it a religious oriented atate then their biblical rules apply.

My suggestion is for law enforcement over there to apply the law equally and with the same zeal as they appear to apply to palestinians.

Until that occurs and other JUST changes are made to the situation I frankly dont want one goddamned red cent of the tax dollars I pay to fund the slow genocide. They cant play victim when its they who foment violence from the State and general Israeli population..

Right, they foment the violence. That is almost laughable since it exactly describes the Palestinian leadership and their entire school system which glorifies martyrdom and murder. Like I said, the Palestinian violence towards Jews and Israelies has been going on for longer than the State of Israel of the occupation ever came to be. This isn't about an eye for eye. It's about security and the right to live without worrying that a kid will stab you in the neck while you are at the mall. Your rhetoric is laughable. "Slow genocide"? Typically, populations undergoing a genocide have a decrease in population. The population of Gaza has meanwhile increased by 687,000 people between 2000 and 2013. The same numbers apply in the West Bank. As soon as the Palestinians and Israel's neighbors decide that Israel has a right to exist, then Israel will no longer need the US military support. Until then, they have every right to defend themselves and are lucky that US leadership has a clearer moral compass than you do.