And what about all the folks who get gunned down cuz they had a wallet or,cellphone in their hands... Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY for their killers?
You see now that is valid point.If the person isn't attacking the officer,and an officer shoots a guy just holding his wallet/phone/keys etc.Then that officer should be held to answer for his actions.No question,no argument.Im not advocating that police get to run rough shot in every case.But this discussion is yet another case of a person who physically assaults the officer.Police are trIned to draw their weapons in those situations and in a split second have to not only decide the best course of action for himself and those in proximity .You can't expect them to have the luxury of hindsight in these split second decisions.Bottom line if the punk had not jumped the cop he would be alive.Lets not blame the officer for this kids poor descisions.
The problem here is that there is no evidence that the punk jumped the cop aside from his word.
And yes, I do hold them accountable for split second decisions...it's their job. An anesthesiologist is responsible for their split second dedecisions of life and death, many doctors are. Accountability is all around us, but not so much in the police force.
my bad. I should have mentioned I was speaking more to the overall duties in general of a cop, not this specific incident. without a link to any kind of story with specifics, there's really not much to comment on, to be honest.
you can't legitimately compare the decision making of one profession that is in no danger to themselves versus another where imminent danger and possible death of themselves is a very real possibility.
I think studies have shown that it just isn't possible for a human to accurately be able to ascertain the level of danger in that type of situation. it's all a crapshoot. I'd have to look it up though.
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
I'm positive we experience better results than 50% of the cop assaults being resolved without lethal force applied.
We only hear of the cases where a shooting occurs because people are lapping these stories up as the flavor of the year.
The amount of good police work to bad police work is astronomically disproportionate. And I'm not saying this shooting sounds like bad police work- it sounds like idiot went and got himself shot by being an idiot.
Sure glad we didn't read of a cop getting killed on duty. Such a thread would only prompt three people to comment.
put yourself in their situation for a milisecond; they see someone..a possibly shady character who may or may not have just gunned down a kid.....you live in a world where everyone and their dog carries and conceals.......the person refuses to obey your orders, and reaches into their inside jacket pocket when you tell them to put their hands behind their head....it's dark......your child and wife and whole life flash before your eyes......what would YOU do?
You have a SPLIT SECOND to decide if you or someone with you/around you is going to die. That is the reality that cops live in. A split fucking second. All because some dipshit is thinking "but I was just reaching for my phone when you told me to put my hands up! I was getting a TEXT, muthafucka!".
sorry, but in my eyes, you obey the police and their requests. everything else is on you. they do what they do to protect you.
in other scenarios, like being pulled over for no reason, yes, you have every right to question your constitutional rights and if they are being violated, but only do that in a normal, low-stress situation.
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
I'm positive we experience better results than 50% of the cop assaults being resolved without lethal force applied.
We only hear of the cases where a shooting occurs because people are lapping these stories up as the flavor of the year.
The amount of good police work to bad police work is astronomically disproportionate. And I'm not saying this shooting sounds like bad police work- it sounds like idiot went and got himself shot by being an idiot.
Sure glad we didn't read of a cop getting killed on duty. Such a thread would only prompt three people to comment.
Agree thirty.Most good police work goes un noticed.The crazy amount of life saving they do daily is mind blowing.We are hearing about the latest few "bad stories"as this seems to be the PC flavor of the year.People are more concerned with putting racial overtones on everything instead of you know putting facts and common sense to it.
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
I'm positive we experience better results than 50% of the cop assaults being resolved without lethal force applied.
We only hear of the cases where a shooting occurs because people are lapping these stories up as the flavor of the year.
The amount of good police work to bad police work is astronomically disproportionate. And I'm not saying this shooting sounds like bad police work- it sounds like idiot went and got himself shot by being an idiot.
Sure glad we didn't read of a cop getting killed on duty. Such a thread would only prompt three people to comment.
The 50% was in reference to accountability after a shooting has occurred.
I think alot of our problems in this society would dissapear if we switched cops and Senators salaries!
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
I'm positive we experience better results than 50% of the cop assaults being resolved without lethal force applied.
We only hear of the cases where a shooting occurs because people are lapping these stories up as the flavor of the year.
The amount of good police work to bad police work is astronomically disproportionate. And I'm not saying this shooting sounds like bad police work- it sounds like idiot went and got himself shot by being an idiot.
Sure glad we didn't read of a cop getting killed on duty. Such a thread would only prompt three people to comment.
The 50% was in reference to accountability after a shooting has occurred.
I think alot of our problems in this society would dissapear if we switched cops and Senators salaries!
police should be as high paid as doctors (dependent on core duties, of course). in canada, cops are paid very well. I have HEARD that cops in the states get paid a mere pittance. is this true?
If it is found that this guy didn't assault the cop, then I am all for him facing charges. The problem is that even when it is proven to be justified, people here and across America, still want to crucify the cops for doing their job.
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Not that cut and dry and shootings should be investigated. Never blindly accept. So good "those" that are always on "other side" criticize. To your benefit.
If it is found that this guy didn't assault the cop, then I am all for him facing charges. The problem is that even when it is proven to be justified, people here and across America, still want to crucify the cops for doing their job.
If it is found that this guy didn't assault the cop, then I am all for him facing charges. The problem is that even when it is proven to be justified, people here and across America, still want to crucify the cops for doing their job.
Problem, yes. But is it a bigger problem than the problems we have with investigating the situation to begin with?
If it is found that this guy didn't assault the cop, then I am all for him facing charges. The problem is that even when it is proven to be justified, people here and across America, still want to crucify the cops for doing their job.
Problem, yes. But is it a bigger problem than the problems we have with investigating the situation to begin with?
I don't think it really matters if the investigation was done properly and you even had video evidence that backs up the cops story, some here will still think the cop should not be able to shoot somebody.
put yourself in their situation for a milisecond; they see someone..a possibly shady character who may or may not have just gunned down a kid.....you live in a world where everyone and their dog carries and conceals.......the person refuses to obey your orders, and reaches into their inside jacket pocket when you tell them to put their hands behind their head....it's dark......your child and wife and whole life flash before your eyes......what would YOU do?
You have a SPLIT SECOND to decide if you or someone with you/around you is going to die. That is the reality that cops live in. A split fucking second. All because some dipshit is thinking "but I was just reaching for my phone when you told me to put my hands up! I was getting a TEXT, muthafucka!".
sorry, but in my eyes, you obey the police and their requests. everything else is on you. they do what they do to protect you.
in other scenarios, like being pulled over for no reason, yes, you have every right to question your constitutional rights and if they are being violated, but only do that in a normal, low-stress situation.
Luv this guy. Gold star day for you today Dillion. Would Luv to buy u a beer
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
So you're saying that someone attacking you and trying to steal your gun doesn't put your life in danger?
Also- don't prison guards not carry guns?
I'm saying that just because the cops get impunity by claiming there was an attempt at the weapon doesn't make it true. Body cams would help alot. Do you really think everyone is always reaching for the gun?
Oh yeah- I'm all for body cams. I think some of the constant outrage would go away when people see exactly what some of these cops are dealing with. And it would also weed out the cops that use their weapons when it's unnecessary.
I don't know if people are always reaching for a cops gun. But in order to protect themselves, don't cops have to assume that? I don't know...I don't think there's a perfect solution
muskydan - I'm curious to see what you think of Indifference71's statement here. I don't understand why we can't all seem to agree that some police brutality is founded, and some is unfounded: there's just too much binary thinking here. If we can promote a system that acknowledges that both citizens and police ought to have more accountability in their correspondences, I think it'd be beneficial for everyone, no? Playing the blame game progresses no party.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Why I’ve Never Respected The Police by Michael Malice
About a decade ago BBC Radio interviewed me about one of my books. “Michael,” the DJ said, “you seem to make fun of the police a lot in your book. Do you get into any trouble for that?”
The discussion had been a typically vapid one until that point, and this question seemed in line with that. I thought I’d give a response as typical and vapid as the question. “Well,” I said, “it’s like my father told me growing up: ‘No matter where you go, no matter where you find yourself in the world, the stupidest people are always the cops.’”
The interviewer literally gasped. “Michael! This is a family show!” he snapped, immediately changing the subject. I was baffled. Sure, I’d seen the degree to which people venerate police in red-state culture. But I had never encountered anyone who would find my statement to be noteworthy, let alone transgressive.
I was born in the former Soviet Union and came to the United States when I was two. Because I came to Brooklyn so young, I never considered myself particularly Russian. I only learned to read and write the language in college so I could get an easy A. My fluency was completely conversational and (apparently) heavily accented. At one point, my grandmother told me that I spoke Russian as if I had Down syndrome.
It is only recently, with the escalating segregation of the US into Team Red and Team Blue, that I’ve come to realize just how much being raised in a Russian household affected my thinking. And nowhere is this more evident than in my perspective on the police—or rather, my awareness of the American perspective on the police.
In Russian culture, the police are the enemy. If they come to your home, bad things come with them. I don’t mean “bad” like when the landlord tells you the hot water will be out for a couple of days. I mean “bad” as in your entire life and that of everyone in your family is going to be messed up very heavily and very quickly.
One corollary to this was that calling the cops is considered the worst thing you can do in terms of character. It is almost the equivalent of bringing a rabid dog to your enemy’s house. Yes, your enemy might get what’s coming to them. Maybe. Hopefully. But you’re still stuck with a savage beast to deal with, one that will be just as happy to bite anyone and everyone. And you brought this thing upon your own family? What kind of person are you?
As a consequence of our family culture, I didn’t grow up trusting the police. This was not something that needed to be taught to me. Children are naturally scared of strangers. Most kids hide behind their parents when an unfamiliar (“not of my family”) adult approaches. They are especially scared of authority figures. A call to the principal’s office is a moment of dread, not a ticket to Narnia. One needs to be taught to trust strangers, especially strangers who have nasty demeanors and wear ominous uniforms.
Republicans like to makes fun of progressives for what they describe as “political correctness.” One particularly biting description of political correctness is that of “a disciplined refusal to acknowledge reality.” As the claim goes, liberals pretend that facts they dislike simply aren’t true, even when those facts are perfectly obvious to everyone else.
But conservatives’ views on the police is its own version of political correctness.
Growing up in America, I constantly heard that I could trust the police. They were there to help me and to keep me safe. They were admirable, heroes even. I was told it in school, I read it in comic books, and it was one of the lessons She-Ra imparted to us at the end of an episode. Yet I couldn’t reconcile what I was being taught with what I was seeing with my own eyes. Yes, some police officers were more polite than others. But every single one of them presented themselves as trashy, tacky louts—and I say this as someone who grew up in a Mafia neighborhood, not Park Avenue.
These were not people with capes waving behind them. They were not aspirational figures, Lady Liberty at her best. These were people that I, as an immigrant, desperately wanted to avoid becoming. These were degenerates, America gone soft and repellent. Unless you are taught otherwise, unless you have blinders on, it is impossible to look at police and not see the worst-mannered people in your area. Yes, sometimes they produce good consequences—but so does chemotherapy. That doesn’t mean that people like chemotherapy. Nor is chemo something you want around except in the direst situations. And even then, you want it to be over as quickly as possible.
When we first came to the US, there were several times where my family was treated very poorly. I recall my mom crying one day because the doctor berated her about learning to speak English as she struggled to understand his technical explanations. As a consequence, I always acknowledge whomever I am interacting with as a fellow human. I don’t talk on my phone when the cashier is checking me out. I nod if I make eye contact with someone doing menial work. We’re both people. We might even both be terrible people, but consistently dehumanizing others can’t but lead to bad psychological experiences in the self. And my cost is nil.
But the police are different. Being a cop is the only profession where it’s not only appropriate to yell at strangers—it’s necessary. It’s to choose a career where you place yourself on a plane above everyone else, by law. Their argument goes that “someone” has to do it. Maybe that’s true. To defend becoming a cop is to give the Jack Nicholson speech in A Few Good Men. Perhaps there are a few good men in the police force. But they are far, far outnumbered by the bad apples because of the very nature of the role.
Physicians know to “first, do no harm.” Our legal system is based on the principle that it’s better one hundred guilty men go free than one innocent man be jailed. But being a cop doesn’t work like that. To wear a badge means to traumatize people who are innocent. It’s to harass adults who, upon inspection, have done nothing wrong. That is an unavoidable part of the job, a function of its statistical approach to justice. You put on a badge knowing that you will sometimes do the wrong thing. Once you give up your conscience, once you disregard your accountability for your ethical choices, you’ve given up the most basic thing that makes us human. Knowingly doing evil is as low as it gets. That, and that alone, is enough for me to condemn the police. Not just the “bad” cops, but each and every single one of them.
Why I’ve Never Respected The Police by Michael Malice
About a decade ago BBC Radio interviewed me about one of my books. “Michael,” the DJ said, “you seem to make fun of the police a lot in your book. Do you get into any trouble for that?”
The discussion had been a typically vapid one until that point, and this question seemed in line with that. I thought I’d give a response as typical and vapid as the question. “Well,” I said, “it’s like my father told me growing up: ‘No matter where you go, no matter where you find yourself in the world, the stupidest people are always the cops.’”
The interviewer literally gasped. “Michael! This is a family show!” he snapped, immediately changing the subject. I was baffled. Sure, I’d seen the degree to which people venerate police in red-state culture. But I had never encountered anyone who would find my statement to be noteworthy, let alone transgressive.
I was born in the former Soviet Union and came to the United States when I was two. Because I came to Brooklyn so young, I never considered myself particularly Russian. I only learned to read and write the language in college so I could get an easy A. My fluency was completely conversational and (apparently) heavily accented. At one point, my grandmother told me that I spoke Russian as if I had Down syndrome.
It is only recently, with the escalating segregation of the US into Team Red and Team Blue, that I’ve come to realize just how much being raised in a Russian household affected my thinking. And nowhere is this more evident than in my perspective on the police—or rather, my awareness of the American perspective on the police.
In Russian culture, the police are the enemy. If they come to your home, bad things come with them. I don’t mean “bad” like when the landlord tells you the hot water will be out for a couple of days. I mean “bad” as in your entire life and that of everyone in your family is going to be messed up very heavily and very quickly.
One corollary to this was that calling the cops is considered the worst thing you can do in terms of character. It is almost the equivalent of bringing a rabid dog to your enemy’s house. Yes, your enemy might get what’s coming to them. Maybe. Hopefully. But you’re still stuck with a savage beast to deal with, one that will be just as happy to bite anyone and everyone. And you brought this thing upon your own family? What kind of person are you?
As a consequence of our family culture, I didn’t grow up trusting the police. This was not something that needed to be taught to me. Children are naturally scared of strangers. Most kids hide behind their parents when an unfamiliar (“not of my family”) adult approaches. They are especially scared of authority figures. A call to the principal’s office is a moment of dread, not a ticket to Narnia. One needs to be taught to trust strangers, especially strangers who have nasty demeanors and wear ominous uniforms.
Republicans like to makes fun of progressives for what they describe as “political correctness.” One particularly biting description of political correctness is that of “a disciplined refusal to acknowledge reality.” As the claim goes, liberals pretend that facts they dislike simply aren’t true, even when those facts are perfectly obvious to everyone else.
But conservatives’ views on the police is its own version of political correctness.
Growing up in America, I constantly heard that I could trust the police. They were there to help me and to keep me safe. They were admirable, heroes even. I was told it in school, I read it in comic books, and it was one of the lessons She-Ra imparted to us at the end of an episode. Yet I couldn’t reconcile what I was being taught with what I was seeing with my own eyes. Yes, some police officers were more polite than others. But every single one of them presented themselves as trashy, tacky louts—and I say this as someone who grew up in a Mafia neighborhood, not Park Avenue.
These were not people with capes waving behind them. They were not aspirational figures, Lady Liberty at her best. These were people that I, as an immigrant, desperately wanted to avoid becoming. These were degenerates, America gone soft and repellent. Unless you are taught otherwise, unless you have blinders on, it is impossible to look at police and not see the worst-mannered people in your area. Yes, sometimes they produce good consequences—but so does chemotherapy. That doesn’t mean that people like chemotherapy. Nor is chemo something you want around except in the direst situations. And even then, you want it to be over as quickly as possible.
When we first came to the US, there were several times where my family was treated very poorly. I recall my mom crying one day because the doctor berated her about learning to speak English as she struggled to understand his technical explanations. As a consequence, I always acknowledge whomever I am interacting with as a fellow human. I don’t talk on my phone when the cashier is checking me out. I nod if I make eye contact with someone doing menial work. We’re both people. We might even both be terrible people, but consistently dehumanizing others can’t but lead to bad psychological experiences in the self. And my cost is nil.
But the police are different. Being a cop is the only profession where it’s not only appropriate to yell at strangers—it’s necessary. It’s to choose a career where you place yourself on a plane above everyone else, by law. Their argument goes that “someone” has to do it. Maybe that’s true. To defend becoming a cop is to give the Jack Nicholson speech in A Few Good Men. Perhaps there are a few good men in the police force. But they are far, far outnumbered by the bad apples because of the very nature of the role.
Physicians know to “first, do no harm.” Our legal system is based on the principle that it’s better one hundred guilty men go free than one innocent man be jailed. But being a cop doesn’t work like that. To wear a badge means to traumatize people who are innocent. It’s to harass adults who, upon inspection, have done nothing wrong. That is an unavoidable part of the job, a function of its statistical approach to justice. You put on a badge knowing that you will sometimes do the wrong thing. Once you give up your conscience, once you disregard your accountability for your ethical choices, you’ve given up the most basic thing that makes us human. Knowingly doing evil is as low as it gets. That, and that alone, is enough for me to condemn the police. Not just the “bad” cops, but each and every single one of them.
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
So you're saying that someone attacking you and trying to steal your gun doesn't put your life in danger?
Also- don't prison guards not carry guns?
I'm saying that just because the cops get impunity by claiming there was an attempt at the weapon doesn't make it true. Body cams would help alot. Do you really think everyone is always reaching for the gun?
Oh yeah- I'm all for body cams. I think some of the constant outrage would go away when people see exactly what some of these cops are dealing with. And it would also weed out the cops that use their weapons when it's unnecessary.
I don't know if people are always reaching for a cops gun. But in order to protect themselves, don't cops have to assume that? I don't know...I don't think there's a perfect solution
muskydan - I'm curious to see what you think of Indifference71's statement here. I don't understand why we can't all seem to agree that some police brutality is founded, and some is unfounded: there's just too much binary thinking here. If we can promote a system that acknowledges that both citizens and police ought to have more accountability in their correspondences, I think it'd be beneficial for everyone, no? Playing the blame game progresses no party.
don't mean to barge in when you asked a specific member a question, but who is saying that all brutality is founded or unfounded? I think it's pretty obvious it falls somewhere in the middle.
Police Departments Must Learn That Respect Goes Both Ways
2014 seemed to be the year of attention on the police. We had so many incidents of police seemingly overstepping their bounds, especially when it came to black and minority young and not so young men that we now have an ongoing protest and national debate on police brutality and reform. This may have been a long time coming.
Police departments and supporters have tried to make this national call for police reform to be about a disrespect for the police and authority, but no amount of that attempted spin will work to convince us that police are the ones dealing with a systemic and ongoing problem of respect. The fact that there are some people who do not like the police does not taint an entire movement that is simply trying to draw attention to a dangerous situation that is just not getting any better.
And the issue of cops being out of control is made even worse when police officers act no better than gangs in how they respond to people who dare to try to stand up to bad behavior on their part. One case in point is the reaction by the hundreds of police officers in New York City who turned their backs on the mayor of New York as a sign of their disrespect for him for daring to say something in support of protestors and their right to protest police actions. The police officers’ disrespect for Mayor Bill de Blasio and his right to speak up is in their minds justified even though they don’t think he has the right to speak his mind. Their actions certainly don’t help the situation.
And then there is the officer in Ferguson, Missouri, who admitted he called the Michael Brown makeshift roadside memorial “a pile of trash.” To say that after a man, a boy, was killed, rightly or wrongly, is such a sign of contempt for that community and those that are mourning the loss of a life, and it certainly gives credence to those who think the police have issues with a certain group of people.
There was also the incident in Los Angeles, at a police officer’s retirement party where the singer sang an awful song mocking Michael Brown’s killing, in a room full of cops, and no one stopped him and apparently there was some laughter. The lyrics went in part like this:
"Michael Brown learned a lesson
about a messin’ with a bad … police man
And he’s, bad, bad Michael Brown
Baddest thug in the whole darn town
Badder than an ol' King Kong
Meaner than a junkyard dog
Two men took to fightin’
And Michael punched in through the door
and Michael looked like some old Swiss cheese
His brain was splatter on the floor."
None of these incidents do anything to help the notion that many have, and the point of protests, that police officers and police departments, often have an antagonistic attitude about minority communities, and while police demand respect from the public and those communities, they clearly show none to the people they are supposed to be caring about.
By no means do I think all police are bad. And I, like most people, including most of those asking for reform of police procedures and better training on dealing with minority communities, do support and respect the police for what they do everyday to keep us safe. But that does not mean we don’t have a right to ask for reform and a better policing of the bad apples in the bunch. When police circle the wagons on bad cops and bad behavior on their part, they do themselves a disservice. It is an old lesson, you have to be respectful to get respect. The same way they want communities to rally to drive out bad people and behavior in their midst, that is all the public wants from them as well.
Why I’ve Never Respected The Police by Michael Malice
About a decade ago BBC Radio interviewed me about one of my books. “Michael,” the DJ said, “you seem to make fun of the police a lot in your book. Do you get into any trouble for that?”
The discussion had been a typically vapid one until that point, and this question seemed in line with that. I thought I’d give a response as typical and vapid as the question. “Well,” I said, “it’s like my father told me growing up: ‘No matter where you go, no matter where you find yourself in the world, the stupidest people are always the cops.’”
The interviewer literally gasped. “Michael! This is a family show!” he snapped, immediately changing the subject. I was baffled. Sure, I’d seen the degree to which people venerate police in red-state culture. But I had never encountered anyone who would find my statement to be noteworthy, let alone transgressive.
I was born in the former Soviet Union and came to the United States when I was two. Because I came to Brooklyn so young, I never considered myself particularly Russian. I only learned to read and write the language in college so I could get an easy A. My fluency was completely conversational and (apparently) heavily accented. At one point, my grandmother told me that I spoke Russian as if I had Down syndrome.
It is only recently, with the escalating segregation of the US into Team Red and Team Blue, that I’ve come to realize just how much being raised in a Russian household affected my thinking. And nowhere is this more evident than in my perspective on the police—or rather, my awareness of the American perspective on the police.
In Russian culture, the police are the enemy. If they come to your home, bad things come with them. I don’t mean “bad” like when the landlord tells you the hot water will be out for a couple of days. I mean “bad” as in your entire life and that of everyone in your family is going to be messed up very heavily and very quickly.
One corollary to this was that calling the cops is considered the worst thing you can do in terms of character. It is almost the equivalent of bringing a rabid dog to your enemy’s house. Yes, your enemy might get what’s coming to them. Maybe. Hopefully. But you’re still stuck with a savage beast to deal with, one that will be just as happy to bite anyone and everyone. And you brought this thing upon your own family? What kind of person are you?
As a consequence of our family culture, I didn’t grow up trusting the police. This was not something that needed to be taught to me. Children are naturally scared of strangers. Most kids hide behind their parents when an unfamiliar (“not of my family”) adult approaches. They are especially scared of authority figures. A call to the principal’s office is a moment of dread, not a ticket to Narnia. One needs to be taught to trust strangers, especially strangers who have nasty demeanors and wear ominous uniforms.
Republicans like to makes fun of progressives for what they describe as “political correctness.” One particularly biting description of political correctness is that of “a disciplined refusal to acknowledge reality.” As the claim goes, liberals pretend that facts they dislike simply aren’t true, even when those facts are perfectly obvious to everyone else.
But conservatives’ views on the police is its own version of political correctness.
Growing up in America, I constantly heard that I could trust the police. They were there to help me and to keep me safe. They were admirable, heroes even. I was told it in school, I read it in comic books, and it was one of the lessons She-Ra imparted to us at the end of an episode. Yet I couldn’t reconcile what I was being taught with what I was seeing with my own eyes. Yes, some police officers were more polite than others. But every single one of them presented themselves as trashy, tacky louts—and I say this as someone who grew up in a Mafia neighborhood, not Park Avenue.
These were not people with capes waving behind them. They were not aspirational figures, Lady Liberty at her best. These were people that I, as an immigrant, desperately wanted to avoid becoming. These were degenerates, America gone soft and repellent. Unless you are taught otherwise, unless you have blinders on, it is impossible to look at police and not see the worst-mannered people in your area. Yes, sometimes they produce good consequences—but so does chemotherapy. That doesn’t mean that people like chemotherapy. Nor is chemo something you want around except in the direst situations. And even then, you want it to be over as quickly as possible.
When we first came to the US, there were several times where my family was treated very poorly. I recall my mom crying one day because the doctor berated her about learning to speak English as she struggled to understand his technical explanations. As a consequence, I always acknowledge whomever I am interacting with as a fellow human. I don’t talk on my phone when the cashier is checking me out. I nod if I make eye contact with someone doing menial work. We’re both people. We might even both be terrible people, but consistently dehumanizing others can’t but lead to bad psychological experiences in the self. And my cost is nil.
But the police are different. Being a cop is the only profession where it’s not only appropriate to yell at strangers—it’s necessary. It’s to choose a career where you place yourself on a plane above everyone else, by law. Their argument goes that “someone” has to do it. Maybe that’s true. To defend becoming a cop is to give the Jack Nicholson speech in A Few Good Men. Perhaps there are a few good men in the police force. But they are far, far outnumbered by the bad apples because of the very nature of the role.
Physicians know to “first, do no harm.” Our legal system is based on the principle that it’s better one hundred guilty men go free than one innocent man be jailed. But being a cop doesn’t work like that. To wear a badge means to traumatize people who are innocent. It’s to harass adults who, upon inspection, have done nothing wrong. That is an unavoidable part of the job, a function of its statistical approach to justice. You put on a badge knowing that you will sometimes do the wrong thing. Once you give up your conscience, once you disregard your accountability for your ethical choices, you’ve given up the most basic thing that makes us human. Knowingly doing evil is as low as it gets. That, and that alone, is enough for me to condemn the police. Not just the “bad” cops, but each and every single one of them.
Outside of the comfortable enclaves the typical WMA is used to, this is a common opinion. Doesn't make it right, but it's not as "what the fuck" worthy as you feel it is. Many people, particularly of ethnicity, go their entire lives without being treated respectfully by police officers.
...The man on the freeway who was shot, should never have shot at police, but really, 40 shots — unreal they didn’t kill him. Or, calling a man out and then shooting him five times. Is it a “protocol” to shoot to kill? I recently had a friend whose roommate accidentally took too many anti-anxiety pills. She called for an ambulance, the police arrived, held the ambulance up while they searched the house. The police in Coeur d’Alene appear to be running scared. Every event is a life and death situation. The video at the gas station with the two young men shows their attitude toward young people in this town. There are some very good, responsible officers, but some are on a power-trip, rude and disrespectful to the public in general. These officers make very important judgment calls when they arrest someone and charge them. It requires good judgment and maturity; one cannot teach good judgment. Just because the police department has had the protocols and attitudes forever doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be reviewed and fine-tuned. I respect police officers, but I expect the same in return.
There's nothing that needs to sink in here. Your judge, jury, executioner cries don't fit here. We, the citizens of this country, give the police this right. Every single time a cop shoots a dumb ass for hitting him, the cop is supposed to burn in hell?
I'm pretty sure some would prefer cop funerals versus idiot criminal funerals.
Better safe than sorry... meaning: it's better the cop die or get severely hurt instead of some idiot that engages a cop in a fight at the scene of an investigation getting shot or killed.
Stupidity.
Since it's always the same posters on here on the same sides of the issue.Can we agree that those of us who live in reality,understand that assaulting an officer could and most likely get u killed,much like running around inside a tiger cage with a meat suit on will likely get you eatin.
There sure is a lot of excuses for law breakers,terrorist and folks who don't control there own actions on these boards.ACCOUNTABILITY,people.
Where is the ACCOUNTABILITY in giving police free reign to end the life of anyone they claim is assaulting them?
Just curious....what is a cop supposed to do if someone attacks them? Do you think it's ever acceptable for a cop to shoot someone if they feel their life or people in the area's lives are in danger?
It's easy to just scream about cops shooting people....what's the answer?
A cop should do the same when attacked as you or I should do when attacked...apply force at a level which ends the threat without escalating to fatal force immediately. Of course I think it's USUALLY acceptable for a cop to shoot someone when they feel their life is in danger! The problem is that there is no process which actually attempts to determine if their life was in danger or not. The investigations into these shootings are a show and nothing more in most cases, if they weren't, we would see cops losing their jobs more often.
.
I don't think there's a process that will ever be able to determine that 100%. Anytime someone attacks a cop, the cop's life is in danger. So what are they supposed to do? Reach for their taser and hope that the person attacking them doesn't get their gun?
That's just a fluffy pile of stinky poo. Seriously? Prison guards don't just shoot to kill every time they get molested and somehow, they get on ok without being murdered cconstantly.
So you're saying that someone attacking you and trying to steal your gun doesn't put your life in danger?
Also- don't prison guards not carry guns?
I'm saying that just because the cops get impunity by claiming there was an attempt at the weapon doesn't make it true. Body cams would help alot. Do you really think everyone is always reaching for the gun?
Oh yeah- I'm all for body cams. I think some of the constant outrage would go away when people see exactly what some of these cops are dealing with. And it would also weed out the cops that use their weapons when it's unnecessary.
I don't know if people are always reaching for a cops gun. But in order to protect themselves, don't cops have to assume that? I don't know...I don't think there's a perfect solution
muskydan - I'm curious to see what you think of Indifference71's statement here. I don't understand why we can't all seem to agree that some police brutality is founded, and some is unfounded: there's just too much binary thinking here. If we can promote a system that acknowledges that both citizens and police ought to have more accountability in their correspondences, I think it'd be beneficial for everyone, no? Playing the blame game progresses no party.
Sure. I absolutely agree with him and your accountability suggestion. Body cameras would be very helpful in theory, but there are a ton of things that need to be hashed out first. Privacy is a very big issue for American Citizens as well as police. People do not want to be recorded every time they have a interaction w/ the police nor do we want to have our conversation's recorded when we talk about our kids little league game last night or the ladies we banged over the weekend, or Mom's Cancer…ect..you get my drift There are huge concerns about the cost to maintain cameras and the storage of all the data taken from these body cameras since most municipalities are broke. Quite honestly I am lucky to get a squad car that is safe to drive since our squad cars are on the streets 24 hrs a day for 3 shifts a day…they get beat to shit and are often unsafe to drive. Here is a interesting one, I have been asked by a few of the big bosses (brass) to attend some of the meetings about body cameras w/ "community activists" think a bunch of Obamas and Rev-runs who as I have said on here before are the ones who really run my city. Their main concern is that these body cameras will paint the Black Community in a bad way and if they can set up a committee to view footage and make a decision's on what can and cannot released to the media and general public. Needless to say I bite my lip and try not to fart in their general direction. We do have a pilot program going on now in a few of our Districts, but it just started last month so the feedback has been limited.
Taken from a different perspective. Can't say I completely disagree, either. Especially this part:
Knowingly doing evil is as low as it gets. That, and that alone, is enough for me to condemn the police.
Huh?
I must be confused. Can you please clarify what you mean here?
Ok. I can empathize with a differing perspective, number 1. Number 2, shooting to kill is evil. It's inhumane, and from the discussions here, is an acceptable way of defending oneself, even when there are four police and on person attempting to reach for a gun.
Just as every cop is a criminal And all the sinners saints As heads is tails Just call me Lucifer Cause I'm in need of some restraint So if you meet me Have some courtesy Have some sympathy, and some taste Use all your well-learned politesse Or I'll lay your soul to waste Pleased to meet you Hope you guessed my name But what's puzzling you Is the nature of my game
Comments
you can't legitimately compare the decision making of one profession that is in no danger to themselves versus another where imminent danger and possible death of themselves is a very real possibility.
I think studies have shown that it just isn't possible for a human to accurately be able to ascertain the level of danger in that type of situation. it's all a crapshoot. I'd have to look it up though.
www.headstonesband.com
We only hear of the cases where a shooting occurs because people are lapping these stories up as the flavor of the year.
The amount of good police work to bad police work is astronomically disproportionate. And I'm not saying this shooting sounds like bad police work- it sounds like idiot went and got himself shot by being an idiot.
Sure glad we didn't read of a cop getting killed on duty. Such a thread would only prompt three people to comment.
I think alot of our problems in this society would dissapear if we switched cops and Senators salaries!
www.headstonesband.com
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
by Michael Malice
About a decade ago BBC Radio interviewed me about one of my books. “Michael,” the DJ said, “you seem to make fun of the police a lot in your book. Do you get into any trouble for that?”
The discussion had been a typically vapid one until that point, and this question seemed in line with that. I thought I’d give a response as typical and vapid as the question. “Well,” I said, “it’s like my father told me growing up: ‘No matter where you go, no matter where you find yourself in the world, the stupidest people are always the cops.’”
The interviewer literally gasped. “Michael! This is a family show!” he snapped, immediately changing the subject. I was baffled. Sure, I’d seen the degree to which people venerate police in red-state culture. But I had never encountered anyone who would find my statement to be noteworthy, let alone transgressive.
I was born in the former Soviet Union and came to the United States when I was two. Because I came to Brooklyn so young, I never considered myself particularly Russian. I only learned to read and write the language in college so I could get an easy A. My fluency was completely conversational and (apparently) heavily accented. At one point, my grandmother told me that I spoke Russian as if I had Down syndrome.
It is only recently, with the escalating segregation of the US into Team Red and Team Blue, that I’ve come to realize just how much being raised in a Russian household affected my thinking. And nowhere is this more evident than in my perspective on the police—or rather, my awareness of the American perspective on the police.
In Russian culture, the police are the enemy. If they come to your home, bad things come with them. I don’t mean “bad” like when the landlord tells you the hot water will be out for a couple of days. I mean “bad” as in your entire life and that of everyone in your family is going to be messed up very heavily and very quickly.
One corollary to this was that calling the cops is considered the worst thing you can do in terms of character. It is almost the equivalent of bringing a rabid dog to your enemy’s house. Yes, your enemy might get what’s coming to them. Maybe. Hopefully. But you’re still stuck with a savage beast to deal with, one that will be just as happy to bite anyone and everyone. And you brought this thing upon your own family? What kind of person are you?
As a consequence of our family culture, I didn’t grow up trusting the police. This was not something that needed to be taught to me. Children are naturally scared of strangers. Most kids hide behind their parents when an unfamiliar (“not of my family”) adult approaches. They are especially scared of authority figures. A call to the principal’s office is a moment of dread, not a ticket to Narnia. One needs to be taught to trust strangers, especially strangers who have nasty demeanors and wear ominous uniforms.
Republicans like to makes fun of progressives for what they describe as “political correctness.” One particularly biting description of political correctness is that of “a disciplined refusal to acknowledge reality.” As the claim goes, liberals pretend that facts they dislike simply aren’t true, even when those facts are perfectly obvious to everyone else.
But conservatives’ views on the police is its own version of political correctness.
Growing up in America, I constantly heard that I could trust the police. They were there to help me and to keep me safe. They were admirable, heroes even. I was told it in school, I read it in comic books, and it was one of the lessons She-Ra imparted to us at the end of an episode. Yet I couldn’t reconcile what I was being taught with what I was seeing with my own eyes. Yes, some police officers were more polite than others. But every single one of them presented themselves as trashy, tacky louts—and I say this as someone who grew up in a Mafia neighborhood, not Park Avenue.
These were not people with capes waving behind them. They were not aspirational figures, Lady Liberty at her best. These were people that I, as an immigrant, desperately wanted to avoid becoming. These were degenerates, America gone soft and repellent. Unless you are taught otherwise, unless you have blinders on, it is impossible to look at police and not see the worst-mannered people in your area. Yes, sometimes they produce good consequences—but so does chemotherapy. That doesn’t mean that people like chemotherapy. Nor is chemo something you want around except in the direst situations. And even then, you want it to be over as quickly as possible.
When we first came to the US, there were several times where my family was treated very poorly. I recall my mom crying one day because the doctor berated her about learning to speak English as she struggled to understand his technical explanations. As a consequence, I always acknowledge whomever I am interacting with as a fellow human. I don’t talk on my phone when the cashier is checking me out. I nod if I make eye contact with someone doing menial work. We’re both people. We might even both be terrible people, but consistently dehumanizing others can’t but lead to bad psychological experiences in the self. And my cost is nil.
But the police are different. Being a cop is the only profession where it’s not only appropriate to yell at strangers—it’s necessary. It’s to choose a career where you place yourself on a plane above everyone else, by law. Their argument goes that “someone” has to do it. Maybe that’s true. To defend becoming a cop is to give the Jack Nicholson speech in A Few Good Men. Perhaps there are a few good men in the police force. But they are far, far outnumbered by the bad apples because of the very nature of the role.
Physicians know to “first, do no harm.” Our legal system is based on the principle that it’s better one hundred guilty men go free than one innocent man be jailed. But being a cop doesn’t work like that. To wear a badge means to traumatize people who are innocent. It’s to harass adults who, upon inspection, have done nothing wrong. That is an unavoidable part of the job, a function of its statistical approach to justice. You put on a badge knowing that you will sometimes do the wrong thing. Once you give up your conscience, once you disregard your accountability for your ethical choices, you’ve given up the most basic thing that makes us human. Knowingly doing evil is as low as it gets. That, and that alone, is enough for me to condemn the police. Not just the “bad” cops, but each and every single one of them.
http://thoughtcatalog.com/michael-malice/2014/12/why-ive-never-respected-the-police/
THE.
FUCK.
www.headstonesband.com
www.headstonesband.com
Do the police deserve more respect?
51% yes, 49% no
(It's too much information to post it all here)
2014 seemed to be the year of attention on the police. We had so many incidents of police seemingly overstepping their bounds, especially when it came to black and minority young and not so young men that we now have an ongoing protest and national debate on police brutality and reform. This may have been a long time coming.
Police departments and supporters have tried to make this national call for police reform to be about a disrespect for the police and authority, but no amount of that attempted spin will work to convince us that police are the ones dealing with a systemic and ongoing problem of respect. The fact that there are some people who do not like the police does not taint an entire movement that is simply trying to draw attention to a dangerous situation that is just not getting any better.
And the issue of cops being out of control is made even worse when police officers act no better than gangs in how they respond to people who dare to try to stand up to bad behavior on their part. One case in point is the reaction by the hundreds of police officers in New York City who turned their backs on the mayor of New York as a sign of their disrespect for him for daring to say something in support of protestors and their right to protest police actions. The police officers’ disrespect for Mayor Bill de Blasio and his right to speak up is in their minds justified even though they don’t think he has the right to speak his mind. Their actions certainly don’t help the situation.
And then there is the officer in Ferguson, Missouri, who admitted he called the Michael Brown makeshift roadside memorial “a pile of trash.” To say that after a man, a boy, was killed, rightly or wrongly, is such a sign of contempt for that community and those that are mourning the loss of a life, and it certainly gives credence to those who think the police have issues with a certain group of people.
There was also the incident in Los Angeles, at a police officer’s retirement party where the singer sang an awful song mocking Michael Brown’s killing, in a room full of cops, and no one stopped him and apparently there was some laughter. The lyrics went in part like this:
"Michael Brown learned a lesson
about a messin’ with a bad … police man
And he’s, bad, bad Michael Brown
Baddest thug in the whole darn town
Badder than an ol' King Kong
Meaner than a junkyard dog
Two men took to fightin’
And Michael punched in through the door
and Michael looked like some old Swiss cheese
His brain was splatter on the floor."
None of these incidents do anything to help the notion that many have, and the point of protests, that police officers and police departments, often have an antagonistic attitude about minority communities, and while police demand respect from the public and those communities, they clearly show none to the people they are supposed to be caring about.
By no means do I think all police are bad. And I, like most people, including most of those asking for reform of police procedures and better training on dealing with minority communities, do support and respect the police for what they do everyday to keep us safe. But that does not mean we don’t have a right to ask for reform and a better policing of the bad apples in the bunch. When police circle the wagons on bad cops and bad behavior on their part, they do themselves a disservice. It is an old lesson, you have to be respectful to get respect. The same way they want communities to rally to drive out bad people and behavior in their midst, that is all the public wants from them as well.
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/columns/police-departments-must-learn-respect-goes-both-ways
Cop Kills 3 people in 21 Weeks...And Gets Promoted
There are some major discrepancies in the reports...
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6837538
Naked, empty hands, shot dead instead of Tasered. Sad story, not many details yet though.
I must be confused. Can you please clarify what you mean here?
Edit-maybe if you guys wouldn't drive up and down "bumpy" roads, your squad cars would be in better shape.
I must be confused. Can you please clarify what you mean here?
Ok. I can empathize with a differing perspective, number 1. Number 2, shooting to kill is evil. It's inhumane, and from the discussions here, is an acceptable way of defending oneself, even when there are four police and on person attempting to reach for a gun.
Just as every cop is a criminal
And all the sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me Lucifer
Cause I'm in need of some restraint
So if you meet me
Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy, and some taste
Use all your well-learned politesse
Or I'll lay your soul to waste
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game