"I don't know if the president loves the United States..."

callen

Last-12-Exit said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

This is absurd and insulting.

I know it appears bad but when Giuliani campaigned every 10th word was 9/11. And the republicans all do it. Use fear to do the work of their handlers, corporations. Osama and Jihad John are many republicans best campaign buddies. Dems do similar.

backseatLover12

hedonist said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

I get calling him out on his comment, but c'mon. What are we, in high school with this shit?

Exactly. Republican politicians have publicly and repeatedly acted like children since the day Obama was elected.

The last part of my post you didn't quote speaks more to my state of mind.

The majority, regardless of party, are acting like immature and indignant little shits.

I was referring to the part I quoted, as I don't know what you're talking about with Michelle. But speaking of which, I'm no proud American for sure. This country has been a disgrace in the world's eye for years, starting with George W Bush. Politicians - all sides - are an embarrassment. They're bringing a country that was once great to the threshold of Hell with their refusal to get their heads out of their asses and out of lobbyists asses.

Last-12-Exit

callen said:

Last-12-Exit said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

This is absurd and insulting.

I know it appears bad but when Giuliani campaigned every 10th word was 9/11. And the republicans all do it. Use fear to do the work of their handlers, corporations. Osama and Jihad John are many republicans best campaign buddies. Dems do similar.

Isn't that what all politicians do? They use what they've done in the past to say what they will do in the future. It's campaigning. Gulliani did an excellent job leading New York during and after the worst attack on America ever.

rr165892

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

I get calling him out on his comment, but c'mon. What are we, in high school with this shit?

Exactly. Republican politicians have publicly and repeatedly acted like children since the day Obama was elected.

The last part of my post you didn't quote speaks more to my state of mind.

The majority, regardless of party, are acting like immature and indignant little shits.

I was referring to the part I quoted, as I don't know what you're talking about with Michelle. But speaking of which, I'm no proud American for sure. This country has been a disgrace in the world's eye for years, starting with George W Bush. Politicians - all sides - are an embarrassment. They're bringing a country that was once great to the threshold of Hell with their refusal to get their heads out of their asses and out of lobbyists asses.

All that aside,I love how some of you on here just love to knock this country and focus on only the negative and never take the time to really think about some of the awesome and wonderful things we do for, and offer the world.It troubles me how anti American this board is.I get it,your right and freedom to feel that way,but remember A lot of blood has been spilled for our freedoms for generations and IMO it's a kick in the balls to all of them. Don't like everything those in power do but I never feel ashamed or un proud of being an American.

Last-12-Exit

At least you don't have to worry about being shot in the back 4 times for bashing this country or the president.

brianlux

Last-12-Exit said:

At least you don't have to worry about being shot in the back 4 times for bashing this country or the president.

For the most part, I tend to agree with you Last 12... but then there's Judi Bari.

rgambs

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

I get calling him out on his comment, but c'mon. What are we, in high school with this shit?

Exactly. Republican politicians have publicly and repeatedly acted like children since the day Obama was elected.

The last part of my post you didn't quote speaks more to my state of mind.

The majority, regardless of party, are acting like immature and indignant little shits.

I was referring to the part I quoted, as I don't know what you're talking about with Michelle. But speaking of which, I'm no proud American for sure. This country has been a disgrace in the world's eye for years, starting with George W Bush. Politicians - all sides - are an embarrassment. They're bringing a country that was once great to the threshold of Hell with their refusal to get their heads out of their asses and out of lobbyists asses.

All that aside,I love how some of you on here just love to knock this country and focus on only the negative and never take the time to really think about some of the awesome and wonderful things we do for, and offer the world.It troubles me how anti American this board is.I get it,your right and freedom to feel that way,but remember A lot of blood has been spilled for our freedoms for generations and IMO it's a kick in the balls to all of them. Don't like everything those in power do but I never feel ashamed or un proud of being an American.

Give one example of blood being spilled for our freedoms. That is an empty platitude.

There is nothing wrong with focusing on the ways in which we could improve.
It's pretty easy to make a case against the indoctrination of patriotism that leads young men to volunteer to kill other young men with which they have NO LEGITIMATE quarrel.

badbrains

Last-12-Exit said:

callen said:

Last-12-Exit said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

This is absurd and insulting.

I know it appears bad but when Giuliani campaigned every 10th word was 9/11. And the republicans all do it. Use fear to do the work of their handlers, corporations. Osama and Jihad John are many republicans best campaign buddies. Dems do similar.

Isn't that what all politicians do? They use what they've done in the past to say what they will do in the future. It's campaigning. Gulliani did an excellent job leading New York during and after the worst attack on America ever.

Excellent job? What the fuck? Ask a firefighter in NYC how good of a job guillani did after 9-11. Ask him why they stopped looking for firefighters bodies after they recovered the gold under all the rubble.

Edit-don't be fooled

rr165892

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

I get calling him out on his comment, but c'mon. What are we, in high school with this shit?

Exactly. Republican politicians have publicly and repeatedly acted like children since the day Obama was elected.

The last part of my post you didn't quote speaks more to my state of mind.

The majority, regardless of party, are acting like immature and indignant little shits.

I was referring to the part I quoted, as I don't know what you're talking about with Michelle. But speaking of which, I'm no proud American for sure. This country has been a disgrace in the world's eye for years, starting with George W Bush. Politicians - all sides - are an embarrassment. They're bringing a country that was once great to the threshold of Hell with their refusal to get their heads out of their asses and out of lobbyists asses.

All that aside,I love how some of you on here just love to knock this country and focus on only the negative and never take the time to really think about some of the awesome and wonderful things we do for, and offer the world.It troubles me how anti American this board is.I get it,your right and freedom to feel that way,but remember A lot of blood has been spilled for our freedoms for generations and IMO it's a kick in the balls to all of them. Don't like everything those in power do but I never feel ashamed or un proud of being an American.

Give one example of blood being spilled for our freedoms. That is an empty platitude.

There is nothing wrong with focusing on the ways in which we could improve.
It's pretty easy to make a case against the indoctrination of patriotism that leads young men to volunteer to kill other young men with which they have NO LEGITIMATE quarrel.

No it's not Gambs.You can go back to Revolutionary war all the way thru WW2.If you are arguing about what war is just,and what blind idealistic leanings those who enlist are following again that's another argument.My point is Many on here talk how they are not proud to be American or they are Ashamed to live here and Ashamed at our country.Like I said before.There is a lot of stuff to be angry about with how our country is run and what direction it is going in?And I think we all agree many actions in our past history are regretful and could be seen as equally if not more brutal then many things we argue about.But that said ,we ae one hot beautiful mess that's not perfect but strives to be a beacon of hope for the entire world.Im proud to be born into such a great place where the sky can be the limit for anyone who is willing to work hard .

It's like when your kids do stupid shit(just you wait) You may be disappointed at them and not like them at that time of the act,but you always continue to love them and want them to learn from the mistakes and be better for it.Same could be said for our relationship with our home,

Last-12-Exit

badbrains said:

Last-12-Exit said:

callen said:

Last-12-Exit said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

This is absurd and insulting.

I know it appears bad but when Giuliani campaigned every 10th word was 9/11. And the republicans all do it. Use fear to do the work of their handlers, corporations. Osama and Jihad John are many republicans best campaign buddies. Dems do similar.

Isn't that what all politicians do? They use what they've done in the past to say what they will do in the future. It's campaigning. Gulliani did an excellent job leading New York during and after the worst attack on America ever.

Excellent job? What the fuck? Ask a firefighter in NYC how good of a job guillani did after 9-11. Ask him why they stopped looking for firefighters bodies after they recovered the gold under all the rubble.

Edit-don't be fooled

I don't know what you are talking about here BB. I have talked to about 30 FDNY fireman that were involved in 9-11 and the vast majority of those guys didn't have a bad word to say about how Gulliani handled his city after 9-11.

callen

Last-12-Exit said:

callen said:

Last-12-Exit said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

This is absurd and insulting.

I know it appears bad but when Giuliani campaigned every 10th word was 9/11. And the republicans all do it. Use fear to do the work of their handlers, corporations. Osama and Jihad John are many republicans best campaign buddies. Dems do similar.

Isn't that what all politicians do? They use what they've done in the past to say what they will do in the future. It's campaigning.

True. So still don't think cartoon posted by Rod was in bad taste. Just true.

badbrains

Last-12-Exit said:

badbrains said:

Last-12-Exit said:

callen said:

Last-12-Exit said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

This is absurd and insulting.

I know it appears bad but when Giuliani campaigned every 10th word was 9/11. And the republicans all do it. Use fear to do the work of their handlers, corporations. Osama and Jihad John are many republicans best campaign buddies. Dems do similar.

Isn't that what all politicians do? They use what they've done in the past to say what they will do in the future. It's campaigning. Gulliani did an excellent job leading New York during and after the worst attack on America ever.

Excellent job? What the fuck? Ask a firefighter in NYC how good of a job guillani did after 9-11. Ask him why they stopped looking for firefighters bodies after they recovered the gold under all the rubble.

Edit-don't be fooled

I don't know what you are talking about here BB. I have talked to about 30 FDNY fireman that were involved in 9-11 and the vast majority of those guys didn't have a bad word to say about how Gulliani handled his city after 9-11.

Scott, for every 30 firefighters happy with him, I'll bring you 30 who can't stand him.

backseatLover12

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

I get calling him out on his comment, but c'mon. What are we, in high school with this shit?

Exactly. Republican politicians have publicly and repeatedly acted like children since the day Obama was elected.

The last part of my post you didn't quote speaks more to my state of mind.

The majority, regardless of party, are acting like immature and indignant little shits.

I was referring to the part I quoted, as I don't know what you're talking about with Michelle. But speaking of which, I'm no proud American for sure. This country has been a disgrace in the world's eye for years, starting with George W Bush. Politicians - all sides - are an embarrassment. They're bringing a country that was once great to the threshold of Hell with their refusal to get their heads out of their asses and out of lobbyists asses.

All that aside,I love how some of you on here just love to knock this country and focus on only the negative and never take the time to really think about some of the awesome and wonderful things we do for, and offer the world.It troubles me how anti American this board is.I get it,your right and freedom to feel that way,but remember A lot of blood has been spilled for our freedoms for generations and IMO it's a kick in the balls to all of them. Don't like everything those in power do but I never feel ashamed or un proud of being an American.

I'll tell you why I'm no proud American, it's not all about government you know. Look around you and you tell me how society has become in this once great nation. Tell me that the gun culture hasn't changed American culture for the worse. Tell me that police brutality isn't a national problem. Tell me that racists are fewer and fewer and more Americans are becoming open-minded and peaceful. Tell me that the poor aren't getting poorer and the 1% aren't gluttonously getting richer. Tell me the Middle Class isn't shrinking. Tell me that rich corporations aren't allowed to buy out politicians. Tell me that denial of a global science affecting our planet is warranted. Tell me that public education isn't crumbling and college is affordable. Tell me that the physical health of our people isn't crumbling with an obesity epidemic.

Because you can't.

On the flip side, we are a lucky 1st world country. We are privileged. We got to this point because of smart leaders. Now tell me where all the smart leaders are now. Tell me that wherever they are, they refuse to be bought. Where are they?

rr165892

That is one very negative view.All doom and gloom.If you want to believe in all that bad shit then that's what you will see all around you.Shit man your glass isn't just 1/2 full it's broken,Discolored and a replacement is out of stock.
I choose to see the good.Thats what's all around you,just take your blinders off and it's easy to see.I see acts of love and kindness and hard work everyday.Hell look at this community.Its benevolent and caring and engaging and we are all really strangers when you get down to it.But you would never know it because of the folks on here are part of what's right.
We are a more exposed society.We are a more I want it now Society.All that is different then the past,but we are not bad.We are not worse off.We don't hate more.Ill give you the we are getting fatter.But as people strive for better hopefully that will change.I think there are plenty of people out there(way more good then bad) that want good.I still think there are honorable and trustful people everywhere and that will always rise above all that other shit.

rr165892

backseat,it's your right and perogative to feel the way you do andI respect that.

muskydan

rr165892 said:

That is one very negative view.All doom and gloom.If you want to believe in all that bad shit then that's what you will see all around you.Shit man your glass isn't just 1/2 full it's broken,Discolored and a replacement is out of stock.
I choose to see the good.Thats what's all around you,just take your blinders off and it's easy to see.I see acts of love and kindness and hard work everyday.Hell look at this community.Its benevolent and caring and engaging and we are all really strangers when you get down to it.But you would never know it because of the folks on here are part of what's right.
We are a more exposed society.We are a more I want it now Society.All that is different then the past,but we are not bad.We are not worse off.We don't hate more.Ill give you the we are getting fatter.But as people strive for better hopefully that will change.I think there are plenty of people out there(way more good then bad) that want good.I still think there are honorable and trustful people everywhere and that will always rise above all that other shit.

No kidding……reading that post was like watching that bit on SNL Debbie Downer.

callen

backseatLover12 said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

I get calling him out on his comment, but c'mon. What are we, in high school with this shit?

Exactly. Republican politicians have publicly and repeatedly acted like children since the day Obama was elected.

The last part of my post you didn't quote speaks more to my state of mind.

The majority, regardless of party, are acting like immature and indignant little shits.

I was referring to the part I quoted, as I don't know what you're talking about with Michelle. But speaking of which, I'm no proud American for sure. This country has been a disgrace in the world's eye for years, starting with George W Bush. Politicians - all sides - are an embarrassment. They're bringing a country that was once great to the threshold of Hell with their refusal to get their heads out of their asses and out of lobbyists asses.

All that aside,I love how some of you on here just love to knock this country and focus on only the negative and never take the time to really think about some of the awesome and wonderful things we do for, and offer the world.It troubles me how anti American this board is.I get it,your right and freedom to feel that way,but remember A lot of blood has been spilled for our freedoms for generations and IMO it's a kick in the balls to all of them. Don't like everything those in power do but I never feel ashamed or un proud of being an American.

I'll tell you why I'm no proud American, it's not all about government you know. Look around you and you tell me how society has become in this once great nation. Tell me that the gun culture hasn't changed American culture for the worse. Tell me that police brutality isn't a national problem. Tell me that racists are fewer and fewer and more Americans are becoming open-minded and peaceful. Tell me that the poor aren't getting poorer and the 1% aren't gluttonously getting richer. Tell me the Middle Class isn't shrinking. Tell me that rich corporations aren't allowed to buy out politicians. Tell me that denial of a global science affecting our planet is warranted. Tell me that public education isn't crumbling and college is affordable. Tell me that the physical health of our people isn't crumbling with an obesity epidemic.

Because you can't.

On the flip side, we are a lucky 1st world country. We are privileged. We got to this point because of smart leaders. Now tell me where all the smart leaders are now. Tell me that wherever they are, they refuse to be bought. Where are they?

Smart leaders running Boeing, P&G, Smith and Wesson and Merck. They are succeeding.

and we have Supreme Court that gives them unlimited influence. Fuck Roberts and rest.

brianlux

I can understand why some of you would look at bsL's post and say, "Man, that's really negative!" But look at each point and tell us they are not true. I can't. I thinks it's healthy to have a positive outlook and I try to do that but, come on guys, don't you ever feel the same way? Do you never feel frustrated that in this country with all of its huge potential and vast (but quickly shrinking) resources, that we are squandering much of that potential and allowing a few really greedy people to make a mess of things? I'm surprised (and frankly, rather disappointed) that more people do get up in arms from time to time about how poorly and selfishly both the powers that be handle things and how so many in our country/culture acquiesce to that power and just assume that as long as we have our cheap McFranken food, cheap gas, and mindless entertainments everything is hunky dory.

It's good to be positively focused- I really believe that- but sometimes it's alright to change the lyric a little to "It's not OK, it's not OK, it's not OK".

gimmesometruth27

brianlux said:

I can understand why some of you would look at bsL's post and say, "Man, that's really negative!" But look at each point and tell us they are not true. I can't. I thinks it's healthy to have a positive outlook and I try to do that but, come on guys, don't you ever feel the same way? Do you never feel frustrated that in this country with all of its huge potential and vast (but quickly shrinking) resources, that we are squandering much of that potential and allowing a few really greedy people to make a mess of things? I'm surprised (and frankly, rather disappointed) that more people do get up in arms from time to time about how poorly and selfishly both the powers that be handle things and how so many in our country/culture acquiesce to that power and just assume that as long as we have our cheap McFranken food, cheap gas, and mindless entertainments everything is hunky dory.

It's good to be positively focused- I really believe that- but sometimes it's alright to change the lyric a little to "It's not OK, it's not OK, it's not OK".

people do not like hearing the hard facts.

problem is, you can not fix any of these problems until you acknowledge that they exist. that is the problem with the people in this country. they can't admit that we have these problems.

rr165892

You can acknowledge the existence of all these issues.We must and it's healthy to do just that.But we don't need to embrace the overwhelming doom and gloom that some feel must accompany these issues.Where is the silver lining in that.
And to Brian's point of course these points are frustrating and mind boggling.But you said it yourself."Getting up in Arms from time to time" is needed.But living under a black blanket with the weight of every issue before us does nothing but cast a darker light on our problems.And that is no way at all to move forward.
Be angry with some of things that are wrong with our imperfect democracy.get mad,protest,educate others(like here