Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
You liberal do gooders ,do realize that after 911 the great Nancy Pelosi was in fact briefed and signed off on "Enhanced Interogation techniques" For which you are sooooo outraged.Everyone was on board after 911.Do your research JC,you will see. Also for those that don't think this ridiculous and careless release is not political ,think again.This is a parting shot by Feinstien before the Rep take over.I hope the are happy that they put many westerners in danger by this stupid partisan bullshit.
Nobody likes Nancy Pelosi, and us liberal dogooders NEVER support torture. Parting shot or last chance to get it into daylight? It is absolutely RIDICULOUS to suggest that torturing is OK but a report about it isn't. I have come to seriously respect you but you sound crazy, like Fox News right now. All this Westerners in danger baloney and tough talk.
Gambs,this subject gets me crazy.I feel the rules have changed.Our "wars"are not like Nam or WW2 anymore.Im not for ripping off nipples with pliers or hacking off toes with hedge clippers or shocking someone until their eyes bleed.But we are seriously fooling ourselves if we think that playing softball is going to gather any actionable intelligence.Are the folks we are fighting playing by those rules?And I question whether the tactics used really are torture.Uncomfortable?Sure.Humiliating?Most certainly but again it's not like a razor blade to the genetalia.Thats torture.Watching someone hurt your family is torture.Listening to load music and not sleeping is an inconvenience.Wearing a diaper(great idea in the pit at aPJ concert).Not torture. Btw I hate Fox News,I'm a CNN guy(mmmm Erin Burnett). The Respect is mutual Gambs.Not agreeing on stuff keeps it fresh and I enjoy the debate.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
What, like an obsession with green paper? Oh wait, that's us. Im no fan of religion, in fact i am a big asshole critic of religion, but at least they believe in something bigger than their own damn selves.
Sleep deprevation,Loud music,uncomfortable positions are 3 of the four items in the report.So that is the torture you guys are worried about? Im sure tickleing with a feather ,and wet willies would also make the list.Lets get real here.We live in a world with evil people and we are not going to contain them by asking nice and offering comfy pillows. These fuckers lop off heads and blow up children and we are worried about pouring water on some scum bag.We are too nice.What the hell are we releasing this for anyway,just stupid.
Ab-Sol-Fuking-lootly…...We are such a joke now to our enemies now. The pusification of American Continues.
Hardly it's the difference between becoming civil or barbarism due to the inability of many to evolve.
We are animals, and continue to treat each other as such. Rise above.
How can anyone defend torture? Black yellow or red, shits wrong. What blows my mind is that we can get info from all over the world. Can read as much as we want on subjects to make our own decessions. And yet we still have people who can see no wrong in what our government is doing. What's that awesome line from that awesome song? "Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country's doing TO YOU!"
Nart ,watch the Movie Unthinkable with Samuel L Jackson.It frames this exact argument perfectly.Its way more complex of an issue then our little conversations on this board.
Will put in que But please explain how. In nutshell we are as barbaric as we claim the enemy to be.
Sleep deprevation,Loud music,uncomfortable positions are 3 of the four items in the report.So that is the torture you guys are worried about? Im sure tickleing with a feather ,and wet willies would also make the list.Lets get real here.We live in a world with evil people and we are not going to contain them by asking nice and offering comfy pillows. These fuckers lop off heads and blow up children and we are worried about pouring water on some scum bag.We are too nice.What the hell are we releasing this for anyway,just stupid.
Ab-Sol-Fuking-lootly…...We are such a joke now to our enemies now. The pusification of American Continues.
Yeah let's sodomize the whole world, that will show our enemies who's tough.
How can anyone defend torture? Black yellow or red, shits wrong. What blows my mind is that we can get info from all over the world. Can read as much as we want on subjects to make our own decessions. And yet we still have people who can see no wrong in what our government is doing. What's that awesome line from that awesome song? "Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country's doing TO YOU!"
Nart ,watch the Movie Unthinkable with Samuel L Jackson.It frames this exact argument perfectly.Its way more complex of an issue then our little conversations on this board.
Will put in que But please explain how. In nutshell we are as barbaric as we claim the enemy to be.
Good Callen,you will enjoy.Its some powerful shit.I don't want to comment anymore about the movie because it will give away needed plot issues.Watch and then let's discuss.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
RR. We are no different Hell we do it for corporations then use religion to get public behind our violence. Why are we in the Middle East?? Fuck we invaded their area of the world. We are the aggressors. Our troops and $$$$ are still contributing to death.
Sleep deprevation,Loud music,uncomfortable positions are 3 of the four items in the report.So that is the torture you guys are worried about? Im sure tickleing with a feather ,and wet willies would also make the list.Lets get real here.We live in a world with evil people and we are not going to contain them by asking nice and offering comfy pillows. These fuckers lop off heads and blow up children and we are worried about pouring water on some scum bag.We are too nice.What the hell are we releasing this for anyway,just stupid.
Ab-Sol-Fuking-lootly…...We are such a joke now to our enemies now. The pusification of American Continues.
You sound like a character from a movie th at would go straight to DVD.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
RR. We are no different Hell we do it for corporations then use religion to get public behind our violence. Why are we in the Middle East?? Fuck we invaded their area of the world. We are the aggressors. Our troops and $$$$ are still contributing to death.
To a certain extent I agree.But we also have protected and supported many also.Our involvement is not all bad.IMO in today's global buisness climate we have to be in many regions,tinkering propping up and developing for the all mighty dollar.We are more interconnected then ever.And as long as we need to keep our economy moving and Fuel in our vehicles it will not change.
Sleep deprevation,Loud music,uncomfortable positions are 3 of the four items in the report.So that is the torture you guys are worried about? Im sure tickleing with a feather ,and wet willies would also make the list.Lets get real here.We live in a world with evil people and we are not going to contain them by asking nice and offering comfy pillows. These fuckers lop off heads and blow up children and we are worried about pouring water on some scum bag.We are too nice.What the hell are we releasing this for anyway,just stupid.
Ab-Sol-Fuking-lootly…...We are such a joke now to our enemies now. The pusification of American Continues.
You sound like a character from a movie th at would go straight to DVD.
Well Roadhouse is one of my All time faves.
Dude,Swayze at 5.6" 150 lbs is not working the door at a Redneck rowdy Roadhouse.Sam Elliott?Maybe. I always thought the stash of spare tires was clever.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
RR. We are no different Hell we do it for corporations then use religion to get public behind our violence. Why are we in the Middle East?? Fuck we invaded their area of the world. We are the aggressors. Our troops and $$$$ are still contributing to death.
To a certain extent I agree.But we also have protected and supported many also.Our involvement is not all bad.IMO in today's global buisness climate we have to be in many regions,tinkering propping up and developing for the all mighty dollar.We are more interconnected then ever.And as long as we need to keep our economy moving and Fuel in our vehicles it will not change.
Wow bro, really? You can't make a statement like this and then get butt hurt when they decide to fight back the only way they can. Cuz you know, they don't have drones and satellites. Why do we have to prop up and develope? You said it perfectly, all mighty dollar.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
RR. We are no different Hell we do it for corporations then use religion to get public behind our violence. Why are we in the Middle East?? Fuck we invaded their area of the world. We are the aggressors. Our troops and $$$$ are still contributing to death.
To a certain extent I agree.But we also have protected and supported many also.Our involvement is not all bad.IMO in today's global buisness climate we have to be in many regions,tinkering propping up and developing for the all mighty dollar.We are more interconnected then ever.And as long as we need to keep our economy moving and Fuel in our vehicles it will not change.
Aren't you basically saying money is more valueable than human life and dignity?
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Because of the report? I think they've been doing plenty of that without it.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
If you're having a hard time thinking about how evil we are do a simple Google image search of drone kills children if you're not into visuals than here are a few sources. These are real people we kill and torture, they have family and friends, real people like like you and me.
PAKISTAN Name | Age | Gender Noor Aziz | 8 | male Abdul Wasit | 17 | male Noor Syed | 8 | male Wajid Noor | 9 | male Syed Wali Shah | 7 | male Ayeesha | 3 | female Qari Alamzeb | 14| male Shoaib | 8 | male Hayatullah KhaMohammad | 16 | male Tariq Aziz | 16 | male Sanaullah Jan | 17 | male Maezol Khan | 8 | female Nasir Khan | male Naeem Khan | male Naeemullah | male Mohammad Tahir | 16 | male Azizul Wahab | 15 | male Fazal Wahab | 16 | male Ziauddin | 16 | male Mohammad Yunus | 16 | male Fazal Hakim | 19 | male Ilyas | 13 | male Sohail | 7 | male Asadullah | 9 | male khalilullah | 9 | male Noor Mohammad | 8 | male Khalid | 12 | male Saifullah | 9 | male Mashooq Jan | 15 | male Nawab | 17 | male Sultanat Khan | 16 | male Ziaur Rahman | 13 | male Noor Mohammad | 15 | male Mohammad Yaas Khan | 16 | male Qari Alamzeb | 14 | male Ziaur Rahman | 17 | male Abdullah | 18 | male Ikramullah Zada | 17 | male Inayatur Rehman | 16 | male Shahbuddin | 15 | male Yahya Khan | 16 |male Rahatullah |17 | male Mohammad Salim | 11 | male Shahjehan | 15 | male Gul Sher Khan | 15 | male Bakht Muneer | 14 | male Numair | 14 | male Mashooq Khan | 16 | male Ihsanullah | 16 | male Luqman | 12 | male Jannatullah | 13 | male Ismail | 12 | male Taseel Khan | 18 | male Zaheeruddin | 16 | male Qari Ishaq | 19 | male Jamshed Khan | 14 | male Alam Nabi | 11 | male Qari Abdul Karim | 19 | male Rahmatullah | 14 | male Abdus Samad | 17 | male Siraj | 16 | male Saeedullah | 17 | male Abdul Waris | 16 | male Darvesh | 13 | male Ameer Said | 15 | male Shaukat | 14 | male Inayatur Rahman | 17 | male Salman | 12 | male Fazal Wahab | 18 | male Baacha Rahman | 13 | male Wali-ur-Rahman | 17 | male Iftikhar | 17 | male Inayatullah | 15 | male Mashooq Khan | 16 | male Ihsanullah | 16 | male Luqman | 12 | male Jannatullah | 13 | male Ismail | 12 | male Abdul Waris | 16 | male Darvesh | 13 | male Ameer Said | 15 | male Shaukat | 14 | male Inayatur Rahman | 17 | male Adnan | 16 | male Najibullah | 13 | male Naeemullah | 17 | male Hizbullah | 10 | male Kitab Gul | 12 | male Wilayat Khan | 11 | male Zabihullah | 16 | male Shehzad Gul | 11 | male Shabir | 15 | male Qari Sharifullah | 17 | male Shafiullah | 16 | male Nimatullah | 14 | male Shakirullah | 16 | male Talha | 8 | male
YEMEN Afrah Ali Mohammed Nasser | 9 | female Zayda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 7 | female Hoda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 5 | female Sheikha Ali Mohammed Nasser | 4 | female Ibrahim Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 13 | male Asmaa Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 9 | male Salma Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | female Fatima Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 3 | female Khadije Ali Mokbel Louqye | 1 | female Hanaa Ali Mokbel Louqye | 6 | female Mohammed Ali Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | male Jawass Mokbel Salem Louqye | 15 | female Maryam Hussein Abdullah Awad | 2 | female Shafiq Hussein Abdullah Awad | 1 | female Sheikha Nasser Mahdi Ahmad Bouh | 3 | female Maha Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 12 | male Soumaya Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 9 | female Shafika Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 4 | female Shafiq Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 2 | male Mabrook Mouqbal Al Qadari | 13 | male Daolah Nasser 10 years | 10 | female AbedalGhani Mohammed Mabkhout | 12 | male Abdel- Rahman Anwar al Awlaki | 16 | male Abdel-Rahman al-Awlaki | 17 | male Nasser Salim | 19
PAKISTAN Name | Age | Gender Noor Aziz | 8 | male Abdul Wasit | 17 | male Noor Syed | 8 | male Wajid Noor | 9 | male Syed Wali Shah | 7 | male Ayeesha | 3 | female Qari Alamzeb | 14| male Shoaib | 8 | male Hayatullah KhaMohammad | 16 | male Tariq Aziz | 16 | male Sanaullah Jan | 17 | male Maezol Khan | 8 | female Nasir Khan | male Naeem Khan | male Naeemullah | male Mohammad Tahir | 16 | male Azizul Wahab | 15 | male Fazal Wahab | 16 | male Ziauddin | 16 | male Mohammad Yunus | 16 | male Fazal Hakim | 19 | male Ilyas | 13 | male Sohail | 7 | male Asadullah | 9 | male khalilullah | 9 | male Noor Mohammad | 8 | male Khalid | 12 | male Saifullah | 9 | male Mashooq Jan | 15 | male Nawab | 17 | male Sultanat Khan | 16 | male Ziaur Rahman | 13 | male Noor Mohammad | 15 | male Mohammad Yaas Khan | 16 | male Qari Alamzeb | 14 | male Ziaur Rahman | 17 | male Abdullah | 18 | male Ikramullah Zada | 17 | male Inayatur Rehman | 16 | male Shahbuddin | 15 | male Yahya Khan | 16 |male Rahatullah |17 | male Mohammad Salim | 11 | male Shahjehan | 15 | male Gul Sher Khan | 15 | male Bakht Muneer | 14 | male Numair | 14 | male Mashooq Khan | 16 | male Ihsanullah | 16 | male Luqman | 12 | male Jannatullah | 13 | male Ismail | 12 | male Taseel Khan | 18 | male Zaheeruddin | 16 | male Qari Ishaq | 19 | male Jamshed Khan | 14 | male Alam Nabi | 11 | male Qari Abdul Karim | 19 | male Rahmatullah | 14 | male Abdus Samad | 17 | male Siraj | 16 | male Saeedullah | 17 | male Abdul Waris | 16 | male Darvesh | 13 | male Ameer Said | 15 | male Shaukat | 14 | male Inayatur Rahman | 17 | male Salman | 12 | male Fazal Wahab | 18 | male Baacha Rahman | 13 | male Wali-ur-Rahman | 17 | male Iftikhar | 17 | male Inayatullah | 15 | male Mashooq Khan | 16 | male Ihsanullah | 16 | male Luqman | 12 | male Jannatullah | 13 | male Ismail | 12 | male Abdul Waris | 16 | male Darvesh | 13 | male Ameer Said | 15 | male Shaukat | 14 | male Inayatur Rahman | 17 | male Adnan | 16 | male Najibullah | 13 | male Naeemullah | 17 | male Hizbullah | 10 | male Kitab Gul | 12 | male Wilayat Khan | 11 | male Zabihullah | 16 | male Shehzad Gul | 11 | male Shabir | 15 | male Qari Sharifullah | 17 | male Shafiullah | 16 | male Nimatullah | 14 | male Shakirullah | 16 | male Talha | 8 | male
YEMEN Afrah Ali Mohammed Nasser | 9 | female Zayda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 7 | female Hoda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 5 | female Sheikha Ali Mohammed Nasser | 4 | female Ibrahim Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 13 | male Asmaa Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 9 | male Salma Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | female Fatima Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 3 | female Khadije Ali Mokbel Louqye | 1 | female Hanaa Ali Mokbel Louqye | 6 | female Mohammed Ali Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | male Jawass Mokbel Salem Louqye | 15 | female Maryam Hussein Abdullah Awad | 2 | female Shafiq Hussein Abdullah Awad | 1 | female Sheikha Nasser Mahdi Ahmad Bouh | 3 | female Maha Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 12 | male Soumaya Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 9 | female Shafika Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 4 | female Shafiq Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 2 | male Mabrook Mouqbal Al Qadari | 13 | male Daolah Nasser 10 years | 10 | female AbedalGhani Mohammed Mabkhout | 12 | male Abdel- Rahman Anwar al Awlaki | 16 | male Abdel-Rahman al-Awlaki | 17 | male Nasser Salim | 19
That's some fucken list of terrorists.
Good way to create enemies and perpetuate war, wouldn't you say?
Approximately 200 people died in U.S. custody, including at least a dozen during or shortly after interrogations.
Killed by interrogation techniques that are so soft rr makes light of them. What pussies, right?....I mean...at least they weren't beheaded, that's a way worse way to go than being tortured to death, right? Oh, but these were 'scum bags', not journalists..... Well, maybe...But how many innocent people were detained and, as mentioned, released without charge? Will we get full investigations into the 'dozen' (nice guess?) killed while being tortured? Is it possible the US tortured innocent people to death? Were there innocents amongst the hundreds who died in custody?
Sleep deprevation,Loud music,uncomfortable positions are 3 of the four items in the report.So that is the torture you guys are worried about? Im sure tickleing with a feather ,and wet willies would also make the list.Lets get real here.We live in a world with evil people and we are not going to contain them by asking nice and offering comfy pillows. These fuckers lop off heads and blow up children and we are worried about pouring water on some scum bag.We are too nice.What the hell are we releasing this for anyway,just stupid.
Ironic. So who are the Evil Ones??
Well Cal I'm sure you guys think it's us.You know those evil Americans with our freedoms of speech and religion.The same ones who let our ladies drive and school girls study.How dare Us. Has our foreign policy been a mess? Have we also done things that are not kosher?Sure,But let's not pretend that those innocent jihadists are not a problem.We at least don't "try" to run up an innocent body count.
You don't? So the use of depleted uranium shells, mini-nukes/'bunker busters' etc - guaranteed to kill innocents, has always been an accident? The US didn't 'try' to drop A-bombs on entire cities? Those helicopter pilots killing journalists and then the paramedics that came to help, on orders?....oops. I could come up with endless examples of actions where innocent victims were written off as collateral damage, as a matter of policy: not accidental deaths. When 'they' do it - it's terrorism. When 'we' do it - it's 'not kosher'. almost funny. I'll keep reminding you here as well.....ISIS is a US/ally creation and proxy in Syria. You're deflecting... right back at yourself.
Deflecting what Drowned? I know you get all hot and bothered every time we have a us(US/the west)vs Them conversation.You always take the anti west stance especially when the Middle East is involved.Why? Bringing WW2 and its Harsh realities don't apply to this conversation.Every modern country has past regrets based on war.From the Roman Empire to Nazi Germany to our Attacks on Japan. I don't condone atrocities Commited by us and I sure as hell don't about those who want to inflict harm. I don't disagree about our part in creating the ISIS problem ,but we cannot just walk away and let that type of ideology run rough shot on the Middle East.
Deflecting = your casus belli for torture - the 'jihadi threat' that we helped create, and still support, that you don't disagree about. I don't take an anti-west stance, I take an anti-war, pro-human rights stance. We are the aggressors in the middle east. If these discussions started with another nation's invasion of the US, and what we have done about it, I might have a different tone. I don't think in 'us against them' or 'for us or against us' absolutes.
I mentioned WW2 as an example (the biggest example) of why the West has no moral high ground - it does apply to this conversation. Which harsh realities necessitated dropping nukes on two cities at the end of the war? Total two-faced bullshit for you to say you don't condone american atrocities. Torture is an atrocity. Wars of aggression to keep 'fuel in your vehicle' is an atrocity. You've openly condoned both in this thread. So spare me the false sympathy for YOUR victims. Yes, YOUR. YOU, and people like you on both sides, are the reason this shit happens.
Let me ask you this - is it ok and justifiable for other countries to torture captured US troops? How about your own citizens?
Remember these policies apply to YOU as well. Your government can torture US citizens without repercussion. Think about the precedent that sets. Or maybe ask Samuel Jackson if you prefer to form opinions based on Hollywood fiction/CIA propaganda.
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
RR. We are no different Hell we do it for corporations then use religion to get public behind our violence. Why are we in the Middle East?? Fuck we invaded their area of the world. We are the aggressors. Our troops and $$$$ are still contributing to death.
To a certain extent I agree.But we also have protected and supported many also.Our involvement is not all bad.IMO in today's global buisness climate we have to be in many regions,tinkering propping up and developing for the all mighty dollar.We are more interconnected then ever.And as long as we need to keep our economy moving and Fuel in our vehicles it will not change.
Aren't you basically saying money is more valueable than human life and dignity?
Torture is not ok. But guess what? The United states will always do it. If you think for a millisecond that this report will stop torture, you're simply naive and wrong. And you know what else? Every other country in the world will to it too. Think about how evil we are for threatening to kill someones family member the next time you watch another American get his head cut off by a dull knife because of this ridiculous report.
Oh that's just plain ridiculous. If everyone knows we torture why is this report going to make someone cut someone's head off?? It can't be both. People don't join terrorist orgs because of Senate reports, they join because their village, their family, their country is being bombed.
Or because of a twisted religious dogma.
RR. We are no different Hell we do it for corporations then use religion to get public behind our violence. Why are we in the Middle East?? Fuck we invaded their area of the world. We are the aggressors. Our troops and $$$$ are still contributing to death.
To a certain extent I agree.But we also have protected and supported many also.Our involvement is not all bad.IMO in today's global buisness climate we have to be in many regions,tinkering propping up and developing for the all mighty dollar.We are more interconnected then ever.And as long as we need to keep our economy moving and Fuel in our vehicles it will not change.
Aren't you basically saying money is more valueable than human life and dignity?
I'm saying Thats how it is,I'm not saying the motivation is just.
Approximately 200 people died in U.S. custody, including at least a dozen during or shortly after interrogations.
Killed by interrogation techniques that are so soft rr makes light of them. What pussies, right?....I mean...at least they weren't beheaded, that's a way worse way to go than being tortured to death, right? Oh, but these were 'scum bags', not journalists..... Well, maybe...But how many innocent people were detained and, as mentioned, released without charge? Will we get full investigations into the 'dozen' (nice guess?) killed while being tortured? Is it possible the US tortured innocent people to death? Were there innocents amongst the hundreds who died in custody?
Sleep deprevation,Loud music,uncomfortable positions are 3 of the four items in the report.So that is the torture you guys are worried about? Im sure tickleing with a feather ,and wet willies would also make the list.Lets get real here.We live in a world with evil people and we are not going to contain them by asking nice and offering comfy pillows. These fuckers lop off heads and blow up children and we are worried about pouring water on some scum bag.We are too nice.What the hell are we releasing this for anyway,just stupid.
Ironic. So who are the Evil Ones??
Well Cal I'm sure you guys think it's us.You know those evil Americans with our freedoms of speech and religion.The same ones who let our ladies drive and school girls study.How dare Us. Has our foreign policy been a mess? Have we also done things that are not kosher?Sure,But let's not pretend that those innocent jihadists are not a problem.We at least don't "try" to run up an innocent body count.
You don't? So the use of depleted uranium shells, mini-nukes/'bunker busters' etc - guaranteed to kill innocents, has always been an accident? The US didn't 'try' to drop A-bombs on entire cities? Those helicopter pilots killing journalists and then the paramedics that came to help, on orders?....oops. I could come up with endless examples of actions where innocent victims were written off as collateral damage, as a matter of policy: not accidental deaths. When 'they' do it - it's terrorism. When 'we' do it - it's 'not kosher'. almost funny. I'll keep reminding you here as well.....ISIS is a US/ally creation and proxy in Syria. You're deflecting... right back at yourself.
Deflecting what Drowned? I know you get all hot and bothered every time we have a us(US/the west)vs Them conversation.You always take the anti west stance especially when the Middle East is involved.Why? Bringing WW2 and its Harsh realities don't apply to this conversation.Every modern country has past regrets based on war.From the Roman Empire to Nazi Germany to our Attacks on Japan. I don't condone atrocities Commited by us and I sure as hell don't about those who want to inflict harm. I don't disagree about our part in creating the ISIS problem ,but we cannot just walk away and let that type of ideology run rough shot on the Middle East.
Deflecting = your casus belli for torture - the 'jihadi threat' that we helped create, and still support, that you don't disagree about. I don't take an anti-west stance, I take an anti-war, pro-human rights stance. We are the aggressors in the middle east. If these discussions started with another nation's invasion of the US, and what we have done about it, I might have a different tone. I don't think in 'us against them' or 'for us or against us' absolutes.
I mentioned WW2 as an example (the biggest example) of why the West has no moral high ground - it does apply to this conversation. Which harsh realities necessitated dropping nukes on two cities at the end of the war? Total two-faced bullshit for you to say you don't condone american atrocities. Torture is an atrocity. Wars of aggression to keep 'fuel in your vehicle' is an atrocity. You've openly condoned both in this thread. So spare me the false sympathy for YOUR victims. Yes, YOUR. YOU, and people like you on both sides, are the reason this shit happens.
Let me ask you this - is it ok and justifiable for other countries to torture captured US troops? How about your own citizens?
Remember these policies apply to YOU as well. Your government can torture US citizens without repercussion. Think about the precedent that sets. Or maybe ask Samuel Jackson if you prefer to form opinions based on Hollywood fiction/CIA propaganda.
You are going under the assumption that P.O.W s of known nations are the one being tortured(again I don't see what we did as torture)It isn't.It was terror suspects for which the Geneva convention does not apply right? And we are not the lone aggressors in the Middle East.Lots of bad actors there.I brought up the movie because it covers this debate to a tee.Not because I saw it as gospel.And if you truly are so worried about Human rights then why not call out those your defending for those sins commited on a daily basis against their own people. You want to wrap this up nice and tight like its a black and white,open and closed issue but it way more complex with so many tangents. I do enjoy your responses though Drowned always though provoking.
Comments
Btw I hate Fox News,I'm a CNN guy(mmmm Erin Burnett).
The Respect is mutual Gambs.Not agreeing on stuff keeps it fresh and I enjoy the debate.
well done america. you should be really proud.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
free press? free country? beacon of a city on a hill? best country in the world?? it is all bullshit now.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=9246
What percentage of Americans are involved with torture vs. percentage of Muslims involved in jihad?
We are animals, and continue to treat each other as such. Rise above.
USA USA USA USA.
Fucking charade and so easy to pull it off.
I always thought the stash of spare tires was clever.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
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2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/nov/24/-sp-us-drone-strikes-kill-1147
http://droneswatch.org/2013/01/20/list-of-children-killed-by-drone-strikes-in-pakistan-and-yemen/
Name | Age | Gender
Noor Aziz | 8 | male
Abdul Wasit | 17 | male
Noor Syed | 8 | male
Wajid Noor | 9 | male
Syed Wali Shah | 7 | male
Ayeesha | 3 | female
Qari Alamzeb | 14| male
Shoaib | 8 | male
Hayatullah KhaMohammad | 16 | male
Tariq Aziz | 16 | male
Sanaullah Jan | 17 | male
Maezol Khan | 8 | female
Nasir Khan | male
Naeem Khan | male
Naeemullah | male
Mohammad Tahir | 16 | male
Azizul Wahab | 15 | male
Fazal Wahab | 16 | male
Ziauddin | 16 | male
Mohammad Yunus | 16 | male
Fazal Hakim | 19 | male
Ilyas | 13 | male
Sohail | 7 | male
Asadullah | 9 | male
khalilullah | 9 | male
Noor Mohammad | 8 | male
Khalid | 12 | male
Saifullah | 9 | male
Mashooq Jan | 15 | male
Nawab | 17 | male
Sultanat Khan | 16 | male
Ziaur Rahman | 13 | male
Noor Mohammad | 15 | male
Mohammad Yaas Khan | 16 | male
Qari Alamzeb | 14 | male
Ziaur Rahman | 17 | male
Abdullah | 18 | male
Ikramullah Zada | 17 | male
Inayatur Rehman | 16 | male
Shahbuddin | 15 | male
Yahya Khan | 16 |male
Rahatullah |17 | male
Mohammad Salim | 11 | male
Shahjehan | 15 | male
Gul Sher Khan | 15 | male
Bakht Muneer | 14 | male
Numair | 14 | male
Mashooq Khan | 16 | male
Ihsanullah | 16 | male
Luqman | 12 | male
Jannatullah | 13 | male
Ismail | 12 | male
Taseel Khan | 18 | male
Zaheeruddin | 16 | male
Qari Ishaq | 19 | male
Jamshed Khan | 14 | male
Alam Nabi | 11 | male
Qari Abdul Karim | 19 | male
Rahmatullah | 14 | male
Abdus Samad | 17 | male
Siraj | 16 | male
Saeedullah | 17 | male
Abdul Waris | 16 | male
Darvesh | 13 | male
Ameer Said | 15 | male
Shaukat | 14 | male
Inayatur Rahman | 17 | male
Salman | 12 | male
Fazal Wahab | 18 | male
Baacha Rahman | 13 | male
Wali-ur-Rahman | 17 | male
Iftikhar | 17 | male
Inayatullah | 15 | male
Mashooq Khan | 16 | male
Ihsanullah | 16 | male
Luqman | 12 | male
Jannatullah | 13 | male
Ismail | 12 | male
Abdul Waris | 16 | male
Darvesh | 13 | male
Ameer Said | 15 | male
Shaukat | 14 | male
Inayatur Rahman | 17 | male
Adnan | 16 | male
Najibullah | 13 | male
Naeemullah | 17 | male
Hizbullah | 10 | male
Kitab Gul | 12 | male
Wilayat Khan | 11 | male
Zabihullah | 16 | male
Shehzad Gul | 11 | male
Shabir | 15 | male
Qari Sharifullah | 17 | male
Shafiullah | 16 | male
Nimatullah | 14 | male
Shakirullah | 16 | male
Talha | 8 | male
YEMEN
Afrah Ali Mohammed Nasser | 9 | female
Zayda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 7 | female
Hoda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 5 | female
Sheikha Ali Mohammed Nasser | 4 | female
Ibrahim Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 13 | male
Asmaa Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 9 | male
Salma Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | female
Fatima Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 3 | female
Khadije Ali Mokbel Louqye | 1 | female
Hanaa Ali Mokbel Louqye | 6 | female
Mohammed Ali Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | male
Jawass Mokbel Salem Louqye | 15 | female
Maryam Hussein Abdullah Awad | 2 | female
Shafiq Hussein Abdullah Awad | 1 | female
Sheikha Nasser Mahdi Ahmad Bouh | 3 | female
Maha Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 12 | male
Soumaya Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 9 | female
Shafika Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 4 | female
Shafiq Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 2 | male
Mabrook Mouqbal Al Qadari | 13 | male
Daolah Nasser 10 years | 10 | female
AbedalGhani Mohammed Mabkhout | 12 | male
Abdel- Rahman Anwar al Awlaki | 16 | male
Abdel-Rahman al-Awlaki | 17 | male
Nasser Salim | 19
That's some fucken list of terrorists.
I don't think this report will cause anyone to die directly. It'll just be used as a recruitment tool for Isis and al queda.
I don't take an anti-west stance, I take an anti-war, pro-human rights stance. We are the aggressors in the middle east. If these discussions started with another nation's invasion of the US, and what we have done about it, I might have a different tone. I don't think in 'us against them' or 'for us or against us' absolutes.
I mentioned WW2 as an example (the biggest example) of why the West has no moral high ground - it does apply to this conversation. Which harsh realities necessitated dropping nukes on two cities at the end of the war?
Total two-faced bullshit for you to say you don't condone american atrocities. Torture is an atrocity. Wars of aggression to keep 'fuel in your vehicle' is an atrocity. You've openly condoned both in this thread. So spare me the false sympathy for YOUR victims. Yes, YOUR. YOU, and people like you on both sides, are the reason this shit happens.
Let me ask you this - is it ok and justifiable for other countries to torture captured US troops?
How about your own citizens?
Remember these policies apply to YOU as well. Your government can torture US citizens without repercussion. Think about the precedent that sets. Or maybe ask Samuel Jackson if you prefer to form opinions based on Hollywood fiction/CIA propaganda.
US Soldiers Rape,Murder & Burn 14 years old Iraqi…:
And we are not the lone aggressors in the Middle East.Lots of bad actors there.I brought up the movie because it covers this debate to a tee.Not because I saw it as gospel.And if you truly are so worried about Human rights then why not call out those your defending for those sins commited on a daily basis against their own people.
You want to wrap this up nice and tight like its a black and white,open and closed issue but it way more complex with so many tangents.
I do enjoy your responses though Drowned always though provoking.