That guy was in that choke hold for about 7 seconds. I'm not sure how much of those seconds resulted in him not being able to breathe. But if you are talking, you are breathing. I think from hearing that autopsy report, the worse part was after the choke hold, the 5 or 6 cops were all kneeling on him. That is worse than the choke. The pressure in his chest and lungs seemed to have triggered his asthma and COPD issue. The combination of the two were obviously deadly.
I am not defending the cops. I don't see any reason why they had to 1) put him in the choke hold to begin with and 2) all of those cops did not need to be kneeling on him while they were cuffing him.It's sensless.
The guy was somewhat resisting arrest which appears to be why the choke hold was used. But no reason for them to not expidite an ambulance to the scene. or offer some other aid. I know for a fact that some police officers here where I live carry O2 cylinders with nasal cannulas and nonrebreathers. Maybe that's not the case in NYPD.
Either way, the police brutality is turning into just another common occurance. Like school shootings, when I hear about it, it's just like business as usual.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Someone had a great quote...if he was selling junk bonds, derivatives or worthless mortgage backed securities instead of loose cigarettes he would be alive
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Care to add to the discussion or are you just here to mock those with whom you disagree? Here on the boards you are not setting the best example for police having maturity, discretion and articulate intelligence.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Care to add to the discussion or are you just here to mock those with whom you disagree? You are not setting the best example for police having maturity, discretion and articulate intelligence on these boards.
I did add to the discussion... Plus I am very fragile and my ego simply cannot handle the name calling. Thanks again for the tip. Today is now going to be a breeze of a day.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Care to add to the discussion or are you just here to mock those with whom you disagree? You are not setting the best example for police having maturity, discretion and articulate intelligence on these boards.
I did add to the discussion... Plus I am very fragile and my ego simply cannot handle the name calling. Thanks again for the tip. Today is now going to be a breeze of a day.
Sol Rosenberg "punitive damages, that you're giving me!"
allegedly these are cops reaction about Garner decision on policeone.com CMTSU!
"Somewhere along the line we became the bad guys."
"Watch your backs out there. Oh your fronts and sides too. Going to get nasty. Unless of course they let us do our job kick some thug ass."
" Every now and then we win one. Horrible situation, man lost his life, but like in the Ferguson case he controlled his own destiny."
" Stay safe, brothers. You're in for another set of riots." | ah yes the dangerous die-ins and arm locking all over the place. "riots"
"People are sick and tired of thugs. Certain people better wake the hell up and stop supporting the thugs."
" I don't see any wrongdoing, and certainly no criminal conduct on their part."
"The criminal weighed in above 300 lbs. and was combative. Case Closed!"
"Congratulations to the officers being cleared."
"Politics has changed our lives the media is turning our world upside down."
"You know what, who gives a fat rats ass how the cop grabbed Garner he resisted arrest and was asked many times to turn around and submit."
"the press minimizes what the criminal did, and vilifies the evil 'White NYC-officer' portraying him killing a harmless 'unarmed black man'"
"You know this kind of lawlessness wouldn't have lasted two days in the 80"s -90"s god,I miss those days."
" Looks like another week or so of chasing around these thugs, letting them have their way."
" It has become extremely difficult to be a good police officer these days. We have to work around race baiters, cop haters."
" Having watched this video, it's clearly another case of someone being non-compliant.."
"Maybe some day, the majority of the public will look up from the TV and wonder what the hell happened to the country." "Maybe they will actually want to see the laws that they passed enforced. Maybe they will want to feel safe in their communities."
" look at these things from the point of view of officer survival. Not surviving the fight, but surviving getting thrown under the bus."
"Instead of suing the police department, his (#EricGarner) family should sue Papa Johns, Dominos, Pizza Hut, Burger King, McDonalds, etc..."
"Just another criminal caught in the middle of committing a crime."
"What is being presented as racial problems between police & blacks is actually a black cultural problem of refusing authority of any type"
"1.Do NOT under any circumstance ARGUE with police out in the street. You cannot win an argument with police out in the field." 2. Do NOt raise your voice, but stay cool and calm. Do NOT make any quick or aggressive movements." "3.Police know that hands kill, so always keep your hands in plain sight. Before you move your hands ask permission," "4.NEVER run from police even if you are innocent." "5.DO NOT resist arrest – if you do one of three things is going to happen:" "a.You are going to get beat down till you stop resisting b.You are going to get injured or 'accidentally' killed""c.And you are going to have charges taken out against you"
"Biblically, it's all there in black and white print..."Do what is right and obey the peace keepers!""
"To the criminals in protest,don't break the law and do what the authorities tell you to do."
"He killed himself by getting so worked up over refusing to follow simple and lawful commands."
"What choke hold? You mean the attempted "Carotid Restraint Hold" that lasted for several seconds on "Fatso" the walking heart attack?"
"We are trained to ARREST those that need arresting = AND use whatever force we see needed to avoid OURS getting killed"
"Now the NYPD will terminate Pantaleo and he'll have to fight to get his job back. Good luck, brother."
"Eric Gardner and Michael Brown are dead because of the poor choices they made when lawfully confronted by the police."
The guy was somewhat resisting arrest which appears to be why the choke hold was used. But no reason for them to not expidite an ambulance to the scene. or offer some other aid. I know for a fact that some police officers here where I live carry O2 cylinders with nasal cannulas and nonrebreathers. Maybe that's not the case in NYPD.
Either way, the police brutality is turning into just another common occurance. Like school shootings, when I hear about it, it's just like business as usual.
Sadly, I agree with your last part. It's as if my outrage passes quicker and quicker over time. Ridiculous.
And this guy was arrested 30 times? True, it's a very petty crime, but jesus.
Jc, you're filling these threads with all of these links that don't have anything to do with the topic. It's becoming quite the chore filtering through what is relevant and what is nonsense.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
I'm not actually sure what you mean by "blinders on policing", but in the context of it being a reply to rgambs' post, it sounds as if you are referring to police discretion as to whether, and how, to enforce a law at any particular point based on public interest. I believe that police already have this discretion. Just one example from our jurisdiction - after a couple of highly publicized high speed chases that ended badly (one fatally), the police are now directed not to engage in a high speed chase (unless there is very clear evidence that they need to to preserve immediate public safety). Since then, there have been a few cases in which they broke off a chase and instead managed to get other officers to stop the vehicle further along, and all have ended well, without injury to anyone. Another example - when responding to "mental health calls", police are strongly encourage to hang back, try to engage in non-threatening dialogue, and not try to rush in and "subdue" the individual or "take control" of the situation; again, these tend to end much better, and we see less violence, not more. Well trained and thoughtful police can always choose whether there is an alternative to just charging in.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Jc, you're filling these threads with all of these links that don't have anything to do with the topic. It's becoming quite the chore filtering through what is relevant and what is nonsense.
This is irrelevant to the topic. Just because a cop put a kid in a choke hold does not make it relevant to the guy that died in NYC. What does this add to this topic? Seriously?
This is also irrelevant. This move to evade a choke hold doesn't matter one bit. Why? Because there were 4 or 5 other officers there ready to pounce as soon as he "escaped."
Remember, the choke hold was not the cause of death. He was alive when they let go of it. It was certainly a factor. But the officers all kneeling on his back was far more damaging than the choke hold.
This is irrelevant to the topic. Just because a cop put a kid in a choke hold does not make it relevant to the guy that died in NYC. What does this add to this topic? Seriously?
you asked why are chokeholds illegal? that video shows a corpus christi cop putting a choke hold on a girl that refused to show id, he threatened to shoot her. after the investigation the chief said althou it is not illegal to use choke holds its not prudent or common to use choke holds to induce compliance. the cop wasnt charged for choke hold or threat to shoot the girl.
This is also irrelevant. This move to evade a choke hold doesn't matter one bit. Why? Because there were 4 or 5 other officers there ready to pounce as soon as he "escaped."
Remember, the choke hold was not the cause of death. He was alive when they let go of it. It was certainly a factor. But the officers all kneeling on his back was far more damaging than the choke hold.
self defense is very important... the girl was asked for id outside of a restaurant and then put in a choke hold, this can happen at a PJ concert. its obvious from your comment "if you're talking, you're breathing" that you were never put in a choke hold so i posted the video just in case you were ever put in one. well we're clogging up the threads with this nonsense so back to the topic at hand.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Y'know... I'm getting a little bit tired of you telling every single person here who disagrees with you and backs up their opinion with case studies or statistics that we're deluded, don't understand the hardships of your job, or are taking the popular opinion. Or just making a complete mockery of everything we say.
My theory? You, and many police officers at this point in time, are having trouble coping with the fact that you might now be discriminated against because of a demographic you belong to. How ironic.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Y'know... I'm getting a little bit tired of you telling every single person here who disagrees with you and backs up their opinion with case studies or statistics that we're deluded, don't understand the hardships of your job, or are taking the popular opinion. Or just making a complete mockery of everything we say.
My theory? You, and many police officers at this point in time, are having trouble coping with the fact that you might now be discriminated against because of a demographic you belong to. How ironic.
It's always been that way Pal, atleast in my town. I will never forget what my Feild training officer said 2 me on my first day.....kid, congratulations ..you are now closer to going 2 jail than you ever have been in your life putting on that uniform, just don't get yourself killed. I thought he was an old crusty veteran that was out of touch and didn't care anymore, but boy I was wrong. Liberal Society is going to get the kind of Policing that they are demanding and that is quite fine with me and everyone I work with. Taking reports and waiting for backup w/ in progress calls is a lot safer for us and apparently citizens. The Police will take the blame as we always do when homicides and shootings skyrocket in urban areas And all the community activist/revruns will be up in arms again for the Police not being aggressive enough dealing with the thug- life element. The song remains the same....been through this countless of times in my town.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Y'know... I'm getting a little bit tired of you telling every single person here who disagrees with you and backs up their opinion with case studies or statistics that we're deluded, don't understand the hardships of your job, or are taking the popular opinion. Or just making a complete mockery of everything we say.
My theory? You, and many police officers at this point in time, are having trouble coping with the fact that you might now be discriminated against because of a demographic you belong to. How ironic.
It's always been that way Pal, atleast in my town. I will never forget what my Feild training officer said 2 me on my first day.....kid, congratulations ..you are now closer to going 2 jail than you ever have been in your life putting on that uniform, just don't get yourself killed. I thought he was an old crusty veteran that was out of touch and didn't care anymore, but boy I was wrong. Liberal Society is going to get the kind of Policing that they are demanding and that is quite fine with me and everyone I work with. Taking reports and waiting for backup w/ in progress calls is a lot safer for us and apparently citizens. The Police will take the blame as we always do when homicides and shootings skyrocket in urban areas And all the community activist/revruns will be up in arms again for the Police not being aggressive enough dealing with the thug- life element. The song remains the same....been through this countless of times in my town.
This right here is the crux of the problem we have. Some police don't consider themselves part of the community they are policing. It's us vs. them, we are the enemy, and that's very problematic and scary.
This one is just tragic.Id call this one a accidental death,a tragedy.I really didn't see excessive force.No guns,tazers,pepper spray.Just Cops trying to arrest a big dude who was not making it easy.This wasn't murder by a long shot.Horrible and tragic and unnecessary yes but I watch the video a few times and I don't see a bunch of gung-ho storm troopers.Just typical police work that had a bad accident.
What amount of force is necessary for a man selling loose cigarettes? To me it seems to be NONE. Typical police work, I agree, that's exactly the problem. Escalate what should be a citation and a goodbye into a show of force which carries the risk of tragedy for civilian and officer alike.
Not the act .The amount of force is relative to his size and non compliance and his perceived escalating hostile demeanor. It sucks and any death is horrible but they could not just sit back and do nothing. I do agree it is not a good outcome and senseless waste of life.
I disagree, sit back and do nothing is exactly what they could have done. This man posed no threat, real or potential, to anybody and they could/should have written him a citation and a summons and went about their day or ignored him entirely. Instead, they chose a display of force so they could show him how tough they are. Meanwhile, how often does a cop or firefighter get a traffic citation? They can turn a blind eye to that but they have to be out there policing the looseys. Broken window policing is racially disparate, just like stop and frisk, and both are bad policy because they lead to unnecessary confrontations with the risk of violence or death. Should every pot smoker be arrested? Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs? Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes. Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested. But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Damit!! I got coffee and donut stains all over me again...That's the second shirt I ruined from laughing so hard at a post. This blinders on policing is starting to sound better and better and safer for everyone apparently... Interesting concept. Thanks for the tip.
Y'know... I'm getting a little bit tired of you telling every single person here who disagrees with you and backs up their opinion with case studies or statistics that we're deluded, don't understand the hardships of your job, or are taking the popular opinion. Or just making a complete mockery of everything we say.
My theory? You, and many police officers at this point in time, are having trouble coping with the fact that you might now be discriminated against because of a demographic you belong to. How ironic.
It's always been that way Pal, atleast in my town. I will never forget what my Feild training officer said 2 me on my first day.....kid, congratulations ..you are now closer to going 2 jail than you ever have been in your life putting on that uniform, just don't get yourself killed. I thought he was an old crusty veteran that was out of touch and didn't care anymore, but boy I was wrong. Liberal Society is going to get the kind of Policing that they are demanding and that is quite fine with me and everyone I work with. Taking reports and waiting for backup w/ in progress calls is a lot safer for us and apparently citizens. The Police will take the blame as we always do when homicides and shootings skyrocket in urban areas And all the community activist/revruns will be up in arms again for the Police not being aggressive enough dealing with the thug- life element. The song remains the same....been through this countless of times in my town.
And what is "liberal society?" It's amazing how many people I see throwing that word around.
I can't fathom how anyone in a union (police, fire, teacher, etc.) or the military can identify with the republican party. You should embrace liberals my friend. Your paycheck depends on it.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
Comments
I am not defending the cops. I don't see any reason why they had to 1) put him in the choke hold to begin with and 2) all of those cops did not need to be kneeling on him while they were cuffing him.It's sensless.
Either way, the police brutality is turning into just another common occurance. Like school shootings, when I hear about it, it's just like business as usual.
Should every pot smoker be arrested?
Should we start arresting people for speeding and failure to stop at stop signs?
Should we arrest people for jaywalking? Where does it end?
This man was arrested, what 30 times? Over untaxed cigarettes.
Mitt Romney doesn't get arrested for millions in tax evasion. Billions in fraud and tax evasion in the financial collapse, nobody arrested.
But these cops couldn't sit back and do nothing? Bullshit!
Here on the boards you are not setting the best example for police having maturity, discretion and articulate intelligence.
CMTSU!
"Somewhere along the line we became the bad guys."
"Watch your backs out there. Oh your fronts and sides too. Going to get nasty. Unless of course they let us do our job kick some thug ass."
" Every now and then we win one. Horrible situation, man lost his life, but like in the Ferguson case he controlled his own destiny."
" Stay safe, brothers. You're in for another set of riots." | ah yes the dangerous die-ins and arm locking all over the place. "riots"
"People are sick and tired of thugs. Certain people better wake the hell up and stop supporting the thugs."
" I don't see any wrongdoing, and certainly no criminal conduct on their part."
"The criminal weighed in above 300 lbs. and was combative. Case Closed!"
"Congratulations to the officers being cleared."
"Politics has changed our lives the media is turning our world upside down."
"You know what, who gives a fat rats ass how the cop grabbed Garner he resisted arrest and was asked many times to turn around and submit."
"the press minimizes what the criminal did, and vilifies the evil 'White NYC-officer' portraying him killing a harmless 'unarmed black man'"
"You know this kind of lawlessness wouldn't have lasted two days in the 80"s -90"s god,I miss those days."
" Looks like another week or so of chasing around these thugs, letting them have their way."
" It has become extremely difficult to be a good police officer these days. We have to work around race baiters, cop haters."
" Having watched this video, it's clearly another case of someone being non-compliant.."
"Maybe some day, the majority of the public will look up from the TV and wonder what the hell happened to the country." "Maybe they will actually want to see the laws that they passed enforced. Maybe they will want to feel safe in their communities."
" look at these things from the point of view of officer survival. Not surviving the fight, but surviving getting thrown under the bus."
"Instead of suing the police department, his (#EricGarner) family should sue Papa Johns, Dominos, Pizza Hut, Burger King, McDonalds, etc..."
"Just another criminal caught in the middle of committing a crime."
"What is being presented as racial problems between police & blacks is actually a black cultural problem of refusing authority of any type"
"1.Do NOT under any circumstance ARGUE with police out in the street. You cannot win an argument with police out in the field."
2. Do NOt raise your voice, but stay cool and calm. Do NOT make any quick or aggressive movements."
"3.Police know that hands kill, so always keep your hands in plain sight. Before you move your hands ask permission,"
"4.NEVER run from police even if you are innocent."
"5.DO NOT resist arrest – if you do one of three things is going to happen:"
"a.You are going to get beat down till you stop resisting b.You are going to get injured or 'accidentally' killed""c.And you are going to have charges taken out against you"
"Biblically, it's all there in black and white print..."Do what is right and obey the peace keepers!""
"To the criminals in protest,don't break the law and do what the authorities tell you to do."
"He killed himself by getting so worked up over refusing to follow simple and lawful commands."
"What choke hold? You mean the attempted "Carotid Restraint Hold" that lasted for several seconds on "Fatso" the walking heart attack?"
"We are trained to ARREST those that need arresting = AND use whatever force we see needed to avoid OURS getting killed"
"Now the NYPD will terminate Pantaleo and he'll have to fight to get his job back. Good luck, brother."
"Eric Gardner and Michael Brown are dead because of the poor choices they made when lawfully confronted by the police."
And this guy was arrested 30 times? True, it's a very petty crime, but jesus.
Choke hold video over not producing id
Remember, the choke hold was not the cause of death. He was alive when they let go of it. It was certainly a factor. But the officers all kneeling on his back was far more damaging than the choke hold.
that video shows a corpus christi cop putting a choke hold on a girl that refused to show id, he threatened to shoot her.
after the investigation the chief said althou it is not illegal to use choke holds its not prudent or common to use choke holds to induce compliance. the cop wasnt charged for choke hold or threat to shoot the girl.
its obvious from your comment "if you're talking, you're breathing" that you were never put in a choke hold so i posted the video just in case you were ever put in one.
well we're clogging up the threads with this nonsense so back to the topic at hand.
I'm not trying to prove wrong just add to the discussion.
Personally I think that cop should be choked to death.
But that's just me.
Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
My theory? You, and many police officers at this point in time, are having trouble coping with the fact that you might now be discriminated against because of a demographic you belong to. How ironic.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Thanks for making that abundantly clear Musky.
I can't fathom how anyone in a union (police, fire, teacher, etc.) or the military can identify with the republican party. You should embrace liberals my friend. Your paycheck depends on it.
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana