Are there any religions that treat woman as 100% equal?
Pastafarianism comes to mind although I could be mistaken.
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage?
Not yet, but if I ever find a religion I think that this is the one.
I'm having third thoughts (had my second thoughts years ago about my religion-by-obligation).
This is the telling statement: my religion-by-obligation.
Hooked in one's most impressionable age, religion survives by passing itself along to kids who are prepared to receive it and embrace it without the means and experience to question it.
I'm sorry to say it, but it's brainwashing of the highest order. I say this because I remember as a kid fearing God, having a relationship with God and totally in love with the idea of Heaven (who wouldn't be?). When I abandoned the idea of it and stepped out towards reality, I felt like I had one foot in Hell. That powerful feeling went away though.
It's tough to break an addiction like religion, but once you do... it's hard not to speak out against what once held you in its grasp. It's a sham. Every one of them.
These words are likely not going to be well received by some and I do wish to clarify that I genuinely like some of those advocating for their religion as much as the next person who speaks against religion. It's not the people who have powerful claws dug into them I am speaking against. I oppose what should now be an obsolete industry that keeps some from understanding what this world is truly about.
* That brainwashing is so strong that even as I type this, I feel blasphemous. It's residue still exists within me. I can only surmise that I would have no hope of leaving it if I had waited until now- instead of 13- to abandon my religion.
I totally agree… My kids were registered for one year in a catholic school (in my town, the ‘public’ board is the catholic one, and the ‘separate’ board are the non-religious schools...just realized I don't really know wtf that means ) ). I argued with my ex about it, but the school had slightly better performance and was more convenient, so she insisted....plus I went to catholic school and turned out ok for the most part….The kids wanted to switch schools the next year to be closer to their friends, and I couldn’t get them out fast enough. I have never spoken about religion at home with anything more than a passing ‘some people believe….’ statement - for the most part I haven't really addressed it at all. I want them to find their own way spiritually. But within a few weeks of attending religion classes (one hour a week), and a couple masses, they came home talking about jesus, drawing religious symbols, and asking about going to church. Good news is, they can be reprogrammed just as quickly. (edit: reprogrammed is the wrong word....more like fall back to their own path. I never criticized religion to them other than to say that many people believe many different things....and my own views, once asked. At which point I said I had no idea if my beliefs were 'right', but they were my own). They've been out of that school for two years and haven't mentioned any of that again. You’re right – when they’re that young, and faith and mythology are presented as fact, it doesn’t take much to convince them of a new reality, and turn them away from what came naturally to them as far as beliefs go. Same goes for racism, political inclinations, views on ‘moral’ issues like sex and drugs….I’m trying to give my daughter straight, realistic facts on sex now that she's taking sex ed, and on drugs before she enters the world of D.A.R.E. this year. Considering sitting in when the police officer comes to speak to them. That would be interesting.
And ya....it took me a long time to get past that blasphemous feeling. Like denying that there is a god in the christian sense would write the ticket to eternal damnation. Dominance by guilt, that's what it's all about from my pov. And I saw thru catholic confession the year it was introduced to me....I remember thinking as an 11 year old that it was a crock of shit to be absolved of your wrongdoings by chanting some ancient mantra over and over. bah.
Are there any religions that treat woman as 100% equal?
Pastafarianism comes to mind although I could be mistaken.
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage?
Not yet, but if I ever find a religion I think that this is the one.
I'm having third thoughts (had my second thoughts years ago about my religion-by-obligation).
This is the telling statement: my religion-by-obligation.
Hooked in one's most impressionable age, religion survives by passing itself along to kids who are prepared to receive it and embrace it without the means and experience to question it.
I'm sorry to say it, but it's brainwashing of the highest order. I say this because I remember as a kid fearing God, having a relationship with God and totally in love with the idea of Heaven (who wouldn't be?). When I abandoned the idea of it and stepped out towards reality, I felt like I had one foot in Hell. That powerful feeling went away though.
It's tough to break an addiction like religion, but once you do... it's hard not to speak out against what once held you in its grasp. It's a sham. Every one of them.
These words are likely not going to be well received by some and I do wish to clarify that I genuinely like some of those advocating for their religion as much as the next person who speaks against religion. It's not the people who have powerful claws dug into them I am speaking against. I oppose what should now be an obsolete industry that keeps some from understanding what this world is truly about.
* That brainwashing is so strong that even as I type this, I feel blasphemous. It's residue still exists within me. I can only surmise that I would have no hope of leaving it if I had waited until now- instead of 13- to abandon my religion.
I totally agree… My kids were registered for one year in a catholic school (in my town, the ‘public’ board is the catholic one, and the ‘separate’ board are the non-religious schools...just realized I don't really know wtf that means ) ). I argued with my ex about it, but the school had slightly better performance and was more convenient, so she insisted....plus I went to catholic school and turned out ok for the most part….The kids wanted to switch schools the next year to be closer to their friends, and I couldn’t get them out fast enough. I have never spoken about religion at home with anything more than a passing ‘some people believe….’ statement - for the most part I haven't really addressed it at all. I want them to find their own way spiritually. But within a few weeks of attending religion classes (one hour a week), and a couple masses, they came home talking about jesus, drawing religious symbols, and asking about going to church. Good news is, they can be reprogrammed just as quickly. They've been out of that school for two years and haven't mentioned any of that again. You’re right – when they’re that young, and faith and mythology is presented as fact, it doesn’t take much to convince them of a new reality, and turn them away from what came naturally to them as far as beliefs go. Same goes for racism, political inclinations, views on ‘moral’ issues like sex and drugs….I’m trying to give my daughter straight, realistic facts on sex now that she's taking sex ed, and on drugs before she enters the world of D.A.R.E. this year. Considering sitting in when the police officer comes to speak to them. That would be interesting.
And ya....it took me a long time to get past that blasphemous feeling. Like denying that there is a god in the christian sense would write the ticket to eternal damnation. Dominance by guilt, that's what it's all about from my pov. And I saw thru catholic confession the year it was introduced to me....I remember thinking as an 11 year old that it was a crock of shit to be absolved of your wrongdoings by chanting some ancient mantra over and over. bah.
That's actually pretty interesting. As a Jew, we experience the 'blasphemous feeling' in a different way. As far as my beliefs go - they're my own, and my parents are a-okay with that. Even my grandmother is. But in terms of keeping Jewish lineage alive - that's a different story. They'd much rather me have bacon cheeseburgers for breakfast, lunch and dinner and preach the absence of a god than marry a non-Jew. But that's where I respectfully tell them that I couldn't give two shits, and if I marry, I will marry for love. If it means the end of a lineage, so be it - maybe the moral superiority I've witnessed from time to time will go away with it.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
So coming in a little late here.This thread started with women,transitioned to religion,turned into a polite love fest, and is now a call for Byrnzie to show up and some how GF got a nice soccer shot in there too.Do I have this right?
This thread will die quickly without any antagonist lol
hhahhhahhahhahahha I see this getting very interesting...muslim's -women-opinion's....BATTEN DOWN THE HATCHES SHE'S GONNA BLOW ! )
Godfather.
We need that Byrzine guy in here.
**Byrnzie
I think byrnzie is still scratching his head over what's happening in the EPL right now. (That's English Premier League (soccer GF) ). )
BB,I'm still trying to figure out how you soccer lovers are so passionate about that sport.I gave it a go during the World Cup,but damn that shit gets slow and boring.They bump into each other and they roll around like they have been beat silly.No offense intended kids,just what is the big draw?Maybe if like a tiger was let loose on the "pitch" or you could check it may be something.
This thread will die quickly without any antagonist lol
hhahhhahhahhahahha I see this getting very interesting...muslim's -women-opinion's....BATTEN DOWN THE HATCHES SHE'S GONNA BLOW ! )
Godfather.
We need that Byrzine guy in here.
**Byrnzie
I think byrnzie is still scratching his head over what's happening in the EPL right now. (That's English Premier League (soccer GF) ). )
BB,I'm still trying to figure out how you soccer lovers are so passionate about that sport.I gave it a go during the World Cup,but damn that shit gets slow and boring.They bump into each other and they roll around like they have been beat silly.No offense intended kids,just what is the big draw?Maybe if like a tiger was let loose on the "pitch" or you could check it may be something.
RR, I grew up with football (soccer) all my life. I can remember the 86 World Cup vividly. Played it all my life. Was on a club team most of my teenager years and we also all kind of grew up together. I totally see how it can be boring for people who are just casual fans, but how about baseball? How slow is that shit? It's so weird cuz football is the biggest sport in the world except for America.
Btw, for us die hards, today is the draw for champions league at noon. People all over the world will be waiting for this draw including myself! Hahahaha
This thread will die quickly without any antagonist lol
hhahhhahhahhahahha I see this getting very interesting...muslim's -women-opinion's....BATTEN DOWN THE HATCHES SHE'S GONNA BLOW ! )
Godfather.
We need that Byrzine guy in here.
**Byrnzie
I think byrnzie is still scratching his head over what's happening in the EPL right now. (That's English Premier League (soccer GF) ). )
BB,I'm still trying to figure out how you soccer lovers are so passionate about that sport.I gave it a go during the World Cup,but damn that shit gets slow and boring.They bump into each other and they roll around like they have been beat silly.No offense intended kids,just what is the big draw?Maybe if like a tiger was let loose on the "pitch" or you could check it may be something.
RR, I grew up with football (soccer) all my life. I can remember the 86 World Cup vividly. Played it all my life. Was on a club team most of my teenager years and we also all kind of grew up together. I totally see how it can be boring for people who are just casual fans, but how about baseball? How slow is that shit? It's so weird cuz football is the biggest sport in the world except for America.
Btw, for us die hards, today is the draw for champions league at noon. People all over the world will be waiting for this draw including myself! Hahahaha
Homer Simpson watching a baseball game while sober ....
This thread will die quickly without any antagonist lol
hhahhhahhahhahahha I see this getting very interesting...muslim's -women-opinion's....BATTEN DOWN THE HATCHES SHE'S GONNA BLOW ! )
Godfather.
We need that Byrzine guy in here.
**Byrnzie
I think byrnzie is still scratching his head over what's happening in the EPL right now. (That's English Premier League (soccer GF) ). )
BB,I'm still trying to figure out how you soccer lovers are so passionate about that sport.I gave it a go during the World Cup,but damn that shit gets slow and boring.They bump into each other and they roll around like they have been beat silly.No offense intended kids,just what is the big draw?Maybe if like a tiger was let loose on the "pitch" or you could check it may be something.
RR, I grew up with football (soccer) all my life. I can remember the 86 World Cup vividly. Played it all my life. Was on a club team most of my teenager years and we also all kind of grew up together. I totally see how it can be boring for people who are just casual fans, but how about baseball? How slow is that shit? It's so weird cuz football is the biggest sport in the world except for America.
Btw, for us die hards, today is the draw for champions league at noon. People all over the world will be waiting for this draw including myself! Hahahaha
I grew up playing Baseball,Im from a baseball family ,shit my bro played pro ball for a little while and that is also soooo boring to watch until the playoffs,I agree. Football and Hockey,now Thats where its at.I need violence and impact in my sports.Now I will say I really liked the women's World Cup in soccer.I found that way more entertaining then mens.They shoot more on goal I think.
Thats not the proper Christian view but coming from people who profess to call themselves Christian and have given Christianity a bad reputation just like most religions do nowadays, its right in there with Christianity approving homosexuality, women priests, child abuse and i could go on, no wonder religion brings about arguments, look at all the lives it has mislead and destroyed, while they teach their own rules and not the good word...
So I'm sure you approve of the approach this kid's parents took when discussing his homosexuality then, since it sounds like The Proper Christian View ™ you reference:
I love how that mom talks about believing the Bible or as JWPearl says "the good word" over science. This was a very disturbing video and is yet more fuel flaming my absolute disdain for religion. I'd like to think most of us will be horrified by parents treating their kid in such an abusive manner but I suppose that is what happens when belief in mythology supercedes rational, clear thinking.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
Thats not the proper Christian view but coming from people who profess to call themselves Christian and have given Christianity a bad reputation just like most religions do nowadays, its right in there with Christianity approving homosexuality, women priests, child abuse and i could go on, no wonder religion brings about arguments, look at all the lives it has mislead and destroyed, while they teach their own rules and not the good word...
So I'm sure you approve of the approach this kid's parents took when discussing his homosexuality then, since it sounds like The Proper Christian View ™ you reference:
I love how that mom talks about believing the Bible or as JWPearl says "the good word" over science. This was a very disturbing video and is yet more fuel flaming my absolute disdain for religion. I'd like to think most of us will be horrified by parents treating their kid in such an abusive manner but I suppose that is what happens when belief in mythology supercedes rational, clear thinking.
Anybody who treats their child that way because of their sexuality is somebody I would not want to associate with. If that's what religion is all about, I can say I am truly thankful that I'm not a member of the club. I don't see many differences between any of the big three monotheistic religions as they all seem to allow for this kind of BS.
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
Just found out my cousin (whose daughter had her Bat Mitzvah at an Orthodox temple, as mentioned in an earlier post) is divorcing her husband after 29 years of marriage. I had no idea, but apparently the old-school Iranian mindset of men's and women's "places" had taken over their relationship. Wasn't a partnership, no equality. Plus using their finances deceitfully, without her knowledge.
How does a man revere (not that "reverence" is even necessary; simple respect and love suffice) his mother but not his wife or daughters?
Just so fucked up - I consider her a sister - but I'm proud of her, setting an example for their four children - youngest is 18 - of what marriage and self-respect are truly about.
Just found out my cousin (whose daughter had her Bat Mitzvah at an Orthodox temple, as mentioned in an earlier post) is divorcing her husband after 29 years of marriage. I had no idea, but apparently the old-school Iranian mindset of men's and women's "places" had taken over their relationship. Wasn't a partnership, no equality. Plus using their finances deceitfully, without her knowledge.
How does a man revere (not that "reverence" is even necessary; simple respect and love suffice) his mother but not his wife or daughters?
Just so fucked up - I consider her a sister - but I'm proud of her, setting an example for their four children - youngest is 18 - of what marriage and self-respect are truly about.
H,Is she a Persian Jew living in Iran?I understand there is quite a number of Jews in Iran.Is the soon to be ex also Iranian?
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
Morning, rr...her father was Persian, her mother is American, and he's Persian by both parents. They live in London (though both lived in Tehran at separate points in their lives). I think he was born and raised there, which I imagine has had more of a cultural impact on his views of women and their required behavior.
And sad thing is that many of the older generation of women buy into this. When I was in my 20s, I attended a baby shower for one of my many cousins (again, Persian). The older ladies there were asking me if I was married, did I have children...I told them no, and that I didn't plan to have children. They poo-poo'd me, almost laughing - like "silly girl, you HAVE to have children!"
Morning, rr...her father was Persian, her mother is American, and he's Persian by both parents. They live in London (though both lived in Tehran at separate points in their lives). I think he was born and raised there, which I imagine has had more of a cultural impact on his views of women and their required behavior.
And sad thing is that many of the older generation of women buy into this. When I was in my 20s, I attended a baby shower for one of my many cousins (again, Persian). The older ladies there were asking me if I was married, did I have children...I told them no, and that I didn't plan to have children. They poo-poo'd me, almost laughing - like "silly girl, you HAVE to have children!"
"Why, who says?"
"It's just what you DO"
Huh?
Interesting dynamic,and I think that all older generations think along those lines.In every family.
Just found out my cousin (whose daughter had her Bat Mitzvah at an Orthodox temple, as mentioned in an earlier post) is divorcing her husband after 29 years of marriage. I had no idea, but apparently the old-school Iranian mindset of men's and women's "places" had taken over their relationship. Wasn't a partnership, no equality. Plus using their finances deceitfully, without her knowledge.
How does a man revere (not that "reverence" is even necessary; simple respect and love suffice) his mother but not his wife or daughters?
Just so fucked up - I consider her a sister - but I'm proud of her, setting an example for their four children - youngest is 18 - of what marriage and self-respect are truly about.
that reverence toward mother is what i encountered when i pressed the morroccans(sp?) about their views on women. They all (in different instances) gave an analogy about muhammed being born by woman and so mothers are somehow the heel or foot of god. I may have this wrong somewhat, it's hard to tell because it didnt make any sense to me at the time so it makes less sense now. If anyone has insight into this foot thing I would appreciate the reminder. Anyhow, that was the standard response I got, the religious "catch phrase" they were taught to use as justification. Revere, cherish, love, and protect, I remember those words but I dont remember the words respect, equal, partnership ever coming from them, even when pressed by my questions. It came up way short to an American fella born to a tough as nails woman who ruled the roost with an iron will.
i have enjoyed catching back up on this thread! Great posts by hedonist, thirtbills, benjs, drowned out....and GF!! I SAID IT! I appreciate the athleticism of futbol but the flopping around writhing in fake pain makes me go blank with rage. Have some fucking self-respect! Writhing around from a little bump and the jumping back up to play when the ref ignores you. I have seen fighters fight with broken hands, and football players tackle with broken forearms...without a peep.
It is a disgrace and it ruins the game.
Soccer players, next time you roll around with your face contorted, back arched, screaming bloody murder, remember that your mother pushed you out into the world in agonizing pain and she did it with less theatrics and more self-respect than you can muster for your overpaid career!
not sure anyone cares, but never slowed me before we had a wonderful sojourn to the mountains. Adirondaks were dissapointing but the presidential range in new hampshire is freakin amazing! Mt washington reminded me of being on top of a 14er! Breathtaking. Doggies stitches held up, and pregnant wife held up (barely)! Apparently, early pregnancy causes a shortness of breath that is not good for climbing a thousand vertical feet lol. But we made it and now the batteries are recharged. For anyone who here who left religion behind, if you feel a need for spirituality I highly recommend a trip into the mountains to push yourself and find your limits. Mountains are for me as the ocean is for Ed, an endless fountain of energy and inspiration, a place to come face to face with life in an affirming way. It is only through seeking our limits that we can break through the bleak curtain that "civilized" life places over our eyes. Ok im done now, continue with the discussion lol
Comments
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
I'm just being an idiot and amusing myself.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
My kids were registered for one year in a catholic school (in my town, the ‘public’ board is the catholic one, and the ‘separate’ board are the non-religious schools...just realized I don't really know wtf that means
And ya....it took me a long time to get past that blasphemous feeling. Like denying that there is a god in the christian sense would write the ticket to eternal damnation. Dominance by guilt, that's what it's all about from my pov. And I saw thru catholic confession the year it was introduced to me....I remember thinking as an 11 year old that it was a crock of shit to be absolved of your wrongdoings by chanting some ancient mantra over and over. bah.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Godfather.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
need byrnzie, not just here, but everywhere
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
(and I'm still with the intent of the thread!)
BTW,my daughter said she may keep her name as well when she marries.Im all for it.so kudos
Btw, for us die hards, today is the draw for champions league at noon. People all over the world will be waiting for this draw including myself! Hahahaha
Football and Hockey,now Thats where its at.I need violence and impact in my sports.Now I will say I really liked the women's World Cup in soccer.I found that way more entertaining then mens.They shoot more on goal I think.
I love how that mom talks about believing the Bible or as JWPearl says "the good word" over science. This was a very disturbing video and is yet more fuel flaming my absolute disdain for religion. I'd like to think most of us will be horrified by parents treating their kid in such an abusive manner but I suppose that is what happens when belief in mythology supercedes rational, clear thinking.
How does a man revere (not that "reverence" is even necessary; simple respect and love suffice) his mother but not his wife or daughters?
Just so fucked up - I consider her a sister - but I'm proud of her, setting an example for their four children - youngest is 18 - of what marriage and self-respect are truly about.
And sad thing is that many of the older generation of women buy into this. When I was in my 20s, I attended a baby shower for one of my many cousins (again, Persian). The older ladies there were asking me if I was married, did I have children...I told them no, and that I didn't plan to have children. They poo-poo'd me, almost laughing - like "silly girl, you HAVE to have children!"
"Why, who says?"
"It's just what you DO"
Huh?
It is a disgrace and it ruins the game.
Soccer players, next time you roll around with your face contorted, back arched, screaming bloody murder, remember that your mother pushed you out into the world in agonizing pain and she did it with less theatrics and more self-respect than you can muster for your overpaid career!
For anyone who here who left religion behind, if you feel a need for spirituality I highly recommend a trip into the mountains to push yourself and find your limits. Mountains are for me as the ocean is for Ed, an endless fountain of energy and inspiration, a place to come face to face with life in an affirming way. It is only through seeking our limits that we can break through the bleak curtain that "civilized" life places over our eyes. Ok im done now, continue with the discussion lol