This is really ridiculous. We should protest more whenever someone robs a store and attacks a cop. I consider those who are protesting and supporting lawlessness to be on the same level as those Westboro baptist church waco's
I would imagine that if someone robbed a store and attacked a cop and no charges resulted that there would be some protesting.
Agreed, but still dont understand why people are protesting in support of a criminal and criticizing the police officer who did what he was trained to do. Its not a race issue, but those who are out there yelling with their hands in the air are making it into one.
White cop/Black kid....definitely a race issue
Death isn't the usual result of jaywalking and/or stealing cigars. A lot of outrage exists at how the grand jury process was handled. There are definitely some strange things that happened.
to start , much of the uproar stems from the simple fact that at the time of the stop and subsequent shooting it wasn't known by wilson that brown was the suspect in the convenience store deal. their contact was wholly about him being in the middle of the street.
I question more so now than before that while the forensics support wilsons report , it still doesnt say why LETHAL force was neccessary for an unarmed man? WHY couldnt NONLETHAL force have been used FIRST such as a taser? Meaning after wilson got out of his car , use the taser.
Good questions. Do we know if he was equipped with a taser?? Also what is the protocol and training for this situation?? Does the fact that there were two individuals instead of one at the initial confrontation disqualify the taser as an option? Does the physical size of the brown and wilson respectively escalate the use of force??
This is really ridiculous. We should protest more whenever someone robs a store and attacks a cop. I consider those who are protesting and supporting lawlessness to be on the same level as those Westboro baptist church waco's
I would imagine that if someone robbed a store and attacked a cop and no charges resulted that there would be some protesting.
Agreed, but still dont understand why people are protesting in support of a criminal and criticizing the police officer who did what he was trained to do. Its not a race issue, but those who are out there yelling with their hands in the air are making it into one.
White cop/Black kid....definitely a race issue
Death isn't the usual result of jaywalking and/or stealing cigars. A lot of outrage exists at how the grand jury process was handled. There are definitely some strange things that happened.
to start , much of the uproar stems from the simple fact that at the time of the stop and subsequent shooting it wasn't known by wilson that brown was the suspect in the convenience store deal. their contact was wholly about him being in the middle of the street.
I question more so now than before that while the forensics support wilsons report , it still doesnt say why LETHAL force was neccessary for an unarmed man? WHY couldnt NONLETHAL force have been used FIRST such as a taser? Meaning after wilson got out of his car , use the taser.
This is really ridiculous. We should protest more whenever someone robs a store and attacks a cop. I consider those who are protesting and supporting lawlessness to be on the same level as those Westboro baptist church waco's
I would imagine that if someone robbed a store and attacked a cop and no charges resulted that there would be some protesting.
Agreed, but still dont understand why people are protesting in support of a criminal and criticizing the police officer who did what he was trained to do. Its not a race issue, but those who are out there yelling with their hands in the air are making it into one.
White cop/Black kid....definitely a race issue
Death isn't the usual result of jaywalking and/or stealing cigars. A lot of outrage exists at how the grand jury process was handled. There are definitely some strange things that happened.
Glen, I understand what you are saying but we have laws and a judicial system. I just cant get over how someone robs a store, attacks the employee, attacks a cop physically, refuses to obey simple orders from the cop, and puts himself into this situation that we see today,the consequence is he gets shot because the cop feared for his life but people are protesting in favor of this criminal. Im not saying anything here is perfect and cut and dry but why glorify criminal and lawlessness. I think the travon martin shooting was more entitled to these protests. Blacks are making it a race issue. I live near chicago and they shoot each other everyday without any protest or action. Black person shoots anyone regaurdless of race....no protest. Black person gets shot by someone other than a black person and here come the protests, al sharpton, and jessie jackson.
Not all of us are protesting in favour of a cop or a citizen. For example, I think that the evidence-gathering process is incredibly flawed, and there's clear evidence to that effect: this same scenario keeps repeating itself. You don't need to glorify criminal action or lawlessness to say that an uncompromising commitment to the pursuit of "truth" in its most impartial form is a noble objective we should all be in favour of. You may say that blacks are making it a race issue, and they're welcome to, but that's not the message we're all trying to make here.
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This is really ridiculous. We should protest more whenever someone robs a store and attacks a cop. I consider those who are protesting and supporting lawlessness to be on the same level as those Westboro baptist church waco's
I would imagine that if someone robbed a store and attacked a cop and no charges resulted that there would be some protesting.
Agreed, but still dont understand why people are protesting in support of a criminal and criticizing the police officer who did what he was trained to do. Its not a race issue, but those who are out there yelling with their hands in the air are making it into one.
White cop/Black kid....definitely a race issue
Death isn't the usual result of jaywalking and/or stealing cigars. A lot of outrage exists at how the grand jury process was handled. There are definitely some strange things that happened.
to start , much of the uproar stems from the simple fact that at the time of the stop and subsequent shooting it wasn't known by wilson that brown was the suspect in the convenience store deal. their contact was wholly about him being in the middle of the street.
I question more so now than before that while the forensics support wilsons report , it still doesnt say why LETHAL force was neccessary for an unarmed man? WHY couldnt NONLETHAL force have been used FIRST such as a taser? Meaning after wilson got out of his car , use the taser.
My 2 favorites from Wilson's gj testimony 1. Brown with 1 hand overpowered Wilson and turned his gun around aiming it at Wilson down at his lap as if to shoot him 2. Brown all the while pausing to hand Johnson the cigars
We're to believe that a gun turned around on someone holding it didn't go off and/or didn't break or fracture the gun holders wrist or hand? We're to believe that Brown while trying to kill Wilson with one hand either by fatal punch or gunshot, stops and hands Johnson $7.89 worth of cigars?
Ive wondered why the prosecution didn't make Wilson re-enact the gun struggle with the unloaded sig Sauer gun. Specifically with the help of someone else re-enact how the gun was turned on him? Why didn't they make him show the jury how Brown with one hand turned the gun and placed a finger in the trigger?
Where was the fingerprint forensics and dna forensics on the handle and trigger anyway?
Ive wondered why the prosecution didn't make Wilson re-enact the gun struggle with the unloaded sig Sauer gun. Specifically with the help of someone else re-enact how the gun was turned on him? Why didn't they make him show the jury how Brown with one hand turned the gun and placed a finger in the trigger?
Where was the fingerprint forensics and dna forensics on the handle and trigger anyway?
In relation to benjs' point about evidence gathering, due process, and the quest for truth, (which was a great point from him, as always) I would say a better question is why was Wilson testifying in the first place? It is not a typical piece of the grand jury process, and is usually reserved for trial.
You guys ever wonder if this is what our government wants? U ever wonder if this was the plan a along to flood the tv with this issue while they're doing shady shit and the news ain't covering it? I have my own beliefs and wouldn't doubt this is the case. Everyone's talking about this issue yet all the shit our military is doing goes unannounced or talked about on the news. A little smoke and mirrors perhaps?
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 36,401
And again...dw doesn't carry a taser, said they are too big and bulky
so then the question is what means or methods of nonlethal force is available to subdue a suspect or noncompliant individual? Why wasnt this used after getting out of the car?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Ive wondered why the prosecution didn't make Wilson re-enact the gun struggle with the unloaded sig Sauer gun. Specifically with the help of someone else re-enact how the gun was turned on him? Why didn't they make him show the jury how Brown with one hand turned the gun and placed a finger in the trigger?
Where was the fingerprint forensics and dna forensics on the handle and trigger anyway?
In relation to benjs' point about evidence gathering, due process, and the quest for truth, (which was a great point from him, as always) I would say a better question is why was Wilson testifying in the first place? It is not a typical piece of the grand jury process, and is usually reserved for trial.
When do you veer bear of a defendant taking the stand? The only recent case I can think of is Casey Anthony. I don't know if it is normal for a defendant to talk to a GJ.
Ive wondered why the prosecution didn't make Wilson re-enact the gun struggle with the unloaded sig Sauer gun. Specifically with the help of someone else re-enact how the gun was turned on him? Why didn't they make him show the jury how Brown with one hand turned the gun and placed a finger in the trigger?
Where was the fingerprint forensics and dna forensics on the handle and trigger anyway?
In relation to benjs' point about evidence gathering, due process, and the quest for truth, (which was a great point from him, as always) I would say a better question is why was Wilson testifying in the first place? It is not a typical piece of the grand jury process, and is usually reserved for trial.
When do you veer bear of a defendant taking the stand? The only recent case I can think of is Casey Anthony. I don't know if it is normal for a defendant to talk to a GJ.
Despite the fact that some feel Wilson should have acted differently... a big idiot contributed in a significant way towards getting himself shot by a cop- the reasons are well known. This idiot was a black guy. Claim racism all you want, but it's weak here given Brown attacked Wilson. Wilson may be a racist, but it doesn't really matter- he was assaulted. Wilson very well may have shot a greasy long haired skid under the same circumstances.
A freakin' 12 year old was gunned down by a white cop in Cleveland for brandishing a toy gun in a playground/park. Hang your hat on that incident and you'll knock it out of the park for the issue some are pushing here.
I won't deny that there is a significant element of racial profiling in the US. I'm saying that before the US is ever to get to the point where the statistics aren't grossly disproportionate... not every case will support the cause. In my opinion... the Brown case is one of that variety.
ST. LOUIS – The St. Louis Police Officers Association has released a statement condemning the St. Louis Rams football players who entered the field displaying the "hands up don't shoot" pose.
A spokesman for the St. Louis Rams says the team was unaware of the demonstration before the game.
St. Louis, Missouri (November 30, 2014) – The St. Louis Police Officers Association is profoundly disappointed with the members of the St. Louis Rams football team who chose to ignore the mountains of evidence released from the St. Louis County Grand Jury this week and engage in a display that police officers around the nation found tasteless, offensive and inflammatory. "Five members of the Rams entered the field today exhibiting the "hands-up-don't-shoot" pose that has been adopted by protestors who accused Ferguson Police Officer Darren Wilson of murdering Michael Brown. The gesture has become synonymous with assertions that Michael Brown was innocent of any wrongdoing and attempting to surrender peacefully when Wilson, according to some now-discredited witnesses, gunned him down in cold blood. "SLPOA Business Manager Jeff Roorda said, "now that the evidence is in and Officer Wilson's account has been verified by physical and ballistic evidence as well as eye-witness testimony, which led the grand jury to conclude that no probable cause existed that Wilson engaged in any wrongdoing, it is unthinkable that hometown athletes would so publicly perpetuate a narrative that has been disproven over-and-over again." "Roorda was incensed that the Rams and the NFL would tolerate such behavior and called it remarkably hypocritical. "All week long, the Rams and the NFL were on the phone with the St. Louis Police Department asking for assurances that the players and the fans would be kept safe from the violent protesters who had rioted, looted, and burned buildings in Ferguson. Our officers have been working 12 hour shifts for over a week, they had days off including Thanksgiving cancelled so that they could defend this community from those on the streets that perpetuate this myth that Michael Brown was executed by a brother police officer and then, as the players and their fans sit safely in their dome under the watchful protection of hundreds of St. Louis's finest, they take to the turf to call a now-exonerated officer a murderer, that is way out-of-bounds, to put it in football parlance," Roorda said. "The SLPOA is calling for the players involved to be disciplined and for the Rams and the NFL to deliver a very public apology. Roorda said he planned to speak to the NFL and the Rams to voice his organization's displeasure tomorrow. He also plans to reach out to other police organizations in St. Louis and around the country to enlist their input on what the appropriate response from law enforcement should be. Roorda warned, "I know that there are those that will say that these players are simply exercising their First Amendment rights. Well I've got news for people who think that way, cops have first amendment rights too, and we plan to exercise ours. I'd remind the NFL and their players that it is not the violent thugs burning down buildings that buy their advertiser's products. It's cops and the good people of St. Louis and other NFL towns that do. Somebody needs to throw a flag on this play. If it's not the NFL and the Rams, then it'll be cops and their supporters."
rian McCarthy, vice president of communications for the National Football League released the following statement Monday morning:
"We respect and understand the concerns of all individuals who have expressed views on this tragic situation."
to my last post i just have to say "boo fucking hoo" to the cops.
this union is using its power to try to stymie 1st amendment protected speech. the cops are offended. i think it is dangerous ground when a union of state employees is trying to stifle the speech of a handful of athletes, who also have a powerful union.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
the rams are standing in solidarity with a minority who was murdered by a government employee. i can see the similarity.
One features an Olympic hero demonstrating strength against Aryan ideology. A classic social moment at a most important time.
The other features some athletes standing in solidarity with a criminal 'murdered' after trying to assault a police officer. A misguided attempt that tried to speak for a very appropriate cause... using the wrong case to do so.
the rams are standing in solidarity with a minority who was murdered by a government employee. i can see the similarity.
One features an Olympic hero demonstrating strength against Aryan ideology. A classic social moment at a most important time.
The other features some athletes standing in solidarity with a criminal 'murdered' after trying to assault a police officer. A misguided attempt that tried to speak for a very appropriate cause... using the wrong case to do so.
Based on the DW photos you make an excellent point with "trying" to assault a police officer. 10 total punches, 2 that connected and fear that a third would be fatal on a fair complexion police officer with the only mark hardly noticeable on the far right side of his face.
The thugs that burned down buildings may just be law enforcement. The owners of advanced auto parts may want to look a little deeper into the events that unfolded in their parking lot the night the gj was announced. The place was being guarded by police but still burned down. Good thing the national guard was called and had 8 days to prepare for protecting the community and businesses.
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My 2 favorites from Wilson's gj testimony
1. Brown with 1 hand overpowered Wilson and turned his gun around aiming it at Wilson down at his lap as if to shoot him
2. Brown all the while pausing to hand Johnson the cigars
We're to believe that a gun turned around on someone holding it didn't go off and/or didn't break or fracture the gun holders wrist or hand?
We're to believe that Brown while trying to kill Wilson with one hand either by fatal punch or gunshot, stops and hands Johnson $7.89 worth of cigars?
Why didn't they make him show the jury how Brown with one hand turned the gun and placed a finger in the trigger?
Where was the fingerprint forensics and dna forensics on the handle and trigger anyway?
Why wasnt this used after getting out of the car?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
white st louisians are angry...
go figure...
these people give ZERO fucks about the rams for the last 6 years, and now everybody is calling local sports radio to call the rams players racist...
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
http://www.uscourts.gov/educational-resources/get-informed/federal-court-basics/jury-service-federal-courts/comparing-trial-juries-grand-juries.aspx
A freakin' 12 year old was gunned down by a white cop in Cleveland for brandishing a toy gun in a playground/park. Hang your hat on that incident and you'll knock it out of the park for the issue some are pushing here.
I won't deny that there is a significant element of racial profiling in the US. I'm saying that before the US is ever to get to the point where the statistics aren't grossly disproportionate... not every case will support the cause. In my opinion... the Brown case is one of that variety.
Obama announces funding for 50,000 police body cameras
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
the rams are standing in solidarity with a minority who was murdered by a government employee. i can see the similarity.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
A spokesman for the St. Louis Rams says the team was unaware of the demonstration before the game.
St. Louis, Missouri (November 30, 2014) – The St. Louis Police Officers Association is profoundly disappointed with the members of the St. Louis Rams football team who chose to ignore the mountains of evidence released from the St. Louis County Grand Jury this week and engage in a display that police officers around the nation found tasteless, offensive and inflammatory.
"Five members of the Rams entered the field today exhibiting the "hands-up-don't-shoot" pose that has been adopted by protestors who accused Ferguson Police Officer Darren Wilson of murdering Michael Brown. The gesture has become synonymous with assertions that Michael Brown was innocent of any wrongdoing and attempting to surrender peacefully when Wilson, according to some now-discredited witnesses, gunned him down in cold blood.
"SLPOA Business Manager Jeff Roorda said, "now that the evidence is in and Officer Wilson's account has been verified by physical and ballistic evidence as well as eye-witness testimony, which led the grand jury to conclude that no probable cause existed that Wilson engaged in any wrongdoing, it is unthinkable that hometown athletes would so publicly perpetuate a narrative that has been disproven over-and-over again."
"Roorda was incensed that the Rams and the NFL would tolerate such behavior and called it remarkably hypocritical. "All week long, the Rams and the NFL were on the phone with the St. Louis Police Department asking for assurances that the players and the fans would be kept safe from the violent protesters who had rioted, looted, and burned buildings in Ferguson. Our officers have been working 12 hour shifts for over a week, they had days off including Thanksgiving cancelled so that they could defend this community from those on the streets that perpetuate this myth that Michael Brown was executed by a brother police officer and then, as the players and their fans sit safely in their dome under the watchful protection of hundreds of St. Louis's finest, they take to the turf to call a now-exonerated officer a murderer, that is way out-of-bounds, to put it in football parlance," Roorda said.
"The SLPOA is calling for the players involved to be disciplined and for the Rams and the NFL to deliver a very public apology. Roorda said he planned to speak to the NFL and the Rams to voice his organization's displeasure tomorrow. He also plans to reach out to other police organizations in St. Louis and around the country to enlist their input on what the appropriate response from law enforcement should be. Roorda warned, "I know that there are those that will say that these players are simply exercising their First Amendment rights. Well I've got news for people who think that way, cops have first amendment rights too, and we plan to exercise ours. I'd remind the NFL and their players that it is not the violent thugs burning down buildings that buy their advertiser's products. It's cops and the good people of St. Louis and other NFL towns that do. Somebody needs to throw a flag on this play. If it's not the NFL and the Rams, then it'll be cops and their supporters."
rian McCarthy, vice president of communications for the National Football League released the following statement Monday morning:
"We respect and understand the concerns of all individuals who have expressed views on this tragic situation."
http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/local/2014/11/30/stl-police-officers-association-condemns-rams-display/19721979/
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
this union is using its power to try to stymie 1st amendment protected speech. the cops are offended. i think it is dangerous ground when a union of state employees is trying to stifle the speech of a handful of athletes, who also have a powerful union.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
if obama supports anything at all, the gop has to fundamentally disagree with it.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
The other features some athletes standing in solidarity with a criminal 'murdered' after trying to assault a police officer. A misguided attempt that tried to speak for a very appropriate cause... using the wrong case to do so.
10 total punches, 2 that connected and fear that a third would be fatal on a fair complexion police officer with the only mark hardly noticeable on the far right side of his face.
http://fusion.net/story/30785/the-man-behind-st-louis-polices-nfl-comments-has-a-history-of-controversy/?hootPostID=6160c9d39e3a56bfd5c828f217aa5d7b
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