My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
I used to argue that w the education thing as not everyone can go to college. There are exceptions but I agree w you and the few exceptions shouldn't make the system not work.
Logging, anything on a boat, most forms of construction...
I got ya. I guess I'll rephrase to say policing has the a lot of unspecified (and thus, hard to prepare for) danger to it. You don't know who or what you're going to run into. Most of those jobs in that "top 10 most dangerous jobs" you posted have more specified dangers (accidents in transportation being the most common it seems), so you know the safety precautions to take.
There's definitely a unique aspect to the danger in policing.
Yeah and with public-trust in policing eroding, coupled with low wages, and folks calling for police departments to be defunded, I worry how many people will even want to be cops and deal with those dangers going forward. And the saddest part is, the bad cops will probably still want to be cops because they have ego/racist/control issues they they take out on people through crooked policing. But the good people that want to be cops might not think it's worth the trouble at this rate. Could lead to even more bad cops in power.
I keep reading that "people want to defund the police" or "disband police".
Where the hell did this come from?
Might have started with this open letter from some celebrities.
I'd love to hear the 15 jobs you think are as dangerous or more dangerous than being a police officer. I'll even start the list for you.
1) Military 2) Firefighting
That's a start, what are the other 13?
Logging, anything on a boat, most forms of construction...
I got ya. I guess I'll rephrase to say policing has the a lot of unspecified (and thus, hard to prepare for) danger to it. You don't know who or what you're going to run into. Most of those jobs in that "top 10 most dangerous jobs" you posted have more specified dangers (accidents in transportation being the most common it seems), so you know the safety precautions to take.
There's definitely a unique aspect to the danger in policing.
Yeah and with public-trust in policing eroding, coupled with low wages, and folks calling for police departments to be defunded, I worry how many people will even want to be cops and deal with those dangers going forward. And the saddest part is, the bad cops will probably still want to be cops because they have ego/racist/control issues they they take out on people through crooked policing. But the good people that want to be cops might not think it's worth the trouble at this rate. Could lead to even more bad cops in power.
I keep reading that "people want to defund the police" or "disband police".
Where the hell did this come from?
Angry protest rhetoric, mostly. It's out there, but it isn't all that serious, IMO.
TY.
I read the article and I will disagree.
I googled it too and see that a few are holding signs.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
Isn't IA supposed to do that job? Police the police?
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
2 problems I see with this. Many won’t go for a tax increase if it’s going to cops. But that’s the smaller issue. The bigger one is this isn’t a quick fix. it would take 20-30 years of this massive increase in salary and requirements to really see a difference. They can’t just fire the 600,000 cops we have now, not without major lawsuits that would bankrupt the counties and cities. So even if you start this today, it will be 20+ years before the majority of cops we have now have left.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
Isn't IA supposed to do that job? Police the police?
I'm not familiar with IA. I figured there must be an organization that is supposed to do that....but it sure doesn't seem to be working.
So what's IA? Obviously, my google search just led me to Iowa.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
Isn't IA supposed to do that job? Police the police?
I'm not familiar with IA. I figured there must be an organization that is supposed to do that....but it sure doesn't seem to be working.
So what's IA? Obviously, my google search just led me to Iowa.
Internal Affairs, but it's part of the same department, staffed by cops. Probably a lot of social pressure there to look the other way. I don't know that...or much about IA, but some non-cops (i.e., not payed by the police department and not friends with the people they're looking into) need to be involved.
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My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
Isn't IA supposed to do that job? Police the police?
I'm not familiar with IA. I figured there must be an organization that is supposed to do that....but it sure doesn't seem to be working.
So what's IA? Obviously, my google search just led me to Iowa.
Internal Affairs, but it's part of the same department, staffed by cops. Probably a lot of social pressure there to look the other way. I don't know that...or much about IA, but some non-cops (i.e., not payed by the police department and not friends with the people they're looking into) need to be involved.
Yeah and that's the problem. I think we need something completely independent of police.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
Isn't IA supposed to do that job? Police the police?
I'm not familiar with IA. I figured there must be an organization that is supposed to do that....but it sure doesn't seem to be working.
So what's IA? Obviously, my google search just led me to Iowa.
Internal Affairs, but it's part of the same department, staffed by cops. Probably a lot of social pressure there to look the other way. I don't know that...or much about IA, but some non-cops (i.e., not payed by the police department and not friends with the people they're looking into) need to be involved.
Yeah and that's the problem. I think we need something completely independent of police.
I will argue that to a point. teachers complain about superintendents that are put into positions that no zero about actual teaching and they claim that is what is wrong with things today.
Not a single post in this on this board (at least according to the search function) about this poor man that was murdered earlier in the week during the riots. Not surprising. His name was David Dorn, a 77-year-old former police chief that tried to help protect businesses in St. Louis during the riots, and was murdered in cold blood. His death as he bled out on the street was livestreamed on facebook. Very sad.
Why was a 77 year old out there trying to protect businesses? He should have known better.
Just so I'm clear that's sarcasm. It's a horrible story.
Also, I think I did read about that here but maybe without the name of the victim.
this was big news here in stl. from what i have seen he is kind of viewed as an uncle tom by protesters that were interviewed. it is really sad for sure though.
i guess the lesson here is if there is an angry mob coming at you to try to destroy something, you have to ask yourself if you are willing to lay down your life for someone else's property.
Which raises concerns about policing going forward. Of course the main concern everyone wants addressed is equality in policing so that minorities aren't targeted like Floyd and others have been. But another problem is....who the fuck is going to want to be a police officer? It's already the most dangerous and most important job there is. They're woefully underpaid. Folks on the left are calling to defund police departments. If you're a cop and the mob comes for you, what do you do? Stand your ground and protect citizens? Or protect yourself? The whole situation sucks. From the systemic racism, to the riots, to the good cops being vilified by the public, to the bad cops being protected by their departments....we're in ugly times. Hopefully something good actually comes of these Floyd protests.
I don't think it's even in the top 15...
I'd love to hear the 15 jobs you think are as dangerous or more dangerous than being a police officer. I'll even start the list for you.
1) Military 2) Firefighting
That's a start, what are the other 13?
Logging, anything on a boat, most forms of construction...
I got ya. I guess I'll rephrase to say policing has the a lot of unspecified (and thus, hard to prepare for) danger to it. You don't know who or what you're going to run into. Most of those jobs in that "top 10 most dangerous jobs" you posted have more specified dangers (accidents in transportation being the most common it seems), so you know the safety precautions to take.
There's definitely a unique aspect to the danger in policing.
Yeah and with public-trust in policing eroding, coupled with low wages, and folks calling for police departments to be defunded, I worry how many people will even want to be cops and deal with those dangers going forward. And the saddest part is, the bad cops will probably still want to be cops because they have ego/racist/control issues they they take out on people through crooked policing. But the good people that want to be cops might not think it's worth the trouble at this rate. Could lead to even more bad cops in power.
I keep reading that "people want to defund the police" or "disband police".
Where the hell did this come from?
Angry protest rhetoric, mostly. It's out there, but it isn't all that serious, IMO.
Plenty of Minneapolis organizations have already terminated contracts with the MPD. The Los Angeles mayor is slashing $150million in funds from the LAPD's budget. It's not just angry protest rhetoric, serious action is beginning to take place. Let's hope it continues because this shit needs fixed. But it runs deep for over 400 years, so it isn't gonna happen overnight.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Great post. Another idea could be to put money towards independent "watchdog" organizations tasked with oversight of police departments. Someone to hold them accountable. The cop that killed Floyd had like 12 violations in his career but was never disciplined. That's on his chief. There has to be someone above that chief to determine if action should be taken in circumstances like that.
Isn't IA supposed to do that job? Police the police?
I'm not familiar with IA. I figured there must be an organization that is supposed to do that....but it sure doesn't seem to be working.
So what's IA? Obviously, my google search just led me to Iowa.
Internal Affairs, but it's part of the same department, staffed by cops. Probably a lot of social pressure there to look the other way. I don't know that...or much about IA, but some non-cops (i.e., not payed by the police department and not friends with the people they're looking into) need to be involved.
Yeah and that's the problem. I think we need something completely independent of police.
I will argue that to a point. teachers complain about superintendents that are put into positions that no zero about actual teaching and they claim that is what is wrong with things today.
Not a single post in this on this board (at least according to the search function) about this poor man that was murdered earlier in the week during the riots. Not surprising. His name was David Dorn, a 77-year-old former police chief that tried to help protect businesses in St. Louis during the riots, and was murdered in cold blood. His death as he bled out on the street was livestreamed on facebook. Very sad.
Why was a 77 year old out there trying to protect businesses? He should have known better.
Just so I'm clear that's sarcasm. It's a horrible story.
Also, I think I did read about that here but maybe without the name of the victim.
this was big news here in stl. from what i have seen he is kind of viewed as an uncle tom by protesters that were interviewed. it is really sad for sure though.
i guess the lesson here is if there is an angry mob coming at you to try to destroy something, you have to ask yourself if you are willing to lay down your life for someone else's property.
Which raises concerns about policing going forward. Of course the main concern everyone wants addressed is equality in policing so that minorities aren't targeted like Floyd and others have been. But another problem is....who the fuck is going to want to be a police officer? It's already the most dangerous and most important job there is. They're woefully underpaid. Folks on the left are calling to defund police departments. If you're a cop and the mob comes for you, what do you do? Stand your ground and protect citizens? Or protect yourself? The whole situation sucks. From the systemic racism, to the riots, to the good cops being vilified by the public, to the bad cops being protected by their departments....we're in ugly times. Hopefully something good actually comes of these Floyd protests.
I don't think it's even in the top 15...
I'd love to hear the 15 jobs you think are as dangerous or more dangerous than being a police officer. I'll even start the list for you.
1) Military 2) Firefighting
That's a start, what are the other 13?
Logging, anything on a boat, most forms of construction...
I got ya. I guess I'll rephrase to say policing has the a lot of unspecified (and thus, hard to prepare for) danger to it. You don't know who or what you're going to run into. Most of those jobs in that "top 10 most dangerous jobs" you posted have more specified dangers (accidents in transportation being the most common it seems), so you know the safety precautions to take.
There's definitely a unique aspect to the danger in policing.
Yeah and with public-trust in policing eroding, coupled with low wages, and folks calling for police departments to be defunded, I worry how many people will even want to be cops and deal with those dangers going forward. And the saddest part is, the bad cops will probably still want to be cops because they have ego/racist/control issues they they take out on people through crooked policing. But the good people that want to be cops might not think it's worth the trouble at this rate. Could lead to even more bad cops in power.
I keep reading that "people want to defund the police" or "disband police".
Where the hell did this come from?
Angry protest rhetoric, mostly. It's out there, but it isn't all that serious, IMO.
Plenty of Minneapolis organizations have already terminated contracts with the MPD. The Los Angeles mayor is slashing $150million in funds from the LAPD's budget. It's not just angry protest rhetoric, serious action is beginning to take place. Let's hope it continues because this shit needs fixed. But it runs deep for over 400 years, so it isn't gonna happen overnight.
I will be interested to see the crime statistics for many of these cities in the next 5 years. Defunding and cutting staff isn't going to fix police brutality and abuse, it's going to exacerbate the problem by having less money for training, resources and staff to handle calls. Go ahead and say fuck the police all you want, but that isn't a solution either.
For those asking about IA, most departments have a civilian review board comprised of citizens, local leaders and police leaders who review the complaints. Someone mentioned that it's the chief's fault Chauvin wasn't disciplined, and while he is ultimately in charge, he most likely had no knowledge of the previous complaints since that would have been handled by sergeants and captains who in turn would have most likely been countered by a strong union rebuttal if there wasn't substantial evidence (video or witness statements) to support the complaint.
On a personal note, I have heard of many officers with Minneapolis outright quitting in the last few weeks because they are fed up with the Department and how things have, and are being handled. There are also several who haven't quit that want to, but can't because they need to support their families and there is no way for them to just get on with another department.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
2 problems I see with this. Many won’t go for a tax increase if it’s going to cops. But that’s the smaller issue. The bigger one is this isn’t a quick fix. it would take 20-30 years of this massive increase in salary and requirements to really see a difference. They can’t just fire the 600,000 cops we have now, not without major lawsuits that would bankrupt the counties and cities. So even if you start this today, it will be 20+ years before the majority of cops we have now have left.
We've done more radical things before, but nothing is going to change at all, let alone sweeping reform.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
why should we give current cops, who are so ingrained with bad cops, a 6 figure salary? you can't teach old dogs new tricks, and bad cops are not going to suddenly find a conscience and unlearn their habits because you doubled their salary. many are sociopaths. why reward that behavior?
the entire policing system needs to be revamped, and more of the current cops have to go to make way for a new culture of police.
in no way should we give cops that amount of money while teachers have to pay out of their own pocket so there are crayons for their classrooms.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
Not a single post in this on this board (at least according to the search function) about this poor man that was murdered earlier in the week during the riots. Not surprising. His name was David Dorn, a 77-year-old former police chief that tried to help protect businesses in St. Louis during the riots, and was murdered in cold blood. His death as he bled out on the street was livestreamed on facebook. Very sad.
Why was a 77 year old out there trying to protect businesses? He should have known better.
Just so I'm clear that's sarcasm. It's a horrible story.
Also, I think I did read about that here but maybe without the name of the victim.
this was big news here in stl. from what i have seen he is kind of viewed as an uncle tom by protesters that were interviewed. it is really sad for sure though.
i guess the lesson here is if there is an angry mob coming at you to try to destroy something, you have to ask yourself if you are willing to lay down your life for someone else's property.
Which raises concerns about policing going forward. Of course the main concern everyone wants addressed is equality in policing so that minorities aren't targeted like Floyd and others have been. But another problem is....who the fuck is going to want to be a police officer? It's already the most dangerous and most important job there is. They're woefully underpaid. Folks on the left are calling to defund police departments. If you're a cop and the mob comes for you, what do you do? Stand your ground and protect citizens? Or protect yourself? The whole situation sucks. From the systemic racism, to the riots, to the good cops being vilified by the public, to the bad cops being protected by their departments....we're in ugly times. Hopefully something good actually comes of these Floyd protests.
I don't think it's even in the top 15...
I'd love to hear the 15 jobs you think are as dangerous or more dangerous than being a police officer. I'll even start the list for you.
1) Military 2) Firefighting
That's a start, what are the other 13?
Logging, anything on a boat, most forms of construction...
I got ya. I guess I'll rephrase to say policing has the a lot of unspecified (and thus, hard to prepare for) danger to it. You don't know who or what you're going to run into. Most of those jobs in that "top 10 most dangerous jobs" you posted have more specified dangers (accidents in transportation being the most common it seems), so you know the safety precautions to take.
There's definitely a unique aspect to the danger in policing.
Yeah and with public-trust in policing eroding, coupled with low wages, and folks calling for police departments to be defunded, I worry how many people will even want to be cops and deal with those dangers going forward. And the saddest part is, the bad cops will probably still want to be cops because they have ego/racist/control issues they they take out on people through crooked policing. But the good people that want to be cops might not think it's worth the trouble at this rate. Could lead to even more bad cops in power.
I keep reading that "people want to defund the police" or "disband police".
Where the hell did this come from?
Angry protest rhetoric, mostly. It's out there, but it isn't all that serious, IMO.
Plenty of Minneapolis organizations have already terminated contracts with the MPD. The Los Angeles mayor is slashing $150million in funds from the LAPD's budget. It's not just angry protest rhetoric, serious action is beginning to take place. Let's hope it continues because this shit needs fixed. But it runs deep for over 400 years, so it isn't gonna happen overnight.
I will be interested to see the crime statistics for many of these cities in the next 5 years. Defunding and cutting staff isn't going to fix police brutality and abuse, it's going to exacerbate the problem by having less money for training, resources and staff to handle calls. Go ahead and say fuck the police all you want, but that isn't a solution either.
i can't imagine the recent police brutality of peaceful people is doing much to help police recruitment. it may help military recruitment because police are basically paramilitary at this point.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
My wife ordered this the other day. I started reading it last night out of curiosity. 1/4 way through it. Makes some good points and interesting arguments.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,797
I was reading this article last night about defunding police departments:
One of the points made is the idea of investing some or much of the funding that goes to police departments into social services. This reminds me of a guest speaker who spoke at one of the classes I worked with in a Human Services at our local community college. The speaker had worked in prison administration. One of our students asked him what he thought was the best way to reform prisoners. He said reform is difficult and that prevention through improved education and social services is proven to be much more effective.
With that in mind, it seems to me that it would make more sense to fund education and social services rather than expand or continue to fund police department at the rate they are now. With better education and social services, there would not be the need for the large policing we have now. But, of course, the question is, will America go for this, or are we just to entrenched in doing things ass backwards?
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
One of the points made is the idea of investing some or much of the funding that goes to police departments into social services. This reminds me of a guest speaker who spoke at one of the classes I worked with in a Human Services at our local community college. The speaker had worked in prison administration. One of our students asked him what he thought was the best way to reform prisoners. He said reform is difficult and that prevention through improved education and social services is proven to be much more effective.
With that in mind, it seems to me that it would make more sense to fund education and social services rather than expand or continue to fund police department at the rate they are now. With better education and social services, there would not be the need for the large policing we have now. But, of course, the question is, will America go for this, or are we just to entrenched in doing things ass backwards?
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
why should we give current cops, who are so ingrained with bad cops, a 6 figure salary? you can't teach old dogs new tricks, and bad cops are not going to suddenly find a conscience and unlearn their habits because you doubled their salary. many are sociopaths. why reward that behavior?
the entire policing system needs to be revamped, and more of the current cops have to go to make way for a new culture of police.
in no way should we give cops that amount of money while teachers have to pay out of their own pocket so there are crayons for their classrooms.
I doubt if more than 10-15% of current police would meet the standards I would enact for the profession. 🤷♂️
This idea that police forces are underfunded is a MYTH. Maybe the officers themselves aren't paid much, but police unions are the one union that even Scott Walker of Wisconsin EXEMPTED from his anti-union amendment in recent years. In Virginia, it's the same. They are the only public union allowed (until this year we got new seriously limited collective bargaining rights for teachers) and the police succeed in their collective bargaining all the time. According to a Dept of Ed brief, in the past three decades state and local spending on corrections has grown three times faster than spending on education and social services. Florida spends 2.3 billion dollars a year on corrections, and 16% of its state employees work in corrections. States and localities use law enforcement to fund their coffers in the form of fees and fines -- found to be true in Ferguson and probably all across this country. Policing is BIG BUSINESS in America. Stop believing the lies about those "poor, poor police."
I have tried to shrink this photo multiple times. Sorry I'm technically challenged . . . I do know how to read, though. EDIT . . . okay, it's smaller in the actual post :-).
This idea that police forces are underfunded is a MYTH. Maybe the officers themselves aren't paid much, but police unions are the one union that even Scott Walker of Wisconsin EXEMPTED from his anti-union amendment in recent years. In Virginia, it's the same. They are the only public union allowed (until this year we got new seriously limited collective bargaining rights for teachers) and the police succeed in their collective bargaining all the time. According to a Dept of Ed brief, in the past three decades state and local spending on corrections has grown three times faster than spending on education and social services. Florida spends 2.3 billion dollars a year on corrections, and 16% of its state employees work in corrections. States and localities use law enforcement to fund their coffers in the form of fees and fines -- found to be true in Ferguson and probably all across this country. Policing is BIG BUSINESS in America. Stop believing the lies about those "poor, poor police."
I have tried to shrink this photo multiple times. Sorry I'm technically challenged . . . I do know how to read, though. EDIT . . . okay, it's smaller in the actual post :-).
Good last couple of posts what dreams. Getting to some of the major problems.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
why should we give current cops, who are so ingrained with bad cops, a 6 figure salary? you can't teach old dogs new tricks, and bad cops are not going to suddenly find a conscience and unlearn their habits because you doubled their salary. many are sociopaths. why reward that behavior?
the entire policing system needs to be revamped, and more of the current cops have to go to make way for a new culture of police.
in no way should we give cops that amount of money while teachers have to pay out of their own pocket so there are crayons for their classrooms.
I doubt if more than 10-15% of current police would meet the standards I would enact for the profession. 🤷♂️
And MN already has one of the highest standards in the country for officers. Some cities even require a 4 year degree, while the standard is at least a 2 year. Many states don't even require any college. HS grad, background and on to the academy. That is scary to me.
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
why should we give current cops, who are so ingrained with bad cops, a 6 figure salary? you can't teach old dogs new tricks, and bad cops are not going to suddenly find a conscience and unlearn their habits because you doubled their salary. many are sociopaths. why reward that behavior?
the entire policing system needs to be revamped, and more of the current cops have to go to make way for a new culture of police.
in no way should we give cops that amount of money while teachers have to pay out of their own pocket so there are crayons for their classrooms.
I doubt if more than 10-15% of current police would meet the standards I would enact for the profession. 🤷♂️
norm posted an interesting article on facebook yesterday that police academies only want applicants with IQs in a certain range. they are afraid that people with IQs that are too high will get bored with mundane police work after expensive training and then leave the profession. i will see if i can find the link. it was fascinating stuff.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
My solution, which I've laid out here in detail a few times, is the opposite: Flood the profession with money. Starting salaries in excess of $100,000 across the board, but in conjunction with MASSIVELY more strict qualifications. Massive increases in training and continuing education. Massive increases in performance evaluation. You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
why should we give current cops, who are so ingrained with bad cops, a 6 figure salary? you can't teach old dogs new tricks, and bad cops are not going to suddenly find a conscience and unlearn their habits because you doubled their salary. many are sociopaths. why reward that behavior?
the entire policing system needs to be revamped, and more of the current cops have to go to make way for a new culture of police.
in no way should we give cops that amount of money while teachers have to pay out of their own pocket so there are crayons for their classrooms.
I doubt if more than 10-15% of current police would meet the standards I would enact for the profession. 🤷♂️
And MN already has one of the highest standards in the country for officers. Some cities even require a 4 year degree, while the standard is at least a 2 year. Many states don't even require any college. HS grad, background and on to the academy. That is scary to me.
is that for all cops? i can see detectives needing that kind of education, but i can't imagine all police having degrees.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
you know what takes a special kind of a person? a prison guard.
i had a roommate in grad school who was a prison guard at a supermax in southern illinois. he was so cruel. even to regular people. he roughed up his g/f one time at a bar and got the cops called on him. i wasn't there at the time, but he was not arrested. i found out later he talked her out of pressing charges.
he had to have been a sociopath. i have not heard from him since 2000. would not surprise me if he pissed off the wrong inmate and got himself attacked.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
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In some states the first assignment sheriffs get is jail. Great idea. Start people who may be idealistic off working with people who are mostly criminals. I imagine that would make some people jaded.
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You shouldn't be able to join a police force if you can't get accepted to a competitive undergraduate program. Best and brightest only.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
I read the article and I will disagree.
I googled it too and see that a few are holding signs.
The bigger one is this isn’t a quick fix. it would take 20-30 years of this massive increase in salary and requirements to really see a difference. They can’t just fire the 600,000 cops we have now, not without major lawsuits that would bankrupt the counties and cities. So even if you start this today, it will be 20+ years before the majority of cops we have now have left.
So what's IA? Obviously, my google search just led me to Iowa.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Internal Affairs, but it's part of the same department, staffed by cops. Probably a lot of social pressure there to look the other way. I don't know that...or much about IA, but some non-cops (i.e., not payed by the police department and not friends with the people they're looking into) need to be involved.
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Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Same could apply to AI.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
On a personal note, I have heard of many officers with Minneapolis outright quitting in the last few weeks because they are fed up with the Department and how things have, and are being handled. There are also several who haven't quit that want to, but can't because they need to support their families and there is no way for them to just get on with another department.
the entire policing system needs to be revamped, and more of the current cops have to go to make way for a new culture of police.
in no way should we give cops that amount of money while teachers have to pay out of their own pocket so there are crayons for their classrooms.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Excellent point
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Methinks they might be a tad off on that one.
I have tried to shrink this photo multiple times. Sorry I'm technically challenged . . . I do know how to read, though. EDIT . . . okay, it's smaller in the actual post :-).
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
i had a roommate in grad school who was a prison guard at a supermax in southern illinois. he was so cruel. even to regular people. he roughed up his g/f one time at a bar and got the cops called on him. i wasn't there at the time, but he was not arrested. i found out later he talked her out of pressing charges.
he had to have been a sociopath. i have not heard from him since 2000. would not surprise me if he pissed off the wrong inmate and got himself attacked.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Great idea.
Start people who may be idealistic off working with people who are mostly criminals.
I imagine that would make some people jaded.