So my daughter asked me this today. “If there is a break in do I call the police, and if so should I tell them two of my brothers are black?” Fucked up world...
I'm so sad that a child has to feel this way (black, white, whatever) She should tell them about her brothers if she ever needs to contact the police because it's going to keep happening.
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
What's happening isn't some political operation or corporate think tank scheme, it's an emotional outpouring from a people who live near their breaking point...And some shitheads who just want to cause trouble, they can always be counted on to latch onto any volatile situation. It's the same as the situation that has occurred in Palestine and untold numbers of oppressed populations. Looking for logical sense in it and shaking your head disdainfully when you don't find it is just a masturbatory exercise in failing to recognize the privilege of your perspective.
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
His point is valid, though, and that point is that it's real easy to put it all on equal terms of "not OK" when you haven't had to live in fear and anger for your entire life.
Ok cool. So I guess as a white guy I can’t have an opinion on this unless I’m out there protesting. Thankfully I can still have an opinion on the new Pearl Jam album, as a white guy. A lot of things make me angry. You know nothing about me. As angry as I’ve been I’ve never shown extreme violence towards the problem.
I didn't say you don't get to have an opinion, I just said your opinion is just about worthless lol
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
Did a black protester execute a cop yesterday? What am I missing?
No. But it’s happened here in NY. And it could happen again.
I don't understand why you would bring that up in the context of this conversation, twice. I don't see the correlation, doesn't make sense to me.
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
What's happening isn't some political operation or corporate think tank scheme, it's an emotional outpouring from a people who live near their breaking point...And some shitheads who just want to cause trouble, they can always be counted on to latch onto any volatile situation. It's the same as the situation that has occurred in Palestine and untold numbers of oppressed populations. Looking for logical sense in it and shaking your head disdainfully when you don't find it is just a masturbatory exercise in failing to recognize the privilege of your perspective.
You don’t know my perspective. You don’t know if I’ve been to jail, arrested. Who I grew up with. How I grew up. You know nothing. You assume based on the color of my skin and my gender that’s it’s all good and smooth. What’s that called again?
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
His point is valid, though, and that point is that it's real easy to put it all on equal terms of "not OK" when you haven't had to live in fear and anger for your entire life.
Ok cool. So I guess as a white guy I can’t have an opinion on this unless I’m out there protesting. Thankfully I can still have an opinion on the new Pearl Jam album, as a white guy. A lot of things make me angry. You know nothing about me. As angry as I’ve been I’ve never shown extreme violence towards the problem.
I didn't say you don't get to have an opinion, I just said your opinion is just about worthless lol
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
What's happening isn't some political operation or corporate think tank scheme, it's an emotional outpouring from a people who live near their breaking point...And some shitheads who just want to cause trouble, they can always be counted on to latch onto any volatile situation. It's the same as the situation that has occurred in Palestine and untold numbers of oppressed populations. Looking for logical sense in it and shaking your head disdainfully when you don't find it is just a masturbatory exercise in failing to recognize the privilege of your perspective.
You don’t know my perspective. You don’t know if I’ve been to jail, arrested. Who I grew up with. How I grew up. You know nothing. You assume based on the color of my skin and my gender that’s it’s all good and smooth. What’s that called again?
No, I don't judge based off those things, I judge your opinion on it's own merit, and it's an uninformed opinion and it's weak. The logic only follows from there that it's born of privilege.
"Let me say as I've always said, and I will always continue to say, that riots are socially destructive and self-defeating. ... But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality, and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation's summers of riots are caused by our nation's winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again. [Martin Luther King Jr., "The Other America"]
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
His point is valid, though, and that point is that it's real easy to put it all on equal terms of "not OK" when you haven't had to live in fear and anger for your entire life.
Ok cool. So I guess as a white guy I can’t have an opinion on this unless I’m out there protesting. Thankfully I can still have an opinion on the new Pearl Jam album, as a white guy. A lot of things make me angry. You know nothing about me. As angry as I’ve been I’ve never shown extreme violence towards the problem.
I didn't say you don't get to have an opinion, I just said your opinion is just about worthless lol
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
How is he ragging on you by saying he thinks both the cop and the rioters are wrong?
As for the riots, I can't blame them. If I was black, I'd probably want to burn down the city too when this sort of thing happens. It's horrible for business owners that don't deserve to have their livelihoods destroyed. But as far as them setting the police station on fire? Oh well. Maybe if they at least arrested the officer, the riots wouldn't have happened.....
Or at least wouldn't happen on this scale. Let's be real, there are some people that don't care one way or another about Floyd's murder, they just look at this as an opportunity to loot. And again, I can't really say I blame them. It's hard to tell legitimately angry people exactly HOW they should be angry. Should you tell a looter who's lighting Target on fire that he'd be better off writing to his local congressman about police brutality? Obviously that doesn't work.
I was preemptively addressing the most likely disagreement with my statement that as a white male he speaks from a position of privilege.
I don't condone any death or violence, however I agreed with the police station fire rather than destroying businesses of those not involved. And go ahead and tell me how awful that sounds but some of you have no idea unless you've walked in their shoes or spent 27 years listening to what they've dealt with. My husband worked in two maximum security prisons (these opinions do not include pedafiles) and the bottom line in all this is respect. My husband never had any issues because he treated his job as a job, not assuming he was the judge and jury, and found from the very beginning in Philadelphia that respect between two humans is the answer. We have no right to judge others, that's for higher beings to decide when people leave this earth. My husband would tell you that he would trust a convict before a cop. In fact, he was instrumental in having a lifers sentence reduced to time served (30 years overturning a life sentence) because the CHILD was convicted at age 15 for a life sentence after robbing someone for food for his younger siblings (no father and mother was a drug addict). He was the most respectful person my husband ever met and helped young men just entering the system to understand how to handle themselves properly in prison, how to behave. I could tell you countless incidents involving the good, kind behavior of convicted fellons. As someone said, unless you've walked in their shoes, lived their lives as children and dealt with prejudice your entire life you should try to at least understand. Unfortunately, the only recourse left is violence because so far nothing works for these people. Same problem with school shootings....we talk and talk and talk and NOTHING gets done. The man was subdued so the officers job was completed. The four of them should be convicted of murder. Someone should have stepped in (kicked the cop in the head) rather than standing around and watching. Those who do and say nothing are just as quilty.
So apparently, the cop and Floyd had worked together as security guards. I wonder if there were any personal issues between them that might have led to the cop to have it out for him....
I don't condone any death or violence, however I agreed with the police station fire rather than destroying businesses of those not involved. And go ahead and tell me how awful that sounds but some of you have no idea unless you've walked in their shoes or spent 27 years listening to what they've dealt with. My husband worked in two maximum security prisons (these opinions do not include pedafiles) and the bottom line in all this is respect. My husband never had any issues because he treated his job as a job, not assuming he was the judge and jury, and found from the very beginning in Philadelphia that respect between two humans is the answer. We have no right to judge others, that's for higher beings to decide when people leave this earth. My husband would tell you that he would trust a convict before a cop. In fact, he was instrumental in having a lifers sentence reduced to time served (30 years overturning a life sentence) because the CHILD was convicted at age 15 for a life sentence after robbing someone for food for his younger siblings (no father and mother was a drug addict). He was the most respectful person my husband ever met and helped young men just entering the system to understand how to handle themselves properly in prison, how to behave. I could tell you countless incidents involving the good, kind behavior of convicted fellons. As someone said, unless you've walked in their shoes, lived their lives as children and dealt with prejudice your entire life you should try to at least understand. Unfortunately, the only recourse left is violence because so far nothing works for these people. Same problem with school shootings....we talk and talk and talk and NOTHING gets done. The man was subdued so the officers job was completed. The four of them should be convicted of murder. Someone should have stepped in (kicked the cop in the head) rather than standing around and watching. Those who do and say nothing are just as quilty.
It's hard to "officially" condone this but I get it and I appreciate where you're coming from. What's it like to know you can go just about anywhere and have a cop beat or kill you for no reason? And legal channels haven't worked for centuries. Why would they work now. Right now Hennepin County Attorney Mike Freeman appears to be dragging his feet (looking for a rationale?). Why? And this murder
differs from a 1950s lynching in one way: smart phones. Without it
being recorded, nothing ever comes of this. The lynching a few months
ago in Georgia? The DA buried it. The police didn't pursue it when
they saw the tape. They pursued it when WE saw the tape.
(I also appreciate some of the rest of what you say and my philosophies on criminal justice, particularly how we treat the people that are going to one day get out, have changed quite a bit. "Three hots and a cot" isn't working)
1995 Milwaukee 1998 Alpine, Alpine 2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston 2004 Boston, Boston 2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty) 2011 Alpine, Alpine 2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
It is terrible for sure, but when the same thing continues to happen year after year all over the country, there is a tipping point where people will resort to violence because quietly protesting hasn't resulted in the change required. Imagine if nationwide riots erupted after events like Sandy Hook or Parkland? People get fed up, especially in a time of quarantine and unemployment and then you throw this on top of it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Setting fire to a police station , walking up to an officer and executing them (no protests for that) , will not make any positive difference. It will only make things worse. There absolutely no excuse for the behavior from the cop or these violent rioters. It’s lose , lose
Rag on me for this all you want, but that's an easy thing to say as a white male. When has the system ever not been in your favor?
Oh please. What does this have to do with what I said? It’s ok to execute a cop as a black male? Or set fire to a precinct? You said quietly protesting hasn’t worked. I’m saying whatever the fuck is happening there now isn’t going to work either. In fact, it will make things worse because I’m sure cops feel like they have a target on their back. Which will make them more violent and jumpy. None of this is ok.
What's happening isn't some political operation or corporate think tank scheme, it's an emotional outpouring from a people who live near their breaking point...And some shitheads who just want to cause trouble, they can always be counted on to latch onto any volatile situation. It's the same as the situation that has occurred in Palestine and untold numbers of oppressed populations. Looking for logical sense in it and shaking your head disdainfully when you don't find it is just a masturbatory exercise in failing to recognize the privilege of your perspective.
You don’t know my perspective. You don’t know if I’ve been to jail, arrested. Who I grew up with. How I grew up. You know nothing. You assume based on the color of my skin and my gender that’s it’s all good and smooth. What’s that called again?
No, I don't judge based off those things, I judge your opinion on it's own merit, and it's an uninformed opinion and it's weak. The logic only follows from there that it's born of privilege.
"Let me say as I've always said, and I will always continue to say, that riots are socially destructive and self-defeating. ... But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality, and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation's summers of riots are caused by our nation's winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again. [Martin Luther King Jr., "The Other America"]
Yeah, The good Dr's quotes are nice but there isn't a leader among Minneapolis to be leading the people so we can take quotes and post em all day long.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,086
What in the actual fuck is happening to parts of this country?
CNN Reporters Arrested For Covering Protests in Minnesota
A crew of CNN reporters were arrested early Friday morning in Minneapolis for … well, it’s not totally clear.
Correspondent Omar Jimenez, producer Bill Kirkos, and camera operator
Leonel Mendez were taken into custody by Minnesota State Police while
reporting on street closures that followed a night of protests over the
death of George Floyd. The period prior to the arrests and the arrests themselves were broadcast live on the network.
As seen in the video, Jimenez clearly states to law enforcement that
the crew will comply with any directions. “Put us back where you want
us,” Jimenez says. “We are getting out of your way. Just let us know.
Wherever you want us, we will go.”
Jimenez then described the scene before he is told he is being put
under arrest and his hands are zip-tied behind his back. He asks why he
is being arrested to no apparent response, after which he is led away
and Kirkos and Mendez are arrested.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.” Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.
If the 4 officers get arrested, is there civil unrest in Minneapolis?
I'll add to that, should there be either way?
If you haven't been a black male in America for the last 50 years can you really understand when enough is enough? It's not just the officer or officers in this one incident, it's an entire system that continues to fail minorities in general.
Bingo , how can I understand what a black person goes through everyday if I don’t walk in a black man’s shoes! Fact
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
White people riot and vandalize and loot because their sports team lost, and almost nothing is done about it.
Black people riot and vandalize and loot because their people are being murdered by police on video, and people use it as an excuse why cops treat black people this way.
interesting.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
So much for non violent, peaceful protests. This whole situation is fucking disgraceful. From the cop straight to the idiots who have to break the law and vandalize. Way to prove a point.
White people riot and vandalize and loot because their sports team lost, and almost nothing is done about it.
Black people riot and vandalize and loot because their people are being murdered by police on video, and people use it as an excuse why cops treat black people this way.
interesting.
Well Halifax did mention the gal killed by a police beanbag during the boston riot of 2004.
I never see "nothing happening" by the cops during white riots, are we calling them this now? White riots?
I did read an interesting article as to why black people turn to rioting after an event. I'll try and find it.
That could be tough. Chauvin was with the department for over 20 years, and judging by his list of infractions with no discipline, he seems well protected. It's possible he was the senior-ranking officer of the four. And per the almighty chain-of-command codes, the others might be able to argue they couldn't overstep him. In a morality court, they're guilty for not speaking up, and they deserved to lose their jobs. But in a legal court, I think they'd have a good defense against being held criminally responsible. Chauvin doesn't. At all.
That could be tough. Chauvin was with the department for over 20 years, and judging by his list of infractions with no discipline, he seems well protected. It's possible he was the senior-ranking officer of the four. And per the almighty chain-of-command codes, the others might be able to argue they couldn't overstep him. In a morality court, they're guilty for not speaking up, and they deserved to lose their jobs. But in a legal court, I think they'd have a good defense against being held criminally responsible. Chauvin doesn't. At all.
Wouldn't there be something in their code of ethics where they are obligated to override their ranking officer if they are putting/neglecting someone in imminent danger?
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
That could be tough. Chauvin was with the department for over 20 years, and judging by his list of infractions with no discipline, he seems well protected. It's possible he was the senior-ranking officer of the four. And per the almighty chain-of-command codes, the others might be able to argue they couldn't overstep him. In a morality court, they're guilty for not speaking up, and they deserved to lose their jobs. But in a legal court, I think they'd have a good defense against being held criminally responsible. Chauvin doesn't. At all.
Wouldn't there be something in their code of ethics where they are obligated to override their ranking officer if they are putting/neglecting someone in imminent danger?
Probably, and that's why they were fired. But that's not the same as being charged with a crime.That'd be a good argument in a civil suit against them though.
That could be tough. Chauvin was with the department for over 20 years, and judging by his list of infractions with no discipline, he seems well protected. It's possible he was the senior-ranking officer of the four. And per the almighty chain-of-command codes, the others might be able to argue they couldn't overstep him. In a morality court, they're guilty for not speaking up, and they deserved to lose their jobs. But in a legal court, I think they'd have a good defense against being held criminally responsible. Chauvin doesn't. At all.
Wouldn't there be something in their code of ethics where they are obligated to override their ranking officer if they are putting/neglecting someone in imminent danger?
Probably, and that's why they were fired. But that's not the same as being charged with a crime.That'd be a good argument in a civil suit against them though.
I obviously have a limited understanding of why they'd be culpable enough to lose their jobs but not enough to be charged.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
That could be tough. Chauvin was with the department for over 20 years, and judging by his list of infractions with no discipline, he seems well protected. It's possible he was the senior-ranking officer of the four. And per the almighty chain-of-command codes, the others might be able to argue they couldn't overstep him. In a morality court, they're guilty for not speaking up, and they deserved to lose their jobs. But in a legal court, I think they'd have a good defense against being held criminally responsible. Chauvin doesn't. At all.
Here's why I think all four should be arrested and charged... feel free to disagree.
My first unpopular opinion is that cops should be held MORE ACCOUNTABLE than the public.
It's difficult with cops because they're in a sticky situation. They wouldn't be there if the call to assist didn't come. But to me it's not an excuse if they are to be held to same standards as the public they 'protect.' Dude had the cops called on him for forgery and being drunk... and ended up getting killed. Very not cool.
If I'm a prosecutor, I would have to ask the other cops why they did not intervene against Chauvin when he had his knee against his neck and you could clearly hear him saying "I can't breathe." Whatever their excuse is ... and if you're about to disagree with me... whatever your excuse is is in my opinion completely wrong. There are no two ways to look at this. If the police are there to protect, they completely failed simply because the person who was committing the crime before their eyes was their colleague, friend, fellow cop. And that is totally wrong. The problem is... I can't think of a single cop that would do what I just suggested which is ironically the right thing to do and what would have prevented a manslaughter.
I've personally been in this exact same situation. Trying to handle a crook on the ground who is passively resisting. Another fellow had his knee on his neck and all I had to do was look at the fellow and say.. "Hey, neck." And off the knee went. That came from training and common sense. It's a balance. Protect yourself, fellow officers, and the public but also be in care and control of the suspect. If you can't do that... you shouldn't be wearing a badge and carrying a firearm.
If they don't get the book thrown at them... all of them... it's not going to send a good message. Not just to the black community, but the entire community.
BTW .. this wasn't a murder. It's bothering me how much I'm seeing on the internet saying Chauvin "murdered" Floyd. No he didn't. But he is culpable for his death (manslaughter) and the three other cops helped and should have known better. Everything you need is on camera.
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Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
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Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
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Toronto I&II 2011
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Comments
She should tell them about her brothers if she ever needs to contact the police because it's going to keep happening.
It's the same as the situation that has occurred in Palestine and untold numbers of oppressed populations. Looking for logical sense in it and shaking your head disdainfully when you don't find it is just a masturbatory exercise in failing to recognize the privilege of your perspective.
"Let me say as I've always said, and I will always continue to say, that riots are socially destructive and self-defeating. ... But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality, and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation's summers of riots are caused by our nation's winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again. [Martin Luther King Jr., "The Other America"]
Even comedians get it.
Unfortunately, the only recourse left is violence because so far nothing works for these people. Same problem with school shootings....we talk and talk and talk and NOTHING gets done. The man was subdued so the officers job was completed. The four of them should be convicted of murder. Someone should have stepped in (kicked the cop in the head) rather than standing around and watching. Those who do and say nothing are just as quilty.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/they-were-working-together-bar-owner-says-george-floyd-and-derek-chauvin-worked-for-her-as-security-guards
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
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CNN Reporters Arrested For Covering Protests in Minnesota
A crew of CNN reporters were arrested early Friday morning in Minneapolis for … well, it’s not totally clear.
Correspondent Omar Jimenez, producer Bill Kirkos, and camera operator Leonel Mendez were taken into custody by Minnesota State Police while reporting on street closures that followed a night of protests over the death of George Floyd. The period prior to the arrests and the arrests themselves were broadcast live on the network.
As seen in the video, Jimenez clearly states to law enforcement that the crew will comply with any directions. “Put us back where you want us,” Jimenez says. “We are getting out of your way. Just let us know. Wherever you want us, we will go.”
Jimenez then described the scene before he is told he is being put under arrest and his hands are zip-tied behind his back. He asks why he is being arrested to no apparent response, after which he is led away and Kirkos and Mendez are arrested.
Please, dude. You can definitely charge him with at least involuntary manslaughter. Charge him, and let the court decide if he's guilty or not.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Black people riot and vandalize and loot because their people are being murdered by police on video, and people use it as an excuse why cops treat black people this way.
interesting.
-EV 8/14/93
I never see "nothing happening" by the cops during white riots, are we calling them this now? White riots?
I did read an interesting article as to why black people turn to rioting after an event. I'll try and find it.
-EV 8/14/93
-EV 8/14/93
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
-EV 8/14/93
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
-EV 8/14/93
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
-EV 8/14/93
My first unpopular opinion is that cops should be held MORE ACCOUNTABLE than the public.
It's difficult with cops because they're in a sticky situation. They wouldn't be there if the call to assist didn't come. But to me it's not an excuse if they are to be held to same standards as the public they 'protect.' Dude had the cops called on him for forgery and being drunk... and ended up getting killed. Very not cool.
If I'm a prosecutor, I would have to ask the other cops why they did not intervene against Chauvin when he had his knee against his neck and you could clearly hear him saying "I can't breathe." Whatever their excuse is ... and if you're about to disagree with me... whatever your excuse is is in my opinion completely wrong. There are no two ways to look at this. If the police are there to protect, they completely failed simply because the person who was committing the crime before their eyes was their colleague, friend, fellow cop. And that is totally wrong. The problem is... I can't think of a single cop that would do what I just suggested which is ironically the right thing to do and what would have prevented a manslaughter.
I've personally been in this exact same situation. Trying to handle a crook on the ground who is passively resisting. Another fellow had his knee on his neck and all I had to do was look at the fellow and say.. "Hey, neck." And off the knee went. That came from training and common sense. It's a balance. Protect yourself, fellow officers, and the public but also be in care and control of the suspect. If you can't do that... you shouldn't be wearing a badge and carrying a firearm.
If they don't get the book thrown at them... all of them... it's not going to send a good message. Not just to the black community, but the entire community.
BTW .. this wasn't a murder. It's bothering me how much I'm seeing on the internet saying Chauvin "murdered" Floyd. No he didn't. But he is culpable for his death (manslaughter) and the three other cops helped and should have known better. Everything you need is on camera.
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx