America's Gun Violence

dudeman

gimmesometruth27 said:

think about it.

the gun store should theoretically be the safest place on earth. nobody goes there except people who are proficient with the basics of how to safely use a gun.

or does this prove my point that there should be basic gun control steps taken?

If you cared enough to research, (I don't) I'm sure you would find that shootings at gun stores are incredibly rare.

dudeman

Smellyman said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

think about it.

the gun store should theoretically be the safest place on earth. nobody goes there except people who are proficient with the basics of how to safely use a gun.

or does this prove my point that there should be basic gun control steps taken?

and the company line....more people that are carrying, the safer it will be.

Legal concealed carry is entirely different than gun ownership. People who legally carry concealed pistols are among the most law-abiding citizens in this country. More so than law enforcement officers, actually.

PJ_Soul

muskydan said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

Don't be surprised if you really enjoy yourself. I have taken many people shooting for their first time before and now they have 10x more guns than me. If you want to take it seriously and are looking to shoot well, try to relax and control your breathing. Its hard because you will be amped up, trust me on that one. Match up your back sights w/ your front sight and don't jump on the trigger. Pull the trigger with a smooth consistent trigger pull.
Now of course none of that crap matters if you get yourself into a gun fight….

I will be very surprised if I enjoy myself. I don't like loud banging noises, abrupt physical sensations, or being around deadly weapons or in a building filled with people who do enjoy deadly weapons, lol. But even if I do enjoy myself, I am against the principle behind recreational gun use, fun or not, so I'm definitely not going to be making a habit of it either way. But thank you for the tips, since nothing is worth doing unless you're going to try and do it right. If I'm going to try it, I obviously want to hit the target, and while I won't be amped up, I will be nervous and uncomfortable, so basically the same thing physically.

dudeman

mickeyrat said:

Fuck your guns, shove them up your ass and pull the trigger. You are too fucking stupid to have kids, and damn sure not responsible for a deadl weapon. I hope you fry and rot in hell. ENOUGH IS FUCKING ENOUGH.

THIS ISNT AN ACCIDENT!!!!!!!! ITS AN EVENTUALITY.

http://wkrn.com/2016/01/25/police-child-accidentally-shot-by-another-child-in-crossville-parking-lot/

This is a disgusting story and a perfect example of parents who should be locked up or worse.

mickeyrat

dudeman said:

mickeyrat said:

dudeman said:

I read about this story on a gun forum earlier. You know what's interesting? They were all saying the same things as the posters here.

Specific to this incident? Or somewhat more generally?

Beginning from stand point of where we are in agreement is better than opposition isnt it?

Both. A lot of gun owners agree with much of what is greenly the outcome of our discussions about guns on AMT.

Changes should be made. Too many people who shouldn't have guns do.

Well that IS heartening. It will take more voices from that "side" of this to speak often and loudly. And perhaps force the chief advocate to modify its position somewhat, because to be honest it really seems as if the NRA no longer represent its membership but rather the manufacturers. In the end its the manufacturers that are benefiting from this debate.

dudeman

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

mickeyrat

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

But its better to learn first hand what some of the appeal may be to form a more knowledgable opinion , isnt it?

PJ_Soul

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

Did you miss the "so to speak" part in my post? It was a figurative comment. I.e. if one is going to debate something they should know everything they reasonably can about the subject. What you are saying is, to me, the equivalent of burying your head in the sand if you don't like something. I am not that kind of person.

dudeman

rgambs said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

It's nothing special. People who love it are nuts. They have to be having Rambo fantasies or something, otherwise I don't see what the big deal is at all. I grew up shooting (Boy Scouts and with family) and it is so overrated it isn't funny.

This doesn't reflect my experiences at all. I don't have "Rambo fantasies" and I don't shoot for fun. I go to the range to develop and maintain proficiency with a tool that may one day be needed in an emergency. That's it.

dudeman

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

mickeyrat said:

Fuck your guns, shove them up your ass and pull the trigger. You are too fucking stupid to have kids, and damn sure not responsible for a deadl weapon. I hope you fry and rot in hell. ENOUGH IS FUCKING ENOUGH.

THIS ISNT AN ACCIDENT!!!!!!!! ITS AN EVENTUALITY.

http://wkrn.com/2016/01/25/police-child-accidentally-shot-by-another-child-in-crossville-parking-lot/

I wonder how many times had one of these two idiots argued against gun control citing responsible ownership to make their case?

It's always someone else. Until it's not.

You'd have to ask one of the two idiots.

dudeman

callen said:

Gun store incident demonstrates many gun owners mentality.

"Come and Take it"

"Don't tread on Me".

"I Don't call 911 call smith and Wesson".

As to shooting guns, yeah gives many sense of empowerment. Instant gun muscles. Unfortunately it's these exact folks that shouldn't have guns. Oh well the foolishness will continue.

This isn't a representative assessment of me or any of the people I shoot and train with.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

dudeman said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

mickeyrat said:

Fuck your guns, shove them up your ass and pull the trigger. You are too fucking stupid to have kids, and damn sure not responsible for a deadl weapon. I hope you fry and rot in hell. ENOUGH IS FUCKING ENOUGH.

THIS ISNT AN ACCIDENT!!!!!!!! ITS AN EVENTUALITY.

http://wkrn.com/2016/01/25/police-child-accidentally-shot-by-another-child-in-crossville-parking-lot/

I wonder how many times had one of these two idiots argued against gun control citing responsible ownership to make their case?

It's always someone else. Until it's not.

You'd have to ask one of the two idiots.

I think we can make some safe assumptions though.

rgambs

dudeman said:

rgambs said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

It's nothing special. People who love it are nuts. They have to be having Rambo fantasies or something, otherwise I don't see what the big deal is at all. I grew up shooting (Boy Scouts and with family) and it is so overrated it isn't funny.

This doesn't reflect my experiences at all. I don't have "Rambo fantasies" and I don't shoot for fun. I go to the range to develop and maintain proficiency with a tool that may one day be needed in an emergency. That's it.

You are in the minority there, everyone I know who is gun nutty is out there having phantom 'Nam flashbacks.

PJ_Soul

rgambs said:

dudeman said:

rgambs said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

It's nothing special. People who love it are nuts. They have to be having Rambo fantasies or something, otherwise I don't see what the big deal is at all. I grew up shooting (Boy Scouts and with family) and it is so overrated it isn't funny.

This doesn't reflect my experiences at all. I don't have "Rambo fantasies" and I don't shoot for fun. I go to the range to develop and maintain proficiency with a tool that may one day be needed in an emergency. That's it.

You are in the minority there, everyone I know who is gun nutty is out there having phantom 'Nam flashbacks.

Agreed. Dudeman, you are one of the exceptions to the rule IMO. Also, I'm not sure I totally buy what you're saying. If you truly only did it so that you were proficient during an emergency you wouldn't need to be nearly as into it as you seem to be.

dudeman

mickeyrat said:

dudeman said:

mickeyrat said:

dudeman said:

I read about this story on a gun forum earlier. You know what's interesting? They were all saying the same things as the posters here.

Specific to this incident? Or somewhat more generally?

Beginning from stand point of where we are in agreement is better than opposition isnt it?

Both. A lot of gun owners agree with much of what is greenly the outcome of our discussions about guns on AMT.

Changes should be made. Too many people who shouldn't have guns do.

Well that IS heartening. It will take more voices from that "side" of this to speak often and loudly. And perhaps force the chief advocate to modify its position somewhat, because to be honest it really seems as if the NRA no longer represent its membership but rather the manufacturers. In the end its the manufacturers that are benefiting from this debate.

Ultimately, we're all on the same side. No one likes to see innocent people killed.

dudeman

PJ_Soul said:

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

Did you miss the "so to speak" part in my post? It was a figurative comment. I.e. if one is going to debate something they should know everything they reasonably can about the subject. What you are saying is, to me, the equivalent of burying your head in the sand if you don't like something. I am not that kind of person.

You are admittedly reluctant, nervous and have feelings of guilt about shooting. You have already decided that it's not something you'll like and it's going to make you uncomfortable.

I wouldn't put a gun in the hand of someone that fit that description. Just saying.

Good luck, though and be safe!

dudeman

mickeyrat said:

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

But its better to learn first hand what some of the appeal may be to form a more knowledgable opinion , isnt it?

I'm against murder but I'm not about to go kill someone just to find out what it's like.

dudeman

PJ_Soul said:

rgambs said:

dudeman said:

rgambs said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

It's nothing special. People who love it are nuts. They have to be having Rambo fantasies or something, otherwise I don't see what the big deal is at all. I grew up shooting (Boy Scouts and with family) and it is so overrated it isn't funny.

This doesn't reflect my experiences at all. I don't have "Rambo fantasies" and I don't shoot for fun. I go to the range to develop and maintain proficiency with a tool that may one day be needed in an emergency. That's it.

You are in the minority there, everyone I know who is gun nutty is out there having phantom 'Nam flashbacks.

Agreed. Dudeman, you are one of the exceptions to the rule IMO. Also, I'm not sure I totally buy what you're saying. If you truly only did it so that you were proficient during an emergency you wouldn't need to be nearly as into it as you seem to be.

Actually, I'm more into the debate about gun control than actually shooting. I think it's important to try to preserve the idea that gun ownership is a right for law-abiding citizens.

You are free to believe whatever you want about me or my intentions, though.

mickeyrat

dudeman said:

mickeyrat said:

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

But its better to learn first hand what some of the appeal may be to form a more knowledgable opinion , isnt it?

I'm against murder but I'm not about to go kill someone just to find out what it's like.

Ok. But to argue from a position of knowledge is far better than supposition.

Bad example though. That statement is beneath both of us andd this debate.

PJ_Soul

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

dudeman said:

PJ_Soul said:

So I'm going to go fire some guns at a range in a couple of weeks. I figure I should know what it's like if I'm going to debate against being a gun nut. I am not into it - i feel no curiosity about what it is like to use a deadly weapon at all to be honest - but a friend convinced me I ought to try it if I feel strongly about the subject and want to speak against gun culture. I dunno... it'll be weird and TBH i feel a little guilty fornsome reason. Like I'm helping to propagate the culture. Strange. But it'll be educational, definitely. Know thine enemy, so to speak.

If you look at gun owners as "thine enemy" why even bother going? Gun ownership is a personal decision and if shooting makes you feel uneasy or guilty, don't do it. It's certainly not for everyone.

Did you miss the "so to speak" part in my post? It was a figurative comment. I.e. if one is going to debate something they should know everything they reasonably can about the subject. What you are saying is, to me, the equivalent of burying your head in the sand if you don't like something. I am not that kind of person.

You are admittedly reluctant, nervous and have feelings of guilt about shooting. You have already decided that it's not something you'll like and it's going to make you uncomfortable.

I wouldn't put a gun in the hand of someone that fit that description. Just saying.

Good luck, though and be safe!

I am not following you. I am doing it so that I have that learning experience. Yes, I'm reluctant, nervous, and feel a bit of guilt. But like a normal, level-headed person, lol. Not like a mental case. I am a responsible, intelligent person who is perfectly capable of learning to use a gun no matter what my feelings are about it. I am not one to avoid an experience just because I'm not into it. Not if there is a purpose to doing it, and there is in this case.