Just one more firearms thread

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Comments

  • Smellyman
    Smellyman Asia Posts: 4,528
    unsung said:

    I don't understand that logic; trying to compare a knife to a gun. Instead of worrying about the tool that is used why don't we worry about why the deed was done. When someone tries to rationalize that the use of a knife would simply kill less that's like saying those knife killings are acceptable numbers. Instead we should focus on why people have the desire to harm others.

    indeed, let's keep guns in hands of nutters while we decipher the human psyche. We will get there someday. In the meantime we need guns to protect ourselves from said nutters with guns.

  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,707
    Smellyman said:

    mattsl1983 said:

    Guns also aren't even the number one item used in murder. Why do we focus on guns so much? Media?

    this sounds like a NRA statistic parroted over and over. first google hit:

    According to a 2007 study by the FBI, the last time a detailed study of this type was conducted, firearms were the most commonly used murder weapons nationally, accounting for 14,831 murders that year. These are followed by knives or stabbing weapons, at 1,796, then by personal weapons, such as hands, feet, fists, etc.; blunt objects; strangulation; fire; asphyxiation; narcotics; drowning; and poison.
    Can you post the link? I thought I saw this as well but I couldn't find it.

    Matts 1983, can you post a link to your source? I'd be interested in seeing it.

    Peace.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Smellyman
    Smellyman Asia Posts: 4,528
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    Smellyman said:

    mattsl1983 said:

    Guns also aren't even the number one item used in murder. Why do we focus on guns so much? Media?

    this sounds like a NRA statistic parroted over and over. first google hit:

    According to a 2007 study by the FBI, the last time a detailed study of this type was conducted, firearms were the most commonly used murder weapons nationally, accounting for 14,831 murders that year. These are followed by knives or stabbing weapons, at 1,796, then by personal weapons, such as hands, feet, fists, etc.; blunt objects; strangulation; fire; asphyxiation; narcotics; drowning; and poison.
    Can you post the link? I thought I saw this as well but I couldn't find it.

    Matts 1983, can you post a link to your source? I'd be interested in seeing it.

    Peace.
    google "methods of murder US" there are a million of them.

    Link
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,707
    unsung said:

    I don't understand that logic; trying to compare a knife to a gun. Instead of worrying about the tool that is used why don't we worry about why the deed was done. When someone tries to rationalize that the use of a knife would simply kill less that's like saying those knife killings are acceptable numbers. Instead we should focus on why people have the desire to harm others.

    You mean like the logic of disputing the 74 school shootings since Newtown is really 15 because a shooting on school grounds, or in a building due to personal disputes, gang activity, suicide or personal disputes is not a "school shooting?" Doesn't that argument mean those deaths are acceptable?

    Peace.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Smellyman said:

    mattsl1983 said:

    Guns also aren't even the number one item used in murder. Why do we focus on guns so much? Media?

    this sounds like a NRA statistic parroted over and over. first google hit:

    According to a 2007 study by the FBI, the last time a detailed study of this type was conducted, firearms were the most commonly used murder weapons nationally, accounting for 14,831 murders that year. These are followed by knives or stabbing weapons, at 1,796, then by personal weapons, such as hands, feet, fists, etc.; blunt objects; strangulation; fire; asphyxiation; narcotics; drowning; and poison.
    I think Matts is comparing guns to heart disease and cancer and confusing 'murder' with 'death by natural causes'.

    By extension, I think he might be suggesting we would be better off banning fatty foods and the sun.

    He might be right?
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • mattsl1983
    mattsl1983 Posts: 711
    I wasn't very specific, but what I was saying is that these types of guns that many here are so convinced that need to be banned, are not the leading weapons of murder, ie assault rifles, semi automatics ect ect.

    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2012/crime-in-the-u.s.-2012/offenses-known-to-law-enforcement/expanded-homicide/expanded_homicide_data_table_8_murder_victims_by_weapon_2008-2012.xls

    That's not a "NRA statistic"

  • rgambs
    rgambs Posts: 13,576
    unsung said:

    I don't understand that logic; trying to compare a knife to a gun. Instead of worrying about the tool that is used why don't we worry about why the deed was done. When someone tries to rationalize that the use of a knife would simply kill less that's like saying those knife killings are acceptable numbers. Instead we should focus on why people have the desire to harm others.

    it is nothing like saying those murders are acceptable, come on that doesnt make sense...it is saying "if we cant stop mental illness quickly (we cant) then we should limit how much carnage the mentally ill can inflict."
    also, i have seen you reject most of the ideas put forward for limiting the mentally ill's ability to gain access to firearms based on personal freedom. So what solution do you have to address "why the deed was done" ? In the meantime, some kid will kill twice as many students as he would have had he been restricted to knives..
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  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,799
    http://www.theonion.com/articles/gun-violence-in-america-facts-and-figures,36266/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Default
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,707
    Bump
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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