As for the Phils - I can't believe I turned off the game when JT hit that homer (had to get the kids to bed). This is the first year I feel confident that they'll rally late, and I haven't felt that for a decade (!!). Oh, plus it was the Mets.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; WF Center 10/21/13; WF Center 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; WF Center 4/28/16; WF Center 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; SeaHearNow Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
Theater is acting like Covid's not an issue, as if it's over. Theater is mandating masks without a more comprehensive plan in place. Masks should most definitely be a requirement in densely packed indoor areas in lieu of, and during, a surge.
Theater is acting like Covid's not an issue, as if it's over. Theater is mandating masks without a more comprehensive plan in place. Masks should most definitely be a requirement in densely packed indoor areas in lieu of, and during, a surge.
But what's the point of having people wear them indoors to restaurants, bars and arena's but let them take them off if eating or drinking? so you wore it to walk into the place but can sit 5 feet from me eating and drinking without out? that's just stupid and allows politicians to feel good that they did something. Not to mention most masks barely work unless you are using N95s or better. With vaccines fairly prevalent and the only people getting sick are unvaccinated and obese what is the point at this point? are we going to test and shut things down for the rest of our lives now? I got it in 2020 fully 100% on board with it then. Now, it's theater.
My biggest takeaway of all of this is really the 1) the general sociology of people is amazing & 2) the toxic individualism of it all is incredibly disappointing. It's amazing how people have broken down data and their own ideas of how to justify said data to dictate their narrative awes me.
Perfect example is the mask effiicacy stuff. Some doctor goes on TV and says these (masks) don't work anymore. And then people run with that. What the person was trying to say - because theyre a public health official, and not a politician or public speaker - is that cloth masks ON THEIR OWN don't work. The conversation shouldn't become "don't wear masks ", the conversation should be "wear these type of masks". The fact of the matter is, yes, masking works and reduces the spread and transmission of the virus. There is no argument to be had there.
Theater is implementing masking policy without fleshing it out. So now masking is required. Has the city given proper protocols to businesses? Have they let restaurants keep their outdoor infrastructure and continue business as usual without the worry of fines or legal hoops? Nope.
The point of vaccines first and foremost was/is to prevent serious disease (overloading health workers) and death. I am proof of vaccines on their own not preventing the spread. Though I somewhat sympathize with the idea that it only affects the unvaccinated is partial. I think people assume most people who are unvaccinated are tinfoil hate lunatics. And to imply those who are obese, too, implies some type of necessary eugenics. When the reality is there are also people like my kids who can't be vaccinated. Or when we should be doing more to give and support poor people, because their a large part of those unvaxed and it's not because they're straight up tinfoil Qanon kooks. Or, because people can't take it upon themselves to wear a mask indoors, let another strain mutate until maybe just maybe it does harm kids who can't be vaccinated.
This world is missing empathy by the boatloads and makes me realize this world is garbage.
The toxic individualism of it all is the reason people move forward like "ok I got mine let's move forward" bullshit like we're out of a pandemic, even though every legitimate health official will tell you otherwise.
It's astounding in WW2 people found a reason to go jump out of a plane to murder some fascists, but in 2022 god forbid a minor inconvenience to put a mask on is all one has to do as their part in fighting the spread of the biggest global event in 100 years, and somehow that's tyranny. We are all an incredible disappointment.
I agree with some of what you say regarding people's toxic individualism. That's just where we are as a society regardless of the pandemic.
I am a season ticket holder for St Joe's basketball and went to the bar before every home game. A bar that is in the city so we had to wear masks to get into the place. Then sat at the bar for up to an hour or more before the game without masks as people we didn't know sat next to us or leaned over us to order from bartenders as we sat at the bar. So what was the fucking point of wearing masks to walk into the place if 500 people aren't wearing them as they drink and eat and we are all breathing the same air? In the cases of bars, restaurants and arena's there is no logical reason to wear masks if people are allowed to take them off to eat and drink. For those type of establishments the mask mandate doesn't make any sense to me in 2022.
I have no problem at all going into businesses that require masks that people aren't eating or drinking in. I do that without reservation if the business requests it.
and aren't the numbers something like 90% of city residents are vaccinated? And yes most of those hospitalized these days are unvaccinated and/or obese. The best defense is to be vaccinated and live a relatively healthy lifestyle.
as for children i honesty have no idea what the best course is because any solution has negative results for kids in some way. i'm not sure anyone has a good solution there.
as for children i honesty have no idea what the best course is because any solution has negative results for kids in some way. i'm not sure anyone has a good solution there.
What are the negative results? I think a relatively decent solution is for people to 1) wear masks, 2)stay home when they're sick/test positive, 3) get vaccinated. When Thybulle says "holistic" he's a big dumb dumb. Because a holistic approach would be implementing steps 1-3. That would reduce transmission, reduce variant mutation, reduce risk to the most vulnerable & children. It's not that hard.
As for your bar example - this shit is too much of a whataboutism point I can't get behind. Again, masks reduce transmission. If the policy isn't in place it'd be even worse. Any attempt is better than no attempt. Additionally, also depends on the venue/business. If I can absolutely guarantee everyone in the venue is vaccinated then I agree with not upholding a masking policy. But that is up to the owners' discretion and how much they want to enforce. We're talking public spaces. Ones where you cannot choose or select who enters your establishment and/or the sheer size of the amount of people makes it too hard to check very closely. The point is the upside of wearing a mask outweighs whatever downside there is. Sure, I understand people are human are going to live their lives and talk at each other very close, eat, drink, yada yada yada. Will people not be perfect at it? Of course! But it's better to do it than not do it. Not doing it gives too much of an opening and opportunity to all the fuckbags that see this thing as tyranny.
What I do know is - beyond your bar example - is every time I visited, or went out to the suburbs pre-vaccine all the soccer moms and everyone else there we're living their lives as much as possible like Covid was never a thing. This isn't new. Toxic individualism = not wanting to be inconvenienced = not wanting your world and all your hopes & dreams to be altered by something you can't control because it doesn't fit neatly into your day-to-day life.
Theater to me is going through a huge surge with Omicron then waking up one day and like poof no more masks, CHOP's policy center changing their guidelines, the CDC changing like we had a miracle, politicians who were pro-masks/pro-mitigation policies all of a sudden changing course because it's politically inconvenient. That's theater to me.
Speaking of which - the midterms are going to be an absolute blood bath for Dems very specifically because of toxic individualism.
Do the Phil’s ever start a season well? Seems like they always suck in April. Offense has been feast or famine so far. Thought they’d be a bit more consistent scoring runs this year. Frustrating so far
0
Options
F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 30,645
Sign of the times. Never ate at either of these places buy progress stops for no man. (Nor cheesesteak / kimbap)
Now city is going to lift the mask mandate. Those 4 days must have made a huge difference
Never said this administration isn't a bunch of fucking dummies. Like everything else with this pandemic - all leadership has been a massive disappointment.
0
Options
The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,315
Yeah, I don't know. The CDC didn't have us in the danger zone. Seems like they jumped the gun. But I'm happy they did what they did to keep people safe. Also happy they reversed course.
At this point, with so many people vaccinated (and other dopes gaining immunity from actually risking their lives and getting the virus), as long as hospitalization rates and death counts aren't jumping way up due to a newer, deadlier virus (which obviously can arise at any point), I don't think we need the mandate in place.
If only the CDC also didn't change their policy so often either. And the airlines dropping their policy midflight was just the nail in the coffin of any hope I had for people. You could see empathy just being shoved out a window. Humans are the worst thing on this planet.
If only health and science officials were setting concrete policy instead of being directed by politicians.
That's the whole point of wearing masks and doing things to mitigate spread - to be proactive than reactive. Why wait to see whether numbers are going up or not? Just like everything else, that has been used as a policy and it made things worse. Numbers are going up, by the way. Not to mention because of policy change, testing and positive cases will be vastly undercounted due to everyone self-diagnosing now.
Just a reminder for any dummy out there who got it and isn't vaxed - or even those with the vax - you can get it again. I sincerely wish for it to be endemic one day, but it is not at this point - partly to do with the cavalier idea that once you get it you're all good once you recover. Just because we don't want to live in a pandemic anymore doesn't mean we are in fact not doing so.
I get it - people have fatigue and trauma from all this shit and they just want it all to go away. Again, unfortunately things don't work that way - I'd rather have someone just admit that up front.
The only thing worse than the people that don't get the vax because they're hesitant of the long-term effects of the vaccination are those who don't consider the long-term effects of, ya know, a brand new virus that we have limited research on (not called "novel" for no reason!). They're already seeing long-term effects of organ failure for those with Long Covid (vaccination reduces your chance of long covid from 1 in 6 to 1 in 10, not great odds imo). The chicken pox comes back as shingles, etc etc, you see where I'm going with this. As much as I'm not fearing getting it (or getting it again, in my case), if all it takes is to wear a mask indoors in a cramped environment to mitigate that is not a big fucking deal. All because no one wants to be inconvenienced.
0
Options
The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,315
I don't think it is really about being proactive verses reactive because we can see how the variants are affecting other countries before it even gets here. So far we've been behind the rest of the world. So we've had that benefit and we can adjust our policies accordingly.
And this new one, while being more highly transmissible, is not leading to much higher hospitalization and death rates...I believe. I just think we're better prepared to deal new variants than we were 8 months ago before boosters and shit.
But I also believe, because so many people refused to get vaccinated and take this seriously, that we're likely never going to be done with this fucking thing. So when there is a new variant that's more deadly, not just more transmissible, I'd be all for mandates going into effect then. Just seems like it should be a case by case thing at this point, unfortunately.
But we were/are reactive. We saw what Delta and Omicron were doing, and we didn't do anything until after they got here and shit started shooting up.
Absolutely agree vaccines put us in a better place than without, but mentally I think that is all people want to here. "I got the shot. Time to move on like nothing happened."
No, it's never going away. That ship has long sailed. But the idea that we've already moved into the "endemic" stage is wishful thinking on peoples' part than anything that is based in reality.
And it's more than just masks - like, I'd say air circulation in like 95% of buildings could be improved. If anything this problem should be putting it front and center.
I come back to that this was our WW2 moment and we all fell flat on our fucking faces. All because there isn't a literal human bad guy to fight, and all ya had to do was put a mask on.
ANYWAY, Phils play a Sunday night game this weekend - my first game of the season - and I'm not happy about it.
0
Options
The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,315
I understand your points. And I agree we definitely need to handle things better than we did with Delta and Omicron. Biden Admin was woefully slow in providing testing this winter. We have the tools to be better prepared moving forward though.
Right now cases are up, but hospitalizations, ICU's, and deaths are still down--I am pretty sure that is what happened in the UK and other places over the last few months. Those latter three metrics, to me, are what we should be more focused on regarding if mandates are put into place or not.
And I understand what you're trying to say. But, again, I'm taking that as you saying we should put masks on after the hospitals are filling up. And at that point - the fuck's the point?
Comments
This is good that they're doing this, any way of better navigating surges the better: https://www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/covid-wastewater-testing-philadelphia-cases-predictions-20220412.html
As for the Phils - I can't believe I turned off the game when JT hit that homer (had to get the kids to bed). This is the first year I feel confident that they'll rally late, and I haven't felt that for a decade (!!). Oh, plus it was the Mets.
WF Center 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; WF Center 4/28/16; WF Center 4/29/16;
Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; SeaHearNow Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
Perfect example is the mask effiicacy stuff. Some doctor goes on TV and says these (masks) don't work anymore. And then people run with that. What the person was trying to say - because theyre a public health official, and not a politician or public speaker - is that cloth masks ON THEIR OWN don't work. The conversation shouldn't become "don't wear masks ", the conversation should be "wear these type of masks". The fact of the matter is, yes, masking works and reduces the spread and transmission of the virus. There is no argument to be had there.
Theater is implementing masking policy without fleshing it out. So now masking is required. Has the city given proper protocols to businesses? Have they let restaurants keep their outdoor infrastructure and continue business as usual without the worry of fines or legal hoops? Nope.
The point of vaccines first and foremost was/is to prevent serious disease (overloading health workers) and death. I am proof of vaccines on their own not preventing the spread. Though I somewhat sympathize with the idea that it only affects the unvaccinated is partial. I think people assume most people who are unvaccinated are tinfoil hate lunatics. And to imply those who are obese, too, implies some type of necessary eugenics. When the reality is there are also people like my kids who can't be vaccinated. Or when we should be doing more to give and support poor people, because their a large part of those unvaxed and it's not because they're straight up tinfoil Qanon kooks. Or, because people can't take it upon themselves to wear a mask indoors, let another strain mutate until maybe just maybe it does harm kids who can't be vaccinated.
This world is missing empathy by the boatloads and makes me realize this world is garbage.
The toxic individualism of it all is the reason people move forward like "ok I got mine let's move forward" bullshit like we're out of a pandemic, even though every legitimate health official will tell you otherwise.
It's astounding in WW2 people found a reason to go jump out of a plane to murder some fascists, but in 2022 god forbid a minor inconvenience to put a mask on is all one has to do as their part in fighting the spread of the biggest global event in 100 years, and somehow that's tyranny. We are all an incredible disappointment.
I am a season ticket holder for St Joe's basketball and went to the bar before every home game. A bar that is in the city so we had to wear
masks to get into the place. Then sat at the bar for up to an hour or more before the game without masks as people we didn't know sat next to us or leaned over us to order from bartenders as we sat at the bar. So what was the fucking point of wearing masks to walk into the place if 500 people aren't wearing them as they drink and eat and we are all breathing the same air? In the cases of bars, restaurants and arena's there is no logical reason to wear masks if people are allowed to take them off to eat and drink. For those type of establishments the mask mandate doesn't make any sense to me in 2022.
I have no problem at all going into businesses that require masks that people aren't eating or drinking in. I do that without reservation if the business requests it.
and aren't the numbers something like 90% of city residents are vaccinated? And yes most of those hospitalized these days are unvaccinated and/or obese. The best defense is to be vaccinated and live a relatively healthy lifestyle.
as for children i honesty have no idea what the best course is because any solution has negative results for kids in some way. i'm not sure anyone has a good solution there.
As for your bar example - this shit is too much of a whataboutism point I can't get behind. Again, masks reduce transmission. If the policy isn't in place it'd be even worse. Any attempt is better than no attempt. Additionally, also depends on the venue/business. If I can absolutely guarantee everyone in the venue is vaccinated then I agree with not upholding a masking policy. But that is up to the owners' discretion and how much they want to enforce. We're talking public spaces. Ones where you cannot choose or select who enters your establishment and/or the sheer size of the amount of people makes it too hard to check very closely. The point is the upside of wearing a mask outweighs whatever downside there is. Sure, I understand people are human are going to live their lives and talk at each other very close, eat, drink, yada yada yada. Will people not be perfect at it? Of course! But it's better to do it than not do it. Not doing it gives too much of an opening and opportunity to all the fuckbags that see this thing as tyranny.
What I do know is - beyond your bar example - is every time I visited, or went out to the suburbs pre-vaccine all the soccer moms and everyone else there we're living their lives as much as possible like Covid was never a thing. This isn't new. Toxic individualism = not wanting to be inconvenienced = not wanting your world and all your hopes & dreams to be altered by something you can't control because it doesn't fit neatly into your day-to-day life.
Theater to me is going through a huge surge with Omicron then waking up one day and like poof no more masks, CHOP's policy center changing their guidelines, the CDC changing like we had a miracle, politicians who were pro-masks/pro-mitigation policies all of a sudden changing course because it's politically inconvenient. That's theater to me.
Speaking of which - the midterms are going to be an absolute blood bath for Dems very specifically because of toxic individualism.
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
Never ate at either of these places buy progress stops for no man. (Nor cheesesteak / kimbap)
https://www.phillymag.com/foobooz/2022/04/14/abners-koreana-upenn-drexel-closing-life-sciences/
Also RIP the Chili's (aka downstairs was Wizards). Quite the, uh, "gentleman's" club.
(Barbecue sauce?)
Looking really good n in the past week (offensively and defensively). Least we salvaged a win today.
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly
At this point, with so many people vaccinated (and other dopes gaining immunity from actually risking their lives and getting the virus), as long as hospitalization rates and death counts aren't jumping way up due to a newer, deadlier virus (which obviously can arise at any point), I don't think we need the mandate in place.
If only health and science officials were setting concrete policy instead of being directed by politicians.
That's the whole point of wearing masks and doing things to mitigate spread - to be proactive than reactive. Why wait to see whether numbers are going up or not? Just like everything else, that has been used as a policy and it made things worse. Numbers are going up, by the way. Not to mention because of policy change, testing and positive cases will be vastly undercounted due to everyone self-diagnosing now.
Just a reminder for any dummy out there who got it and isn't vaxed - or even those with the vax - you can get it again. I sincerely wish for it to be endemic one day, but it is not at this point - partly to do with the cavalier idea that once you get it you're all good once you recover. Just because we don't want to live in a pandemic anymore doesn't mean we are in fact not doing so.
I get it - people have fatigue and trauma from all this shit and they just want it all to go away. Again, unfortunately things don't work that way - I'd rather have someone just admit that up front.
The only thing worse than the people that don't get the vax because they're hesitant of the long-term effects of the vaccination are those who don't consider the long-term effects of, ya know, a brand new virus that we have limited research on (not called "novel" for no reason!). They're already seeing long-term effects of organ failure for those with Long Covid (vaccination reduces your chance of long covid from 1 in 6 to 1 in 10, not great odds imo). The chicken pox comes back as shingles, etc etc, you see where I'm going with this. As much as I'm not fearing getting it (or getting it again, in my case), if all it takes is to wear a mask indoors in a cramped environment to mitigate that is not a big fucking deal. All because no one wants to be inconvenienced.
And this new one, while being more highly transmissible, is not leading to much higher hospitalization and death rates...I believe. I just think we're better prepared to deal new variants than we were 8 months ago before boosters and shit.
But I also believe, because so many people refused to get vaccinated and take this seriously, that we're likely never going to be done with this fucking thing. So when there is a new variant that's more deadly, not just more transmissible, I'd be all for mandates going into effect then. Just seems like it should be a case by case thing at this point, unfortunately.
Absolutely agree vaccines put us in a better place than without, but mentally I think that is all people want to here. "I got the shot. Time to move on like nothing happened."
No, it's never going away. That ship has long sailed. But the idea that we've already moved into the "endemic" stage is wishful thinking on peoples' part than anything that is based in reality.
And it's more than just masks - like, I'd say air circulation in like 95% of buildings could be improved. If anything this problem should be putting it front and center.
I come back to that this was our WW2 moment and we all fell flat on our fucking faces. All because there isn't a literal human bad guy to fight, and all ya had to do was put a mask on.
Right now cases are up, but hospitalizations, ICU's, and deaths are still down--I am pretty sure that is what happened in the UK and other places over the last few months. Those latter three metrics, to me, are what we should be more focused on regarding if mandates are put into place or not.