I've never had a flu shot in my life and I'm still alive to talk about it.
And what's your point? You do realize that there are a lot of immunocompromised people out there and a lot of us with strong immune systems get the vaccine to help protect those people.
Well i think my point is pretty obvious.
There is a whole lot of fear mongering going on these days, fueled by the pharmaceutical companies who are raking in the cash from flu vaccines. I haven't even had the flu since 1998 or so. I don't feel like it's necessary for people who aren't in the higher risk groups to get flu shots. I feel like they are trying to convince people that it is because $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. And they are doing a fine job - it's totally working!
So you are implying a conspiracy between government, health care professionals and scientists for profit. Got it.
Can you provide any evidence of this scaremongering....or is this just how you feel?
Can you prove that there is not? I'll leave the health care professionals out of the equation. But are you saying that there is no conflict of interest when scientific studies are funded by pharmaceutical companies?
The burden of proof is on the people saying there is a conspiracy, not on me. I could say there is a little blue man in the sky watching over us right now and you would say I'm full of shit but I could retort back "prove he isn't". Pretty weak argument.
Also, I'm sorry but you can't leave the health care professionals out of it because they would have to be in on it too.
If you have any evidence of scientists making up data for the sale of vaccines I'm all ears. I think most people here don't really understand the scientific process works.
And do they have all the information? Basic scientific method says that any scientist should be able to replicate results. And yet there is evidence that data has been withheld therefore results have been skewed. And there has been evidence of scientists overestimating results but the pharmaceuticals and the government have withheld some of that information. Can you prove that scientists haven't faked data? Pretty weak argument on your part to throw it back when you can't prove it and there is evidence that scientists haven't released all their findings. I thought science was transparent and all about proof?
I could care less what you believe and I'm not going to do your research for you. You want to get the flu shot and every little vaccine that comes along, great, go for it. But quit bullying everyone else and let people make their own informed choices.
Are you kidding me? Who am I bullying? If you want to post an opinion all I ask is that you can try and back that opinion up.....with anything......which apparently you can't. That's how this works. If you make claims like scientists are overestimating results in regards to vaccines it's not my job to find out what nonsense you are talking about.
By the way this is not about you. I initially started getting the vaccine because of elderly people in my life who would be more at risk without me getting it. My mother has Lupus and is immunocompromised. I get the vaccine on the advice of my doctor and hers. They must all be in on the conspiracy too.
Silly.
Do I have proof? No, I do not. But questions about vaccines have been raised by scientists like Andrew Wakefield ( and yes I am aware that the industry worked very hard to discredit him but he sticks by his account of events and I think that is significant) and Diane Harper and I am sure others that we may never know about. Both of whom questioned the role of the pharmaceuticals and organizations like the CDC. Doesn't that warrant further study? Why do you so completely dismiss out of hand that there might be problems with these vaccines and that there might not be enough cause to continue vaccines of the entire population? Shouldn't these be saved for people in the highest risk groups? If you work around people who are compromised that can't get the vaccine then yes, you should protect them by getting vaccinated. But why everyone if there isn't greater efficacy rates? If you choose to get vaccines because you feel the risk/reward is worthwhile then I think you should absolutely do that. But you are attempting to get people to do what you think is best through shaming. Otherwise you wouldn't call me silly, you wouldn't tell me that its not about me and imply that I'm selfish.
People can use alternative means to protect themselves and others. The elder flower has been scientifically studied and has been proven to provide protection against contracting the flu AND reducing duration of symptoms if contracted. I take multiple doses throughout flu season for protection FOR MYSELF AND OTHERS. I have firsthand experience with using it to treat the flu and it works (and yes I know that is anecdotal and will be dismissed out of hand). Following are a few studies that have been conducted that address that efficacy.
Your position might be strengthened if you treated people with opposing opinions with respect rather than condescension, anger, and vitriol. This should be a conversation not an event to shame others into complying with your point of view. I understand that this is an emotional issue but your side only pushes people further away when you ridicule them at every turn. You've made it clear that you think I'm some silly little girl and you most likely put me in the camp of religious zealots who don't want to vaccinate because of the use of stem cells. Refine your arguments because not everyone that questions efficacy and safety are religious wingnuts. I just want to understand and do my best for my family and others.
Kong F. Pilot clinical study on a proprietary elderberry extract: efficacy in addressing influenza symptoms. Online Journal of Pharmacology and Pharmacokinetics. 2009;5:32-43.
Roxas M, Jurenka J. Colds and influenza: a review of diagnosis and conventional, botanical, and nutritional considerations. Altern Med Rev. 2007 Mar;12(1):25-48. Review.
Zakay-Rones Z, Thom E, Wollan T, Wadstein J. Randomized study of the efficacy and safety of oral elderberry extract in the treatment of influenza A and B virus infections. J Int Med Res. 2004;32:132-40.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
Andrew Jeremy Wakefield (born c. 1957) is a British former surgeon and medical researcher, known for his fraudulent 1998 research paper in support of the now-discredited claim that there is a link between the administration of the measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) vaccine, and the appearance of autism and bowel disease.
After the publication of the paper, other researchers were unable to reproduce Wakefield's findings or confirm his hypothesis of an association between the MMR vaccine and autism[6] or autism and gastrointestinal disease. A 2004 investigation by Sunday Times reporter Brian Deer identified undisclosed financial conflicts of interest on Wakefield's part, and most of his co-authors then withdrew their support for the study's interpretations.The British General Medical Council (GMC) conducted an inquiry into allegations of misconduct against Wakefield and two former colleagues. The investigation centred on Deer's numerous findings, including that children with autism were subjected to unnecessary invasive medical procedures, such as colonoscopy and lumbar puncture, and that Wakefield acted without the required ethical approval from an institutional review board.
On 28 January 2010, a five-member statutory tribunal of the GMC found three dozen charges proved, including four counts of dishonesty and 12 counts involving the abuse of developmentally challenged children. The panel ruled that Wakefield had "failed in his duties as a responsible consultant", acted both against the interests of his patients, and "dishonestly and irresponsibly" in his published research. The Lancet immediately and fully retracted his 1998 publication on the basis of the GMC's findings, noting that elements of the manuscript had been falsified. Wakefield was struck off the Medical Register in May 2010, with a statement identifying deliberate falsification in The Lancet research, and is barred from practising medicine in the UK.
In January 2011, an editorial accompanying an article by Brian Deer in BMJ identified Wakefield's work as an "elaborate fraud". In a follow-up article, Deer said that Wakefield had planned to launch a venture on the back of an MMR vaccination scare that would profit from new medical tests and "litigation driven testing". In November 2011, yet another report in BMJ revealed original raw data indicating that, contrary to Wakefield's claims in The Lancet, children in his research did not have inflammatory bowel disease.
Wakefield's study and his claim that the MMR vaccine might cause autism led to a decline in vaccination rates in the United States, United Kingdom and Ireland and a corresponding rise in measles and mumps, resulting in serious illness and fatalities, and his continued warnings against the vaccine have contributed to a climate of distrust of all vaccines and the reemergence of other previously controlled diseases. Wakefield has continued to defend his research and conclusions, saying there was no fraud, hoax or profit motive.
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
I really don't care if anyone thinks I'm being self-righteous and there is plenty of room for denouncing. When people die from others peoples ignorance I take that seriously.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
I'm no scientist or researcher nor am I the brightest in the bunch but I think a pretty simple way to prove to me that the flu shot is truly effective is by showing me the statistics and data that proves the flu shot actually works. Show me the disparity in flu outbreak and death in years the shot contained the infecting strains compared to the years in which it didn't contain the infecting strains. Instead I read the flu shot may not prevent the flu but it will make the effects less severe, (how possibly can they draw that conclusion? scientifically?) and how the flu "mutated". This is a serious question, I cannot find that data so if someone can point me in the direction.
I'm no scientist or researcher nor am I the brightest in the bunch but I think a pretty simple way to prove to me that the flu shot is truly effective is by showing me the statistics and data that proves the flu shot actually works. Show me the disparity in flu outbreak and death in years the shot contained the infecting strains compared to the years in which it didn't contain the infecting strains. Instead I read the flu shot may not prevent the flu but it will make the effects less severe, (how possibly can they draw that conclusion? scientifically?) and how the flu "mutated". This is a serious question, I cannot find that data so if someone can point me in the direction.
All great questions JC. I will poke my wifes brain for some of these answers when I and she has the time.
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
I really don't care if anyone thinks I'm being self-righteous and there is plenty of room for denouncing. When people die from others peoples ignorance I take that seriously.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
Well, I don't care if YOU don't care %-( Was tossing in my nickel's worth.
My words weren't directly to you, dignin - of course you have to do what you feel is right for yourself, your little one, those close to you and even strangers. As do I. My choice, and I think those of many others', isn't borne of ignorance.
For what it's worth, I had the gamut of "typical" vaccinations as a kid. So far so good.
I'm no scientist or researcher nor am I the brightest in the bunch but I think a pretty simple way to prove to me that the flu shot is truly effective is by showing me the statistics and data that proves the flu shot actually works. Show me the disparity in flu outbreak and death in years the shot contained the infecting strains compared to the years in which it didn't contain the infecting strains. Instead I read the flu shot may not prevent the flu but it will make the effects less severe, (how possibly can they draw that conclusion? scientifically?) and how the flu "mutated". This is a serious question, I cannot find that data so if someone can point me in the direction.
I don't think there is any way to calculate it. I've had the flu in the past and just stayed at home and rode it out. I think a lot of people don't go to the doctor. And even if they did, I don't believe that doctors are putting those numbers into a national data base.
All I know is that I've never gotten the flu when I got the shot. It could be just by chance, but I'm riding this donkey until I get the shot and the flu.
I'm no scientist or researcher nor am I the brightest in the bunch but I think a pretty simple way to prove to me that the flu shot is truly effective is by showing me the statistics and data that proves the flu shot actually works. Show me the disparity in flu outbreak and death in years the shot contained the infecting strains compared to the years in which it didn't contain the infecting strains. Instead I read the flu shot may not prevent the flu but it will make the effects less severe, (how possibly can they draw that conclusion? scientifically?) and how the flu "mutated". This is a serious question, I cannot find that data so if someone can point me in the direction.
I don't think there is any way to calculate it. I've had the flu in the past and just stayed at home and rode it out. I think a lot of people don't go to the doctor. And even if they did, I don't believe that doctors are putting those numbers into a national data base.
All I know is that I've never gotten the flu when I got the shot. It could be just by chance, but I'm riding this donkey until I get the shot and the flu.
I'm referring to those that see a doctor and test positive for influenza. I do think cases of positively id influenza are documented, reported cases. I would hope so! Im not talking about the generic use of the word flu, i had the flu bug, i had the 24 hour flu, stomach flu etc.
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
I really don't care if anyone thinks I'm being self-righteous and there is plenty of room for denouncing. When people die from others peoples ignorance I take that seriously.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
I have always thought that the parents/mothers that don't vaccinate their children for those diseases should be arrested.
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
I really don't care if anyone thinks I'm being self-righteous and there is plenty of room for denouncing. When people die from others peoples ignorance I take that seriously.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
I have always thought that the parents/mothers that don't vaccinate their children for those diseases should be arrested.
Mumps and measels should depend on where you live and where you travel. I'm not even sure how many cases of mumps and measel cases there are in the US, 100? When has someone in the US died from mumps measels? I live in the US...do parents ask these questions?
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
I really don't care if anyone thinks I'm being self-righteous and there is plenty of room for denouncing. When people die from others peoples ignorance I take that seriously.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
I have always thought that the parents/mothers that don't vaccinate their children for those diseases should be arrested.
Mumps and measels should depend on where you live and where you travel. I'm not even sure how many cases of mumps and measel cases there are in the US, 100? When has someone in the US died from mumps measels? I live in the US...do parents ask these questions?
There was an measles outbreak where I live this year
I do put myself first and recognize it can be considered selfish. That's fine; I accept that part of myself, in this instance as well as others.
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
I really don't care if anyone thinks I'm being self-righteous and there is plenty of room for denouncing. When people die from others peoples ignorance I take that seriously.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
I have always thought that the parents/mothers that don't vaccinate their children for those diseases should be arrested.
Mumps and measels should depend on where you live and where you travel. I'm not even sure how many cases of mumps and measel cases there are in the US, 100? When has someone in the US died from mumps measels? I live in the US...do parents ask these questions?
There was an measles outbreak where I live this year
No deaths from measles this year in the USA but as you can see the numbers are significantly higher. In the breakdown that I found between Jan 1 and May 23 2014, there were already 288 cases, 60 of which were serious enough to require hospitalization. Age of infection ranged from 2 weeks to 65 years. Of course, 2 week old babies don't get vaccinated; they depend on the herd immunity to protect them. Before the advent of immunization, an average of 500 Americans died per year from measles. That rate would likely be much lower now, even without immunization, due to better overall medical care, but if these outbreaks continue there are likely to be deaths and other serious consequences like encephalitis.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
I ran out for my whooping cough shot....what I miss?
My doc made me get an attenuated pertussis vaccine a few years ago because I had young children. Then when I went to get my physical this year my doc was wearing a mask. She said she was no longer contagious, it was just a precaution as she still had a remaining cough from whooping cough. These diseases are no joke. I think our society has become a bit complacent because so many people have no personal history with someone they know and love having the disease. Throw in someone claiming injury from the vaccines and the pendulum swings the other way. My high school counselor walked with bilateral canes because he had had polio as a young man. He was one of the lucky survivors. My mother walked door to door to collect money so that a vaccine could be developed for the dreaded disease. I had mumps as a baby but I don't remember. There is still no cure for tetanus, once the bacteria begins making toxins. As a nurse, I have never seen a case of measles, because the vaccines have done such a good job. But people get complacent and the diseases are making a comeback.
And the sun it may be shining . . . but there's an ocean in my eyes
reading one, the quoting feature is fucking up on me right now, so I'll say I also appreciate your post up there right above mine. Your comment about being personally affected hit home. I'm not complacent (I hope not), but having a first cousin who had polio in the 50s makes me give more thought to this topic in general.
May seem contradictory - I have no problem with the standard childhood vaccinations but they seem more...concrete I suppose is the right word...vs the "maybe" connected to the ones for flu strains that vary from year to year.
I don't think it seems contradictory. I understand. The flu vaccine is made based on the best guesstimate of which variety of the disease will be most prevalent. Some times they get it right, and some times not so much. Last year's vaccine was right on. I admit I haven't investigated this year's vaccine as much. But the vaccine in last year's shot was for the flu strain that killed my brother-in-law. And I don't know if it would have saved him or not, but it is certainly a chance I would have liked him to take.
And the sun it may be shining . . . but there's an ocean in my eyes
And in an unusual twist, there apparently is an outbreak of mumps among NHL players. 11 players at this point have mumps, which is serious in post-pubertal males as it can lead to inflammation of the testes with reduction in fertility and even infertility. Cases of mumps have been on the rise in recent years, like all of these childhood infectious diseases that had been essentially wiped out in North America prior to the reductions in vaccination rates.
I should probably apologize for any rancor I've shown towards anyone on this particular thread but I find it very difficult to discuss this topic in an unemotional way. I'll just leave it at this, thanks to all who present their point of view for it gives me (and all of us) a lot of information to better make informed choices. I guess that's all that can be said at the end of the day is to research, research, research and hope that we can all make the choices that are best for each of us.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
Additionally, Crosby, like many players, reportedly received the mumps vaccine before leaving for the Olympics in February. Though the vaccination is going to protect a lot of people against the disease, it has a lower effectiveness rate compared to other vaccinations.
“Mumps is a little bit challenging for us in that the effectiveness of the vaccine is a little bit lower for some of the other diseases,” Wallace told CBSSports.com. “We do occasionally see some limited outbreaks in groups that tend to have a high two-dose vaccine coverage. The virus can out-compete the vaccine.”
Vaccinations have not been able to wipe out mumps like they have other viruses, so exposure to the virus still leaves those at risk.
“If you have a team and their staff consists of 100 people and they all get exposed,” Dr. Wallace said, ”you could have 10, 12, 15 cases even if everyone is vaccinated. “
I don't think the government provides the vaccine because in the best interest of everyone, I think the public health department makes it a priority because it is in the best interest of everyone.
I should probably apologize for any rancor I've shown towards anyone on this particular thread but I find it very difficult to discuss this topic in an unemotional way. I'll just leave it at this, thanks to all who present their point of view for it gives me (and all of us) a lot of information to better make informed choices. I guess that's all that can be said at the end of the day is to research, research, research and hope that we can all make the choices that are best for each of us.
And in an unusual twist, there apparently is an outbreak of mumps among NHL players. 11 players at this point have mumps, which is serious in post-pubertal males as it can lead to inflammation of the testes with reduction in fertility and even infertility. Cases of mumps have been on the rise in recent years, like all of these childhood infectious diseases that had been essentially wiped out in North America prior to the reductions in vaccination rates.
I don't think the government provides the vaccine because in the best interest of everyone, I think the public health department makes it a priority because it is in the best interest of everyone.
I should probably apologize for any rancor I've shown towards anyone on this particular thread but I find it very difficult to discuss this topic in an unemotional way. I'll just leave it at this, thanks to all who present their point of view for it gives me (and all of us) a lot of information to better make informed choices. I guess that's all that can be said at the end of the day is to research, research, research and hope that we can all make the choices that are best for each of us.
…and the best for others around us as well.
Yes, you've mentioned this numerous times. The flu shot is not the only means of protection. You can choose to use more natural, less harmful methods. The use of elderberry syrup as a means of protecting against, and reducing the duration of the flu if you happen to get it, is just as effective as the flu shot without the harmful side effects.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I don't think the government provides the vaccine because in the best interest of everyone, I think the public health department makes it a priority because it is in the best interest of everyone.
I should probably apologize for any rancor I've shown towards anyone on this particular thread but I find it very difficult to discuss this topic in an unemotional way. I'll just leave it at this, thanks to all who present their point of view for it gives me (and all of us) a lot of information to better make informed choices. I guess that's all that can be said at the end of the day is to research, research, research and hope that we can all make the choices that are best for each of us.
…and the best for others around us as well.
Yes, you've mentioned this numerous times. The flu shot is not the only means of protection. You can choose to use more natural, less harmful methods. The use of elderberry syrup as a means of protecting against, and reducing the duration of the flu if you happen to get it, is just as effective as the flu shot without the harmful side effects.
Except that you can still pass it along to others who may be immunocompromised.
Comments
People can use alternative means to protect themselves and others. The elder flower has been scientifically studied and has been proven to provide protection against contracting the flu AND reducing duration of symptoms if contracted. I take multiple doses throughout flu season for protection FOR MYSELF AND OTHERS. I have firsthand experience with using it to treat the flu and it works (and yes I know that is anecdotal and will be dismissed out of hand). Following are a few studies that have been conducted that address that efficacy.
Your position might be strengthened if you treated people with opposing opinions with respect rather than condescension, anger, and vitriol. This should be a conversation not an event to shame others into complying with your point of view. I understand that this is an emotional issue but your side only pushes people further away when you ridicule them at every turn. You've made it clear that you think I'm some silly little girl and you most likely put me in the camp of religious zealots who don't want to vaccinate because of the use of stem cells. Refine your arguments because not everyone that questions efficacy and safety are religious wingnuts. I just want to understand and do my best for my family and others.
Kong F. Pilot clinical study on a proprietary elderberry extract: efficacy in addressing influenza symptoms. Online Journal of Pharmacology and Pharmacokinetics. 2009;5:32-43.
Roxas M, Jurenka J. Colds and influenza: a review of diagnosis and conventional, botanical, and nutritional considerations. Altern Med Rev. 2007 Mar;12(1):25-48. Review.
Zakay-Rones Z, Thom E, Wollan T, Wadstein J. Randomized study of the efficacy and safety of oral elderberry extract in the treatment of influenza A and B virus infections. J Int Med Res. 2004;32:132-40.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
Of course life isn't about ONLY me, but, well...see above.
I really appreciate seeing the various perspectives and wealth of information provided, but I'm not sure there's room for self-righteousness or denouncing either way, any way. It's a choice.
For anyone who would consider choosing to forgo the vaccination route being equal to not giving a shit about others is a quite a leap, to me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield
Andrew Jeremy Wakefield (born c. 1957) is a British former surgeon and medical researcher, known for his fraudulent 1998 research paper in support of the now-discredited claim that there is a link between the administration of the measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) vaccine, and the appearance of autism and bowel disease.
After the publication of the paper, other researchers were unable to reproduce Wakefield's findings or confirm his hypothesis of an association between the MMR vaccine and autism[6] or autism and gastrointestinal disease. A 2004 investigation by Sunday Times reporter Brian Deer identified undisclosed financial conflicts of interest on Wakefield's part, and most of his co-authors then withdrew their support for the study's interpretations.The British General Medical Council (GMC) conducted an inquiry into allegations of misconduct against Wakefield and two former colleagues. The investigation centred on Deer's numerous findings, including that children with autism were subjected to unnecessary invasive medical procedures, such as colonoscopy and lumbar puncture, and that Wakefield acted without the required ethical approval from an institutional review board.
On 28 January 2010, a five-member statutory tribunal of the GMC found three dozen charges proved, including four counts of dishonesty and 12 counts involving the abuse of developmentally challenged children. The panel ruled that Wakefield had "failed in his duties as a responsible consultant", acted both against the interests of his patients, and "dishonestly and irresponsibly" in his published research. The Lancet immediately and fully retracted his 1998 publication on the basis of the GMC's findings, noting that elements of the manuscript had been falsified. Wakefield was struck off the Medical Register in May 2010, with a statement identifying deliberate falsification in The Lancet research, and is barred from practising medicine in the UK.
In January 2011, an editorial accompanying an article by Brian Deer in BMJ identified Wakefield's work as an "elaborate fraud". In a follow-up article, Deer said that Wakefield had planned to launch a venture on the back of an MMR vaccination scare that would profit from new medical tests and "litigation driven testing". In November 2011, yet another report in BMJ revealed original raw data indicating that, contrary to Wakefield's claims in The Lancet, children in his research did not have inflammatory bowel disease.
Wakefield's study and his claim that the MMR vaccine might cause autism led to a decline in vaccination rates in the United States, United Kingdom and Ireland and a corresponding rise in measles and mumps, resulting in serious illness and fatalities, and his continued warnings against the vaccine have contributed to a climate of distrust of all vaccines and the reemergence of other previously controlled diseases. Wakefield has continued to defend his research and conclusions, saying there was no fraud, hoax or profit motive.
I never said I don't think antti-vaccers don't care about anyone but I do think they are dangerous. Not getting the flu shot is one thing....but I have no patience for people who don't vaccinate for the mumps, measles and all that other very scary stuff.
When someone posts bad info they need to be called out on it. If some don't like my style, that's fine, I can live with it.
As a side note, I'm taking my 10 week old to get his first round of vaccinations today. It won't be fun for anybody, but it's the smart thing to do, and I'm grateful that we live in an age where it can be done.
Instead I read the flu shot may not prevent the flu but it will make the effects less severe, (how possibly can they draw that conclusion? scientifically?) and how the flu "mutated".
This is a serious question, I cannot find that data so if someone can point me in the direction.
My words weren't directly to you, dignin - of course you have to do what you feel is right for yourself, your little one, those close to you and even strangers. As do I. My choice, and I think those of many others', isn't borne of ignorance.
For what it's worth, I had the gamut of "typical" vaccinations as a kid. So far so good.
All I know is that I've never gotten the flu when I got the shot. It could be just by chance, but I'm riding this donkey until I get the shot and the flu.
I'm referring to those that see a doctor and test positive for influenza. I do think cases of positively id influenza are documented, reported cases. I would hope so! Im not talking about the generic use of the word flu, i had the flu bug, i had the 24 hour flu, stomach flu etc.
I live in the US...do parents ask these questions?
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/measles-outbreak-declared-in-calgary-edmonton-and-central-alberta-1.2626122
Measles in the USA
http://www.cdc.gov/measles/cases-outbreaks.html
It's all about the herd immunity. When people stop vaccinating these diseases come back.
http://www.vaccines.gov/basics/protection/
Moo
I just can't imagine. X_X
May seem contradictory - I have no problem with the standard childhood vaccinations but they seem more...concrete I suppose is the right word...vs the "maybe" connected to the ones for flu strains that vary from year to year.
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/12/12/sidney-crosby-mumps_n_6317476.html
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
“Mumps is a little bit challenging for us in that the effectiveness of the vaccine is a little bit lower for some of the other diseases,” Wallace told CBSSports.com. “We do occasionally see some limited outbreaks in groups that tend to have a high two-dose vaccine coverage. The virus can out-compete the vaccine.”
Vaccinations have not been able to wipe out mumps like they have other viruses, so exposure to the virus still leaves those at risk.
“If you have a team and their staff consists of 100 people and they all get exposed,” Dr. Wallace said, ”you could have 10, 12, 15 cases even if everyone is vaccinated. “
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
https://medium.com/the-nib/vaccines-work-here-are-the-facts-5de3d0f9ffd0
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Giving flu shots to schoolchildren also protects others, a new study finds.The effect of schoolbased vaccination was profound, both on the students and on the community,” lead author Cuc Tran, a doctoral student in public health at the University of Florida, said in a university news release. http://consumer.healthday.com/infectious-disease-information-21/flu-news-314/vaccinating-school-kids-reduces-flu-in-community-study-694520.html