OPEN LETTER TO THE 10 CLUB & TIM BIERMAN TO CHANGE GA LINE

Mamasan Bren

Evensteven wrote:

If people aren't using it to hold their place and go do other things - which I saw and experienced a lot of - then why need the list at all? If you are the first 10 people in line and you waited all day like everyone says they are doing then you should be the first 10 through the door and the first 10 on the floor and the first 10 on the rail. So how does the list help that? The if you're 100 and not on the rail what is the order? Some prefer to stand in front of ED, others Mike, others Stone. So how does it work after the rail?

Exactly. It gets used so people can get away with not truly waiting all day. Again, not all do this. But the fact that some do sucks and the list and hand-numbering should be done away with. Hopefully 10 Club will look into it, put their wise heads together with knowledge of other bands, and develop one they think is fair and works best. People shouldn't have to become all tough-guy and threaten others who have cut in front of them. If you're a timid introverted girl, why should you have to get into an uncomfortable argument with some dudes who you know haven't waited all day. This argument of "step up for yoursellf, be tough" is hogwash too. You shouldn't even have to deal with that as a fan.

Evensteven

Mamasan Bren wrote:

Evensteven wrote:

If people aren't using it to hold their place and go do other things - which I saw and experienced a lot of - then why need the list at all? If you are the first 10 people in line and you waited all day like everyone says they are doing then you should be the first 10 through the door and the first 10 on the floor and the first 10 on the rail. So how does the list help that? The if you're 100 and not on the rail what is the order? Some prefer to stand in front of ED, others Mike, others Stone. So how does it work after the rail?

Exactly. It gets used so people can get away with not truly waiting all day. Again, not all do this. But the fact that some do sucks and the list and hand-numbering should be done away with. Hopefully 10 Club will look into it, put their wise heads together with knowledge of other bands, and develop one they think is fair and works best.

There are people on that list that wait all day. Someone in their group may leave to go to the bathroom or get merch but they are there all day. However there are many, many people that get on the list, "make friends" then come back later. A LOT of people did this at Charlottesville. Many people showed up after I did from the same bar and waltzed to the front.

Mamasan Bren

Evensteven wrote:

Mamasan Bren wrote:

Evensteven wrote:

If people aren't using it to hold their place and go do other things - which I saw and experienced a lot of - then why need the list at all? If you are the first 10 people in line and you waited all day like everyone says they are doing then you should be the first 10 through the door and the first 10 on the floor and the first 10 on the rail. So how does the list help that? The if you're 100 and not on the rail what is the order? Some prefer to stand in front of ED, others Mike, others Stone. So how does it work after the rail?

Exactly. It gets used so people can get away with not truly waiting all day. Again, not all do this. But the fact that some do sucks and the list and hand-numbering should be done away with. Hopefully 10 Club will look into it, put their wise heads together with knowledge of other bands, and develop one they think is fair and works best.

There are people on that list that wait all day. Someone in their group may leave to go to the bathroom or get merch but they are there all day. However there are man, many people that get on the list, "make friends" then come back later. A LOT of people did this at Charlottesville. Many people showed up after I did from the same bar and waltzed to the front.

This is it in a nutshell. It's happening. Those that wait and only take quick breaks, no problem. Let's make it their Last Waltz.

drummerboy_73

As I stated in another thread, I'm going to be at LA night one with my 17 year old son for his 1st Pearl Jam concert. I have never been close to front row, and this time, I plan on making every effort to be.

We are driving down very early Saturday morning from Las Vegas, and plan on spending the ENTIRE day at the venue. We will get our tickets and get in line. If one of of us has to leave to take a pee break, the other will stay. If we want to get some merch, one of us will stay in line. If for some crazy reason we both need to leave the line, I will arrange it with the people behind and in front of me, and not be gone for more than a few minutes. I plan on GETTING my spot and STAYING in my spot. I will follow the 10C rules and the venue's rules. If anyone thinks they're going to flash some stupid notebook or wave a markered hand at me to get in front of me, you have another thing coming. If it's not part of the procedure/policy given to me by 10 Club or on my ticket confirmation, it doesn't mean SHIT.

Evensteven

drummerboy_73 wrote:

As I stated in another thread, I'm going to be at LA night one with my 17 year old son for his 1st Pearl Jam concert. I have never been close to front row, and this time, I plan on making every effort to be.

We are driving down very early Saturday morning from Las Vegas, and plan on spending the ENTIRE day at the venue. We will get our tickets and get in line. If one of of us has to leave to take a pee break, the other will stay. If we want to get some merch, one of us will stay in line. If for some crazy reason we both need to leave the line, I will arrange it with the people behind and in front of me, and not be gone for more than a few minutes. I plan on GETTING my spot and STAYING in my spot. I will follow the 10C rules and the venue's rules. If anyone thinks they're going to flash some stupid notebook or wave a markered hand at me to get in front of me, you have another thing coming. If it's not part of the procedure/policy given to me by 10 Club or on my ticket confirmation, it doesn't mean SHIT.

Get in line first then go get your tickets. Tickets don't open until 2pm

demetrios

Why all the shouting over GA folks? :nono:

Do you wanna know the secret to a successful PJ indoor GA show'? Huh? Wanna?

Well, for one, your 10club spare ticket should never, I repeat, NEVER be given to your wife or girlfriend. Or yet your best friend. What you want to do is give your 10club spare ticket to a young kid. That's right! Your son, daughter, cousin, a young rent-a-kid-for-a-day from an orphanage house etc... Some one who is much younger & so adorable that you can pick up over your shoulders with that could hold a sign during the whole show. This is the new way of doing Pearl Jam shows, GA style.

It doesn't matter if you waited in line for hours. Or have a wicked 10club number. Or hanging on the rail all day. It doesn't matter! I can't stress that enough. You could be a few rows back or on the sides inside the GA section. It's all about YOU tossing your young one into the air like a beach ball, and whoring it to any of the band members on stage to get their attention. Then, only then will be showered with PJ treats.

..

Back to "The List" ..

PJ88 wrote:

If you have waited all day and someone shows up and says they belong in front of you because of some list, tell them to take their list and shove it up their ass. Take a walk. What the hell are they going to do about it? Call the list police? The problem is that people allow others to do that (cut/walk up) to them. The whole idea of a list is so foolish. If you want in early than you wait. Period.

I agree with this. Have you seen all these pictures of folks posting their almighty number that is marked on their hand on Facebook & Twitter pages that they have such a low number that minutes later they are hanging out, posting pics @ the preparties down the street. Say whaaa?!?! :shock:

10club & the arena's security need better communications on this matter. There should NEVER be "The List". "The List" is stupid & the numbering on the hand is stupid. It's first come, first serve! You leave your spot in line, you don't come back. You go behind like everyone else does and continue from there. "The List" doesn't occur when you are waiting in line at the groceries, @ the bank, picking up a record at Easy Street Records, getting coffee at the drive thru @ Tim Hortons. There is no list! It's first come, first serve! You can't just leave for the rest of the day and come back thinking you can butt right through just cause your name is on this fan's piece of paper & you have a marker on your hand. That doesn't work in real life. Yeah, this is happen @ the Pearl Jam show's, but IMO The 10club & Pearl Jam management should step in and do something about it.

End rant.

PS .. "The List" SUCKS! Say no to "The List". Boycott "The List". Next time you see someone holding "The List", rip it right in front of them. And the next time you see someone that tries to mark on your hand, mark on their face!

It's a fucking rock concert. Who made these "List" folks GOD? To take control of my money & my time? :roll:

D

drummerboy_73

Evensteven wrote:

drummerboy_73 wrote:

As I stated in another thread, I'm going to be at LA night one with my 17 year old son for his 1st Pearl Jam concert. I have never been close to front row, and this time, I plan on making every effort to be.

We are driving down very early Saturday morning from Las Vegas, and plan on spending the ENTIRE day at the venue. We will get our tickets and get in line. If one of of us has to leave to take a pee break, the other will stay. If we want to get some merch, one of us will stay in line. If for some crazy reason we both need to leave the line, I will arrange it with the people behind and in front of me, and not be gone for more than a few minutes. I plan on GETTING my spot and STAYING in my spot. I will follow the 10C rules and the venue's rules. If anyone thinks they're going to flash some stupid notebook or wave a markered hand at me to get in front of me, you have another thing coming. If it's not part of the procedure/policy given to me by 10 Club or on my ticket confirmation, it doesn't mean SHIT.

Get in line first then go get your tickets. Tickets don't open until 2pm

So GA entry line starts forming before tickets are in hand? How does it work for venues where our ticket confirmation states "GA ticket holders may enter the venue from any gate/door"? Will there be lines forming at each door prior to ticket pick-up? Thanks for the tips!

I hope people get where I'm coming from. We should be rewarded for our efforts, not some bullshit nepotism by way of some mystical list that not everyone is aware of. Besides, my 10C ticket confirmation also says "The GA section is located on the floor directly in front of the stage and is first-come-first-serve."
 End of story.

Evensteven

demetrios wrote:

Why all the shouting over GA folks? :nono:

Do you wanna know the secret to a successful PJ indoor GA show'? Huh? Wanna?

Well, for one, your 10club spare ticket should never, I repeat, NEVER be given to your wife or girlfriend. Or yet your best friend. What you want to do is give your 10club spare ticket to a young kid. That's right! Your son, daughter, cousin, a young rent-a-kid-for-a-day from an orphanage house etc... Some one who is much younger & so adorable that you can pick up over your shoulders with that could hold a sign during the whole show. This is the new way of doing Pearl Jam shows, GA style.

It doesn't matter if you waited in line for hours. Or have a wicked 10club number. Or hanging on the rail all day. It doesn't matter! I can't stress that enough. You could be a few rows back or on the sides inside the GA section. It's all about YOU tossing your young one into the air like a beach ball, and whoring it to any of the band members on stage to get their attention. Then, only then will be showered with PJ treats.

..

Back to "The List" ..

PJ88 wrote:

If you have waited all day and someone shows up and says they belong in front of you because of some list, tell them to take their list and shove it up their ass. Take a walk. What the hell are they going to do about it? Call the list police? The problem is that people allow others to do that (cut/walk up) to them. The whole idea of a list is so foolish. If you want in early than you wait. Period.

I agree with this. Have you seen all these pictures of folks posting their almighty number that is marked on their hand on Facebook & Twitter pages that they have such a low number that minutes later they are hanging out, posting pics @ the preparties down the street. Say whaaa?!?! :shock:

10club & the arena's security need better communications on this matter. There should NEVER be "The List". "The List" is stupid & the numbering on the hand is stupid. It's first come, first serve! You leave your spot in line, you don't come back. You go behind like everyone else does and continue from there. "The List" doesn't occur when you are waiting in line at the groceries, @ the bank, picking up a record at Easy Street Records, getting coffee at the drive thru @ Tim Hortons. There is no list! It's first come, first serve! You can't just leave for the rest of the day and come back thinking you can butt right through just cause your name is on this fan's piece of paper & you have a marker on your hand. That doesn't work in real life. Yeah, this is happen @ the Pearl Jam show's, but IMO The 10club & Pearl Jam management should step in and do something about it.

End rant.

PS .. "The List" SUCKS! Say no to "The List". Boycott "The List". Next time you see someone holding "The List", rip it right in front of them. And the next time you see someone that tries to mark on your hand, mark on their face!

It's a fucking rock concert. Who made these "List" folks GOD? To take control of my money & my time? :roll:

D

Classic post.

The twitter pics alone are enough evidence that the "system" doesn't work.

Yes - boycott the list. May the cutest kid win.

Evensteven

I'm not sure how the GA line starts but people are there at 5:30 am. So maybe it starts at the ticket window then later they tell you where it will be. I'm not sure.

Joey Eakins

drummerboy_73 wrote:

As I stated in another thread, I'm going to be at LA night one with my 17 year old son for his 1st Pearl Jam concert. I have never been close to front row, and this time, I plan on making every effort to be.

We are driving down very early Saturday morning from Las Vegas, and plan on spending the ENTIRE day at the venue. We will get our tickets and get in line. If one of of us has to leave to take a pee break, the other will stay. If we want to get some merch, one of us will stay in line. If for some crazy reason we both need to leave the line, I will arrange it with the people behind and in front of me, and not be gone for more than a few minutes. I plan on GETTING my spot and STAYING in my spot. I will follow the 10C rules and the venue's rules. If anyone thinks they're going to flash some stupid notebook or wave a markered hand at me to get in front of me, you have another thing coming. If it's not part of the procedure/policy given to me by 10 Club or on my ticket confirmation, it doesn't mean SHIT.

If you do what you say here, then you have nothing to worry about. This list isn't something that people make in a closet then show up late in the day and try to enforce it. If you show up early and are willing to wait the entire day, then you will have no problem getting up close. Like many people have said already, you will be close even if you show up at 5pm because GA is small. Like I said in a previous post, me and my girlfriend were to first to show up in OKC and no one came up with a list and try to get in front of me. A list was created by someone else, we wrote our names on it/wrote on our hands and waited the entire day. I had a pleasant experience with this list because I was surrounded by the people who waited there and didn't abuse it. For the people willing to put in a whole day effort, you have nothing to worry about.

Good luck in LA. I hope you get the rail and enjoy you time with your son. The earlier you get at the arena, the better. Sleep is overrated if you want to be on the rail.

EdsonNascimento

drummerboy_73 wrote:

So GA entry line starts forming before tickets are in hand? How does it work for venues where our ticket confirmation states "GA ticket holders may enter the venue from any gate/door"? Will there be lines forming at each door prior to ticket pick-up? Thanks for the tips!

I hope people get where I'm coming from. We should be rewarded for our efforts, not some bullshit nepotism by way of some mystical list that not everyone is aware of. Besides, my 10C ticket confirmation also says "The GA section is located on the floor directly in front of the stage and is first-come-first-serve."
 End of story.

After the first couple shows (Pitt and Buff) they designated 1 door for GA entry, so the line started there. I know for mine the e-mail from here indicated which door. But, even if you don't get that, it will be pretty easy to identify.

Then, when doors opened that was the only area they let to the floor initially.

You can then help your line mates by holding their spot while you get your tix and vice versa (though you have someone to do that with, so no issues).

EDIT: So you will be outside on line. Hartford had indoor space outside the arena doors, but I don't think most of the others do. So you will be on the sidewalk waiting (so no need for tix until doors open).

dimitrispearljam

The most funny is the posts from people never saw or wait in the line for a pj show..EPIC!!!

Veddernarian

I have the solution... GA on the floor, Reserved seats up the sides. Go back to 2000 and a 10c member gets to go to one ( 1 ) show. Both GA and reserved will be smaller because of the 1 show per tour aspect. GA is 1st come, 1st serve. No lists or anything like that. If you want to camp and wait, you'll be first and people coming later will be next. Reserved seats should be good because of the 1 show per tour aspect. Reserved seats should not be on the floor.

This will eliminate the show lottery. You'll get your one 10C show, and then you can play whack-a-mole with the refresh key with Ticketmaster on whatever saturday public sale takes place. You'll probably fare better than the 10c lottery.

drummerboy_73

Veddernarian wrote:

I have the solution... GA on the floor, Reserved seats up the sides. Go back to 2000 and a 10c member gets to go to one ( 1 ) show. Both GA and reserved will be smaller because of the 1 show per tour aspect. GA is 1st come, 1st serve. No lists or anything like that. If you want to camp and wait, you'll be first and people coming later will be next. Reserved seats should be good because of the 1 show per tour aspect. Reserved seats should not be on the floor.

This will eliminate the show lottery. You'll get your one 10C show, and then you can play whack-a-mole with the refresh key with Ticketmaster on whatever saturday public sale takes place. You'll probably fare better than the 10c lottery.

This is spot on - I got 10C tix to Las Vegas, 2000 - was on the floor, about 8-10 rows back near Stone's side, which was good considering many people used their one choice for 10C tix to travel to this anniversary show. I then bought TM tix to the San Diego show a few days later, the day of the show, from a TM outlet in a mall, and was 10-12 rows up from Stone's side of stage.

Flagg

I lined up in the Dallas GA line at 5:00 PM. I was about #75 or so in line. That was just a quick count I did in my head. I ended up one person off the rail right in front of Mike. So I think it worked out pretty well.

MG79478

Suziemay wrote:

Wrigley: I gave a random stranger on the board my spare PJ20 Alpine tickets. She happen to win Wrigley GA tix and offered her spare to me to repay the favor. I did not ask for it. We are good friends now

Buffalo: I had a behind the stage ticket and went to the box office when I arrived to see if there were better tickets. The ticket dude was like, we have tickets on the floor if you don't mind standing. ?!?!?!?!?

Worcester 2: I won the 10c lottery for like the 2nd/3rd round. As far as I know, everyone who entered won. I gave my other GA ticket to a fan who got shut out.

Brooklyn 1: Only Leg 1 show I won the lottery for first time around.

Brooklyn 2: Traded my spare Brooklyn 1 for Brooklyn 2 with a super cool fan that I've traded with before in the past on Lost Dogs.

I'm not sure how this makes me a bad person but somehow you think it's an issue that I found a way to make it happen. I don't have special connections. I try to help fans out when I can, and have been fortunate to benefit from others who do the same. Sometimes from people I've helped out in the past, other times from random strangers. It's a beautiful thing.

Some of us have careers / families / other obligations that keep us from utilizing the PJ community. Shouldn’t everyone have equal access to tickets directly from PJ? So essentially you have an advantage that others do not, which was considered “unfair” in the days of F5. Back then, some people “found a way to make it happen”, they learned the website, practiced, and gained advantages over others. Some people had an issue with that, but we didn’t have special connections. It was a beautiful thing.

I have no beef with you, you exploited the current system, I actually applaud you for that. My problem is with the system and those who think it is fair. GA winner’s trade amongst GA winners, the rich get richer. The only way to keep GA tickets and be fair is to sell only singles, or print names on tickets the day of purchase. It’s just funny to see people who feel so strongly about their perception of fairness in one situation, throw it completely out the window in another nearly identical situation, all out of selfishness.

shortstack

MG79478 wrote:

It’s just funny to see people who feel so strongly about their perception of fairness in one situation, throw it completely out the window in another nearly identical situation, all out of selfishness.

:!:

EdsonNascimento

MG79478 wrote:

Some of us have careers / families / other obligations that keep us from utilizing the PJ community. Shouldn’t everyone have equal access to tickets directly from PJ? So essentially you have an advantage that others do not, which was considered “unfair” in the days of F5. Back then, some people “found a way to make it happen”, they learned the website, practiced, and gained advantages over others. Some people had an issue with that, but we didn’t have special connections. It was a beautiful thing.

I have no beef with you, you exploited the current system, I actually applaud you for that. My problem is with the system and those who think it is fair. GA winner’s trade amongst GA winners, the rich get richer. The only way to keep GA tickets and be fair is to sell only singles, or print names on tickets the day of purchase. It’s just funny to see people who feel so strongly about their perception of fairness in one situation, throw it completely out the window in another nearly identical situation, all out of selfishness.

You are so far off base it's scary. I had someone that traded my 10C reserved spare for his 10C GA. Very cool guy. Did he get richer? I guess you would say I did. Well, yes - especially since I made a new friend. As others have described - there is nothing wrong with having/making friends. There's nothing unfair or nefarious (exploiting? Really?) about that. Everyone does have equal access to tix now. Even with the F5 process once you had tix, you could do the same thing. Hey, I'm an F5 supporter, but what you are suggesting is apples and watermelons.

Sell only singles? Yowzers. So, you're suggesting folks can't bring friends. Yikes. I think you need to rethink your thought process.

RoleModelsinBlood31

Joey Eakins wrote:

I had GA for OKC. Before OKC, I had read the whole "the line and the list" thread and if you search my posts, you will see that I am not a fan of it. My girlfriend (photogirlliz on here) hadn't been on the rail ever, and we were determined to get rail by EARNING it. We were concerned about this list and how they were going to handle entry into the arena. So to get around it all, we showed up at 5:45am at the arena and were the first people out there. So when the list got started (it wasn't our idea to start it), it didn't matter how the list ended up working out because no matter what Liz and I were numbers 1 and 2. We sat in front of the entry door all day. No one was going to get in front of us, list or no list.

All I know is that Liz and I waited all day (545am-6:10pm) at the venue in order to get rail. We didn't leave and go to a preparty or bar. We stayed right there. I left to get us lunch, I had a few piss breaks, I walked down to the merch tent for a few minutes. However, at all times, either Liz or I was at that venue because we really wanted the rail. We met some really great people in the line and I would say the first two dozen or so people on that list really earned their spot. They didn't go to the preparty or leave all day only to show up at the last minute. They hung out right around us the whole day. However, I won't say that the list worked that well for people 30+ or so. I know for a fact that some people in the 70s on the list waited a hell of a lot more time outside the venue than some of the people in the 40s, 50s, and 60s. This is absolutely unfair and I really felt bad for them. They deserved to enter the building a little sooner than others.

So I guess my point is if you are concerned about getting rail and this whole "list" thing, get there insanely early and wait it out. If a list gets started, so be it....You will be really high on that list and will get rail anyways. I know that in Dallas, the first guy got at the building at 5am and for OKC we were first and got there at 545am. I feel bad for some of those that actually put in their time and got screwed by the whole list thing. I hope a better system gets in place.

To all the people in OKC that waited along side Liz and I the whole day, congrats on getting the rail...I had a wonderful time with you all. And to the poster who went on a rant about the two kids on the rail in OKC, you can fuck off. Those kids put their time in at the venue that day. They were there almost that entire fucking day and I didn't hear them complain hardly at all. They wanted to be there. They earned their spot and IMO, I feel Eddie's night was made better by their and their parents' presence.

:clap: :clap:

:corn:

Damn! People are going balls deep in this shit! I was reserved at the two shows I was at but if someone told me to get on the list I would do so, I suppose. The problem seems that not everyone knows about it... And that's just wrong. As Mike Tyson said "everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face." Just wait. Someone's going to get blasted. The list is a pretty petty asinine sounding thing that elitists seem to be using to take advantage of the average joe. Too bad really.

Kimmiebyrom

Flagg wrote:

I lined up in the Dallas GA line at 5:00 PM. I was about #75 or so in line. That was just a quick count I did in my head. I ended up one person off the rail right in front of Mike. So I think it worked out pretty well.

I don't know if Dallas was an anomaly, but it was freaking awesome. The venue actually moved us twice so the numbered hands came in handy when everyone had to grab all their belongings and move to where the GA entrance would eventually be. No one was pissed, everyone hung out together in line, we looked out for one another, and the people that came later were given information and the ability to sign a notebook sitting on a stool with a marker to sign and give themselves a chronological number on their hand IF THEY WANTED TO. No one was in charge of the notebook, it was just there. In fact, everyone in line encouraged one another, allowed food/bathroom/merch/ticket pick up. I know of no one that left for hours on end after getting a number and then tried to get back in line. We policed ourselves, made friends and memories, shared stories, etc. We knew the people that were there before us and the ones that came after. It wasn't rocket science. I met people from all over the world!

The Dallas GA was pretty small, so perhaps that made a difference. When we were escorted down to the floor by security, no one pushed/shoved/stampeded and I heard NO ONE complain about their position. In fact, Stone's end of the rail at the very end was EMPTY! We had kids, adults, signs, flags...it was all so very respectful and calm. A great experience. The only incident I think occurred when the venue moved the GA line around 3pm. But it got resolved without fisticuffs. All in all a great experience.