Pearl Jam turned Better Man into a cream puff song

Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
edited May 2013 in The Porch
facts are facts, on VH1 Storytellers Eddie Vedder says it is about women who are in an abusive relationship and not being able to get out of it, so people trying to make it into some glorified sing-along has made it one of my least favorite Pearl Jam songs, back in the day when they use to go out and just kick ass on the song,I gave it a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, I am sick of reading people on Twitter quoting the song and not paying attention to the song or what it was written about it was a song speaking out against domestic violence I use to think of it as speaking out against it, but ####ing people have made it into a hollow campfire sing along, sorry, that's the way I feel, women are still getting shit beat out of them, and people need to remember that song was speaking out against that, I am actually getting to the point I can't even stand to hear the song anymore in it's current form, I mean what are we celebrating? and who is speaking out for the women still getting shit beat out of them? there are so many better songs to sing along that actually celebrate stuff that is positive (Present Tense, Black, Corduroy, State Of Love And Trust even Alive), if you must sing a long, think about the words you are actually singing and what the song is written about next time

Waitin', watchin' the clock, it's four o' clock, it's got to stop (the abuse)
Tell him, take no more, she practices her speech
As he opens the door, she rolls over
Pretends to sleep as he looks her over (so he won't abuse her anymore)

She lies (telling a lie) and says she's in love with him, can't find a better man
She dreams in color (black & blue), she dreams in red (bloody), can't find a better man
Can't find a better man
Can't find a better man

Ohh...

Talkin' to herself, there's no one else who needs to know (embarrassed that she is being abused)
She tells herself, oh...

Memories back when she was bold and strong
And waiting for the world to come along
Swears she knew it, now she swears he's gone
She lies (telling a lie) and says she's in love with him, can't find a better man
She dreams in color(black & blue), she dreams in red (bloody), can't find a better man
She lies (telling a lie) and says she still loves him, can't find a better man
She dreams in color (black & blue), she dreams in red (bloody), can't find a better man
Can't find a better man
Can't find a better man

She loved him, yeah, she don't want to leave this way
She needs him, yeah, that's why she'll be back again
Can't find a better man (Can't find a better man)
Can't find a better man (Can't find a better man)
Can't find a better man (Can't find a better man)
Can't find a better man


pretty obvious what the song is about, and Eddie even said so, even Stone makes a comment about how strange it is that people turned it into a love song although they do kick ass in the VH1 Storytellers version, one of the few kick ass versions since 2000, sad that a song with such a deep meaning has lost all it's meaning

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmpowoB43dc

back when the song kicked ass and you can see it in the intensity the band plays the song back in the day

the real Better Man R.I.P. 1994-2000 :cry:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPBhbCbWrY4
pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
Post edited by Unknown User on
«13456

Comments

  • To say Alive is a positive song is to ignore its origins as well... That aside, the song is very difficult to understand. It's so upbeat, and some lyrics, if taken by themselves, could be construed as a song of affection. As to the sing along part, I remember this feeling wash over me when I saw the Live at the garden DVD sing along, I had never been to a show, and that was the beginning of PJ intoxication for me. So, respectfully, my feelings are in direct contrast with yours, plus Save it for Later is a favorite of mine. Just my thoughts on the matter.
  • Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
    mookieb10 wrote:
    To say Alive is a positive song is to ignore its origins as well... That aside, the song is very difficult to understand. It's so upbeat, and some lyrics, if taken by themselves, could be construed as a song of affection. As to the sing along part, I remember this feeling wash over me when I saw the Live at the garden DVD sing along, I had never been to a show, and that was the beginning of PJ intoxication for me. So, respectfully, my feelings are in direct contrast with yours, plus Save it for Later is a favorite of mine. Just my thoughts on the matter.
    well but as Eddie goes on to say in VH1 Storytellers, we the fans broke the curse of Alive, but Alive was against his own inner struggles, Better Man is about women being abused, so there is a massive difference, Eddie has a great life and overcame the inner demons of that song, fact is there is some woman, somewhere in the world getting the crap beaten out of her as we speak, so to trivialize the meaning of that song is sad, and takes away the focus from domestic violence and putting an end to that is something we should all care about
    pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
  • TyTy Posts: 1,003
    All red and angry about people enjoying a song, doing what they did for "Alive"... build a bridge, Dude! A very odd and angry post. Take a chill pill. And there ain't too much positive about the other songs you listed... :fp:
    PJ - Sydney 1998; Sydney 2003; Sydney, Melbourne, Newcastle 2006; Melbourne, Sydney 2009; Gold Coast, Melbourne, Sydney 2014.
    EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
  • TyTy Posts: 1,003
    Only clicked on this in hope that Puscifer had covered Better Man.
    PJ - Sydney 1998; Sydney 2003; Sydney, Melbourne, Newcastle 2006; Melbourne, Sydney 2009; Gold Coast, Melbourne, Sydney 2014.
    EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
  • facts are facts, on VH1 Storytellers Eddie Vedder says it is about women who are in an abusive relationship and not being able to get out of it, so people trying to make it into some glorified sing-along has made it one of my least favorite Pearl Jam songs, back in the day when they use to go out and just kick ass on the song,I gave it a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, I am sick of reading people on Twitter quoting the song and not paying attention to the song or what it was written about it was a song speaking out against domestic violence I use to think of it as speaking out against it, but ####ing people have made it into a hollow campfire sing along, sorry, that's the way I feel, women are still getting shit beat out of them, and people need to remember that song was speaking out against that, I am actually getting to the point I can't even stand to hear the song anymore in it's current form, I mean what are we celebrating? and who is speaking out for the women still getting shit beat out of them? there are so many better songs to sing along that actually celebrate stuff that is positive (Present Tense, Black, Corduroy, State Of Love And Trust even Alive), if you must sing a long, think about the words you are actually singing and what the song is written about next time

    How is Black (heartbreak song), Corduroy (song about Ed not being comfortable about fame), and State of Love and Trust (suicide reference) positive?
  • AndySlashAndySlash Posts: 3,116
    this one goes out to the one i love
    the plural of vinyl is vinyl
  • maybe it's because I wasn't following the band in the 90's, but I never view the song, or the band as champions against domestic violence. You might know better than I, if they were back then, and if they truly hung the song out as an anthem against domestic violence. If so, then it's very understandable why you feel like they've abandon the songs original meaning, and its prior meaning to you. BTW, the "she dreams in color, she dreams in red" line, they insert (black and blue), I never made that connection before, nor do I think its an easy reference to catch. Do most fans know the meaning of that line?
  • MangoMango Brisbane, Australia (via Dublin, Ireland)Posts: 1,049
    Maybe you should speak to Eddie and ask him to stop encouraging fans to sing along to it karaoke style with house lights up. But then again its his song and its clearly become something different now. Its the closest thing they have to a pop song. No one is in any more danger because it is sung this way. Nothings fucked here dude.
    "Life comes from within your heart and desire"
  • Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
    Ty wrote:
    All red and angry about people enjoying a song, doing what they did for "Alive"... build a bridge, Dude! A very odd and angry post. Take a chill pill. And there ain't too much positive about the other songs you listed... :fp:
    lets see one song is a bout a kid who didn't get to know his father, however that was something he overcame, but that was his own inner struggle, I use to see Better Man for what it was speaking out against domestic violence, and I always thought it was an advocacy for that, yeah lets end domestic violence, and it was one of my favorite Pearl Jam songs, now it's current form, and the way people sing the lyrics hollow, with no sense of what the song is really about, just sad, go ahead and sing it if you want and celebrate women getting the crap out of them, because is what the song is about, I guess if you never grew up around it, then of course you wouldn't get it
    pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
  • Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
    Amongst The Waves, Unthought Known, Just Breathe, Come Back, Love Boat Captain, I Am Mine, Given To Fly plenty of songs to sing along with, I don't even mind people singing along to Better Man, but people should remember what it is they are singing, that really is my point, the song has lost it's meaning, so you guys can have it, I really want nothing to do with it now in it's current form, a hollow pop song
    pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
  • MangoMango Brisbane, Australia (via Dublin, Ireland)Posts: 1,049
    ...and the way people sing the lyrics hollow, with no sense of what the song is really about, just sad, go ahead and sing it if you want and celebrate women getting the crap out of them, because is what the song is about, I guess if you never grew up around it, then of course you wouldn't get it

    Are you serious? The band practically conduct the crowd to have a sing-along with this! No one is "celebrating" violence. FFS grow up.
    "Life comes from within your heart and desire"
  • Mamasan BrenMamasan Bren Posts: 945
    edited February 2013
    Food for thought. Jump to 6:30 if too busy to watch the whole thing. But watch the whole thing if you want to hear a thoughtful intelligent speech. Granted the NY Times stat dropped by the speaker after the 6:30 mark mentions sexual abuse, and not physical, still...food for thought. I think the definition of manhood could equally apply to music as well as the point he makes about film.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx8RRIiP53Q
    1/95 DC 7/95 Chicago Tor Tol Cha 96 AlpV I II Chi St L KC 98 BSB I II 99 Phx Vegas Fresno SBern 00 BSB I II 01 (met ed) Vegas Phx Fargo St. Paul Chicago Alpine V Indy Col Virg Phi I II MSG I II (got on DVD!) 03 Calg 05 Clev Vegas LA I II SBar 06 Lon Dus Cop Nij Bel 07 Phi I II DC MSG I II Har BOS I II 08, LA3/4, SD '09, MSG I II '10, Missoula, London ONT, Wrigley, SD, LA1/2, Portland. Wrigley '16 I and II. 
  • Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
    Mango wrote:
    ...and the way people sing the lyrics hollow, with no sense of what the song is really about, just sad, go ahead and sing it if you want and celebrate women getting the crap out of them, because is what the song is about, I guess if you never grew up around it, then of course you wouldn't get it

    Are you serious? The band practically conduct the crowd to have a sing-along with this! No one is "celebrating" violence. FFS grow up.
    the band had no choice the fans have hijacked it from them, and yeah band has gone along with, so go knock yourselves out, whatever, but the song has been neutered, you cannot even compare the way it is now to what it use to be, and that is not a good thing in my book
    pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
  • papa_pearls_jam.pj20papa_pearls_jam.pj20 Chicago USAPosts: 2,142
    DM44143 wrote:
    facts are facts, on VH1 Storytellers Eddie Vedder says it is about women who are in an abusive relationship and not being able to get out of it, so people trying to make it into some glorified sing-along has made it one of my least favorite Pearl Jam songs, back in the day when they use to go out and just kick ass on the song,I gave it a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, I am sick of reading people on Twitter quoting the song and not paying attention to the song or what it was written about it was a song speaking out against domestic violence I use to think of it as speaking out against it, but ####ing people have made it into a hollow campfire sing along, sorry, that's the way I feel, women are still getting shit beat out of them, and people need to remember that song was speaking out against that, I am actually getting to the point I can't even stand to hear the song anymore in it's current form, I mean what are we celebrating? and who is speaking out for the women still getting shit beat out of them? there are so many better songs to sing along that actually celebrate stuff that is positive (Present Tense, Black, Corduroy, State Of Love And Trust even Alive), if you must sing a long, think about the words you are actually singing and what the song is written about next time

    How is Black (heartbreak song), Corduroy (song about Ed not being comfortable about fame), and State of Love and Trust (suicide reference) positive?
    Exactly.
    Posimists. Fuck the pessimists...fuck'em.
  • Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
    Food for thought. Jump to 6:30 if too busy to watch the whole thing. But watch the whole thing if you want to hear a thoughtful intelligent speech. Granted the NY Times stat dropped by the speaker after the 6:30 mark mentions sexual abuse, and not physical, still...food for thought. I think the definition of manhood could equally apply to music as well as the point he makes about film.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx8RRIiP53Q
    exactly, I had always thought of Eddie as one of the few guys in music speaking out for women, and no song more so than Better Man
    pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
  • MangoMango Brisbane, Australia (via Dublin, Ireland)Posts: 1,049
    Saying you prefer an older version (or call it original if you want) of a song compared to the current version is one thing but you kinda came at this at 100mph. I don't know if something happened and you are having a bad day but as previously said by another member... chill.

    I've sung along to Better Man plenty of times: at concerts, in work, at my home. This doesn't mean I don't care about the issues of the song. It means the song is what it is - its a catchy tune. Indifference is one of my all time favourites but you know what, I don't need to be suicidal to listen and enjoy it.
    "Life comes from within your heart and desire"
  • papa_pearls_jam.pj20papa_pearls_jam.pj20 Chicago USAPosts: 2,142
    Mango wrote:
    ...and the way people sing the lyrics hollow, with no sense of what the song is really about, just sad, go ahead and sing it if you want and celebrate women getting the crap out of them, because is what the song is about, I guess if you never grew up around it, then of course you wouldn't get it

    Are you serious? The band practically conduct the crowd to have a sing-along with this! No one is "celebrating" violence. FFS grow up.
    That's right.

    If Ed, the writer of the song, wants to begin, then encourage the crowd, to sing the song along with, instead of, over the top of, and pausing at points in the first verse into the chorus, with a invitation for dramatic effect and connection with the audience, then why would that not be alright with anyone else?

    Maybe the point is, and you allude to it in your comments, this song in its infant or recorded or first played or last played stage is not going to prevent domestic abuse or violence towards women or children, or men, for that matter.

    Thanks for raising the awareness, though.
    :corn:
    Posimists. Fuck the pessimists...fuck'em.
  • papa_pearls_jam.pj20papa_pearls_jam.pj20 Chicago USAPosts: 2,142
    EddieVedder.jpg
    Posimists. Fuck the pessimists...fuck'em.
  • Big Bank HankBig Bank Hank Seattle, WAPosts: 8,639
    Mango wrote:
    ...and the way people sing the lyrics hollow, with no sense of what the song is really about, just sad, go ahead and sing it if you want and celebrate women getting the crap out of them, because is what the song is about, I guess if you never grew up around it, then of course you wouldn't get it

    Are you serious? The band practically conduct the crowd to have a sing-along with this! No one is "celebrating" violence. FFS grow up.
    That's right.

    If Ed, the writer of the song, wants to begin, then encourage the crowd, to sing the song along with, instead of, over the top of, and pausing at points in the first verse into the chorus, with a invitation for dramatic effect and connection with the audience, then why would that not be alright with anyone else?

    Maybe the point is, and you allude to it in your comments, this song in its infant or recorded or first played or last played stage is not going to prevent domestic abuse or violence towards women or children, or men, for that matter.

    Thanks for raising the awareness, though.
    :corn:
    look and if it gets people to think, then really that is never a bad thing, like I have said throughout the thread, just think about what it is about, if you still want to sing it go ahead, but let the words have meaning, Pearl Jam has always been my favorite band because I believe Eddie Vedder to be one of the greatest poets of our generation
    pearl-jam-cameron-crowe.jpg
  • The version from MSG II in 2010 is my favorite, the crowd singing along is what makes it for me

    I don't see it as trivializing the meaning of the tune but rather the unification of the crowd by singing along to a song they love from a band they love who is playing right in front of their eyes.

    I mean it looks obvious that Eddie himself loves it when the crowd sings along, that pretty much speaks for itself
  • dwhite76dwhite76 Posts: 2,797
    Ty wrote:
    All red and angry about people enjoying a song, doing what they did for "Alive"... build a bridge, Dude! A very odd and angry post. Take a chill pill. And there ain't too much positive about the other songs you listed... :fp:
    lets see one song is a bout a kid who didn't get to know his father, however that was something he overcame, but that was his own inner struggle, I use to see Better Man for what it was speaking out against domestic violence, and I always thought it was an advocacy for that, yeah lets end domestic violence, and it was one of my favorite Pearl Jam songs, now it's current form, and the way people sing the lyrics hollow, with no sense of what the song is really about, just sad, go ahead and sing it if you want and celebrate women getting the crap out of them, because is what the song is about, I guess if you never grew up around it, then of course you wouldn't get it


    I think you totally forgot the Alive also refers to the moms sick incestual love for the kid. Yes Eddie described Alive as that being apart of the meaning of the song too. Then again Ed has said a lot of things.
    I don't think he wanted us to take his meaning of a song as our own. PJ wants us to interpret music into our own way. Sometimes it helps us heal, cry, and even get pissed off. One of the main reasons they wont do videos.
    Some words when spoken...Can't be taken back...
  • You lost me when you said we should celebrate "positive songs.. ..like black".
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • dwhite76dwhite76 Posts: 2,797
    You lost me when you said we should celebrate "positive songs.. ..like black".


    :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
    Some words when spoken...Can't be taken back...
  • dannydanny Posts: 2,020
    great song!
    danny d
  • ckravitzckravitz NJPosts: 1,666
    Ty wrote:
    All red and angry about people enjoying a song, doing what they did for "Alive"... build a bridge, Dude! A very odd and angry post. Take a chill pill. And there ain't too much positive about the other songs you listed... :fp:

    Seriously.
  • ckravitzckravitz NJPosts: 1,666
    The version from MSG II in 2010 is my favorite, the crowd singing along is what makes it for me

    I don't see it as trivializing the meaning of the tune but rather the unification of the crowd by singing along to a song they love from a band they love who is playing right in front of their eyes.

    I mean it looks obvious that Eddie himself loves it when the crowd sings along, that pretty much speaks for itself

    Well said.
  • Dr. DelightDr. Delight Posts: 11,059
    Bonkers.
    And so you see, I have come to doubt
    All that I once held as true
    I stand alone without beliefs
    The only truth I know is you.
  • Can I wear a Pearl Jam T-Shirt, when I sing along to this song, while at a concert?
    Free Boston Lou!!!!
  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    Ty wrote:
    Only clicked on this in hope that Puscifer had covered Better Man.

    Hahahahaha I wonder how Maynard would sound! :corn:
  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    Can I wear a Pearl Jam T-Shirt, when I sing along to this song, while at a concert?

    Who gives a rats ass what speedy wears!!!!!
«13456
Sign In or Register to comment.