i can't speak for anyone but myself, but i will tell you what i believe. i think you guys put values on human life, you make one life more important than another. for me, a little girl getting mangled in a car wreck is no different than a little girl getting shot to death. both are repugnant, both could be prevented. but people's response to that is, yeah but it's not intentional. so you're saying that preventable unintentional deaths arent worth preventing, because they are just accidents and accidents happen. i think banning cars is the best analogy because look at all the positive that could come from it, millions of cars no longer putting out pollution, tens of thousands of human lives and countless more animal lives being saved. like i said in the other threads, i'm willing to sacrifice my guns if yous guys are willing to sacrifice the other killers like cars, tobacco, alcohol, etc. and i'm sure the "we don't need guns" reply is coming and my response to that is that as human beings we only NEED water, oxygen and food. everything else is just a convenience, so before you say, i need my car we don't need guns....uhhh no you don't.
Kind of like people who abuse prescription meds...however that thread was locked. 112 people a day killed by that...but lets concentrate on guns. :?
I don't get the arguments i'm seeing from people comparing other types of deaths like overdoses, cigarette smoking, etc. to gun murder. It just makes no sense.
if you think what I believe is stupid, bizarre, ridiculous or outrageous.....it's ok, I think I had a brain tumor when I wrote that.
Don't be so obtuse or simple minded. How many of those 112 people killed each day are caused by someone else pushing that pill in their mouth? How many times is it because someone does this to dozens of people back-to-back-to-back, etc at the local school, mall, church, whatever?????
It's a ridiculous argument. But that's all your left with.
aawe man you're asking for it...you're going to get a hundred more analogies about smoking, slipping on banana peels, bullfighting etc etc, to try to make the mass shooting in CT look insubstantial in the "bigger picture."
I love it when gun fearing liberals dismiss valid points as ridiculous. What that basically means is it's "I have no answer for that".
Just an fyi, when everyone else thinks your" valid points" are ridiculous, chances are they are.
Any try answering a direct question for once, ok?
My whole life
was like a picture
of a sunny day
“We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
― Abraham Lincoln
I love it when everyone who disagrees with the dogma of the right is branded a "gun fearing liberal".
So do I. Liberals instead of examining themselves and worrying about themselves always feel they need to change society and others. It must be this person's fault....it must be the guns that are the issue....it's not me, it's them.
Are these gun fearing liberals saying it is society that needs to be changed or that it is the guns that are the issue? You're not even making sense anymore.
i can't speak for anyone but myself, but i will tell you what i believe. i think you guys put values on human life, you make one life more important than another. for me, a little girl getting mangled in a car wreck is no different than a little girl getting shot to death. both are repugnant, both could be prevented. but people's response to that is, yeah but it's not intentional. so you're saying that preventable unintentional deaths arent worth preventing, because they are just accidents and accidents happen. i think banning cars is the best analogy because look at all the positive that could come from it, millions of cars no longer putting out pollution, tens of thousands of human lives and countless more animal lives being saved. like i said in the other threads, i'm willing to sacrifice my guns if yous guys are willing to sacrifice the other killers like cars, tobacco, alcohol, etc. and i'm sure the "we don't need guns" reply is coming and my response to that is that as human beings we only NEED water, oxygen and food. everything else is just a convenience, so before you say, i need my car we don't need guns....uhhh no you don't.
They are all concerns. But if the auto accident analogy must be used, you can also consider it like this:
In some areas its likely that there werent speed limits or rules regarding driving in a car...until accidents started happening. So they made a speed limit of 50 miles an hour. Too many accidents still occurred, so they dropped it to 25 mph...
With guns, the majority dont want a ban, we just want it recognized that the USA has some of the weakest laws/restrictions in the world, with very easy access. So, if the speed limit is dropped from 50 to 25 in some places, its like dropping the magazine capacity from 30 to 12...
Also, I think we should make more difficult driving tests! I nearly get killed everyday here in south florida with these awful drivers!
As long as everyone stands their ground on the issue... nothing is going to change.
If nothing is going to change... then, we... as Americans, will simply have to reach the conclusion that the deaths of people due to gunfire is just part of what defines us as 'American'. It becomes a part of who we are and we have to face the reality that we accept these types of losses as payment for our freedoms.
Exactly.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
As long as everyone stands their ground on the issue... nothing is going to change.
If nothing is going to change... then, we... as Americans, will simply have to reach the conclusion that the deaths of people due to gunfire is just part of what defines us as 'American'. It becomes a part of who we are and we have to face the reality that we accept these types of losses as payment for our freedoms.
i can't speak for anyone but myself, but i will tell you what i believe. i think you guys put values on human life, you make one life more important than another. for me, a little girl getting mangled in a car wreck is no different than a little girl getting shot to death. both are repugnant, both could be prevented. but people's response to that is, yeah but it's not intentional. so you're saying that preventable unintentional deaths arent worth preventing, because they are just accidents and accidents happen. i think banning cars is the best analogy because look at all the positive that could come from it, millions of cars no longer putting out pollution, tens of thousands of human lives and countless more animal lives being saved. like i said in the other threads, i'm willing to sacrifice my guns if yous guys are willing to sacrifice the other killers like cars, tobacco, alcohol, etc. and i'm sure the "we don't need guns" reply is coming and my response to that is that as human beings we only NEED water, oxygen and food. everything else is just a convenience, so before you say, i need my car we don't need guns....uhhh no you don't.
...
The car vs. gun comparison... the bread and butter of the pro-gun arguement.
Fair enough... I'll play.
Q: How often do you operate your car?
Q: How many cars are operated on a daily basis?
Q: How often do you shoot your gun?
Q: Do you shoot you gun, everytime you operate your car?
Q: Would you feel safer is everyone who is driving around was firing a gun at the same time they are driving or if everyone who owns a car, owned a gun and used both the car and the gun in equal terms? (i.e. if someone drives to/from work 30 minutes a day (1 hour per day) they fired their guns for one hour per day)
...
Balance the equation with cars and their operational usage and apply equal numbers and usage to guns... or vice versa.
Now... your comparison of guns and cars can be made.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
I'm absolutely in favor or citizens owning a gun that's handled and locked up responsibly. Protecting your family in America with a firearm has saved thousands and thousands of lives from sickos and criminals. We can't be like _______(insert country here). It's kind of too late for that dream.
The issue is really about having tougher ownership laws, better training, and what guns you should be allowed to buy. But if someone breaks into my house i'm prepared. That's a nice feeling.
I know the answer will be for "protection", but in my mind that is the same thing as saying "to potentially murder someone".
Absolutely and there's no shame there. If someone is "savage" enough to bust through your window or kick down your door and threaten your family you'll probably need to resort to seriously harming them or killing them. It happens in every neighborhood eventually.
I'm absolutely in favor or citizens owning a gun that's handled and locked up responsibly. Protecting your family in America with a firearm has saved thousands and thousands of lives from sickos and criminals. We can't be like _______(insert country here). It's kind of too late for that dream.
The issue is really about having tougher ownership laws, better training, and what guns you should be allowed to buy. But if someone breaks into my house i'm prepared. That's a nice feeling.
Do you have stats for this? What percentage of people who own guns have actually saved a life with them (outside of police officers)?
And if you save a life by ending one, is it really saving a life?
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
I know the answer will be for "protection", but in my mind that is the same thing as saying "to potentially murder someone".
Absolutely and there's no shame there. If someone is "savage" enough to bust through your window or kick down your door and threaten your wife or kids you'll probably need to resort to seriously harming them or killing them.
Maybe you think you need to, but I don't. Until they actually murder me, it's just speculation. I don't think murdering someone on speculation is acceptable.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
man i've read your post like ten times and i'm just not getting the point you're trying to make. it's over my head i think, but i'll answer your questions and you tell me how i did.
1.about once a week, i'm unemployed
2. no idea, tens of millions if i had to guess.
3. lately about once every 4 months
4. no i don't
5. no i wouldn't feel safe if people were driving around shooting guns in the air.
i can't speak for anyone but myself, but i will tell you what i believe. i think you guys put values on human life, you make one life more important than another. for me, a little girl getting mangled in a car wreck is no different than a little girl getting shot to death. both are repugnant, both could be prevented. but people's response to that is, yeah but it's not intentional. so you're saying that preventable unintentional deaths arent worth preventing, because they are just accidents and accidents happen. i think banning cars is the best analogy because look at all the positive that could come from it, millions of cars no longer putting out pollution, tens of thousands of human lives and countless more animal lives being saved. like i said in the other threads, i'm willing to sacrifice my guns if yous guys are willing to sacrifice the other killers like cars, tobacco, alcohol, etc. and i'm sure the "we don't need guns" reply is coming and my response to that is that as human beings we only NEED water, oxygen and food. everything else is just a convenience, so before you say, i need my car we don't need guns....uhhh no you don't.
...
The car vs. gun comparison... the bread and butter of the pro-gun arguement.
Fair enough... I'll play.
Q: How often do you operate your car?
Q: How many cars are operated on a daily basis?
Q: How often do you shoot your gun?
Q: Do you shoot you gun, everytime you operate your car?
Q: Would you feel safer is everyone who is driving around was firing a gun at the same time they are driving or if everyone who owns a car, owned a gun and used both the car and the gun in equal terms? (i.e. if someone drives to/from work 30 minutes a day (1 hour per day) they fired their guns for one hour per day)
...
Balance the equation with cars and their operational usage and apply equal numbers and usage to guns... or vice versa.
Now... your comparison of guns and cars can be made.
if you think what I believe is stupid, bizarre, ridiculous or outrageous.....it's ok, I think I had a brain tumor when I wrote that.
I'm absolutely in favor or citizens owning a gun that's handled and locked up responsibly. Protecting your family in America with a firearm has saved thousands and thousands of lives from sickos and criminals. We can't be like _______(insert country here). It's kind of too late for that dream.
The issue is really about having tougher ownership laws, better training, and what guns you should be allowed to buy. But if someone breaks into my house i'm prepared. That's a nice feeling.
Do you have stats for this? What percentage of people who own guns have actually saved a life with them (outside of police officers)?
And if you save a life by ending one, is it really saving a life?
Yes. You're saving your life and your family's life. You are ending a criminal's life in favor of innocents.
I know the answer will be for "protection", but in my mind that is the same thing as saying "to potentially murder someone".
Absolutely and there's no shame there. If someone is "savage" enough to bust through your window or kick down your door and threaten your wife or kids you'll probably need to resort to seriously harming them or killing them.
Maybe you think you need to, but I don't. Until they actually murder me, it's just speculation. I don't think murdering someone on speculation is acceptable.
When someone breaks in your house, go ahead and make sure you ask if they plan to rape, murder or just rob your family. You certainly won't need that gun when they are just gonna rob you.
I'm absolutely in favor or citizens owning a gun that's handled and locked up responsibly. Protecting your family in America with a firearm has saved thousands and thousands of lives from sickos and criminals. We can't be like _______(insert country here). It's kind of too late for that dream.
The issue is really about having tougher ownership laws, better training, and what guns you should be allowed to buy. But if someone breaks into my house i'm prepared. That's a nice feeling.
Do you have stats for this? What percentage of people who own guns have actually saved a life with them (outside of police officers)?
And if you save a life by ending one, is it really saving a life?
Yes. You're saving your life and your family's life. You are ending a criminal's life in favor of innocents.
My family is far from innocent.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Kind of like people who abuse prescription meds...however that thread was locked. 112 people a day killed by that...but lets concentrate on guns. :?
Don't be so obtuse or simple minded. How many of those 112 people killed each day are caused by someone else pushing that pill in their mouth? How many times is it because someone does this to dozens of people back-to-back-to-back, etc at the local school, mall, church, whatever?????
It's a ridiculous argument. But that's all your left with.
Doesn't matter. If peole are going to use reasons such as "accidental death" and "suicidal people" as reasons to limit guns this is a 100% valid point.
Yes it does matter. Your point couldn't be further from 100% valid, it is exactly 0% valid
When someone breaks in your house, go ahead and make sure you ask if they plan to rape, murder or just rob your family. You certainly won't need that gun when they are just gonna rob you.
I actually feel sorry for people who live with this kind of fear.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
When someone breaks in your house, go ahead and make sure you ask if they plan to rape, murder or just rob your family. You certainly won't need that gun when they are just gonna rob you.
I actually feel sorry for people who live with this kind of fear.
I've never had anyone break into my house in the middle of the night but I can only imagine it is one of the worst fears imaginable. Particularly if you are alone or if you have children.
That is 42 deaths per day for prescription med deaths.
Compared to 85 deaths per day related to guns.
Again, you are rallying for focusing on the bigger issue. Yet you then ignore the bigger issue or start trying to find a different one to compare against.
As long as everyone stands their ground on the issue... nothing is going to change.
If nothing is going to change... then, we... as Americans, will simply have to reach the conclusion that the deaths of people due to gunfire is just part of what defines us as 'American'. It becomes a part of who we are and we have to face the reality that we accept these types of losses as payment for our freedoms.
When someone breaks in your house, go ahead and make sure you ask if they plan to rape, murder or just rob your family. You certainly won't need that gun when they are just gonna rob you.
I actually feel sorry for people who live with this kind of fear.
You've obviously never been assaulted or mugged......consider yourself lucky.
When someone breaks in your house, go ahead and make sure you ask if they plan to rape, murder or just rob your family. You certainly won't need that gun when they are just gonna rob you.
I actually feel sorry for people who live with this kind of fear.
You've obviously never been assaulted or mugged......consider yourself lucky.
I am lucky. But I'm talking about the kind of fear that would make someone make the decision that they would murder someone else and buy a gun.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
When someone breaks in your house, go ahead and make sure you ask if they plan to rape, murder or just rob your family. You certainly won't need that gun when they are just gonna rob you.
I actually feel sorry for people who live with this kind of fear.
You've obviously never been assaulted or mugged......consider yourself lucky.
I have been assaulted and actually shot at at work and I don't have a gun. Why not you ask? cause I don't believe its keeps you safe.
Outside of hunting and target shooting for recreation or sport, what is the purpose of owning a gun?
I know the answer will be for "protection", but in my mind that is the same thing as saying "to potentially murder someone".
I am not necessarily in favor of banning guns, but the people who are most enthusiastic about their guns (bragging about them, etc.) disturb me a lot more than those who are most enthusiastic about banning them.
In a way, I feel sorry for people who let fear so dominate their lives that they put their faith and take comfort in a gun to murder someone who threatens them.
I don't own a gun or carry but sure hope if I am in danger a good guy will be there
who is not afraid to step up and save a life, his own, mine or any of ours.
I find it fearful to have your head in the sand, disregard the fact that very bad people are
victimizing good people. There is a hero in the making this minute.
We could have used a hero Friday, no disputing that.
And if you don't mind giving up your life to the soulless scum that preys on good people
like parasites, that is your choice. No one says you must own or carry a gun. This is choice.
That is the key... individual choice. Just like abortion ... individual choice.
The states , the people are making the laws they want where they live.
Each state is handling making the regulations how they see fit. The people.
The federal government does not need to make laws for the states.
States, the people, are perfectly capable of making their own choices and laws.
man i've read your post like ten times and i'm just not getting the point you're trying to make. it's over my head i think, but i'll answer your questions and you tell me how i did.
1.about once a week, i'm unemployed
2. no idea, tens of millions if i had to guess.
3. lately about once every 4 months
4. no i don't
5. no i wouldn't feel safe if people were driving around shooting guns in the air.
...
Basically... you cannot compare gun deaths to car deaths. Why?
Because many, many more Americans use their cars on a daily basis. And they use their car for extended periods.
Far fewer Americans own guns, than cars.
And those gun owners do not operate their guns as much as the average American uses their car. Most gun owners do not use their guns, everyday.
...
Now, if you are going to compare the two... guns vs. cars... then, you either have to up the gun ownership to be equal to the car ownership... and you have to up the gun usage to the same as the car usage.
Or... you can drop the car ownership and usage equal to the gun ownership and gun annual usage.
After doing that, you can make a fair comparison.
Would gun accidents increase, if everyone who owns a car, owned a gun... and if everyone used their gun as often as they use their car?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Outside of hunting and target shooting for recreation or sport, what is the purpose of owning a gun?
I know the answer will be for "protection", but in my mind that is the same thing as saying "to potentially murder someone".
I am not necessarily in favor of banning guns, but the people who are most enthusiastic about their guns (bragging about them, etc.) disturb me a lot more than those who are most enthusiastic about banning them.
In a way, I feel sorry for people who let fear so dominate their lives that they put their faith and take comfort in a gun to murder someone who threatens them.
...I don't own a gun or carry but sure hope if I am in danger a good guy will be there
who is not afraid to step up and save a life, his own, mine or any of ours....
So,not being the registered owner but having a gun in one's home for 'protection' is absolutely useless if one's partner/husband is not there to 'protect' with it?
yeah i think if everyone who owned a car owned a gun and shot is as often as they drove that there would be more gun accidents. i can compare gun deaths to car deaths because they break down the same. both car deaths and gun deaths could both be prevented if neither of them existed.
if you think what I believe is stupid, bizarre, ridiculous or outrageous.....it's ok, I think I had a brain tumor when I wrote that.
Comments
Just an fyi, when everyone else thinks your" valid points" are ridiculous, chances are they are.
Any try answering a direct question for once, ok?
was like a picture
of a sunny day
“We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
― Abraham Lincoln
Are these gun fearing liberals saying it is society that needs to be changed or that it is the guns that are the issue? You're not even making sense anymore.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
They are all concerns. But if the auto accident analogy must be used, you can also consider it like this:
In some areas its likely that there werent speed limits or rules regarding driving in a car...until accidents started happening. So they made a speed limit of 50 miles an hour. Too many accidents still occurred, so they dropped it to 25 mph...
With guns, the majority dont want a ban, we just want it recognized that the USA has some of the weakest laws/restrictions in the world, with very easy access. So, if the speed limit is dropped from 50 to 25 in some places, its like dropping the magazine capacity from 30 to 12...
Also, I think we should make more difficult driving tests!
Exactly.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Perfectly said.
interesting
The car vs. gun comparison... the bread and butter of the pro-gun arguement.
Fair enough... I'll play.
Q: How often do you operate your car?
Q: How many cars are operated on a daily basis?
Q: How often do you shoot your gun?
Q: Do you shoot you gun, everytime you operate your car?
Q: Would you feel safer is everyone who is driving around was firing a gun at the same time they are driving or if everyone who owns a car, owned a gun and used both the car and the gun in equal terms? (i.e. if someone drives to/from work 30 minutes a day (1 hour per day) they fired their guns for one hour per day)
...
Balance the equation with cars and their operational usage and apply equal numbers and usage to guns... or vice versa.
Now... your comparison of guns and cars can be made.
Hail, Hail!!!
The issue is really about having tougher ownership laws, better training, and what guns you should be allowed to buy. But if someone breaks into my house i'm prepared. That's a nice feeling.
Absolutely and there's no shame there. If someone is "savage" enough to bust through your window or kick down your door and threaten your family you'll probably need to resort to seriously harming them or killing them. It happens in every neighborhood eventually.
Do you have stats for this? What percentage of people who own guns have actually saved a life with them (outside of police officers)?
And if you save a life by ending one, is it really saving a life?
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Maybe you think you need to, but I don't. Until they actually murder me, it's just speculation. I don't think murdering someone on speculation is acceptable.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
1.about once a week, i'm unemployed
2. no idea, tens of millions if i had to guess.
3. lately about once every 4 months
4. no i don't
5. no i wouldn't feel safe if people were driving around shooting guns in the air.
Yes. You're saving your life and your family's life. You are ending a criminal's life in favor of innocents.
My family is far from innocent.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Yes it does matter. Your point couldn't be further from 100% valid, it is exactly 0% valid
And how would that be?
I actually feel sorry for people who live with this kind of fear.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
LOL uh okay.
I've never had anyone break into my house in the middle of the night but I can only imagine it is one of the worst fears imaginable. Particularly if you are alone or if you have children.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Statistics from 2009 (a year a cited deaths related to both cars and guns), there were 15,000 people how overdosed and died on prescription meds.
http://www.cdc.gov/vitalsigns/MethadoneOverdoses/
That is 42 deaths per day for prescription med deaths.
Compared to 85 deaths per day related to guns.
Again, you are rallying for focusing on the bigger issue. Yet you then ignore the bigger issue or start trying to find a different one to compare against.
I am lucky. But I'm talking about the kind of fear that would make someone make the decision that they would murder someone else and buy a gun.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
I have been assaulted and actually shot at at work and I don't have a gun. Why not you ask? cause I don't believe its keeps you safe.
who is not afraid to step up and save a life, his own, mine or any of ours.
I find it fearful to have your head in the sand, disregard the fact that very bad people are
victimizing good people. There is a hero in the making this minute.
We could have used a hero Friday, no disputing that.
And if you don't mind giving up your life to the soulless scum that preys on good people
like parasites, that is your choice.
No one says you must own or carry a gun. This is choice.
That is the key... individual choice. Just like abortion ... individual choice.
The states , the people are making the laws they want where they live.
Each state is handling making the regulations how they see fit. The people.
The federal government does not need to make laws for the states.
States, the people, are perfectly capable of making their own choices and laws.
Basically... you cannot compare gun deaths to car deaths. Why?
Because many, many more Americans use their cars on a daily basis. And they use their car for extended periods.
Far fewer Americans own guns, than cars.
And those gun owners do not operate their guns as much as the average American uses their car. Most gun owners do not use their guns, everyday.
...
Now, if you are going to compare the two... guns vs. cars... then, you either have to up the gun ownership to be equal to the car ownership... and you have to up the gun usage to the same as the car usage.
Or... you can drop the car ownership and usage equal to the gun ownership and gun annual usage.
After doing that, you can make a fair comparison.
Would gun accidents increase, if everyone who owns a car, owned a gun... and if everyone used their gun as often as they use their car?
Hail, Hail!!!
So,not being the registered owner but having a gun in one's home for 'protection' is absolutely useless if one's partner/husband is not there to 'protect' with it?
Hmmmm..... OK.