PJ 20 Book - Where's Abbruzzese?

Spiritual_Chaos

he wasn't in Matt's league as a drummer

I don't have the qualification to judge who's the "better" drummer - but I much rather listen to the drumming on Sonic Reducer from Oprheum 1994 than from Berlin 2009.

But that's beside the point. The thing is. When Pearl Jam was the biggets and for 2-3 intensive years he was part of the band. But still - for some reason - theye is some shady George Lucas-esque tactics going on with trying to remove him from history.

E.g. He should have been featured on the MTV Unplugged cover. Poor taste to exclude him - even if I can see the reason with showing pearl jam on the cover and not "pearl jam as it looked back then". But still. If they didn't want it to look like he still is part of the band, they could have made other designdecision.

Just one example. The lack of pictures of him in the book and not bringing him up in the documentary AT ALL is just shady and weird. Even if it's a "Pearl jam endorsed" doc made by one of their friends. I find it a lack of respect for him.

Even if they had their feuds and Matt Cameron is a "miracle" that made "the band so much better". yada yada.

JasonE

Spiritual_Chaos wrote:

he wasn't in Matt's league as a drummer

I don't have the qualification to judge who's the "better" drummer - but I much rather listen to the drumming on Sonic Reducer from Oprheum 1994 than from Berlin 2009.

But that's beside the point. The thing is. When Pearl Jam was the biggets and for 2-3 intensive years he was part of the band. But still - for some reason - theye is some shady George Lucas-esque tactics going on with trying to remove him from history.

E.g. He should have been featured on the MTV Unplugged cover. Poor taste to exclude him - even if I can see the reason with showing pearl jam on the cover and not "pearl jam as it looked back then". But still. If they didn't want it to look like he still is part of the band, they could have made other designdecision.

Just one example. The lack of pictures of him in the book and not bringing him up in the documentary AT ALL is just shady and weird. Even if it's a "Pearl jam endorsed" doc made by one of their friends. I find it a lack of respect for him.

Even if they had their feuds and Matt Cameron is a "miracle" that made "the band so much better". yada yada.

This

rival.

i think place/date has more dave than PJ20 :?

great shot of jeff punching him in the face after the montreal (?) show.

would have been awesome to see some of that in the movie, but.... ya know.

CJMST3K

JasonE wrote:

Spiritual_Chaos wrote:

he wasn't in Matt's league as a drummer

I don't have the qualification to judge who's the "better" drummer - but I much rather listen to the drumming on Sonic Reducer from Oprheum 1994 than from Berlin 2009.

But that's beside the point. The thing is. When Pearl Jam was the biggets and for 2-3 intensive years he was part of the band. But still - for some reason - theye is some shady George Lucas-esque tactics going on with trying to remove him from history.

E.g. He should have been featured on the MTV Unplugged cover. Poor taste to exclude him - even if I can see the reason with showing pearl jam on the cover and not "pearl jam as it looked back then". But still. If they didn't want it to look like he still is part of the band, they could have made other designdecision.

Just one example. The lack of pictures of him in the book and not bringing him up in the documentary AT ALL is just shady and weird. Even if it's a "Pearl jam endorsed" doc made by one of their friends. I find it a lack of respect for him.

Even if they had their feuds and Matt Cameron is a "miracle" that made "the band so much better". yada yada.

This

+1

Hugh Freaking Dillon

I think for the band (or maybe just Ed, who knows) this is the equivalent of the media constantly asking Metallica about the Dave Mustaine days. A blip in their history, as it probably looks to them now.

Unfortunately, they don't do a very good job of hiding it their distaste (or whatever) for the man. I mean, in every book and cd they put out of the early years, they PROMINENTLY display all their old drummers, even the ones who were in the band for about a week.

I think it was almost a bigger dig in the movie for Ed to tell Cameron to ask Mike about the drummer situation, and they glossed over the whole thing in about 10 seconds. That was kind of juvenile in my eyes.

They should have had a clip of Dave eating waffles.

kiljoythemerciful

The idea that Dave A had an equal hand in their success is idiotic. He was a strong drummer, with a bit of flair and seemed like a decent fellow.

But there are probably a few thousand drummers who could of walked into his seat and the band still would of been huge. I suppose seeing that the movie is so heavily focused on the years he was the primary drummer we could of seen more of him. Seemed like all past drummers got the same treatment, so I don't really get the beef besides that there are a small group of people who feel he got slighted. He's one of the luckiest bastards on the planet. I think some people feel sorry for him or something, and that he needs redemption.

I would love to see people's reaction if they had re-recorded the drums on the Vs/Vitalogy reissue. That would of been hilarious and maybe something to get angry about.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

kiljoythemerciful wrote:

I would love to see people's reaction if they had re-recorded the drums on the Vs/Vitalogy reissue. That would of been hilarious and maybe something to get angry about.

didn't they do that for Lost Dogs?

kiljoythemerciful

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

kiljoythemerciful wrote:

I would love to see people's reaction if they had re-recorded the drums on the Vs/Vitalogy reissue. That would of been hilarious and maybe something to get angry about.

didn't they do that for Lost Dogs?

I don't think so. I thought they only re-recorded vocals on Alone and Mike added a new solo to Brother. I could be wrong though.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

kiljoythemerciful wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

kiljoythemerciful wrote:

I would love to see people's reaction if they had re-recorded the drums on the Vs/Vitalogy reissue. That would of been hilarious and maybe something to get angry about.

didn't they do that for Lost Dogs?

I don't think so. I thought they only re-recorded vocals on Alone and Mike added a new solo to Brother. I could be wrong though.

I remember someone in the media asking Ed if they re-recorded any of the songs for the release, and he said "yes, we did, I'll let you guess which ones". I took that as "we re-recorded Dave's songs so he wouldn't get any money". I know, that might have been a bit of a stretch, but that's how I took it at the time.

Shawshank

I guess thinking about this further...Boom has been with the band over twice as long as Dave and he got even less screen time...nearly zero.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

Shawshank wrote:

I guess thinking about this further...Boom has been with the band over twice as long as Dave and he got even less screen time...nearly zero.

he's never been in the band. huge difference.

GTFLYGIRL

Shawshank wrote:

I guess thinking about this further...Boom has been with the band over twice as long as Dave and he got even less screen time...nearly zero.

absolutely.

their movie. their stories. their take...

and cameron crowe's.....

that said... i love me some BOOOOOM!!!!!!!!

GTFLYGIRL

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

Shawshank wrote:

I guess thinking about this further...Boom has been with the band over twice as long as Dave and he got even less screen time...nearly zero.

he's never been in the band. huge difference.

nine years of boom vs. two and a half years of dave?

yeaaah... ok. agreed. huge difference.

Given this thought process... Yeaaah!! Boom has been way under represented in both the film AND the book..... BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hugh Freaking Dillon

GTFLYGIRL wrote:

nine years of boom vs. two and a half years of dave?

yeaaah... ok. agreed. huge difference.

Given this thought process... Yeaaah!! Boom has been way under represented in both the film AND the book..... BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

he's a touring keyboardist. HE'S NOT IN THE BAND, NEVER WAS. Dave wrote some PJ songs. you don't think there's a difference there?

longevity aside, I'm not saying he should have had a major part in the book, but the point is they give their other drummers who have been there shorter or the same amount of time in the band much more exposure. you can't argue that. it's right there in black and white. check the place/date book. check the 5X1 book. plain as dave.

dadagibberish1

I can't really speak on the book or the movie, I haven't checked out either yet. However, I kind of love the Foo Fighters documentary that came out this year because they took some time to discuss this issue. They talked about their original drummer and had an interview with him as well as their revolving door of guitarists. As a fan, it was nice to hear both sides on this topic.

Indifference09

dadagibberish1 wrote:

I can't really speak on the book or the movie, I haven't checked out either yet. However, I kind of love the Foo Fighters documentary that came out this year because they took some time to discuss this issue. They talked about their original drummer and had an interview with him as well as their revolving door of guitarists. As a fan, it was nice to hear both sides on this topic.

Too true, the movie was greatbut would have loved it to get a bit more behind the scenes. Like when they mention Ed travelling seperately to the band and the tension that caused. Then all of a sudden they changed the subject and moved on.

What happened, was their a confrontation, did it just work itself out?

JTH

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

he's a touring keyboardist. HE'S NOT IN THE BAND, NEVER WAS. Dave wrote some PJ songs. you don't think there's a difference there?

Well, Boom did co-write "Love Boat Captain" ...

But yeah, he didn't play on Backspacer and since the band is working with Brendan O'Brien on the new stuff, it's a good bet that he won't be on the next album, either.

DewieCox

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

I remember someone in the media asking Ed if they re-recorded any of the songs for the release, and he said "yes, we did, I'll let you guess which ones". I took that as "we re-recorded Dave's songs so he wouldn't get any money". I know, that might have been a bit of a stretch, but that's how I took it at the time.

I take that as, "if you can't tell the difference in my voice, why would I tell you."

dadagibberish1 wrote:

I can't really speak on the book or the movie, I haven't checked out either yet. However, I kind of love the Foo Fighters documentary that came out this year because they took some time to discuss this issue. They talked about their original drummer and had an interview with him as well as their revolving door of guitarists. As a fan, it was nice to hear both sides on this topic.

I really lost some respect for Grohl there with the way he handled the situations, and that's probably the sorta thing that PJ is trying to avoid, since their success is so contingent on the hardcore fans.

CJMST3K

DewieCox wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

I remember someone in the media asking Ed if they re-recorded any of the songs for the release, and he said "yes, we did, I'll let you guess which ones". I took that as "we re-recorded Dave's songs so he wouldn't get any money". I know, that might have been a bit of a stretch, but that's how I took it at the time.

I take that as, "if you can't tell the difference in my voice, why would I tell you."

dadagibberish1 wrote:

I can't really speak on the book or the movie, I haven't checked out either yet. However, I kind of love the Foo Fighters documentary that came out this year because they took some time to discuss this issue. They talked about their original drummer and had an interview with him as well as their revolving door of guitarists. As a fan, it was nice to hear both sides on this topic.

I really lost some respect for Grohl there with the way he handled the situations, and that's probably the sorta thing that PJ is trying to avoid, since their success is so contingent on the hardcore fans.

I agree with your first point. I think the re-recordings were not drum related.... but its been a while since I listened.

With Foo Fighters, I really liked how they allowed their earlier drummer to say his piece about things. I think Grohl being a drummer wanted to allow him a voice, since he did have a place in their history.

skanji32

Boom will be prominantly featured in the bluray with the extra scenes...