Man to be executed for "revenge killings" for 9/11 attacks

Blockhead

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Blockhead wrote:

Would you rather not exist or experience life in a prison?
Why does someone who does horrendous crimes (that your brain won't even allow you to imagine) be allowed to live a fairly comfortable life in prison with all the benefits (i.e food, shelter, cable tv, internet access, visitations, phone calls, letters, etc.). All the while my family member is long dead because of this *******. That isn't balance of nature.

i would appreciate you debating the topic instead of being so condescending and implying that my brain could not comprehend this horendous crime. personal attacks as a sign that you are losing the debate and losing your cool.

and back to your post.

who put you in charge of balancing nature? it is not your responsibility, nor is it your responsibility to decide who gets to appeal and who has to accept and have this sentence carried out. you are not the punisher.

and i would rather be dead if i could not live free, outside of prison walls. so to me life in prison would be a worse punishment than death.

the bottom line is this guy was no longer a threat to society and was not going to be raping anybody's mom from the minute he was arrested. he was incapacitated and not a danger to anyone else. yet texas killed him anyway. is spite of pleas from the REAL victim in this case.

this is nto the fucking dark ages where people would beg the king for mercy only to be executed to set an example of the king's power. we live in a society here.

God damn dude, can you not fucking comprehend anything. I used YOU as in people in general. It wasn't a personal attack... Its pretty sick that you can comprehend something that this guy did.
Its pathetic how badly you just insulted people who have been murdered. You would rather give up your only life on earth, over spending it in a cell where you can still read, sleep, feel, communicate with family/friends.

EdsonNascimento

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

The people of the US were no longer in danger from this man who was in jail and wasn't in the act of raping anyone's mom.

How does killing him now make us any better than him?

It doesn't. We are better than him because we did not walk up to 3 people doing their jobs and shoot them with the intent to kill.

It is part of the PENAL code, and has no bearing on whether we are better than someone or not. Texas has determined that it needs capital punishment as one of its penalties for certain crimes. The PENAL code does not determine if the populace is better than a single person. It determines does the penalty fit the crime.

I actually think some of the mandatory drug sentencing guidelines are more concering than this. We could argue when it's approrpriate to mete out death as a punishment all day long. But, this isn't a case where we are unsure of who did it or what the motive was. So, I can't see this being the poster case for anyone that is anti-DP.

Whether I support the DP in this person's case does not say if I'm better than him or not. I KNOW I'm better than him. Even if I supported the DP in this case (again, not saying I do - quite frankly haven't given it much thought b/c it's not a situation where there was any doubt about the situation), there is at least a rationale (which you are free to argue about) for killing him. There was absolutely no rationale in a civil society for what he did.

polaris_x

Blockhead wrote:

Dude you need to quit posting. I have asked several time to post your stats on where the US leads in Violent crime/murders. You have repeated this over and over without providing any actual facts. I KNOW that US does not lead in violent crime.
WHy do you keep saying it?

quit posting? ... i know i'm a bane to your global warming stuff but this is a bit extreme?

i posted this in another thread - and i didn't read where you asked for it ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... icide_rate

and i said developed countries not the world ... repeatedly ...

Blockhead

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if it is such a deterrant, why are there so many murders???

i guarantee some person is going to read about this case, read that the guy was killed by the state, and still go out and commit that premeditated murder because he thinks he will never be caught or that he will never be killed due to the 15 years it takes to carry out the sentence.

i think you don't go around punching everyone you don't like is not because of legal consequences. it might be because you are afraid you might punch the wrong person, a trained fighter such as myself, or you might be just a bit more sensible than some of your posts would suggest. either way it is a poor analogy to compare the dp deterring murder in the same way a simple battery charge deters people from punching people they don't like..

I don't go around punching people becuase every action I make, I think how it would effect my family.
haha I have to laught at your E-tough guy approach. I have stated in several threads what SEC school I played college football at, getting cut from NFL teams. I am a big guy. If thats you in your avatar I would laugh at someone your size. Trained fighter or not, you look like a bean pole. This is the internet, quit bragging.

gimmesometruth27

Blockhead wrote:

God damn dude, can you not fucking comprehend anything. I used YOU as in people in general. It wasn't a personal attack... Its pretty sick that you can comprehend something that this guy did.
Its pathetic how badly you just insulted people who have been murdered. You would rather give up your only life on earth, over spending it in a cell where you can still read, sleep, feel, communicate with family/friends.

are you going to address my post, other than the fact that i would rather die than live in prison? how the hell does that insult anyone.

i think most people would agree with me if posed this question.

"would you rather be killed, or would you rather live the rest of your life on 23 hour a day lockdown, in solitary confinement, where you will be able to read, exercise an hour a day, eat prison food, have no visitors, be unable to enjoy a beer and bar b que and watch a baseball game on a saturday afternoon, live under constant threat of violence, not just from other prisoners when/if you do get to interact with them, but from guards as well, get to shower twice a week, make no money and have nothing to buy with what little you have, and be cut off from your family, friends, and loved ones?"

the answer is a simple one for me...

keeponrockin

keeponrockin wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

And please answer one question: What do you have to say about any ONE person who has been innocently executed by the government?

I'd like to see the answer to this as well.

Blockhead?

Blockhead

JonnyPistachio wrote:

And please answer one question: What do you have to say about any ONE person who has been innocently executed by the government?

And please quit trying to put a label on me. This thread was about this case...
IN this case I support the Death Penalty. I have never said as a whole I support the Death Peanlty.
Quit assuming things because I disagree with you in THIS CASE.
This is a pretty clear cut case.

Blockhead

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Blockhead wrote:

God damn dude, can you not fucking comprehend anything. I used YOU as in people in general. It wasn't a personal attack... Its pretty sick that you can comprehend something that this guy did.
Its pathetic how badly you just insulted people who have been murdered. You would rather give up your only life on earth, over spending it in a cell where you can still read, sleep, feel, communicate with family/friends.

are you going to address my post, other than the fact that i would rather die than live in prison? how the hell does that insult anyone.

i think most people would agree with me if posed this question.

"would you rather be killed, or would you rather live the rest of your life on 23 hour a day lockdown, in solitary confinement, where you will be able to read, exercise an hour a day, eat prison food, have no visitors, be unable to enjoy a beer and bar b que and watch a baseball game on a saturday afternoon, live under constant threat of violence, not just from other prisoners when/if you do get to interact with them, but from guards as well, get to shower twice a week, make no money and have nothing to buy with what little you have, and be cut off from your family, friends, and loved ones?"

the answer is a simple one for me...

That was not my question. Life in prison is not solitary confinement. Quit backpedaling?

gimmesometruth27

Blockhead wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if it is such a deterrant, why are there so many murders???

i guarantee some person is going to read about this case, read that the guy was killed by the state, and still go out and commit that premeditated murder because he thinks he will never be caught or that he will never be killed due to the 15 years it takes to carry out the sentence.

i think you don't go around punching everyone you don't like is not because of legal consequences. it might be because you are afraid you might punch the wrong person, a trained fighter such as myself, or you might be just a bit more sensible than some of your posts would suggest. either way it is a poor analogy to compare the dp deterring murder in the same way a simple battery charge deters people from punching people they don't like..

I don't go around punching people becuase every action I make, I think how it would effect my family.
haha I have to laught at your E-tough guy approach. I have stated in several threads what SEC school I played college football at, getting cut from NFL teams. I am a big guy. If thats you in your avatar I would laugh at someone your size. Trained fighter or not, you look like a bean pole. This is the internet, quit bragging.

yeah ok.... you might think before you act, but you definitely don't think before you type...perhaps you don't go punching people because this is not kindergarten and we do not conduct ourselves like that in public...

three years ago i would have loved for you to punch me. i'm a big dude too, but i'm down 20 lbs from my fighting weight. size doesn't really matter as i have routinely beat guys who weighted 260 when i was weighing in around 230. i don't look like much, but it never kept me from winning fights. it is kind of like how people make the argument that "i don't go pulling my gun on people because i don't know if they have a gun or not". they think they are a hardass and pull it on someone and end up getting shot. fact is they don't go around pulling guns on people because they don't want to be a douche.

JonnyPistachio

Blockhead wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

And please answer one question: What do you have to say about any ONE person who has been innocently executed by the government?

And please quit trying to put a label on me. This thread was about this case...
IN this case I support the Death Penalty. I have never said as a whole I support the Death Peanlty.
Quit assuming things because I disagree with you in THIS CASE.
This is a pretty clear cut case.

Thats fine, we know you wont answer. Because you cant.

I agree though.. this specific case is a tough one.. the guy in this case was caught on video. Hes dead now though. I honestly would have a hard time controlling myself from beating him to a pulp if I had a chance, but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt. People who are murderers are not right in the head to begin with. its not good to stoop to their level.
btw, talk about backpedaling...Earlier you were talking DP in general, that's why I asked this general question, which apparently you will not even try to answer.

Blockhead

Go Beavers wrote:

Blockhead wrote:

polaris_x wrote:

the death penalty only serves the appetite for revenge ... nothing more ... sure, the perpetrator will not be able to kill anyone else but it does not act as a deterrent to would be murderers ... life in prison would in most situations accomplish the same thing ...

again - one has to ask themselves why in such a land of opportunities and freedoms does the US lead the developed countries in violent crime statistics by a landslide? ...

Again,
why do you keep posting this?

The death penalty doesn't deter crime and the homicide rate in the U.S. leads Western countries. That's probably why they keep posting this.

so all violent crime is considered homicide?
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_t ... al-victims

gimmesometruth27

Blockhead wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Blockhead wrote:

God damn dude, can you not fucking comprehend anything. I used YOU as in people in general. It wasn't a personal attack... Its pretty sick that you can comprehend something that this guy did.
Its pathetic how badly you just insulted people who have been murdered. You would rather give up your only life on earth, over spending it in a cell where you can still read, sleep, feel, communicate with family/friends.

are you going to address my post, other than the fact that i would rather die than live in prison? how the hell does that insult anyone.

i think most people would agree with me if posed this question.

"would you rather be killed, or would you rather live the rest of your life on 23 hour a day lockdown, in solitary confinement, where you will be able to read, exercise an hour a day, eat prison food, have no visitors, be unable to enjoy a beer and bar b que and watch a baseball game on a saturday afternoon, live under constant threat of violence, not just from other prisoners when/if you do get to interact with them, but from guards as well, get to shower twice a week, make no money and have nothing to buy with what little you have, and be cut off from your family, friends, and loved ones?"

the answer is a simple one for me...

That was not my question. Life in prison is not solitary confinement. Quit backpedaling?

i am not backpedaling.

in many cases life in prison is in solitary. it depends on the crime, the prison facility, and other factors such as mental health and prior record, and prior behavior in jail..

my former roommate was a guard at the supermax Tamms. all of those dudes were on life sentences and all of them were alone in their cells and most had no contact with other prisoners.

JonnyPistachio

The costs of administering capital punishment are prohibitive. Even in states where prosecutors infrequently seek the death penalty, the price of obtaining convictions and executions ranges from $2.5 million to $5 million per case (in current dollars), compared to less than $1 million for each killer sentenced to life without parole."

http://www.law.columbia.edu/law_school/ ... italpunish

also a great stat: Texas, Florida, and Louisiana are among the leaders nationwide in executions -- and lead the nation in murders per 100,000 people.

Yay! lets just keep on killing! :roll:

EdsonNascimento

JonnyPistachio wrote:

...but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt.

Are you religious? Zeus has nothing to do with this.

And if you believe in the Western God, then you also believe he does not determine who lives and who dies. Another specious argument. (Because if he did, wouldn't those 2 innocent people be alive regardless of what you think of their killer?)

(For the 50th time - not advocating DP. Just weeding out the points that I constantly hear in these discussions that are completely off base).

Blockhead

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Thats fine, we know you wont answer. Because you cant.

I agree though.. this specific case is a tough one.. the guy in this case was caught on video. Hes dead now though. I honestly would have a hard time controlling myself from beating him to a pulp if I had a chance, but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt. People who are murderers are not right in the head to begin with. its not good to stoop to their level.
btw, talk about backpedaling...Earlier you were talking DP in general, that's why I asked this general question, which apparently you will not even try to answer.

:roll: No innocent person should be put to death, but again we are talking about this CASE. There is no secret to who committed these murder.
Its not about not answering, its about taking things like this on a case by case basis.
I was talking about DP in gerneral as in the murder is a proven murder. Not some casey anthony case.
how did I not answer your question?

Blockhead

JonnyPistachio wrote:

The costs of administering capital punishment are prohibitive. Even in states where prosecutors infrequently seek the death penalty, the price of obtaining convictions and executions ranges from $2.5 million to $5 million per case (in current dollars), compared to less than $1 million for each killer sentenced to life without parole."

http://www.law.columbia.edu/law_school/ ... italpunish

also a great stat: Texas, Florida, and Louisiana are among the leaders nationwide in executions -- and lead the nation in murders per 100,000 people.

Yay! lets just keep on killing! :roll:

Where did you get that great stat? Those 3 states are not the top thee in murder rate...

JonnyPistachio

EdsonNascimento wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

...but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt.

Are you religious? Zeus has nothing to do with this.

And if you believe in the Western God, then you also believe he does not determine who lives and who dies. Another specious argument. (Because if he did, wouldn't those 2 innocent people be alive regardless of what you think of their killer?)

(For the 50th time - not advocating DP. Just weeding out the points that I constantly hear in these discussions that are completely off base).

No I am not religious. I was speaking figuratively. I don't think anyone should have the right to decide if someone should live or die.. especially focusing on the govt. Just substitute God for "ultimate deciding power of life and death"..and its not completely off base. my point is that the original act of murder is a choice made poorly by the perpetrator. The CHOICe our govt has to kill someone to me is barbaric, costly, ineffective, and flawed.

Blockhead

JonnyPistachio wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

...but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt.

Are you religious? Zeus has nothing to do with this.

And if you believe in the Western God, then you also believe he does not determine who lives and who dies. Another specious argument. (Because if he did, wouldn't those 2 innocent people be alive regardless of what you think of their killer?)

(For the 50th time - not advocating DP. Just weeding out the points that I constantly hear in these discussions that are completely off base).

No I am not religious. I was speaking figuratively. I don't think anyone should have the right to decide if someone should live or die.. especially focusing on the govt. Just substitute God for "ultimate deciding power of life and death"..and its not completely off base. my point is that the original act of murder is a choice made poorly by the perpetrator. The CHOICe our govt has to kill someone to me is barbaric, costly, ineffective, and flawed.

Do you view killing animals and eating them barbaric?

JonnyPistachio

Blockhead wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Thats fine, we know you wont answer. Because you cant.

I agree though.. this specific case is a tough one.. the guy in this case was caught on video. Hes dead now though. I honestly would have a hard time controlling myself from beating him to a pulp if I had a chance, but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt. People who are murderers are not right in the head to begin with. its not good to stoop to their level.
btw, talk about backpedaling...Earlier you were talking DP in general, that's why I asked this general question, which apparently you will not even try to answer.

:roll: No innocent person should be put to death, but again we are talking about this CASE. There is no secret to who committed these murder.
Its not about not answering, its about taking things like this on a case by case basis.
I was talking about DP in gerneral as in the murder is a proven murder. Not some casey anthony case.
how did I not answer your question?

You said several things that were generalities about the DP - separate from this case, so I asked the simple question referring to your stance on the DP in general. But then you backpedaled saying that we are only talking about this case. Which is it?

Blockhead

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Blockhead wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Thats fine, we know you wont answer. Because you cant.

I agree though.. this specific case is a tough one.. the guy in this case was caught on video. Hes dead now though. I honestly would have a hard time controlling myself from beating him to a pulp if I had a chance, but i'd prefer MY govt not play God. I don't play God, so why should the govt. People who are murderers are not right in the head to begin with. its not good to stoop to their level.
btw, talk about backpedaling...Earlier you were talking DP in general, that's why I asked this general question, which apparently you will not even try to answer.

:roll: No innocent person should be put to death, but again we are talking about this CASE. There is no secret to who committed these murder.
Its not about not answering, its about taking things like this on a case by case basis.
I was talking about DP in gerneral as in the murder is a proven murder. Not some casey anthony case.
how did I not answer your question?

You said several things that were generalities about the DP - separate from this case, so I asked the simple question referring to your stance on the DP in general. But then you backpedaled saying that we are only talking about this case. Which is it?

Is it that hard for you to understand. I am allowed to have my opinion on general regurgitated talking points that anit-dP people bring up and I disagree with them. That does not make me Pro-DP. My stance on DP is not a general one, its a case by case. Something like this case should end in DP, as I do not view this person have the right to live.