guns and bullets

MotoDC

Byrnzie wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

semantics...

i was saying guns were designed to kill... thats the same as saying invented... just as saucers were designed to hold cups.

So whats your stance on knives??? They were originall designed to kill, (small spear) Are you going to discredit knives because somepeople use them to kill and others to cut things and other secondary uses???

Knives were designed to kill animals and to cut food. Hunter gatherers used spears and knives as survival tools. And you cannot commit a massacre with a knife unless you're Zorro, or a ninja.

If I were a ninja, I'd sneak into your brain and make you less stubborn.

Byrnzie

MotoDC wrote:

If I were a ninja, I'd sneak into your brain and make you less stubborn.

Thanks. It would probably work out cheaper than a shrink. :thumbup:

Blockhead

dunkman wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

semantics...

i was saying guns were designed to kill... thats the same as saying invented... just as saucers were designed to hold cups.

So whats your stance on knives??? They were originall designed to kill, (small spear) Are you going to discredit knives because somepeople use them to kill and others to cut things and other secondary uses???

actually knives were designed to be multi-functional... kill animals for food, not humans... big difference... cut meat for eating, sharping wooden hunting tools, cleaning animal hides, etc etc ... but they were not PRIMARILY designed to kill another human.


the point is, as many others have made, that this nutjob killed 6 people using a gun in less than 1 minute... nobody and i mean nobody with a knife could do that... this guy http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/540387.stm had a Samurai sword in a busy church and he could only injure a lot of people... which is horrific really... but had he had access to a legally acquired handgun he would have killed many many people i'm sure.

Now you've changed you stance from "designed to kill" to "designed to kill humans". Knives were most certinly made to kill. Animals as well as they used them during battle with other tribes.

MotoDC

Byrnzie wrote:

MotoDC wrote:

If I were a ninja, I'd sneak into your brain and make you less stubborn.

Thanks. It would probably work out cheaper than a shrink. :thumbup:

Jason P

Byrnzie wrote:

Knives were designed to kill animals and to cut food. Hunter gatherers used spears and knives as survival tools. And you cannot commit a massacre with a knife unless you're Zorro, or a ninja.

It's rare, but China has experienced several cases of mentally unstable people entering schools and stabbing multiple people and children, correct?

Anyway, the best we can hope for is that there are new regulations and exams required for obtaining a handgun. They are not going away, but maybe we can make sure that people with mental conditions are weeded out.

Blockhead

dunkman wrote:

actually knives were designed to be multi-functional... kill animals for food, not humans... big difference... cut meat for eating, sharpening wooden hunting tools, cleaning animal hides, etc etc ... but they were not PRIMARILY designed to kill another human.


the point is, as many others have made, that this nutjob killed 6 people using a gun in less than 1 minute... nobody and i mean nobody with a knife could do that... this guy http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/540387.stm had a Samurai sword in a busy church and he could only injure a lot of people... which is horrific really... but had he had access to a legally acquired handgun he would have killed many many people i'm sure.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/1376982.stm

Byrnzie

Jason P wrote:

Byrnzie wrote:

Knives were designed to kill animals and to cut food. Hunter gatherers used spears and knives as survival tools. And you cannot commit a massacre with a knife unless you're Zorro, or a ninja.

It's rare, but China has experienced several cases of mentally unstable people entering schools and stabbing multiple people and children, correct?

Anyway, the best we can hope for is that there are new regulations and exams required for obtaining a handgun. They are not going away, but maybe we can make sure that people with mental conditions are weeded out.

O.k, fair point, but it will always be harder to kill multiple people with a knife than with a hand gun. In the case of these little children, it's obviously easier for a nutter to do more damage, but it wouldn't have been so easy to kill the same amount of adults. There's also the factor of the distance a gun puts between the killer and his victim, allowing him to kill at a distance. With a knife you're compelled to get into some degree of physical struggle with the victim/victims.

dunkman

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

actually knives were designed to be multi-functional... kill animals for food, not humans... big difference... cut meat for eating, sharpening wooden hunting tools, cleaning animal hides, etc etc ... but they were not PRIMARILY designed to kill another human.


the point is, as many others have made, that this nutjob killed 6 people using a gun in less than 1 minute... nobody and i mean nobody with a knife could do that... this guy http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/540387.stm had a Samurai sword in a busy church and he could only injure a lot of people... which is horrific really... but had he had access to a legally acquired handgun he would have killed many many people i'm sure.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/1376982.stm

i said kill 6 people in less than a minute... took this guy a while, only 2 died instantly... i dunno why cos he was only fighting 6 and 7 year old kids... the pussy... he should have used a gun? the american way huh? dumbass.

for every 1 story you can find like this .. from anywhere in the world.. i'll post you 5 stories of multiple gun shootings that only happened in the US.. how's that for a bet?

dunkman

another good reason why US teenagers like using guns instead of pipe bombs, chainsaws, etc as Pandora has suggest

Alex Robert Youshock, Two pipe bombs went off in a hallway of Hillsdale High School, in San Mateo, California, during the beginning of first period classes. Nobody was injured from the explosions. Alex Youshock, a 17-year-old former student of the school, was held by staff members until police arrived and was found with eight other pipe bombs, a two-foot-long sword, and a chainsaw concealed in a guitar case. Youshock was subsequently arrested and charged as an adult with eight felonies.

dunkman

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/0 ... cipal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

Blockhead

dunkman wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

actually knives were designed to be multi-functional... kill animals for food, not humans... big difference... cut meat for eating, sharpening wooden hunting tools, cleaning animal hides, etc etc ... but they were not PRIMARILY designed to kill another human.


the point is, as many others have made, that this nutjob killed 6 people using a gun in less than 1 minute... nobody and i mean nobody with a knife could do that... this guy http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/540387.stm had a Samurai sword in a busy church and he could only injure a lot of people... which is horrific really... but had he had access to a legally acquired handgun he would have killed many many people i'm sure.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/1376982.stm

i said kill 6 people in less than a minute... took this guy a while, only 2 died instantly... i dunno why cos he was only fighting 6 and 7 year old kids... the pussy... he should have used a gun? the american way huh? dumbass.

for every 1 story you can find like this .. from anywhere in the world.. i'll post you 5 stories of multiple gun shootings that only happened in the US.. how's that for a bet?

I am sure you could, but you have yet to make a sound arugement in anything. You bring up that the US is so crime ridden becaues we have guns, yet we have the same crime rate as UK. You bring up that guns do nothing but bad things, yet I have several times shown facts/stats on the ammount of crimes prevented by use of a gun. You bring up that guns were designed only to kill, I bring up knives and you keep reducing your arguement to reach your conclutions. The only thing you have said correctly is that guns kill faster. No one has disputed or argued that. You seem to really like to blame objects and the US, instead of the root cause. He killed people because he was nuts. I have agreed there needs to be a stricter regulation on who and how people get guns. But banning them completly will do nothing but affect the law abiders.

Blockhead

dunkman wrote:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/06/nebraska-school-shooting-vice-principal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

The problem with this is, You don't fucking know what he would do. You can't use that as an arguement or debate. You have some seriously bad debating skills.

Moonpig

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/06/nebraska-school-shooting-vice-principal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

The problem with this is, You don't fucking know what he would do. You can't use that as an arguement or debate. You have some seriously bad debating skills.

Well if all else fails I guess he can resort to callng people "pussy bitches" or "idiots" etc...

eMMI

dunkman wrote:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/06/nebraska-school-shooting-vice-principal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

One thing that stood out for me in that text: "Police Chief Alex Hayes said Butler apparently took the gun from a closet." A closet? His father, the police officer's, gun was in a closet?

Maybe this wouldn't have even happened if the weapon had been locked away and not so easily accessable. Of course, speculation is always just speculation. Guns should always be behind locks in the house, though, I think.

Blockhead

Moonpig wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/06/nebraska-school-shooting-vice-principal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

The problem with this is, You don't fucking know what he would do. You can't use that as an arguement or debate. You have some seriously bad debating skills.

Well if all else fails I guess he can resort to callng people "pussy bitches" or "idiots" etc...

I see you have nothing to add to the debate, why post, you out of arguements?

dunkman

HeidiJam wrote:

I am sure you could, but you have yet to make a sound arugement in anything. You bring up that the US is so crime ridden becaues we have guns, yet we have the same crime rate as UK. You bring up that guns do nothing but bad things, yet I have several times shown facts/stats on the ammount of crimes prevented by use of a gun. You bring up that guns were designed only to kill, I bring up knives and you keep reducing your arguement to reach your conclutions. The only thing you have said correctly is that guns kill faster. No one has disputed or argued that. You seem to really like to blame objects and the US, instead of the root cause. He killed people because he was nuts. I have agreed there needs to be a stricter regulation on who and how people get guns. But banning them completly will do nothing but affect the law abiders.

i have made many sound arguments.. you are just choosing to ignore them.

• I showed you the stats that shows the US death total caused by firearms is 16 times higher than that of the other 25 richest countries in the world combined

• you don't have the same crime rate as the UK... you have the same crime rate if you had a 4000% reduction in gun crime maybe... but otherwise you and us are on the same in regards to theft, rape, arson... but we have a much lower murder rate, gun-crime rate.

• guns were designed to kill. knives weren't. thats a historical fact... yet you seem intent on arguing it.

• he killed people because he was nuts and he had access to a fucking gun!! Now either easy access to a gun is the issue (which you say isnt the case) or you have a problem with mental people over there. (which can't be the case as mental people are everywhere) - The simple fact is that America has the same level of mental fuckers as every other country... its just that they can pick up a gun a shitload easier than most other countries... and yet you still say the gun isnt the problem, its the person... well do something about the fucking people then... make them sit tests, exams, bi-monthly mental assessments... do something!



stats showing the prevention of a crime by use of a gun are suppositions... for every one of those stats I'll show you a stat on accidental shootings...

Moonpig

HeidiJam wrote:

Moonpig wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/06/nebraska-school-shooting-vice-principal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

The problem with this is, You don't fucking know what he would do. You can't use that as an arguement or debate. You have some seriously bad debating skills.

Well if all else fails I guess he can resort to callng people "pussy bitches" or "idiots" etc...

I see you have nothing to add to the debate, why post, you out of arguements?

[/quote]

I tagged out when you admitted that the reason for more gun crime in the states was that there were more guns, seemed to back up the point I was trying to make. Imagine, it took you 2 days to reach just that conclusion, how long might it take for you to consider the next brain teaser - less guns, resulting from more stringent regulations, may mean _______ gun crime. I'll let you mull it over

dunkman

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/06/nebraska-school-shooting-vice-principal.html

this didnt even make a ripple?!?!??! guy gets sent home from school... posts on facebook... then using his dads gun he goes back to the school and kills 2 people.

if he had no gun i wonder what he would have done? probably have stewed for a couple of days and then moved on with his life.

The problem with this is, You don't fucking know what he would do. You can't use that as an arguement or debate. You have some seriously bad debating skills.

thats why i used a question mark and also added in the word of 'wonder'

you have some seriously bad reading comprehension skills.

dunkman

HeidiJam wrote:

dunkman wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

So whats your stance on knives??? They were originall designed to kill, (small spear) Are you going to discredit knives because somepeople use them to kill and others to cut things and other secondary uses???

actually knives were designed to be multi-functional... kill animals for food, not humans... big difference... cut meat for eating, sharping wooden hunting tools, cleaning animal hides, etc etc ... but they were not PRIMARILY designed to kill another human.


the point is, as many others have made, that this nutjob killed 6 people using a gun in less than 1 minute... nobody and i mean nobody with a knife could do that... this guy http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/540387.stm had a Samurai sword in a busy church and he could only injure a lot of people... which is horrific really... but had he had access to a legally acquired handgun he would have killed many many people i'm sure.

Now you've changed you stance from "designed to kill" to "designed to kill humans". Knives were most certinly made to kill. Animals as well as they used them during battle with other tribes.

i havent changed my stance... i've stated right from the start that guns were designed to kill humans..

dunkman

HeidiJam wrote:

THey fail to realize that there are messed up people out there and they will commit crimes no matter what is against the law, As i pointed out in the other thread the US is about even with the UK in crime... we have more gun crime, well because we have more guns.

although this quote of yours came from the other thread... its the last line that is sooooo telling