I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
I can tell you I don't. Some investment needs to be paid before dividends are paid to them.
Opportunity should be presented. Immigrants need to work. First generation immigrants need to accept (and be appreciative of) a modest lifestyle- hopefully paving the way for an easier time for the second and third generation.
I speak to the efforts of my Ukrainian grandparents that uprooted from Kiev and immigrated to Saskatchewan. They weren't afforded much outside of opportunity. They had it rough. But they provided a wonderful opportunity for their children and subsequent generations that I know Baba was proud of.
My ancestors are Irish and Lithuanian and did it the legal way. Sorry bud I am a rule follower, do it legally and play along the same rules as every other citizen of the country. Does Canada reward illegal citizens with college scholarships?
I never opposed your opinion. I supported it.
Canada does all kinds of ridiculous things. I'm not even going to investigate whether we do or not. I wouldn't be surprised. I'm taking loans to get my kids through university. I'm sure that someone who cannot obtain a loan would likely get money given to them.
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
I can tell you I don't. Some investment needs to be paid before dividends are paid to them.
Opportunity should be presented. Immigrants need to work. First generation immigrants need to accept (and be appreciative of) a modest lifestyle- hopefully paving the way for an easier time for the second and third generation.
I speak to the efforts of my Ukrainian grandparents that uprooted from Kiev and immigrated to Saskatchewan. They weren't afforded much outside of opportunity. They had it rough. But they provided a wonderful opportunity for their children and subsequent generations that I know Baba was proud of.
Fellow Uke!
No wonder I thought you were cool!
My father came to the country in the 30s. My real last name is Rosul, but he Americanized it to get a job. No one wanted to hire immigrants. All the crap about how Americans welcome legal immigrants is just that..crap. Bo first generations have been welcomed here.
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
I can tell you I don't. Some investment needs to be paid before dividends are paid to them.
Opportunity should be presented. Immigrants need to work. First generation immigrants need to accept (and be appreciative of) a modest lifestyle- hopefully paving the way for an easier time for the second and third generation.
I speak to the efforts of my Ukrainian grandparents that uprooted from Kiev and immigrated to Saskatchewan. They weren't afforded much outside of opportunity. They had it rough. But they provided a wonderful opportunity for their children and subsequent generations that I know Baba was proud of.
My ancestors are Irish and Lithuanian and did it the legal way. Sorry bud I am a rule follower, do it legally and play along the same rules as every other citizen of the country. Does Canada reward illegal citizens with college scholarships?
The question is whether your Irish and Slavic ancestors would have tried to enter the country illegally. Would they have stayed and starved during the potato famine? Remember we had "open borders" back then.
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
I can tell you I don't. Some investment needs to be paid before dividends are paid to them.
Opportunity should be presented. Immigrants need to work. First generation immigrants need to accept (and be appreciative of) a modest lifestyle- hopefully paving the way for an easier time for the second and third generation.
I speak to the efforts of my Ukrainian grandparents that uprooted from Kiev and immigrated to Saskatchewan. They weren't afforded much outside of opportunity. They had it rough. But they provided a wonderful opportunity for their children and subsequent generations that I know Baba was proud of.
My ancestors are Irish and Lithuanian and did it the legal way. Sorry bud I am a rule follower, do it legally and play along the same rules as every other citizen of the country. Does Canada reward illegal citizens with college scholarships?
The question is whether your Irish and Slavic ancestors would have tried to enter the country illegally. Would they have stayed and starved during the potato famine? Remember we had "open borders" back then.
Well they didn’t, all my ancestors passed through Ellis island and did everything legally.
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
Legal immigrants sure, illegal....no. Illegal is illegal so why are we awarding anything to illegal?
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
I can tell you I don't. Some investment needs to be paid before dividends are paid to them.
Opportunity should be presented. Immigrants need to work. First generation immigrants need to accept (and be appreciative of) a modest lifestyle- hopefully paving the way for an easier time for the second and third generation.
I speak to the efforts of my Ukrainian grandparents that uprooted from Kiev and immigrated to Saskatchewan. They weren't afforded much outside of opportunity. They had it rough. But they provided a wonderful opportunity for their children and subsequent generations that I know Baba was proud of.
My ancestors are Irish and Lithuanian and did it the legal way. Sorry bud I am a rule follower, do it legally and play along the same rules as every other citizen of the country. Does Canada reward illegal citizens with college scholarships?
The question is whether your Irish and Slavic ancestors would have tried to enter the country illegally. Would they have stayed and starved during the potato famine? Remember we had "open borders" back then.
Well they didn’t, all my ancestors passed through Ellis island and did everything legally.
Empathy is being able to understand another's plight. Your ancestors passed legally because the was no illegal. I'm surprised you never pondered it. I know if I was in central america, in the middle of poverty and civil war, I would take the chance to make a better life. Would you? Or would your "rule follower " instincts win the day?
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
I can tell you I don't. Some investment needs to be paid before dividends are paid to them.
Opportunity should be presented. Immigrants need to work. First generation immigrants need to accept (and be appreciative of) a modest lifestyle- hopefully paving the way for an easier time for the second and third generation.
I speak to the efforts of my Ukrainian grandparents that uprooted from Kiev and immigrated to Saskatchewan. They weren't afforded much outside of opportunity. They had it rough. But they provided a wonderful opportunity for their children and subsequent generations that I know Baba was proud of.
My ancestors are Irish and Lithuanian and did it the legal way. Sorry bud I am a rule follower, do it legally and play along the same rules as every other citizen of the country. Does Canada reward illegal citizens with college scholarships?
I never opposed your opinion. I supported it.
Canada does all kinds of ridiculous things. I'm not even going to investigate whether we do or not. I wouldn't be surprised. I'm taking loans to get my kids through university. I'm sure that someone who cannot obtain a loan would likely get money given to them.
Thank god. Imagine if your kid lost funding for College to someone who is in your country illegally??? Yeah not cool. Come to Canada legally. Come to the us legally. Illegal should not be rewarded.
Did any of you read the article that was posted? $27MM “cost” or “investment” for $200MM+ or there abouts for revenue from illegal or undocumented immigrants. How do you begin to break the cycle of poverty if you’re going to continue to demonize and punish children for the sins of their parent(s)? Pro life? Please.
Did any of you read the article that was posted? $27MM “cost” or “investment” for $200MM+ or there abouts for revenue from illegal or undocumented immigrants. How do you begin to break the cycle of poverty if you’re going to continue to demonize and punish children for the sins of their parent(s)? Pro life? Please.
So I love math. There are about 4,500,000 illegals/undocumented people in the state of New York.
The srticle says that they paid $155,000,000 in taxes.
Heres the good part.
So if you divide 4.5M into 155M you get?!?
$34 per person...
lets just say that the numbers are off and there are only 1 million people here in ny. Just for fun.
Did any of you read the article that was posted? $27MM “cost” or “investment” for $200MM+ or there abouts for revenue from illegal or undocumented immigrants. How do you begin to break the cycle of poverty if you’re going to continue to demonize and punish children for the sins of their parent(s)? Pro life? Please.
So I love math. There are about 4,500,000 illegals/undocumented people in the state of New York.
The srticle says that they paid $155,000,000 in taxes.
Heres the good part.
So if you divide 4.5M into 155M you get?!?
$34 per person...
lets just say that the numbers are off and there are only 1 million people here in ny. Just for fun.
So again divide 1M into 155M and you’ll get?!?
Anybody?!?
$155.00
I love math...
Yea but they’re not all eligible for the college education benefits and it’s more likely that they pay in and don’t collect the benefits. Further, multiple studies show that immigrants contribute more than they “take.” Simple math is just that, simple. It’s like believing immigration reform legislation is as easy as naming a post office.
Did any of you read the article that was posted? $27MM “cost” or “investment” for $200MM+ or there abouts for revenue from illegal or undocumented immigrants. How do you begin to break the cycle of poverty if you’re going to continue to demonize and punish children for the sins of their parent(s)? Pro life? Please.
So I love math. There are about 4,500,000 illegals/undocumented people in the state of New York.
The srticle says that they paid $155,000,000 in taxes.
Heres the good part.
So if you divide 4.5M into 155M you get?!?
$34 per person...
lets just say that the numbers are off and there are only 1 million people here in ny. Just for fun.
So again divide 1M into 155M and you’ll get?!?
Anybody?!?
$155.00
I love math...
And because all native born people under the age of 18 work and pay taxes? Do the taxes include sales taxes or just income taxes? Does it account for under the table cash payments that end up in the economy? C’mon man, you’re smarter than that.
And in Wilbur Ross’ parlance, it’s less than 1/100 of NY State’s GDP, a mere blip, that $27MM. But you know, the other. I suppose you’d also rather spend $100k per year per undocumented in legal and incarceration costs, for deportation and/or prison? Pro life, sure.
Did any of you read the article that was posted? $27MM “cost” or “investment” for $200MM+ or there abouts for revenue from illegal or undocumented immigrants. How do you begin to break the cycle of poverty if you’re going to continue to demonize and punish children for the sins of their parent(s)? Pro life? Please.
So I love math. There are about 4,500,000 illegals/undocumented people in the state of New York.
The srticle says that they paid $155,000,000 in taxes.
Heres the good part.
So if you divide 4.5M into 155M you get?!?
$34 per person...
lets just say that the numbers are off and there are only 1 million people here in ny. Just for fun.
So again divide 1M into 155M and you’ll get?!?
Anybody?!?
$155.00
I love math...
And because all native born people under the age of 18 work and pay taxes? Do the taxes include sales taxes or just income taxes? Does it account for under the table cash payments that end up in the economy? C’mon man, you’re smarter than that.
And in Wilbur Ross’ parlance, it’s less than 1/100 of NY State’s GDP, a mere blip, that $27MM. But you know, the other. I suppose you’d also rather spend $100k per year per undocumented in legal and incarceration costs, for deportation and/or prison? Pro life, sure.
OK I read the numbers wrong so here goes.. There are NOT 4,500,000 illegal undocumented in NY but 535,000.
So, 535,000 illegal undocumented people, lets say half of them work then so 267,500 people.
Divide that into $155,000,000 and you get $579 per person...
Look, i had this argument before when another article talked about "how much illegals bring in to the economy with taxes" and came up with about the same number.
You ask what taxes? I don't know, the person who writes these articles claiming that the amount they are paying in is good should tell us that. If I can draw a conclusion that they only pay so little then i'm sorry, stop writing articles that say that it is good amount going in to the economy.
Something else that isn't quantified is the amount of extra resources that are used in schools for the ESL kids, the amount of healthcare that is spent on them in care facilities, or how much money they send back to their countries that is never taxed nor spent here.
I'd like to see the money spent on incarceration and deportation spent more wisely and less on it though.
Here's another bad part about illegal immigration (and the need for immigration reform to get more people here legally). That's a lot of $ leaving the US economy and going to Mexico. Imagine if it were spent in the US?
Did any of you read the article that was posted? $27MM “cost” or “investment” for $200MM+ or there abouts for revenue from illegal or undocumented immigrants. How do you begin to break the cycle of poverty if you’re going to continue to demonize and punish children for the sins of their parent(s)? Pro life? Please.
So I love math. There are about 4,500,000 illegals/undocumented people in the state of New York.
The srticle says that they paid $155,000,000 in taxes.
Heres the good part.
So if you divide 4.5M into 155M you get?!?
$34 per person...
lets just say that the numbers are off and there are only 1 million people here in ny. Just for fun.
So again divide 1M into 155M and you’ll get?!?
Anybody?!?
$155.00
I love math...
And because all native born people under the age of 18 work and pay taxes? Do the taxes include sales taxes or just income taxes? Does it account for under the table cash payments that end up in the economy? C’mon man, you’re smarter than that.
And in Wilbur Ross’ parlance, it’s less than 1/100 of NY State’s GDP, a mere blip, that $27MM. But you know, the other. I suppose you’d also rather spend $100k per year per undocumented in legal and incarceration costs, for deportation and/or prison? Pro life, sure.
OK I read the numbers wrong so here goes.. There are NOT 4,500,000 illegal undocumented in NY but 535,000.
So, 535,000 illegal undocumented people, lets say half of them work then so 267,500 people.
Divide that into $155,000,000 and you get $579 per person...
Look, i had this argument before when another article talked about "how much illegals bring in to the economy with taxes" and came up with about the same number.
You ask what taxes? I don't know, the person who writes these articles claiming that the amount they are paying in is good should tell us that. If I can draw a conclusion that they only pay so little then i'm sorry, stop writing articles that say that it is good amount going in to the economy.
Something else that isn't quantified is the amount of extra resources that are used in schools for the ESL kids, the amount of healthcare that is spent on them in care facilities, or how much money they send back to their countries that is never taxed nor spent here.
I'd like to see the money spent on incarceration and deportation spent more wisely and less on it though.
You are missing the big one...housing. A few months back an article appeared in one of our national newspapers in Canada, wrote an article that stated in Toronto that the influx of Asylum seekers and illegal borders hoppers has made finding affordable housing much harder. Now mind you, I never considered any large city affordable...
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
Legal immigrants sure, illegal....no. Illegal is illegal so why are we awarding anything to illegal?
Agree. If we sytart handing out scholarships just because someone is an immigrant or illegal ,it would be hard to imagine that wouldn't just promote more illegal immigration. As for legal immigrants, they should be treated the same. Not given preference or excluded. I believe you need to be a resident for 2 years to qualify for in-state tuition. It only makes sense to apply that to everyone, not just citizens.
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
Legal immigrants sure, illegal....no. Illegal is illegal so why are we awarding anything to illegal?
Who's awarding anything?
It's a cost benefit analysis. Like offering rehab to a drug addict. Sure they may have done something illegal, but does punishment really fix the problem? Or is there a way to turn a bad situation into a good one?
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
Legal immigrants sure, illegal....no. Illegal is illegal so why are we awarding anything to illegal?
Agree. If we sytart handing out scholarships just because someone is an immigrant or illegal ,it would be hard to imagine that wouldn't just promote more illegal immigration. As for legal immigrants, they should be treated the same. Not given preference or excluded. I believe you need to be a resident for 2 years to qualify for in-state tuition. It only makes sense to apply that to everyone, not just citizens.
Exactly, illegal immigration should be discouraged, not rewarded. Come here, get your identification, start working and paying taxes, then you can reap the rewards of the tax funded programs.
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
Legal immigrants sure, illegal....no. Illegal is illegal so why are we awarding anything to illegal?
Who's awarding anything?
It's a cost benefit analysis. Like offering rehab to a drug addict. Sure they may have done something illegal, but does punishment really fix the problem? Or is there a way to turn a bad situation into a good one?
The problem is layered to me. Providing a service (non-humanitarian in this case) to someone who is an illegal immigrant is problematic. the reason is because they did not pay into the tax system that is supporting the service. By definition, an illegal immigrant cannot pay the full range of taxes. Food, shelter, medical services are different because I feel there's a moral obligation there. There isn't a moral obligation to provide college assistance to the same person.
I don't buy the argument for illegal immigrants of "but they put money back into the economy and pay sales tax on everything" argument. Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families. According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate. As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
I don't buy the argument for illegal immigrants of "but they put money back into the economy and pay sales tax on everything" argument. Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families. According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate. As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
I think people are getting smarter about colleges and universities.
The payoff isn't there anymore for most degree programs.
I don't buy the argument for illegal immigrants of "but they put money back into the economy and pay sales tax on everything" argument. Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families. According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate. As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
I think people are getting smarter about colleges and universities.
The payoff isn't there anymore for most degree programs.
Trades programs are a much greater investment.
Having huge college debts is usually related to making poor financial decisions in my opinion. I knew so many people that refused to work during college and took out the maximum amount of loan money they could to pay for living, eating, parting, etc. Get a job ya freakin losers, lol. Not to mention that the college that you go to and the degree program you choose are all CHOICES. There are plenty of ways to get through college debt free or with minimum debt. “But I want to be a doctor” is no excuse for taking out $100,000 in loans. No one to blame but yourself and your CHOICES. I agree, trade programs usually have way better payout. The people that I know that went to the community college for skills like welding or being airplane mechanics have ended up way better financially than the ones that went to expensive colleges.
I don't buy the argument for illegal immigrants of "but they put money back into the economy and pay sales tax on everything" argument. Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families. According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate. As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
Myth #1: Immigrants take more from the U.S. government than they contribute
Fact: Immigrants contribute more in tax revenue than they take in government benefits
First-generation immigrants cost the government more than native-born Americans, according to the report — about $1,600 per person annually. But second generation immigrants are “among the strongest fiscal and economic contributors in the U.S.,” the report found. They contribute about $1,700 per person per year. All other native-born Americans, including third generation immigrants, contribute $1,300 per year on average.
Fact: Immigrants workers often take jobs that boost other parts of the economy
Immigrants make up 17 percent of the U.S. labor force, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, but few experts believe they’re taking jobs from Americans, as Trump claims.
“Most economists agree that in spite of being a very big part of the labor force, immigrants have not come at the cost either of American jobs, nor of American wages,” Peri, the UC Davis professor, said.
A study from the bipartisan research organization New American Economy found immigrants were 15 percent more likely to work unusual hours than similar U.S.-born workers. They are also more likely to be employed in dangerous jobs, according to data from the American Community Survey and Bureau of Statistics.
Immigrants fill those roles in part because they are on average less educated than native-born Americans. About 26 percent have less than a high school degree, compared to 5 percent of native-born workers, according to the Urban Institute. But one in three immigrant workers have a college or advanced degree, a rate on par with Americans born here. Unauthorized immigrants tend to have slightly lower education levels; about 13 percent have college degrees.
Myth #3: The U.S. economy does not need immigrants
Fact: Immigrants are key to offsetting a falling birth rate
The U.S. birth rate is 1.8 births per woman, down from 3.65 in 1960, according to the World Bank. Demographers consider 2.1 births per woman as the rate needed to replace the existing population.
According to the Pew Research Center, if not for immigrants, the U.S. workforce would be shrinking. That would create a host of problems for the federal government.
Social Security, which is paid for by current workers, would be in even more serious budgetary trouble than it already is. Economic growth would also likely stagnate or even contract, as it has in Japan, a country where the population is shrinking and does not attract many immigrants.
Automation can buttress economic growth for a while, but investment in new technology only goes so far, said Betsey Stevenson, an associate professor of economics at the University of Michigan.
Plus, immigrants increase demand for goods and services, which further boosts economic growth, she added.
Myth #4: It would be better for the economy if immigrants’ children were not citizens
Fact: Children with citizenship are more productive workers
A Migration Policy Institute analysis estimates the number of unauthorized immigrants would increase from 11 million to 16 million by 2050 if birthright citizenship were repealed.
“Over the course of decades, you’d end up with a growing population that is cut off from the rest of society because they live in fear of deportation and they can’t get jobs,” said Randy Capps, the director of research for U.S. programs at the Migration Policy Institute.
Take, for example, the population of so-called “Dreamers” who were brought to the U.S. illegally as children. One study estimated the U.S. is losing out on $15 billion in economic potential from that group because they often face problems getting into college and getting a job.
An experiment in Germany, which does not have birthright citizenship, also showed that when children of immigrants were given citizenship at birth, those children experienced better health outcomes and had fewer children of their own.
I don't buy the argument for illegal immigrants of "but they put money back into the economy and pay sales tax on everything" argument. Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families. According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate. As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
Imagine what life would be like for those family members that didn't receive the $70 billion? Are you against making life better in other parts of the world so folks don't have to be so desperate to travel thousands of miles to escape poverty and violence? And unless they're buying cars, gas, groceries, utilities, cable, clothes, and everything else that the average person buys on the black market, then yes, they are paying taxes. And probably also into social security and fed and state taxes if they're working with a fake SS#, money they'll never get back in tax returns or retirement. Do you think all those folks in the back of the house restaurant chains are being paid in cash? And another myth, immigrants, on average, are more law abiding and commit less crimes than native born. Who's the burden?
I'm not sure how anyone could not be okay with ensuring that the youth in America get a good education so that they can contribute to the success of America later.
“good education”...so you want them to go to private schools? Lol, I kid, I kid!
“private schools”...so you want them to grow up to be little terrorists like Sandsmann and Kavanaugh? Lol, I kid, I kid!
Obviously kidding if you consider them “terrorists”.
Perhaps you’d prefer “culture warrior?” Lol!
Surely you can’t agree with giving money to illegal immigrants before actual citizens?
Sure why not? They spend it better, that's ROI.
And they probably need it more....
Giving it to citizens just perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Definitely better to give to immigrants.
Legal immigrants sure, illegal....no. Illegal is illegal so why are we awarding anything to illegal?
Who's awarding anything?
It's a cost benefit analysis. Like offering rehab to a drug addict. Sure they may have done something illegal, but does punishment really fix the problem? Or is there a way to turn a bad situation into a good one?
The problem is layered to me. Providing a service (non-humanitarian in this case) to someone who is an illegal immigrant is problematic. the reason is because they did not pay into the tax system that is supporting the service. By definition, an illegal immigrant cannot pay the full range of taxes. Food, shelter, medical services are different because I feel there's a moral obligation there. There isn't a moral obligation to provide college assistance to the same person.
There isn't? Why not?
Isn't it enough as a society to decide we want to spread knowledge and educate as many people as are willing?
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I don't buy the argument for illegal immigrants of "but they put money back into the economy and pay sales tax on everything" argument. Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families. According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate. As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
Imagine what life would be like for those family members that didn't receive the $70 billion? Are you against making life better in other parts of the world so folks don't have to be so desperate to travel thousands of miles to escape poverty and violence? And unless they're buying cars, gas, groceries, utilities, cable, clothes, and everything else that the average person buys on the black market, then yes, they are paying taxes. And probably also into social security and fed and state taxes if they're working with a fake SS#, money they'll never get back in tax returns or retirement. Do you think all those folks in the back of the house restaurant chains are being paid in cash? And another myth, immigrants, on average, are more law abiding and commit less crimes than native born. Who's the burden?
No I am not. I can't imagine what their life must be like to feel better off moving to another country and sending a large portion of what you make back home to the family that was unable to join you. It must be very difficult. I never disputed any of those myth/fact bullet points you listed, I never said they take more from the government than they give. But none of those points addresses the fact that $70 billion a year, and growing, is sent down south. That fact was strictly in response to the several comments I saw that stated "but they come here and work and that money goes back into the economy. It isn't costing our economy anything" Because a lot of it does not, and it does cost our economy $70 billion. All those other facts you pointed out can still be true, and they can still send $70 billion out of our economy every year. And I doubt a penny of that is taxed (at least not in this country). But yes, all the money they spend here will have sales tax. No one has denied that.
Comments
I never opposed your opinion. I supported it.
Canada does all kinds of ridiculous things. I'm not even going to investigate whether we do or not. I wouldn't be surprised. I'm taking loans to get my kids through university. I'm sure that someone who cannot obtain a loan would likely get money given to them.
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There are about 4,500,000 illegals/undocumented people in the state of New York.
The srticle says that they paid $155,000,000 in taxes.
Heres the good part.
So if you divide 4.5M into 155M you get?!?
$34 per person...
lets just say that the numbers are off and there are only 1 million people here in ny. Just for fun.
So again divide 1M into 155M and you’ll get?!?
Anybody?!?
$155.00
I love math...
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https://www.osc.state.ny.us/reports/immigration/immigration_2016.pdf
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So, 535,000 illegal undocumented people, lets say half of them work then so 267,500 people.
Divide that into $155,000,000 and you get $579 per person...
Look, i had this argument before when another article talked about "how much illegals bring in to the economy with taxes" and came up with about the same number.
You ask what taxes? I don't know, the person who writes these articles claiming that the amount they are paying in is good should tell us that. If I can draw a conclusion that they only pay so little then i'm sorry, stop writing articles that say that it is good amount going in to the economy.
Something else that isn't quantified is the amount of extra resources that are used in schools for the ESL kids, the amount of healthcare that is spent on them in care facilities, or how much money they send back to their countries that is never taxed nor spent here.
I'd like to see the money spent on incarceration and deportation spent more wisely and less on it though.
Here's another bad part about illegal immigration (and the need for immigration reform to get more people here legally). That's a lot of $ leaving the US economy and going to Mexico. Imagine if it were spent in the US?
As for legal immigrants, they should be treated the same. Not given preference or excluded. I believe you need to be a resident for 2 years to qualify for in-state tuition. It only makes sense to apply that to everyone, not just citizens.
It's a cost benefit analysis. Like offering rehab to a drug addict. Sure they may have done something illegal, but does punishment really fix the problem? Or is there a way to turn a bad situation into a good one?
Because many don't. I always thought it was common knowledge that many, even most immigrant workers send a large portion of their money back home to help their families.
According to NPR it was as much as $70 billion in just 2016.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/02/10/514172676/mexicans-in-the-u-s-are-sending-home-more-money-than-ever
So any argument that they are paying a fair share of taxes and putting money back into the economy just isn't true or accurate.
As others have said, I'm not against immigration. Just illegal immigration. And it also needs to be controlled. College is already competitive and expensive enough without expanding the pool. There's plenty of studies showing the impact that the stress has on getting into college has on kids. They take too many advanced/AP classes and spend too much time on school just to get a chance at getting in so they can accumulate 100k of debt in 4 years. Why make it more competitive and expensive?
The payoff isn't there anymore for most degree programs.
Trades programs are a much greater investment.
Myth #1: Immigrants take more from the U.S. government than they contribute
Fact: Immigrants contribute more in tax revenue than they take in government benefits
First-generation immigrants cost the government more than native-born Americans, according to the report — about $1,600 per person annually. But second generation immigrants are “among the strongest fiscal and economic contributors in the U.S.,” the report found. They contribute about $1,700 per person per year. All other native-born Americans, including third generation immigrants, contribute $1,300 per year on average.
Fact: Immigrants workers often take jobs that boost other parts of the economy
Immigrants make up 17 percent of the U.S. labor force, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, but few experts believe they’re taking jobs from Americans, as Trump claims.
“Most economists agree that in spite of being a very big part of the labor force, immigrants have not come at the cost either of American jobs, nor of American wages,” Peri, the UC Davis professor, said.
A study from the bipartisan research organization New American Economy found immigrants were 15 percent more likely to work unusual hours than similar U.S.-born workers. They are also more likely to be employed in dangerous jobs, according to data from the American Community Survey and Bureau of Statistics.
Immigrants fill those roles in part because they are on average less educated than native-born Americans. About 26 percent have less than a high school degree, compared to 5 percent of native-born workers, according to the Urban Institute. But one in three immigrant workers have a college or advanced degree, a rate on par with Americans born here. Unauthorized immigrants tend to have slightly lower education levels; about 13 percent have college degrees.
Myth #3: The U.S. economy does not need immigrants
Fact: Immigrants are key to offsetting a falling birth rate
The U.S. birth rate is 1.8 births per woman, down from 3.65 in 1960, according to the World Bank. Demographers consider 2.1 births per woman as the rate needed to replace the existing population.
According to the Pew Research Center, if not for immigrants, the U.S. workforce would be shrinking. That would create a host of problems for the federal government.
Social Security, which is paid for by current workers, would be in even more serious budgetary trouble than it already is. Economic growth would also likely stagnate or even contract, as it has in Japan, a country where the population is shrinking and does not attract many immigrants.
Automation can buttress economic growth for a while, but investment in new technology only goes so far, said Betsey Stevenson, an associate professor of economics at the University of Michigan.
Plus, immigrants increase demand for goods and services, which further boosts economic growth, she added.
Myth #4: It would be better for the economy if immigrants’ children were not citizens
Fact: Children with citizenship are more productive workers
A Migration Policy Institute analysis estimates the number of unauthorized immigrants would increase from 11 million to 16 million by 2050 if birthright citizenship were repealed.
“Over the course of decades, you’d end up with a growing population that is cut off from the rest of society because they live in fear of deportation and they can’t get jobs,” said Randy Capps, the director of research for U.S. programs at the Migration Policy Institute.
Take, for example, the population of so-called “Dreamers” who were brought to the U.S. illegally as children. One study estimated the U.S. is losing out on $15 billion in economic potential from that group because they often face problems getting into college and getting a job.
An experiment in Germany, which does not have birthright citizenship, also showed that when children of immigrants were given citizenship at birth, those children experienced better health outcomes and had fewer children of their own.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/making-sense/4-myths-about-how-immigrants-affect-the-u-s-economy
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Imagine what life would be like for those family members that didn't receive the $70 billion? Are you against making life better in other parts of the world so folks don't have to be so desperate to travel thousands of miles to escape poverty and violence? And unless they're buying cars, gas, groceries, utilities, cable, clothes, and everything else that the average person buys on the black market, then yes, they are paying taxes. And probably also into social security and fed and state taxes if they're working with a fake SS#, money they'll never get back in tax returns or retirement. Do you think all those folks in the back of the house restaurant chains are being paid in cash? And another myth, immigrants, on average, are more law abiding and commit less crimes than native born. Who's the burden?
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Isn't it enough as a society to decide we want to spread knowledge and educate as many people as are willing?
I never disputed any of those myth/fact bullet points you listed, I never said they take more from the government than they give. But none of those points addresses the fact that $70 billion a year, and growing, is sent down south.
That fact was strictly in response to the several comments I saw that stated "but they come here and work and that money goes back into the economy. It isn't costing our economy anything" Because a lot of it does not, and it does cost our economy $70 billion. All those other facts you pointed out can still be true, and they can still send $70 billion out of our economy every year. And I doubt a penny of that is taxed (at least not in this country). But yes, all the money they spend here will have sales tax. No one has denied that.