Brian is worth my life! I really love Brian from Family Guy, after I saved him we'd go have martini's
Seriously, I have been thinking about the woman who lost her life and the love she carried in her heart for her best friend. That's the key, some of us consider our relationships with our pets to be like best friends even better. "I'd rather be with an animal" is pretty much been my motto for my life.
I also thought about this woman's parents. I think a person who loves animals like this probably learned to value them from their parents as a child. So her parents would probably do the same, risk their lives also and although they are grieving they get it.
I have no doubt in my mind my children would risk their lives to save their dogs. My daughter would probably do that for an animal she didn't even know! I would understand her heart and be proud of the depth of care she has for another living thing. And I would miss her terribly but I would never say she was foolish to care so deeply.
My son would know exactly what he was doing but he would go in and get Bonnie the Bulldog because she is his responsibility and she needs him. She is an elderly rescue Bulldog who has given my son purpose in his life. They need each other.
So my point is no one should judge this woman's actions and call her foolish because she valued the life of someone, yes someone, to her, her dog was someone, someone she loved dearly. This judging comes from not understanding another's heart and what is of value in their lives.
unfortunately I will judge her... I, and many thousands of firefighters will agree, find her actions to be 'foolish'. She not only risked her own life but she was also endangering the lives of others who would then have tried to rescue her. For a dog? What about the pet ant? does it not receive the same level of care from you guys who find her actions to be valiant? Should she have rescued a pet ant?
Respectfully your pet ant thing is a bit unrealistic. As far as firefighters this is their job, to save people from fires and that includes someone who goes in to rescue a loved one, which of course they never suggest doing. This being a dog, a child, a parent, whomever. Firefighter do not want people going into burning buildings period.
The fact that you do not understand in your heart the value this friend had in this woman's life is something no one can change for you. You would have to feel it. Some people understand love like this some do not. Others shouldn't judge you because you can not understand this love and you should not judge others for feeling it.
Exactly my point... firefighters and all advice is to not try and rescue anything from a fire... so for those of you saying you would then you are 'foolish'... you are going against the advice of experts and that is foolish... no amount of talking about the love in your heart is going to change the basic definition of the word 'foolish' for me, or for anyone actually.
and i don't understand anything in my heart as its primarily an organ for moving blood around... my brain does understand it though and my brain tells me that a dog is not worth the loss of a human life*
* unless it's Mick Hucknall
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
i just woke up so my head is a bit cloudy...
but here goes...
walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames is not a good idea at all. walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames requires training and the wearing of a firefighters outfit. between the flames and the thick smoke spewing out of a structure a person has zero chance of surviving unless they are wearing the protective gear of a firefighter. to me it's very serious and i would not ever walk into a structure that is ragging in flames and smoke unless i had a firefighters outfit on and had a bit of training.
this goes for trying to save a dog, a cat, a bird, a horse, or even another human being.
to me all life is equal.
i am no better than a tree or blade of grass but i'll be damned if i walk into a serious fire to save another life without putting more of a successful percentage of survival in my corner.
i just woke up so my head is a bit cloudy...
but here goes...
walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames is not a good idea at all. walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames requires training and the wearing of a firefighters outfit. between the flames and the thick smoke spewing out of a structure a person has zero chance of surviving unless they are wearing the protective gear of a firefighter. to me it's very serious and i would not ever walk into a structure that is ragging in flames and smoke unless i had a firefighters outfit on and had a bit of training.
this goes for trying to save a dog, a cat, a bird, a horse, or even another human being.
to me all life is equal.
i am no better than a tree or blade of grass but i'll be damned if i walk into a serious fire to save another life without putting more of a successful percentage of survival in my corner.
Agreed... well, except the part about horses. For the last week or so I've felt like punching horses and for good reason (long story).
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As far as firefighters this is their job, to save people from fires and that includes someone who goes in to rescue a loved one, which of course they never suggest doing. This being a dog, a child, a parent, whomever. Firefighter do not want people going into burning buildings period.
The fact that you do not understand in your heart the value this friend had in this woman's life is something no one can change for you. You would have to feel it. Some people understand love like this some do not. Others shouldn't judge you because you can not understand this love and you should not judge others for feeling it.
i just woke up so my head is a bit cloudy...
but here goes...
walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames is not a good idea at all. walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames requires training and the wearing of a firefighters outfit. between the flames and the thick smoke spewing out of a structure a person has zero chance of surviving unless they are wearing the protective gear of a firefighter. to me it's very serious and i would not ever walk into a structure that is ragging in flames and smoke unless i had a firefighters outfit on and had a bit of training.
this goes for trying to save a dog, a cat, a bird, a horse, or even another human being.
to me all life is equal.
i am no better than a tree or blade of grass but i'll be damned if i walk into a serious fire to save another life without putting more of a successful percentage of survival in my corner.
i wonder how many people would be calling this woman foolish or judging her actions so harshly if she went back in to save her child. i do agree, overall...it IS foolish, to try and save ANYone in such a situation.....and yet, i still imagine there would be many who would take such a risk to try and save one they love, human or otherwise. so it really IS a question of valuing, and loving, another being, no matter the species....and feeling it worth the risk to your own life to try and save another.
my heart goes out to her family.
i also hope someone takes in and loves and cares for this dog, who evidently was so beloved that this woman risked, and lost, her life in an effort to save it.
i wonder how many people would be calling this woman foolish or judging her actions so harshly if she went back in to save her child.
if it was HER child then that childs life is more important than a dogs... end of story. this is due to the fact that she gave birth to the fucking thing and kinda help make it ... as opposed to a dog which she probably picked up from a friend for free because it spent 11 hours trying to eat its own tail.
big difference.
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
As far as firefighters this is their job, to save people from fires and that includes someone who goes in to rescue a loved one, which of course they never suggest doing. This being a dog, a child, a parent, whomever. Firefighter do not want people going into burning buildings period.
The fact that you do not understand in your heart the value this friend had in this woman's life is something no one can change for you. You would have to feel it. Some people understand love like this some do not. Others shouldn't judge you because you can not understand this love and you should not judge others for feeling it.
exactly.
it's only 'exactly' in your own opinion... don't pass it off as 'fact'
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
As far as firefighters this is their job, to save people from fires
It is their job, but they are already putting their lives at risk in a 'normal' fire without having to further risk their lives running behind someone who was 'foolish' enough to run into a burning house for an animal. How good would the family have felt if, not only this lady would have lost her life, but because of her actions, another person is dead (albeit doing his job) - a death that could have been avoided.
I'm not heartless, I have 5 cats (and a mouse and numerous fish). My gut instinct/emotions would also be to go in for the animals (except the fish) as I would know they would be frightened and could die a horrible death. My 'reasoning' side would tell me otherwise. I would probably be gutted and wouldn't be able to forgive myself, but my daugher would still have a mother and my husband a wife. This lady's death is tragic but it's still a death that could have been avoided. Luckily, her actions did not cause injury or death to a firefighter (even if it's their job).
D2D was wondering if it would be the same if one were to try and rescue a child. Guess we wouldn't think it was as 'foolish', especially for a child. As much as I value all life (except cockroaches), way down deep, human life is on the top of the pecking order.
i wonder how many people would be calling this woman foolish or judging her actions so harshly if she went back in to save her child.
if it was HER child then that childs life is more important than a dogs... end of story. this is due to the fact that she gave birth to the fucking thing and kinda help make it ... as opposed to a dog which she probably picked up from a friend for free because it spent 11 hours trying to eat its own tail.
big difference.
to YOU.
and i am sure to the majority of people.
still, not fact for all.
and i have never pushed my opinion as a fact, saying 'exactly' is akin to 'agreed' imo here. but if you want to get tied down in the semantics of the comment, go ahead ....i'll just stick to the topic. and on that ALL of it is opinion.
and redrock...i DO agree with you overall. i have NO idea what i would do honestly.
i also have to say, yes, most people value human life above all else....but again, not everyone does. there's no right or wrong there, it's just different values. i think someone said as much earlier, and i full agree.
there's no right or wrong there, it's just different values. .
As long as you don't put others in danger with your actions. Which, in circumstances such as this one, could be a reality. If you value your pet's life above/on the same par as yours, that is fine and a personal choice but you cannot put that same value on a firefighter's life - he has no say in the matter as he has to do his job. Just like some thrill seekers that come up with such dangerous stunts (but fun!). It's their choice and, if something goes wrong, it's a bit unfair expecting someone else to risk their lives to help them.
My heart goes out to his lady's family and I hope they share the same values as she does. If not it will be so much more difficult for them.
Until there comes a time to make a difference. Burning house - a 10 year old girl and your 15 year old dog. Both in different rooms, cannot get out on their own - only one can be saved. I'll bet anything the life of a human being will prevail over the life of an animal. Whatever people want to say.
there's no right or wrong there, it's just different values. .
As long as you don't put others in danger with your actions. Which, in circumstances such as this one, could be a reality. If you value your pet's life above/on the same par as yours, that is fine and a personal choice but you cannot put that same value on a firefighter's life - he has no say in the matter as he has to do his job. Just like some thrill seekers that come up with such dangerous stunts (but fun!). It's their choice and, if something goes wrong, it's a bit unfair expecting someone else to risk their lives to help them.
My heart goes out to his lady's family and I hope they share the same values as she does. If not it will be so much more difficult for them.
100% agreement there.
however, i think that's a big part of it....child, dog, cat, elderly parent, whomever.......if you are in the situation, have to make the choice to risk yourself going in to try and save ANYone....you could well put a firefighter's life in jeopardy - and i agree, one really should NOT do that, but people do. that is why i totally agree it is a foolish thing to do - my only point was, i don't think half as many people would even be debating this woman's actions to such a degree except for the fact that she went for her dog and not another human being. obviously, for some they would never make such a choice, but others would, and to dismiss her feelings for this other creature, imo, is just rude and disrespectful. that was all.
*also, perhaps the fact that she did NOT have a husband, or children...perhaps this dog was her main life companion, and thus while she certainly would leave behind her extended family and friends.....in her day to day life, her dog was her greatest love so to speak? and sure, there may be people who might think that sad, idk, and i didn't know her or her situation....but i think the fact that she didn't have to think about leaving a child motherless or a husband a widow, could well play a part. and let's face it, MANY people simply DON'T think in such situations, they just react....rightly or wrongly.
Until there comes a time to make a difference. Burning house - a 10 year old girl and your 15 year old dog. Both in different rooms, cannot get out on their own - only one can be saved. I'll bet anything the life of a human being will prevail over the life of an animal. Whatever people want to say.
good point.
i still stand on what i said earlier.
i am not going into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames.
it is not a good idea and i am no fireman with a firefighter's outfit @ my disposal.
for me, in your scenario, both lives are not going to make it unless i have a firefighters suit on or the structure is not full blown out of control in a ragging inferno.
This is the funny thing about a debate like this, I can't change your mind and no one will change my heart
I know there are many here that get my point and I see the other side. It does come down to a persons values and what their heart tells them to do. Dunkman said he didn't have a heart though, well not like the one I speak of, but I know he certainly does.
For me my heart is also my conscience. As I said in my original post, I would hope to be so brave as to save my dogs because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't try. They are my bestest buddies which obviously some people can not understand. I raised my children like this, my husband believes as I do,maybe even more so, one if the things I love him so for. I know they would understand if I left this world like this.
Anyways this lady will remain a hero to me, may her soul rest now with God and may she be forever blessed with this kind of love. The kind of love that makes life worth living and dying for.
This is the funny thing about a debate like this, I can't change your mind and no one will change my heart
I know there are many here that get my point and I see the other side. It does come down to a persons values and what their heart tells them to do. Dunkman said he didn't have a heart though, well not like the one I speak of, but I know he certainly does.
For me my heart is also my conscience. As I said in my original post, I would hope to be so brave as to save my dogs because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't try. They are my bestest buddies which obviously some people can not understand. I raised my children like this, my husband believes as I do,maybe even more so, one if the things I love him so for. I know they would understand if I left this world like this.
Anyways this lady will remain a hero to me, may her soul rest now with God and may she be forever blessed with this kind of love. The kind of love that makes life worth living and dying for.
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
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People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
i really seriously doubt that people on here would walk head first into a ragging inferno to save a life, rather it be a human or a dog.
This is the funny thing about a debate like this, I can't change your mind and no one will change my heart
I know there are many here that get my point and I see the other side. It does come down to a persons values and what their heart tells them to do. Dunkman said he didn't have a heart though, well not like the one I speak of, but I know he certainly does.
For me my heart is also my conscience. As I said in my original post, I would hope to be so brave as to save my dogs because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't try. They are my bestest buddies which obviously some people can not understand. I raised my children like this, my husband believes as I do,maybe even more so, one if the things I love him so for. I know they would understand if I left this world like this.
Anyways this lady will remain a hero to me, may her soul rest now with God and may she be forever blessed with this kind of love. The kind of love that makes life worth living and dying for.
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
I agree with your thoughts, none of us know how we would react. I know I'm not real good in emergencies, I've found that out already.
This is the funny thing about a debate like this, I can't change your mind and no one will change my heart
I know there are many here that get my point and I see the other side. It does come down to a persons values and what their heart tells them to do. Dunkman said he didn't have a heart though, well not like the one I speak of, but I know he certainly does.
For me my heart is also my conscience. As I said in my original post, I would hope to be so brave as to save my dogs because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't try. They are my bestest buddies which obviously some people can not understand. I raised my children like this, my husband believes as I do,maybe even more so, one if the things I love him so for. I know they would understand if I left this world like this.
Anyways this lady will remain a hero to me, may her soul rest now with God and may she be forever blessed with this kind of love. The kind of love that makes life worth living and dying for.
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
I agree with your thoughts, none of us know how we would react. I know I'm not real good in emergencies, I've found that out already.
It's funny because I normally have a cagey nervous energy thing going, but in tight situations, I am calm as a stone.
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People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
i really seriously doubt that people on here would walk head first into a ragging inferno to save a life, rather it be a human or a dog.
in fact i would bet my life on it.
You would lose that bet my friend.
When I was 16 we lived in a huge apartment complex. it was Dec. 23, my sister and I were out christmas shopping. we couldnt get down the street to our apt. so went around another way and pulled into a church parking lot behind the complex. I saw fire shooting out of the top floor windows and top of the building.
My sister claims I jumped out of the car as she sped up the hill and never broke stride and ran towards evreyone looking for my Mom. A friend said that she had gone back into the building to get some old lady out and they didn't see her come out. I went running to the building and was 2 steps away from the door when my mom grabbed me. she had come out the other side of the building and was standing up front of the crowd with the old lady.
my point is, I've been there. I didn't think twice about going in after my mother, nor did she think twice about going in after the old lady. and before anyone says that we put fire fighter life at risk, not really. they were not even fucking there yet. Had my mother waited there is no doubt the old lady would have died.
Peace, Love.
"To question your government is not unpatriotic --
to not question your government is unpatriotic."
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This is the funny thing about a debate like this, I can't change your mind and no one will change my heart
I know there are many here that get my point and I see the other side. It does come down to a persons values and what their heart tells them to do. Dunkman said he didn't have a heart though, well not like the one I speak of, but I know he certainly does.
For me my heart is also my conscience. As I said in my original post, I would hope to be so brave as to save my dogs because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't try. They are my bestest buddies which obviously some people can not understand. I raised my children like this, my husband believes as I do,maybe even more so, one if the things I love him so for. I know they would understand if I left this world like this.
Anyways this lady will remain a hero to me, may her soul rest now with God and may she be forever blessed with this kind of love. The kind of love that makes life worth living and dying for.
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
Exactly. The part of our brain that kicks in and starts functioning in a panic situation is a totally different part than the portion that manages logical thought. It all becomes about fight/flight/freeze and instinct takes over. I always think that if someone breaks into my house I'm gonna kick some ass. But usually when I hear a noise when I'm alone at night the first thing I do is freeze. Then calm sets in...which is weird because I'm usually a bit of a high strung mess So you don't know. We all know what we think we would do...but once adrenalin takes hold it's all about instinct and how you're hardwired.
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
i really seriously doubt that people on here would walk head first into a ragging inferno to save a life, rather it be a human or a dog.
in fact i would bet my life on it.
You would lose that bet my friend.
When I was 16 we lived in a huge apartment complex. it was Dec. 23, my sister and I were out christmas shopping. we couldnt get down the street to our apt. so went around another way and pulled into a church parking lot behind the complex. I saw fire shooting out of the top floor windows and top of the building.
My sister claims I jumped out of the car as she sped up the hill and never broke stride and ran towards evreyone looking for my Mom. A friend said that she had gone back into the building to get some old lady out and they didn't see her come out. I went running to the building and was 2 steps away from the door when my mom grabbed me. she had come out the other side of the building and was standing up front of the crowd with the old lady.
my point is, I've been there. I didn't think twice about going in after my mother, nor did she think twice about going in after the old lady. and before anyone says that we put fire fighter life at risk, not really. they were not even fucking there yet. Had my mother waited there is no doubt the old lady would have died.
There are heros out there that will risk their life to save another, more than we know. I admire your bravery and your heart.
I can just picture my wake/funeral, after I died saving my dogs life...
As I lay in the coffin, there is no doubt someone in my family, or one of my friends would bring my dog into the wake. As I lay in my coffin, and family members are grieving, the good preacher would start to say a few kind words.....
As this was going on my dog would be there doing one of 2 things...or both.....
1. He would be licking his balls....
2. After licking his balls, he would start humping my girlfriends leg.
And the reason he didn't pee on your coffin was because somebody left their "mark" already .
As for the woman who died, it was a fatal mistake. I'm sorry but no animal is worth the price of "your" life or mine. I have been at a fire when a woman was screaming "My baby, my baby". Only to find out she was talking about her dog. We had to rescue the firefighter out of the window. :?
So, What you Giving ?........ (Thanks Speedy, Alesek, & Arq+friends)
What You Giving
I suggest you step out on your Porch.
Run away my son. See it all. Oh, See the World!
When I was 16 we lived in a huge apartment complex. it was Dec. 23, my sister and I were out christmas shopping. we couldnt get down the street to our apt. so went around another way and pulled into a church parking lot behind the complex. I saw fire shooting out of the top floor windows and top of the building.
My sister claims I jumped out of the car as she sped up the hill and never broke stride and ran towards evreyone looking for my Mom. A friend said that she had gone back into the building to get some old lady out and they didn't see her come out. I went running to the building and was 2 steps away from the door when my mom grabbed me. she had come out the other side of the building and was standing up front of the crowd with the old lady.
my point is, I've been there. I didn't think twice about going in after my mother, nor did she think twice about going in after the old lady. and before anyone says that we put fire fighter life at risk, not really. they were not even fucking there yet. Had my mother waited there is no doubt the old lady would have died.
that is amazing on you and your mother.
i stand corrected.
(shakes your hand through the internet)
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
i really seriously doubt that people on here would walk head first into a ragging inferno to save a life, rather it be a human or a dog.
in fact i would bet my life on it.
id do it for my child and my granddaughter. without hesitation.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Comments
The fact that you do not understand in your heart the value this friend had in this woman's life is something no one can change for you. You would have to feel it. Some people understand love like this some do not. Others shouldn't judge you because you can not understand this love and you should not judge others for feeling it.
Exactly my point... firefighters and all advice is to not try and rescue anything from a fire... so for those of you saying you would then you are 'foolish'... you are going against the advice of experts and that is foolish... no amount of talking about the love in your heart is going to change the basic definition of the word 'foolish' for me, or for anyone actually.
and i don't understand anything in my heart as its primarily an organ for moving blood around... my brain does understand it though and my brain tells me that a dog is not worth the loss of a human life*
* unless it's Mick Hucknall
I see what you mean
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RY8YeLEr ... re=related
:P
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A protuberance of flesh above the waistband of a tight pair of trousers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HJTG6RRN4E
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Wish you were here...
♥~RIP Dad
but here goes...
walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames is not a good idea at all. walking into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames requires training and the wearing of a firefighters outfit. between the flames and the thick smoke spewing out of a structure a person has zero chance of surviving unless they are wearing the protective gear of a firefighter. to me it's very serious and i would not ever walk into a structure that is ragging in flames and smoke unless i had a firefighters outfit on and had a bit of training.
this goes for trying to save a dog, a cat, a bird, a horse, or even another human being.
to me all life is equal.
i am no better than a tree or blade of grass but i'll be damned if i walk into a serious fire to save another life without putting more of a successful percentage of survival in my corner.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Agreed... well, except the part about horses. For the last week or so I've felt like punching horses and for good reason (long story).
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exactly.
i wonder how many people would be calling this woman foolish or judging her actions so harshly if she went back in to save her child. i do agree, overall...it IS foolish, to try and save ANYone in such a situation.....and yet, i still imagine there would be many who would take such a risk to try and save one they love, human or otherwise. so it really IS a question of valuing, and loving, another being, no matter the species....and feeling it worth the risk to your own life to try and save another.
my heart goes out to her family.
i also hope someone takes in and loves and cares for this dog, who evidently was so beloved that this woman risked, and lost, her life in an effort to save it.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
if it was HER child then that childs life is more important than a dogs... end of story. this is due to the fact that she gave birth to the fucking thing and kinda help make it ... as opposed to a dog which she probably picked up from a friend for free because it spent 11 hours trying to eat its own tail.
big difference.
it's only 'exactly' in your own opinion... don't pass it off as 'fact'
It is their job, but they are already putting their lives at risk in a 'normal' fire without having to further risk their lives running behind someone who was 'foolish' enough to run into a burning house for an animal. How good would the family have felt if, not only this lady would have lost her life, but because of her actions, another person is dead (albeit doing his job) - a death that could have been avoided.
I'm not heartless, I have 5 cats (and a mouse and numerous fish). My gut instinct/emotions would also be to go in for the animals (except the fish) as I would know they would be frightened and could die a horrible death. My 'reasoning' side would tell me otherwise. I would probably be gutted and wouldn't be able to forgive myself, but my daugher would still have a mother and my husband a wife. This lady's death is tragic but it's still a death that could have been avoided. Luckily, her actions did not cause injury or death to a firefighter (even if it's their job).
D2D was wondering if it would be the same if one were to try and rescue a child. Guess we wouldn't think it was as 'foolish', especially for a child. As much as I value all life (except cockroaches), way down deep, human life is on the top of the pecking order.
to YOU.
and i am sure to the majority of people.
still, not fact for all.
and i have never pushed my opinion as a fact, saying 'exactly' is akin to 'agreed' imo here. but if you want to get tied down in the semantics of the comment, go ahead
and redrock...i DO agree with you overall. i have NO idea what i would do honestly.
i also have to say, yes, most people value human life above all else....but again, not everyone does. there's no right or wrong there, it's just different values. i think someone said as much earlier, and i full agree.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
My heart goes out to his lady's family and I hope they share the same values as she does. If not it will be so much more difficult for them.
not hard to understand.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Until there comes a time to make a difference. Burning house - a 10 year old girl and your 15 year old dog. Both in different rooms, cannot get out on their own - only one can be saved. I'll bet anything the life of a human being will prevail over the life of an animal. Whatever people want to say.
100% agreement there.
however, i think that's a big part of it....child, dog, cat, elderly parent, whomever.......if you are in the situation, have to make the choice to risk yourself going in to try and save ANYone....you could well put a firefighter's life in jeopardy - and i agree, one really should NOT do that, but people do. that is why i totally agree it is a foolish thing to do - my only point was, i don't think half as many people would even be debating this woman's actions to such a degree except for the fact that she went for her dog and not another human being. obviously, for some they would never make such a choice, but others would, and to dismiss her feelings for this other creature, imo, is just rude and disrespectful. that was all.
*also, perhaps the fact that she did NOT have a husband, or children...perhaps this dog was her main life companion, and thus while she certainly would leave behind her extended family and friends.....in her day to day life, her dog was her greatest love so to speak? and sure, there may be people who might think that sad, idk, and i didn't know her or her situation....but i think the fact that she didn't have to think about leaving a child motherless or a husband a widow, could well play a part. and let's face it, MANY people simply DON'T think in such situations, they just react....rightly or wrongly.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
good point.
i still stand on what i said earlier.
i am not going into a structure that is fully engulfed in flames.
it is not a good idea and i am no fireman with a firefighter's outfit @ my disposal.
for me, in your scenario, both lives are not going to make it unless i have a firefighters suit on or the structure is not full blown out of control in a ragging inferno.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
I know there are many here that get my point and I see the other side. It does come down to a persons values and what their heart tells them to do. Dunkman said he didn't have a heart though, well not like the one I speak of, but I know he certainly does.
For me my heart is also my conscience. As I said in my original post, I would hope to be so brave as to save my dogs because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't try. They are my bestest buddies which obviously some people can not understand. I raised my children like this, my husband believes as I do,maybe even more so, one if the things I love him so for. I know they would understand if I left this world like this.
Anyways this lady will remain a hero to me, may her soul rest now with God and may she be forever blessed with this kind of love. The kind of love that makes life worth living and dying for.
People also debate this without the adrenaline and fear of real panic mode. We behave in super crazy illogical ways when panic sets in. Some folks stop thinking and just start reacting... or they shut down altogether. It is easy to say what you think you will do, and what you should do, but what you really do is another story. The only time I have ever considered slapping my wife was when we were in a tight spot deep in the mountains and she went into full blown panic and reacted very poorly. Normally she wouldn't have done that, but who knows how you might react on any given day and to what situation.
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i really seriously doubt that people on here would walk head first into a ragging inferno to save a life, rather it be a human or a dog.
in fact i would bet my life on it.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
It's funny because I normally have a cagey nervous energy thing going, but in tight situations, I am calm as a stone.
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You would lose that bet my friend.
When I was 16 we lived in a huge apartment complex. it was Dec. 23, my sister and I were out christmas shopping. we couldnt get down the street to our apt. so went around another way and pulled into a church parking lot behind the complex. I saw fire shooting out of the top floor windows and top of the building.
My sister claims I jumped out of the car as she sped up the hill and never broke stride and ran towards evreyone looking for my Mom. A friend said that she had gone back into the building to get some old lady out and they didn't see her come out. I went running to the building and was 2 steps away from the door when my mom grabbed me. she had come out the other side of the building and was standing up front of the crowd with the old lady.
my point is, I've been there. I didn't think twice about going in after my mother, nor did she think twice about going in after the old lady. and before anyone says that we put fire fighter life at risk, not really. they were not even fucking there yet. Had my mother waited there is no doubt the old lady would have died.
"To question your government is not unpatriotic --
to not question your government is unpatriotic."
-- Sen. Chuck Hagel
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
As for the woman who died, it was a fatal mistake. I'm sorry but no animal is worth the price of "your" life or mine. I have been at a fire when a woman was screaming "My baby, my baby". Only to find out she was talking about her dog. We had to rescue the firefighter out of the window. :?
What You Giving
I suggest you step out on your Porch.
Run away my son. See it all. Oh, See the World!
we have things in common.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
that is amazing on you and your mother.
i stand corrected.
(shakes your hand through the internet)
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
id do it for my child and my granddaughter. without hesitation.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say