Forget about the fact that they traded up for EJ (which was a bad move). Why sit him? NOBODY, not even the head coach, expected a playoff run this year. Let the kid develop if you expect him to be the QB of the future. Jesus Christ, Peyton manning won 2 games his first season. Yes the offense sucks, but damn, let the defense carry you while this guy learns.
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WhatYouTaughtMe
I have no idea what's going on right now! Posts: 4,957
edited September 2014
Orton sucks but EJ can't hit a wide open receiver half the time. A couple drops weren't his fault yesterday but the guy cannot throw the ball consistent enough to be a starter right now. It's a shame because I like his composure and ability to move around, just can't throw.
Forget about the fact that they traded up for EJ (which was a bad move). Why sit him? NOBODY, not even the head coach, expected a playoff run this year. Let the kid develop if you expect him to be the QB of the future. Jesus Christ, Peyton manning won 2 games his first season. Yes the offense sucks, but damn, let the defense carry you while this guy learns.
They actually traded back and took manuel which I think was the alonso pick.
This team stated they were all in and want to win now which is why they blew next year's 1st for watkins. This management and coaching staff knows they need to win now or the new owner will bring scorched earth. Wilson may have tolerated failure, but pegula will not.
Also manning has absolutely nothing to do with manuel. Manuel has not had one great game. Only games where he manages to not screw up so his defense, running game, and special teams can win. The offense is so simple and dumbed down for this guy. He can't read defenses or pre play. Yesterday woods was unaccounted for one play and he missed it. He also blatantly locks on receivers and cannot go through progressions before dumping it to an rb. His throwing mechanics are also terrible. He throws off the back foot and the ball has nothing behind it. Laughably inaccurate. He has completed something like 25% of passes to wrs. That's nearly tebow territory.
Basically the exact book experts wrote on him pegging him as a 4th to 6th round pick are dead on. Another colossal mistake by the bills.
You also have to consider the rest of the team. I suspect some sort of mutiny brewing in the lockerroom. The body language on the receivers yesterday was telling. Manuel has been setting those guys up on train tracks since the preseason and he can't hit open guys or anyone in stride.
He is not going to develop into peyton manning as much as jp losman and trent edwards developed into manning. It was a terrible pick and may cost everyone their jobs. Also don't forget we had only tuel and lewis as backups for over a calendar year... Orton gives them the best possibility of winning for a couple years until they can find a qb...
Post edited by MayDay10 on
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WhatYouTaughtMe
I have no idea what's going on right now! Posts: 4,957
Forget about the fact that they traded up for EJ (which was a bad move). Why sit him? NOBODY, not even the head coach, expected a playoff run this year. Let the kid develop if you expect him to be the QB of the future. Jesus Christ, Peyton manning won 2 games his first season. Yes the offense sucks, but damn, let the defense carry you while this guy learns.
They actually traded back and took manuel which I think was the alonso pick.
This team stated they were all in and want to win now which is why they blew next year's 1st for watkins. This management and coaching staff knows they need to win now or the new owner will bring scorched earth. Wilson may have tolerated failure, but pegula will not.
Also manning has absolutely nothing to do with manuel. Manuel has not had one great game. Only games where he manages to not screw up so his defense, running game, and special teams can win. The offense is so simple and dumbed down for this guy. He can't read defenses or pre play. Yesterday woods was unaccounted for one play and he missed it. He also blatantly locks on receivers and cannot go through progressions before dumping it to an rb. His throwing mechanics are also terrible. He throws off the back foot and the ball has nothing behind it. Laughably inaccurate. He has completed something like 25% of passes to wrs. That's nearly tebow territory.
Basically the exact book experts wrote on him pegging him as a 4th to 6th round pick are dead on. Another colossal mistake by the bills.
You also have to consider the rest of the team. I suspect some sort of mutiny brewing in the lockerroom. The body language on the receivers yesterday was telling. Manuel has been setting those guys up on train tracks since the preseason and he can't hit open guys or anyone in stride.
He is not going to develop into peyton manning as much as jp losman and trent edwards developed into manning. It was a terrible pick and may cost everyone their jobs. Also don't forget we had only tuel and lewis as backups for over a calendar year... Orton gives them the best possibility of winning for a couple years until they can find a qb...
I know he's not going to develop like manning. My point was just to say I think they are pulling the trigger to cast. I forgot they traded down. My point was exactly what you said. They could have gotten him in the second or third round.
My second point is why bench him? The alternative is not an improvement. If they went out and signed a better backup, sure sit him. But Orton is not the answer. I agree that he's not developing as quickly as be should be. But how many games has he started? 12 or 13? They need consistency. That isn't going to happen by bouncing back and forth between Manuel and Orton.
The coach was in the hit seat the second that team was bought. All this is is an attempt to stay the coach the whole season ( which I don't think he will). Take your lumps, let him finish the year. If no major improvement is seen, then move on and find another qb.
There is talent in this offense. The defense is good. The formula is there to win. They just need to find it.
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WhatYouTaughtMe
I have no idea what's going on right now! Posts: 4,957
I know he's not going to develop like manning. My point was just to say I think they are pulling the trigger to cast. I forgot they traded down. My point was exactly what you said. They could have gotten him in the second or third round.
My second point is why bench him? The alternative is not an improvement. If they went out and signed a better backup, sure sit him. But Orton is not the answer. I agree that he's not developing as quickly as be should be. But how many games has he started? 12 or 13? They need consistency. That isn't going to happen by bouncing back and forth between Manuel and Orton.
The coach was in the hit seat the second that team was bought. All this is is an attempt to stay the coach the whole season ( which I don't think he will). Take your lumps, let him finish the year. If no major improvement is seen, then move on and find another qb.
There is talent in this offense. The defense is good. The formula is there to win. They just need to find it.
I absolutely hate Orton as our starter, but Manuel has not shown he can complete wide open passes. Our defense can only get us so far. We don't need Orton to throw for 400 yards a game. We just need more first downs to keep our offense on the field. How many games have we lost the last couple years when our D is gassed late in games because we can't keep the offense out there? Manuel threw a pick six on a swing pass yesterday. The defender was right in front of him. That single play cost us the game in my opinion. We have too much talent on our team to squander it with a guy getting our receivers creamed and throwing it into their feet on a ten yard slant. Unless he learns how to put the ball on their numbers, he can't play at this level. Orton isn't much better but he has far more experience.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
Philly I & II, 16
Denver 22
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WhatYouTaughtMe
I have no idea what's going on right now! Posts: 4,957
I know he's not going to develop like manning. My point was just to say I think they are pulling the trigger to cast. I forgot they traded down. My point was exactly what you said. They could have gotten him in the second or third round.
My second point is why bench him? The alternative is not an improvement. If they went out and signed a better backup, sure sit him. But Orton is not the answer. I agree that he's not developing as quickly as be should be. But how many games has he started? 12 or 13? They need consistency. That isn't going to happen by bouncing back and forth between Manuel and Orton.
The coach was in the hit seat the second that team was bought. All this is is an attempt to stay the coach the whole season ( which I don't think he will). Take your lumps, let him finish the year. If no major improvement is seen, then move on and find another qb.
There is talent in this offense. The defense is good. The formula is there to win. They just need to find it.
You said it yourself. There is talent on offense and the defense is good. This team reminds me a lot, ironically of the 2012 Denver Broncos with Tebow (and Orton benched as backup). The whole offense was predicated on smoke and mirrors and hiding Tebow's obvious flaws in order to allow the defense to hold teams to under 15 points and somehow Tebow just kept getting lucky at the end... and they benefited from being in an awful division.
You can see it in the offensive playcalling. It is very simple, predictable, all built around Manuel's shortcomings and is severely limiting what these weapons can do. A guy like Orton can deliver the ball to receivers. He has the experience to read defenses and go through a progression. Orton isnt great, but provides a much higher ceiling for this team. He will be capable of having big 300 yard days.
Unless Orton is a complete disaster or gets injured, I think this is it for Manuel. Pegula is going to lay down a mandate for whoever he selects to run this team that they need to find the franchise QB at all costs. I think a guy like Orton can be a serviceable 2 year placeholder and with these weapons can get the team to the playoffs.
Just look at Bridgewater, Glennon, and Bortles this weekend. Its a young man's league now. QBs dont need (or allowed) to have years to develop. EJ is exactly what everyone said he would be. No team would be interested in him.
Manuel is really, really bad and I dont believe he is ever going to be adequate. I feel bad because he seems like a good smart guy and a hard worker. He just has no accuracy or poise. You really cant teach accuracy, especially when its this "broke" and deeply rooted into his mechanics.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
While Orton isnt very good... These stats are misleading. Throwing to WRs, Manuel has an awful %. Most of his completions are dumpoff to RBs because he cant read/adjust and doesnt have the accuracy to hit WRs. When he does hit them, it is not in stride... and often misses by a mile.
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Unanimous approval by league finance committee today. Final owner vote October 8th and then its party time (it already seems like party time)
They actually traded back and took manuel which I think was the alonso pick.
This team stated they were all in and want to win now which is why they blew next year's 1st for watkins. This management and coaching staff knows they need to win now or the new owner will bring scorched earth. Wilson may have tolerated failure, but pegula will not.
Also manning has absolutely nothing to do with manuel. Manuel has not had one great game. Only games where he manages to not screw up so his defense, running game, and special teams can win. The offense is so simple and dumbed down for this guy. He can't read defenses or pre play. Yesterday woods was unaccounted for one play and he missed it. He also blatantly locks on receivers and cannot go through progressions before dumping it to an rb. His throwing mechanics are also terrible. He throws off the back foot and the ball has nothing behind it. Laughably inaccurate. He has completed something like 25% of passes to wrs. That's nearly tebow territory.
Basically the exact book experts wrote on him pegging him as a 4th to 6th round pick are dead on. Another colossal mistake by the bills.
You also have to consider the rest of the team. I suspect some sort of mutiny brewing in the lockerroom. The body language on the receivers yesterday was telling. Manuel has been setting those guys up on train tracks since the preseason and he can't hit open guys or anyone in stride.
He is not going to develop into peyton manning as much as jp losman and trent edwards developed into manning. It was a terrible pick and may cost everyone their jobs. Also don't forget we had only tuel and lewis as backups for over a calendar year...
Orton gives them the best possibility of winning for a couple years until they can find a qb...
My second point is why bench him? The alternative is not an improvement. If they went out and signed a better backup, sure sit him. But Orton is not the answer. I agree that he's not developing as quickly as be should be. But how many games has he started? 12 or 13? They need consistency. That isn't going to happen by bouncing back and forth between Manuel and Orton.
The coach was in the hit seat the second that team was bought. All this is is an attempt to stay the coach the whole season ( which I don't think he will). Take your lumps, let him finish the year. If no major improvement is seen, then move on and find another qb.
There is talent in this offense. The defense is good. The formula is there to win. They just need to find it.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
You can see it in the offensive playcalling. It is very simple, predictable, all built around Manuel's shortcomings and is severely limiting what these weapons can do. A guy like Orton can deliver the ball to receivers. He has the experience to read defenses and go through a progression. Orton isnt great, but provides a much higher ceiling for this team. He will be capable of having big 300 yard days.
Unless Orton is a complete disaster or gets injured, I think this is it for Manuel. Pegula is going to lay down a mandate for whoever he selects to run this team that they need to find the franchise QB at all costs. I think a guy like Orton can be a serviceable 2 year placeholder and with these weapons can get the team to the playoffs.
Just look at Bridgewater, Glennon, and Bortles this weekend. Its a young man's league now. QBs dont need (or allowed) to have years to develop. EJ is exactly what everyone said he would be. No team would be interested in him.
Manuel is really, really bad and I dont believe he is ever going to be adequate. I feel bad because he seems like a good smart guy and a hard worker. He just has no accuracy or poise. You really cant teach accuracy, especially when its this "broke" and deeply rooted into his mechanics.
plus, he's making $5M this year!
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
comp 58.6%
td% 3.7%
int% 2.7%
rating 78.5
kyle orton career stats
comp 58.5%
td% 3.7%
int% 2.6%
rating 79.9
good luck, buffalo!