While I still regret my emotional outburst earlier in this thread, information coming to light suggests that the influence of extremist ideologies MIGHT have been relevant in this case. I'd like to thank people like Triumphant Angel for jumping all over my nuts.
i hope you're joking, you weren't even able to give me a better response regarding your post than "I have my opinions and you have yours." lol
Oh, and that's the`last comment I will have on the topic, because apparently my Caucasian heritage precludes me from having an informed opinion on how Muslims must think.
...
Unless you are a Muslim... there is no way you can answer the question that was asked.
"How come Muslims very rarely or ever speak out condemning these kind of acts if they are so peace loving?"
...
You can SPECULATE in regards to your response, and yes... speculation is uninformed. For you to attempt to answer that would be the same as answering the question, 'What is it like to be Black in America?", or "What is it like to be an AIG Executive?" or 'What is it like to be a dead person?" The only people who can answer these questions are black people, AIG Execs and dead people. The rest of us will simply speculate.
...
And the question is kinda dumb... when you look at the opposite side of this coin. A related question would be someone in Saudia Arabia asking, "Why do Christians like the taste of mayonaise?" to a bunch of Saudi Arabian guys. My guess... they would answer, "I don't know" or come up with some completely false speculation.
Post edited by Cosmo on
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Oh, and that's the`last comment I will have on the topic, because apparently my Caucasian heritage precludes me from having an informed opinion on how Muslims must think.
really?? cause my caucasian heritage doesnt preclude me.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
While I still regret my emotional outburst earlier in this thread, information coming to light suggests that the influence of extremist ideologies MIGHT have been relevant in this case. I'd like to thank people like Triumphant Angel for jumping all over my nuts.
you are talking here about information NOW coming to light. my post was a few days ago, and i just called it as i saw it.
and trust me. your nuts are safe. i'm kinda fussy who's nuts i jump on, and yours aren't on the list. :roll:
While I still regret my emotional outburst earlier in this thread, information coming to light suggests that the influence of extremist ideologies MIGHT have been relevant in this case. I'd like to thank people like Triumphant Angel for jumping all over my nuts.
i hope you're joking, you weren't even able to give me a better response regarding your post than "I have my opinions and you have yours." lol
Oh ... Buried somewhere in your usual apologetic diatribes and rants about the media were questions? My bad. Ask away if you've got questions, and I will attempt to answer. Feel free to keep it concise, though.
While I still regret my emotional outburst earlier in this thread, information coming to light suggests that the influence of extremist ideologies MIGHT have been relevant in this case. I'd like to thank people like Triumphant Angel for jumping all over my nuts.
you are talking here about information NOW coming to light. my post was a few days ago, and i just called it as i saw it.
and trust me. your nuts are safe. i'm kinda fussy who's nuts i jump on, and yours aren't on the list. :roll:
Oh, and that's the`last comment I will have on the topic, because apparently my Caucasian heritage precludes me from having an informed opinion on how Muslims must think.
...
Unless you are a Muslim... there is no way you can answer the question that was asked.
"How come Muslims very rarely or ever speak out condemning these kind of acts if they are so peace loving?"
...
You can SPECULATE in regards to your response, and yes... speculation is uninformed. For you to attempt to answer that would be the same as answering the question, 'What is it like to be Black in America?", or "What is it like to be an AIG Executive?" or 'What is it like to be a dead person?" The only people who can answer these questions are black people, AIG Execs and dead people. The rest of us will simply speculate.
...
And the question is kinda dumb... when you look at the opposite side of this coin. A related question would be someone in Saudia Arabia asking, "Why do Christians like the taste of mayonaise?" to a bunch of Saudi Arabian guys. My guess... they would answer, "I don't know" or come up with some completely false speculation.
I can agree that the question as originally posted was problematic, if nothing else because there ARE many Muslims who do speak out against violence. Not sure that speculation about those who don't is entirely unwarranted, though. There's probably a reason, and a solution to the problem of religious violence requires that questions be asked and possibilities entertained. Sure, asking the people themselves is the best idea. Any imams out there rocking out to Johnny Guitar?
While I still regret my emotional outburst earlier in this thread, information coming to light suggests that the influence of extremist ideologies MIGHT have been relevant in this case. I'd like to thank people like Triumphant Angel for jumping all over my nuts.
you are talking here about information NOW coming to light. my post was a few days ago, and i just called it as i saw it.
and trust me. your nuts are safe. i'm kinda fussy who's nuts i jump on, and yours aren't on the list. :roll:
Thanks, you're probably not my type either.
there's no probably about it. i guarantee you i'm not.
While I still regret my emotional outburst earlier in this thread, information coming to light suggests that the influence of extremist ideologies MIGHT have been relevant in this case. I'd like to thank people like Triumphant Angel for jumping all over my nuts.
i hope you're joking, you weren't even able to give me a better response regarding your post than "I have my opinions and you have yours." lol
Oh ... Buried somewhere in your usual apologetic diatribes and rants about the media were questions? My bad. Ask away if you've got questions, and I will attempt to answer. Feel free to keep it concise, though.
wear your reading glasses next time, you might be able to see my point.
Not sure that speculation about those who don't ["speak out against 'religious' violence"] is entirely unwarranted, though.
so if a Muslim organization doesn't feel obligated to condemn the attacks because it has absolutely nothing to do with them then "speculation" is not entirely unwarranted? don't you think it is a bit ridiculous to suggest that Muslims are obligated to condemn these attacks simply because of the small connection that the man is Muslim? should Muslim organizations then be obligated to condemn every single crime committed by a Muslim? Are Jewish organizations obligated, by that logic, to condemn the actions of Bernie Madoff because he was Jewish? Perhaps the State of Israel should release an official apology.
There's probably a reason, and a solution to the problem of religious violence requires that questions be asked and possibilities entertained. Sure, asking the people themselves is the best idea. Any imams out there rocking out to Johnny Guitar?
Well, if someone committed mass murder in the name of a religious faith that I held dear, yes ... I'd feel more than a little obligated to speak up. Could just be me. Some Muslim groups do publically condemn violence such as this, so at least some of them must agree with me on this issue.
And thanks for bringing Israel up yet again, _outlaw, because I have long wondered why you have no qualms about evoking extremist ideologies (i.e., Zionism) when explaining the behavior of Isrealis, but when it comes to Muslims, no, there it must have nothing to do with extremism and everything to do with someone else's prejudice. In your view, some groups of people are apparently immune to the detrimental effects of religious extremism but instead react solely as victims, whereas others (i.e., the Jews) do horrible things because of an idelogical position that disregards the value of human life and freedom. Its not possible that both groups contribute to the problem via a fundamental disregard for each other's lives? I guess one-way causal models are just easier for some people to understand.
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
apparently you did not click on the links. these are examples of american christians targeting other americans and murdering them. very relevent since you said that this never happens in america.
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
apparently you did not click on the links. these are examples of american christians targeting other americans and murdering them. very relevent since you said that this never happens in america.
Because there have been, incidents were extremist Christians have gone of the deep end, do not compare with the situation at Fort Hood. Like I said earlier, this would not have happened if not for people being scared to defend there own country...because of political correctness!
Christians have not declared their hate and desire to kill Americans. Why is it okay with you people that Muslims, kill, pray, and talk to others about their religion but it’s not ok for Christians to do the same? What do you have against Christians? This man is an Islamist terrorist. The people he killed were being sent overseas so he looks at this as saving his fellow Muslims. How can anyone Justify defending them!
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
"You bunch"...nice touch there. This place reeks of hypocrisy.
Thank you I thought it was a nice touch myself. Did it offend you? Well cry me a river.
Do you even know what I meant by "you bunch"? Probably not but you just felt the need to express your useless opinion.
You bunch = people like aerial, shawshank, prfctlefts who think blanket bans on Muslims in your war-mongering army is not discrimination but precaution. Add to that list the rest of those people who think the same. If that includes you then let me open the doors and welcome you in.
Because there have been, incidents were extremist Christians have gone of the deep end, do not compare with the situation at Fort Hood. Like I said earlier, this would not have happened if not for people being scared to defend there own country...because of political correctness!
Christians have not declared their hate and desire to kill Americans. Why is it okay with you people that Muslims, kill, pray, and talk to others about their religion but it’s not ok for Christians to do the same? What do you have against Christians? This man is an Islamist terrorist. The people he killed were being sent overseas so he looks at this as saving his fellow Muslims. How can anyone Justify defending them!
for the last time i am not defending the shooter. i am not defending muslims or defaming christians. do you really not see how there is a correlation between these issues? you have said that christians have never murdered americans because of religious reasons and i called bullshit on your claim. instead you focus on side issues like political correctness and call it the soup du jour cause for the fall of america. if this guy was all over the radar a few months ago and nobody did anything about it, then they are guilty of negligence. the same as bush and co were gulity of negligence when they got the "bin laden determined to hijack planes and use them as missles" national security brief before 9/11.
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
Because there have been, incidents were extremist Christians have gone of the deep end, do not compare with the situation at Fort Hood. Like I said earlier, this would not have happened if not for people being scared to defend there own country...because of political correctness!
Christians have not declared their hate and desire to kill Americans. Why is it okay with you people that Muslims, kill, pray, and talk to others about their religion but it’s not ok for Christians to do the same? What do you have against Christians? This man is an Islamist terrorist. The people he killed were being sent overseas so he looks at this as saving his fellow Muslims. How can anyone Justify defending them![/quote][/quote]
for the last time i am not defending the shooter. i am not defending muslims or defaming christians. do you really not see how there is a correlation between these issues? you have said that christians have never murdered americans because of religious reasons and i called bullshit on your claim. instead you focus on side issues like political correctness and call it the soup du jour cause for the fall of america. if this guy was all over the radar a few months ago and nobody did anything about it, then they are guilty of negligence. the same as bush and co were gulity of negligence when they got the "bin laden determined to hijack planes and use them as missles" national security brief before 9/11.[/quote]
You have me confuse with someone else. I didn’t say that. .....How can they do anything when everyone is so damn quick to cry Racist Bigot! As they do on this site without even knowing the person. The way it is today who ever would have been the person to call him out would have been the one that got kicked out of the service. I see it alot since Obama came in office. The bad guy some how becomes the victim and the good guy turns into scum.
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
Apparently this dude WAS on the defense department's radar, for quite some time ... Is doing nothing about his mental state negligence? I would argue yeah, absolutely. Of course, what might folks have said if the military HAD taken early action here? Probably something about discrimination against Muslims. You lose either way ... Early action in these kinds of cases gets equated with racial or some other form of profiling and gets decried (even in cases where there is a legitimate reason to be worried), so that's out. On the other hand, doing nothing means many lives lost.
Thank you I thought it was a nice touch myself. Did it offend you? Well cry me a river.
Do you even know what I meant by "you bunch"? Probably not but you just felt the need to express your useless opinion.
You bunch = people like aerial, shawshank, prfctlefts who think blanket bans on Muslims in your war-mongering army is not discrimination but precaution. Add to that list the rest of those people who think the same. If that includes you then let me open the doors and welcome you in.
Take a deep breath.
Somone so upset over peole blanketing others together probably should do the same thing.
Somone so upset over peole blanketing others together probably should do the same thing.
Just once, I'd like to see someone freak out on here when overgeneralizations are being made about Israelis or Christians or conservatives. In reality, though, somewhere in this place's collective unconscious there exists a list of acceptable targets (Israel, Christians, white people, conservatives, etc.) and a list of unacceptable targets (Muslims, minorities, liberals, etc.). Its a biased, slanted place. I'd say "leftist", but I refuse to believe that its that simple. Surely someone who really is a socialist would decry violence like this instead of take an opportunity to rant about a pet cause ... Right?
Somone so upset over peole blanketing others together probably should do the same thing.
Take a deep breath yourself and reread what I said. All the three posters above have agreed that a blanket ban on Muslims is a good idea. There is no "blanketing" others in my statements just facts.
Just once, I'd like to see someone freak out on here when overgeneralizations are being made about Israelis or Christians or conservatives. In reality, though, somewhere in this place's collective unconscious there exists a list of acceptable targets (Israel, Christians, white people, conservatives, etc.) and a list of unacceptable targets (Muslims, minorities, liberals, etc.). Its a biased, slanted place. I'd say "leftist", but I refuse to believe that its that simple. Surely someone who really is a socialist would decry violence like this instead of take an opportunity to rant about a pet cause ... Right?
Perhaps the reason why there is no rush to voice concern is because it is not those groups that have been constantly targeted by foreign armies such as your own and killed by the thousands, if not millions.
Perhaps the reason why there is no rush to voice concern is because it is not those groups that have been constantly targeted by foreign armies such as your own and killed by the thousands, if not millions.
I am not American, for the record. I will say that soldiers are not the cause of the problem you speak of ... Politicians are.
Comments
No dipshit, I'm not joking. If you lived in the real world, you'd see where people walk on eggshells when it comes to this issue.
Unless you are a Muslim... there is no way you can answer the question that was asked.
"How come Muslims very rarely or ever speak out condemning these kind of acts if they are so peace loving?"
...
You can SPECULATE in regards to your response, and yes... speculation is uninformed. For you to attempt to answer that would be the same as answering the question, 'What is it like to be Black in America?", or "What is it like to be an AIG Executive?" or 'What is it like to be a dead person?" The only people who can answer these questions are black people, AIG Execs and dead people. The rest of us will simply speculate.
...
And the question is kinda dumb... when you look at the opposite side of this coin. A related question would be someone in Saudia Arabia asking, "Why do Christians like the taste of mayonaise?" to a bunch of Saudi Arabian guys. My guess... they would answer, "I don't know" or come up with some completely false speculation.
Hail, Hail!!!
really?? cause my caucasian heritage doesnt preclude me.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
and trust me. your nuts are safe. i'm kinda fussy who's nuts i jump on, and yours aren't on the list. :roll:
Very classy response.
This video will give you a little insight into the real world and how truly respectful you bunch are..
http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?do ... firefox-a#
Oh ... Buried somewhere in your usual apologetic diatribes and rants about the media were questions? My bad. Ask away if you've got questions, and I will attempt to answer. Feel free to keep it concise, though.
Thanks, you're probably not my type either.
I can agree that the question as originally posted was problematic, if nothing else because there ARE many Muslims who do speak out against violence. Not sure that speculation about those who don't is entirely unwarranted, though. There's probably a reason, and a solution to the problem of religious violence requires that questions be asked and possibilities entertained. Sure, asking the people themselves is the best idea. Any imams out there rocking out to Johnny Guitar?
hell... i dont even rock out to johnny guitar. :P
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
And thanks for bringing Israel up yet again, _outlaw, because I have long wondered why you have no qualms about evoking extremist ideologies (i.e., Zionism) when explaining the behavior of Isrealis, but when it comes to Muslims, no, there it must have nothing to do with extremism and everything to do with someone else's prejudice. In your view, some groups of people are apparently immune to the detrimental effects of religious extremism but instead react solely as victims, whereas others (i.e., the Jews) do horrible things because of an idelogical position that disregards the value of human life and freedom. Its not possible that both groups contribute to the problem via a fundamental disregard for each other's lives? I guess one-way causal models are just easier for some people to understand.
I weep tears of bitter, bitter loss and rage.
"You bunch"...nice touch there. This place reeks of hypocrisy.
Not Relevant .....................
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Because there have been, incidents were extremist Christians have gone of the deep end, do not compare with the situation at Fort Hood. Like I said earlier, this would not have happened if not for people being scared to defend there own country...because of political correctness!
Christians have not declared their hate and desire to kill Americans. Why is it okay with you people that Muslims, kill, pray, and talk to others about their religion but it’s not ok for Christians to do the same? What do you have against Christians? This man is an Islamist terrorist. The people he killed were being sent overseas so he looks at this as saving his fellow Muslims. How can anyone Justify defending them!
Thank you I thought it was a nice touch myself. Did it offend you? Well cry me a river.
Do you even know what I meant by "you bunch"? Probably not but you just felt the need to express your useless opinion.
You bunch = people like aerial, shawshank, prfctlefts who think blanket bans on Muslims in your war-mongering army is not discrimination but precaution. Add to that list the rest of those people who think the same. If that includes you then let me open the doors and welcome you in.
for the last time i am not defending the shooter. i am not defending muslims or defaming christians. do you really not see how there is a correlation between these issues? you have said that christians have never murdered americans because of religious reasons and i called bullshit on your claim. instead you focus on side issues like political correctness and call it the soup du jour cause for the fall of america. if this guy was all over the radar a few months ago and nobody did anything about it, then they are guilty of negligence. the same as bush and co were gulity of negligence when they got the "bin laden determined to hijack planes and use them as missles" national security brief before 9/11.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Christians have not declared their hate and desire to kill Americans. Why is it okay with you people that Muslims, kill, pray, and talk to others about their religion but it’s not ok for Christians to do the same? What do you have against Christians? This man is an Islamist terrorist. The people he killed were being sent overseas so he looks at this as saving his fellow Muslims. How can anyone Justify defending them![/quote][/quote]
for the last time i am not defending the shooter. i am not defending muslims or defaming christians. do you really not see how there is a correlation between these issues? you have said that christians have never murdered americans because of religious reasons and i called bullshit on your claim. instead you focus on side issues like political correctness and call it the soup du jour cause for the fall of america. if this guy was all over the radar a few months ago and nobody did anything about it, then they are guilty of negligence. the same as bush and co were gulity of negligence when they got the "bin laden determined to hijack planes and use them as missles" national security brief before 9/11.[/quote]
You have me confuse with someone else. I didn’t say that. .....How can they do anything when everyone is so damn quick to cry Racist Bigot! As they do on this site without even knowing the person. The way it is today who ever would have been the person to call him out would have been the one that got kicked out of the service. I see it alot since Obama came in office. The bad guy some how becomes the victim and the good guy turns into scum.
Take a deep breath.
Somone so upset over peole blanketing others together probably should do the same thing.
Just once, I'd like to see someone freak out on here when overgeneralizations are being made about Israelis or Christians or conservatives. In reality, though, somewhere in this place's collective unconscious there exists a list of acceptable targets (Israel, Christians, white people, conservatives, etc.) and a list of unacceptable targets (Muslims, minorities, liberals, etc.). Its a biased, slanted place. I'd say "leftist", but I refuse to believe that its that simple. Surely someone who really is a socialist would decry violence like this instead of take an opportunity to rant about a pet cause ... Right?
Take a deep breath yourself and reread what I said. All the three posters above have agreed that a blanket ban on Muslims is a good idea. There is no "blanketing" others in my statements just facts.
Nice try. Better luck next time.
Perhaps the reason why there is no rush to voice concern is because it is not those groups that have been constantly targeted by foreign armies such as your own and killed by the thousands, if not millions.
I am not American, for the record. I will say that soldiers are not the cause of the problem you speak of ... Politicians are.