true but does religion not state that god created the universe?
Which religion? I really dig Taoism, which does not (similar to most other Eastern religions as far as I know). It is not important to the Eastern philosophy. To most Christians, yes.
if that is the case then god would have to had to existed at some point for him to create the universe (perhaps god was responsible for the big bang). Otherwise religion would be based on a falsehood and that would then bring that whole religion into question. This would be the same for any scientific theory if it was disproven then it would be ignored.
:?:
Before the "big bang" there was no such thing as space or time... there was no "before" the big bang. There was nothing, and then there was everything. This is quantum physics here... not some preachy religious shit. Again, I think most quantum physicists would agree that this screams of "creationism" which is why a lot of scientists who are atheists hate it, and ironically the fundamentalist religion folk don't know that and are trying to disprove it as well because they think it somehow is trying to disprove god.
The atheists use theory issues like the "horizon problem" to disprove the big bang because they think it screams creationism, and theists use the horizon problem to disprove it because they think the big bang theory is atheistic. Funny stuff... really.
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
All the legitimate alternatives should be presented in the classroom. For a professor to say you can't mention or discuss intelligent design is fascism. Im not saying turn to Christianity, but it should be discussed.
I believe in creative design and I believe in evolution,but I think it was over seen by a Higher Power. The problem I have with Science is that it doesn't advance the human condition in any moralistic way,and jesus did.If everybody Followed his teachings we would have Peace On Earth. Would we not ? I think everyone would love one another and we'd almost be an idllic civilization.
Im not 100% sure that Jesus God,but I choose to believe that because the man was so extraordinary in what he did in his 33 yrs on earth, an it still resonates to this day.
if we were all non-violent hindus, we'd have peace on earth. so what's so great about christianity? if we were all the same and peaceful and loving, we'd have peace on earth. maybe if we were all stoned all the time, we'd have peace on earth.
i'm not saying the teachings are bad, but some pipe dream of universal utopia based on everyone adopting the same religious beliefs as you is a VERY dangerous idea.
science has nothing to do with moralism. why would it? do you really want our public schools teaching morals? whose morals? should we teach the secular humanism of tolerance for gays, or the bigotry of pentecostal visionaries that think homos are the spawn of satan? which one gets in? are our teachers the best equipped people to do this? or is it more appropriately something that should be taught by family, friends, community, or pastors?
All the legitimate alternatives should be presented in the classroom. For a professor to say you can't mention or discuss intelligent design is fascism. Im not saying turn to Christianity, but it should be discussed.
I believe in creative design and I believe in evolution,but I think it was over seen by a Higher Power. The problem I have with Science is that it doesn't advance the human condition in any moralistic way,and jesus did.If everybody Followed his teachings we would have Peace On Earth. Would we not ? I think everyone would love one another and we'd almost be an idllic civilization.
Im not 100% sure that Jesus God,but I choose to believe that because the man was so extraordinary in what he did in his 33 yrs on earth, an it still resonates to this day.
No, no, no. Beliefs do not belong in the classroom. Scientific consensus belongs in the classroom. Is there any peer-reviewed scientific journals that advocate creationism? Just one?!?!
Morality... shit. "Morality," today, allows Moslems to stone women to death, as it once fueled the Christian witch-hunts. "Morality" has excused every war, and glorified some of them. "Morality" constantly plots to subvert the Constitutional guarantee of free speech. "Morality" inspires gay-bashing and the bombing of women's clinics. Why, without "morality" we might all suddenly go stark staring sane.
It is that religion shit that got us into most of the wars we're involved in right now, so it seems ironic that you think religion will cure all the world's problems.
Yes, Jesus was extraordinary - I agree. A lot can be learned from his teachings. But the same can be said about MLK, Ghandi, my grandpa, RFK, John Adams, Kurt Vonnegut, Eddie Vedder, and on and on... but I don't worship those dudes.
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
I'm not even convinced that Jesus was an actual person. I have researched this and honestly cannot see how others can say with certainty that he existed. Too many of his "lessons" were lifted from those before him for him to be given credit for anything at all.
It's a nice story though....but it is just a story
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
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I'm not even convinced that Jesus was an actual person. I have researched this and honestly cannot see how others can say with certainty that he existed. Too many of his "lessons" were lifted from those before him for him to be given credit for anything at all.
It's a nice story though....but it is just a story
i was watching a doco on noahs ark not too long ago and the one thing I found interesting was that the story looked to have been borred from earlier stories as a fable to tell small children. Granted their is no way to say that jesus did or did not exists. Perhaps their was some guy named jesus who lived arround that time, but was he the same guy describe in the bible? All i know about the bible was it not written 200 years or so after the fact?
All the legitimate alternatives should be presented in the classroom. For a professor to say you can't mention or discuss intelligent design is fascism. Im not saying turn to Christianity, but it should be discussed,and also that there are more believers than non believers.
I believe in creative design and I believe in evolution,but I think it was over seen by a Higher Power. The problem I have with Science is that it doesn't advance the human condition in any moralistic way,and jesus did.If everybody Followed his teachings we would have Peace On Earth. Would we not ? I think everyone would love one another and we'd almost be an idllic civilization.
Im not 100% sure that Jesus God,but I choose to believe that because the man was so extraordinary in what he did in his 33 yrs on earth, an it still resonates to this day.
but does not creative design be disproved by evolution, or at least the fossils we have found that show a gradual change in species over time. Perhaps you are right as it could be used as a simplistic example of how we came to be, but is it worth teaching as their would be far more important topics to be covered in a science class. Why should science improve the human condition in a moralistic way, does relgion do this. Or do people become good people out of selfish means so they can get into heaven?
But what version of the bible would we follow and how would we interpret it? this would probablly cause just as much hatered and violence as their is the the world today.
I know I'll get branded and get looked down upon for being a christian on here bcos that's what most atheist do.
not from me you wont mate.
sorry guys a little sleep deprevied today (only got two hours) and sick
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Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth. Forget all the other stuff, just argue big bang over creation. I'll wait.
For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
All the legitimate alternatives should be presented in the classroom. For a professor to say you can't mention or discuss intelligent design is fascism. Im not saying turn to Christianity, but it should be discussed,and also that there are more believers than non believers.
I believe in creative design and I believe in evolution,but I think it was over seen by a Higher Power. The problem I have with Science is that it doesn't advance the human condition in any moralistic way,and jesus did.If everybody Followed his teachings we would have Peace On Earth. Would we not ? I think everyone would love one another and we'd almost be an idllic civilization.
Im not 100% sure that Jesus God,but I choose to believe that because the man was so extraordinary in what he did in his 33 yrs on earth, an it still resonates to this day.
I know I'll get branded and get looked down upon for being a christian on here bcos that's what most atheist do.
...
Science does not exist to advance human morality. It is trying to explain the natural world that humans exist in. Just as it is not up to religion to explain things such as gravity, plate techtonics or biology. Both religion and science can live together, as long as one does not feel threatened by the existance of the other.
As for schools... keep religion in your churches. No one says you must also teach Evolution along side with your sermons... why is it okay to teach your religion to everyone?
And Christianity does not corner the market on morality. Morality is a human trait and does not only exist in the person that has religion. If Christians were more 'like Christ' in their everyday living... caring for the poor... the less fortunate... the weak, then us heathens would probably have more respect. Jesus was about forgiveness... not death penalties. Peace, not War. Turning the other cheek, not striking back in anger... with hatred. You talk about a peaceful world... if only everyone else were like you. Have you ever thought it would be a peaceful world... if you were just like me?
No one 'looks down' on Christians... so, you can shed that whole persecution thing. You are doing the exact same thing you claim to hate... grouping all Aetheists as one... when you hate being lumped to gether with all Christians.
Me? Personally? I have no problems with God, Jesus or Christianity. My problem arises with the people who follow Jesus in name only. Unforgiveness, intolerance, prejudice, war, indifference, exclusion... those are not the teachings of Jesus... yet, i see it in the lives of many, many of His followers.
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Hail, Hail!!!
Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth. Forget all the other stuff, just argue big bang over creation. I'll wait.
For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
...
Science in not so much about answers... it is more about questions.
Science does not profess to know what existed before the Big Bang... but, Christianity has it neatly wrapped up in 5000 year old text? Wouldn't that mean, men... 5000 years ago knew more about our Universe than we know today... right?
...
Since no one has the answer... except the Christians... I can come up with my own hypothesis. The Big Bang was simply the start of the existance of this Universe we are experiencing at this time. It is a cycle. Explosion. Expansion. Equilibrium. Contraction. Compression. Explosion. Never ending... no beginning. We created God in order to give it meaning... when maybe there in no meaning... other than what we make of it.
I have no proof of this... but, at the purely logical level... it's just as good as the Bible's explanation. The biggest difference... I'm not telling eveyone else the I know the truth.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth. Forget all the other stuff, just argue big bang over creation. I'll wait.
For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
...
Science in not so much about answers... it is more about questions.
Science does not profess to know what existed before the Big Bang... but, Christianity has it neatly wrapped up in 5000 year old text? Wouldn't that mean, men... 5000 years ago knew more about our Universe than we know today... right?
...
Since no one has the answer... except the Christians... I can come up with my own hypothesis. The Big Bang was simply the start of the existance of this Universe we are experiencing at this time. It is a cycle. Explosion. Expansion. Equilibrium. Contraction. Compression. Explosion. Never ending... no beginning. We created God in order to give it meaning... when maybe there in no meaning... other than what we make of it.
I have no proof of this... but, at the purely logical level... it's just as good as the Bible's explanation. The biggest difference... I'm not telling eveyone else the I know the truth.
But your beliefs take a leap of faith just as creation does. And although you're not telling everyone you know the truth, the reality is most people that believe 100% in the big bang theory do profess to know this as the truth, or at least the only possibility.
I don't believe the earth is 5,000 years old. I do believed humans evolved. But from what? Hard to say. But it's hard to once again take a leap of faith that we somehow evolved from a primordial ooze. How? No one has yet been able to generate life in a laboratory, and I suspect no one will.
All the legitimate alternatives should be presented in the classroom. For a professor to say you can't mention or discuss intelligent design is fascism.
Intelligent design isn't a "Legitimate alternative," it's idiot Christians grasping at straws as they admit that evolution is real but "God did it anyway."
I believe in creative design and I believe in evolution,but I think it was over seen by a Higher Power.
And you're allowed to have whatever beliefs you want.. but you can't teach them in science class because they're not science.
The problem I have with Science is that it doesn't advance the human condition in any moralistic way,and jesus did.
That's because SCIENCE isn't moral... it's just a study of FACTS. ERg.
If everybody Followed his teachings we would have Peace On Earth. Would we not ?
We would not. Our last president was an evangelical, claimed that Jesus was in his heart and he was a war monger and evil to the core. Like more evangelicals.
I know I'll get branded and get looked down upon for being a christian on here bcos that's what most atheist do.
And you'd never lump people together like "the atheists," would you. Fuck, you people don't even listen o yourselves, do you?
Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth.
Because if you were an astrophysicist or cosmologist you'd be able to prove it's existence on paper. It's been done. And they've got radio recordings of the echos it's made in space and even a sort of "photograph" of the remnants of it reflecting back from space. Kind of, I'm dumbing it way down.
And even the Pope can't prove that God is real. which is why teaching your fables doesn't belong in a school.
But your beliefs take a leap of faith just as creation does. And although you're not telling everyone you know the truth, the reality is most people that believe 100% in the big bang theory do profess to know this as the truth, or at least the only possibility.
I don't believe the earth is 5,000 years old. I do believed humans evolved. But from what? Hard to say. But it's hard to once again take a leap of faith that we somehow evolved from a primordial ooze. How? No one has yet been able to generate life in a laboratory, and I suspect no one will.
...
No. I am not taking a leap of faith because I know that I don't know.
As for the Big Bang... are you saying you do not believe that the galaxies are moving away from one point, even though there is evidence of that? I thought you were asking about the time before the Big Bang... not the event, itself.
As for Evolution... there are transitional fossils in the fossil record. Evolution tells us that if you look at the layer of rock that is the right age, And in the right place... you will find those transitional fossils. Such as the one that links fish to amphibian. i think it is a bit easier to take the leap of faith in Evolution... than all of Mankind is the result of incest between a man and his rib that was perpetrated by a talking snake.
But, that's just me... and who am i to say... right?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
I guess I'm playing the devil's advocate more than anything, because I don't think man came from Adam and Eve, I don't believe a big flood wiped out every creature on earth except the ones put on on big ass ship - in short, I really don't think the old testament is too much more than a book of fables myself. With a little truth creeping in every now and then. I know all about the expansion theory. I have an earth science degree from a major university. I understand and agree with most of the science of the big bang theory. I'm just saying at the end of the day, we don't really know how the universe began.
Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth. Forget all the other stuff, just argue big bang over creation. I'll wait.
For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
One point I have always tried to make (as an atheist/agnostic) is that belief in evolution does not automatically negate religion. I was raised Methodist but my father was a veterinarian and he taught us very early about evolution. I honestly don't remember knowing that people actually refuted it until I got to college.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
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What if atheists published a 50 page introduction to the bible?
Why can't Christians let people have their beliefs?
they feel it is their duty to "save" people.
man kirk cameron is such a douche.
i like how it said "due to the number of atheists not being cordial in their responses, all comments have been disabled." lol, they can present their side of things but refuse to allow criticism of their message....how typical...what a joke...
I'd like to see Eddie kick Kirk Cameron in the balls really really hard
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth. Forget all the other stuff, just argue big bang over creation. I'll wait.
For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
One point I have always tried to make (as an atheist/agnostic) is that belief in evolution does not automatically negate religion. I was raised Methodist but my father was a veterinarian and he taught us very early about evolution. I honestly don't remember knowing that people actually refuted it until I got to college.
well which are you an atheist or an agnostic???
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I believe in creative design and I believe in evolution,but I think it was over seen by a Higher Power.
And you're allowed to have whatever beliefs you want.. but you can't teach them in science class because they're not science.
that's the main issue for me. intelligent design is NOT a scientific theory, but a religious one. evolution IS a scientific theory. they are NOT the same, at all. so evolution absolutely gets taught in science class whereas intelligent design does not belong there...at most, if a religious studies/theory class exists at the HS level, it could well be taught there. otherwise, it simply has NO place in a PUBLIC school curriculum.
One point I have always tried to make (as an atheist/agnostic) is that belief in evolution does not automatically negate religion. I was raised Methodist but my father was a veterinarian and he taught us very early about evolution. I honestly don't remember knowing that people actually refuted it until I got to college.
exactly.
i am not religious, but i was saying the same earlier. it is possible to believe in BOTH.
"Agnosticism (Greek: α- a-, without + γνώσις gnōsis, knowledge; after Gnosticism) is the philosophical view that the truth value of certain claims — particularly metaphysical claims regarding theology, afterlife or the existence of deities, spiritual beings, or even ultimate reality — are unknown or, in some forms of agnosticism, unknowable.[1] It is not a religious declaration in itself, and an agnostic may also be a theist or an atheist.[2]" - wikipedia
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
"Agnosticism (Greek: α- a-, without + γνώσις gnōsis, knowledge; after Gnosticism) is the philosophical view that the truth value of certain claims — particularly metaphysical claims regarding theology, afterlife or the existence of deities, spiritual beings, or even ultimate reality — are unknown or, in some forms of agnosticism, unknowable.[1] It is not a religious declaration in itself, and an agnostic may also be a theist or an atheist.[2]" - wikipedia
a bad place to end the definition and so...
An agnostic atheist is atheistic because he or she does not believe in the existence of any deity and is also agnostic because he or she does not claim to have definitive knowledge that a deity does not exist. The agnostic atheist may be contrasted with the agnostic theist, who does believe that one or more deities exist but does not claim to have definitive knowledge of this.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Sometimes science takes a leap of faith too. Someone please explain to me how the big bang theory is so much more believable than God creating the heavens and earth. Forget all the other stuff, just argue big bang over creation. I'll wait.
For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
One point I have always tried to make (as an atheist/agnostic) is that belief in evolution does not automatically negate religion. I was raised Methodist but my father was a veterinarian and he taught us very early about evolution. I honestly don't remember knowing that people actually refuted it until I got to college.
well which are you an atheist or an agnostic???
I am an Agnostic atheist.....seriously
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
"Agnosticism (Greek: α- a-, without + γνώσις gnōsis, knowledge; after Gnosticism) is the philosophical view that the truth value of certain claims — particularly metaphysical claims regarding theology, afterlife or the existence of deities, spiritual beings, or even ultimate reality — are unknown or, in some forms of agnosticism, unknowable.[1] It is not a religious declaration in itself, and an agnostic may also be a theist or an atheist.[2]" - wikipedia
a bad place to end the definition and so...
An agnostic atheist is atheistic because he or she does not believe in the existence of any deity and is also agnostic because he or she does not claim to have definitive knowledge that a deity does not exist. The agnostic atheist may be contrasted with the agnostic theist, who does believe that one or more deities exist but does not claim to have definitive knowledge of this.
I guess agnostic in the sense that I will not claim to understand the first second of the universe and while I do not feel any superior being is involved until science discovers the cause I am willing to leave a window open for the invisible man.
but I don't think it is likely
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
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How fucking closed-minded do you have to be in order to believe our world/universe is here just by an accidental set of circumstances.
About as delusional as you have to believe that a big human being in the sky that loves only humans made this all up 5000 years ago and is just throwing a bunch of tragedy at us to test our faith in him.
How fucking closed-minded do you have to be in order to believe our world/universe is here just by an accidental set of circumstances.
About as delusional as you have to believe that a big human being in the sky that loves only humans made this all up 5000 years ago and is just throwing a bunch of tragedy at us to test our faith in him.
That was the predictable response I was expecting.
How fucking closed-minded do you have to be in order to believe our world/universe is here just by an accidental set of circumstances.
...
'Closed minded'? How?
And yes... it is a random set of circumstances in a hostile environment that we live in.
At time time, in this space... life can exist. Move the Earth closer or further from the Sun... and things would be different. The Earth's core will cool, thus shutting down the machinery that creates the atmosphere... life ends. As the Sun cools, it will expand... consuming the terrestrial planets (Earth being one). The Milky Way Galaxy will collide with the Andromeda Galaxy... will more than likely change our planet (if it still even exists then).
Life on Earth exists because it is at the right distance, orbiting the right sized star... at this time... in this space in the Universe. This won't always be true.
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Comments
Which religion? I really dig Taoism, which does not (similar to most other Eastern religions as far as I know). It is not important to the Eastern philosophy. To most Christians, yes.
:?:
Before the "big bang" there was no such thing as space or time... there was no "before" the big bang. There was nothing, and then there was everything. This is quantum physics here... not some preachy religious shit. Again, I think most quantum physicists would agree that this screams of "creationism" which is why a lot of scientists who are atheists hate it, and ironically the fundamentalist religion folk don't know that and are trying to disprove it as well because they think it somehow is trying to disprove god.
The atheists use theory issues like the "horizon problem" to disprove the big bang because they think it screams creationism, and theists use the horizon problem to disprove it because they think the big bang theory is atheistic. Funny stuff... really.
if we were all non-violent hindus, we'd have peace on earth. so what's so great about christianity? if we were all the same and peaceful and loving, we'd have peace on earth. maybe if we were all stoned all the time, we'd have peace on earth.
i'm not saying the teachings are bad, but some pipe dream of universal utopia based on everyone adopting the same religious beliefs as you is a VERY dangerous idea.
science has nothing to do with moralism. why would it? do you really want our public schools teaching morals? whose morals? should we teach the secular humanism of tolerance for gays, or the bigotry of pentecostal visionaries that think homos are the spawn of satan? which one gets in? are our teachers the best equipped people to do this? or is it more appropriately something that should be taught by family, friends, community, or pastors?
No, no, no. Beliefs do not belong in the classroom. Scientific consensus belongs in the classroom. Is there any peer-reviewed scientific journals that advocate creationism? Just one?!?!
Morality... shit. "Morality," today, allows Moslems to stone women to death, as it once fueled the Christian witch-hunts. "Morality" has excused every war, and glorified some of them. "Morality" constantly plots to subvert the Constitutional guarantee of free speech. "Morality" inspires gay-bashing and the bombing of women's clinics. Why, without "morality" we might all suddenly go stark staring sane.
It is that religion shit that got us into most of the wars we're involved in right now, so it seems ironic that you think religion will cure all the world's problems.
Yes, Jesus was extraordinary - I agree. A lot can be learned from his teachings. But the same can be said about MLK, Ghandi, my grandpa, RFK, John Adams, Kurt Vonnegut, Eddie Vedder, and on and on... but I don't worship those dudes.
yes you are right sir
It's a nice story though....but it is just a story
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
i was watching a doco on noahs ark not too long ago and the one thing I found interesting was that the story looked to have been borred from earlier stories as a fable to tell small children. Granted their is no way to say that jesus did or did not exists. Perhaps their was some guy named jesus who lived arround that time, but was he the same guy describe in the bible? All i know about the bible was it not written 200 years or so after the fact?
but does not creative design be disproved by evolution, or at least the fossils we have found that show a gradual change in species over time. Perhaps you are right as it could be used as a simplistic example of how we came to be, but is it worth teaching as their would be far more important topics to be covered in a science class. Why should science improve the human condition in a moralistic way, does relgion do this. Or do people become good people out of selfish means so they can get into heaven?
But what version of the bible would we follow and how would we interpret it? this would probablly cause just as much hatered and violence as their is the the world today.
not from me you wont mate.
sorry guys a little sleep deprevied today (only got two hours) and sick
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For the record, I am a Christian and believe in evolution. I find a way to make both work. It just doesn't fit into most people's neat little beliefs.
Science does not exist to advance human morality. It is trying to explain the natural world that humans exist in. Just as it is not up to religion to explain things such as gravity, plate techtonics or biology. Both religion and science can live together, as long as one does not feel threatened by the existance of the other.
As for schools... keep religion in your churches. No one says you must also teach Evolution along side with your sermons... why is it okay to teach your religion to everyone?
And Christianity does not corner the market on morality. Morality is a human trait and does not only exist in the person that has religion. If Christians were more 'like Christ' in their everyday living... caring for the poor... the less fortunate... the weak, then us heathens would probably have more respect. Jesus was about forgiveness... not death penalties. Peace, not War. Turning the other cheek, not striking back in anger... with hatred. You talk about a peaceful world... if only everyone else were like you. Have you ever thought it would be a peaceful world... if you were just like me?
No one 'looks down' on Christians... so, you can shed that whole persecution thing. You are doing the exact same thing you claim to hate... grouping all Aetheists as one... when you hate being lumped to gether with all Christians.
Me? Personally? I have no problems with God, Jesus or Christianity. My problem arises with the people who follow Jesus in name only. Unforgiveness, intolerance, prejudice, war, indifference, exclusion... those are not the teachings of Jesus... yet, i see it in the lives of many, many of His followers.
Hail, Hail!!!
Science in not so much about answers... it is more about questions.
Science does not profess to know what existed before the Big Bang... but, Christianity has it neatly wrapped up in 5000 year old text? Wouldn't that mean, men... 5000 years ago knew more about our Universe than we know today... right?
...
Since no one has the answer... except the Christians... I can come up with my own hypothesis. The Big Bang was simply the start of the existance of this Universe we are experiencing at this time. It is a cycle. Explosion. Expansion. Equilibrium. Contraction. Compression. Explosion. Never ending... no beginning. We created God in order to give it meaning... when maybe there in no meaning... other than what we make of it.
I have no proof of this... but, at the purely logical level... it's just as good as the Bible's explanation. The biggest difference... I'm not telling eveyone else the I know the truth.
Hail, Hail!!!
But your beliefs take a leap of faith just as creation does. And although you're not telling everyone you know the truth, the reality is most people that believe 100% in the big bang theory do profess to know this as the truth, or at least the only possibility.
I don't believe the earth is 5,000 years old. I do believed humans evolved. But from what? Hard to say. But it's hard to once again take a leap of faith that we somehow evolved from a primordial ooze. How? No one has yet been able to generate life in a laboratory, and I suspect no one will.
Intelligent design isn't a "Legitimate alternative," it's idiot Christians grasping at straws as they admit that evolution is real but "God did it anyway."
And you're allowed to have whatever beliefs you want.. but you can't teach them in science class because they're not science.
That's because SCIENCE isn't moral... it's just a study of FACTS. ERg.
We would not. Our last president was an evangelical, claimed that Jesus was in his heart and he was a war monger and evil to the core. Like more evangelicals.
And you'd never lump people together like "the atheists," would you. Fuck, you people don't even listen o yourselves, do you?
Because if you were an astrophysicist or cosmologist you'd be able to prove it's existence on paper. It's been done. And they've got radio recordings of the echos it's made in space and even a sort of "photograph" of the remnants of it reflecting back from space. Kind of, I'm dumbing it way down.
And even the Pope can't prove that God is real. which is why teaching your fables doesn't belong in a school.
No. I am not taking a leap of faith because I know that I don't know.
As for the Big Bang... are you saying you do not believe that the galaxies are moving away from one point, even though there is evidence of that? I thought you were asking about the time before the Big Bang... not the event, itself.
As for Evolution... there are transitional fossils in the fossil record. Evolution tells us that if you look at the layer of rock that is the right age, And in the right place... you will find those transitional fossils. Such as the one that links fish to amphibian. i think it is a bit easier to take the leap of faith in Evolution... than all of Mankind is the result of incest between a man and his rib that was perpetrated by a talking snake.
But, that's just me... and who am i to say... right?
Hail, Hail!!!
One point I have always tried to make (as an atheist/agnostic) is that belief in evolution does not automatically negate religion. I was raised Methodist but my father was a veterinarian and he taught us very early about evolution. I honestly don't remember knowing that people actually refuted it until I got to college.
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
I'd like to see Eddie kick Kirk Cameron in the balls really really hard
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
well which are you an atheist or an agnostic???
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
that's the main issue for me. intelligent design is NOT a scientific theory, but a religious one. evolution IS a scientific theory. they are NOT the same, at all. so evolution absolutely gets taught in science class whereas intelligent design does not belong there...at most, if a religious studies/theory class exists at the HS level, it could well be taught there. otherwise, it simply has NO place in a PUBLIC school curriculum.
exactly.
i am not religious, but i was saying the same earlier. it is possible to believe in BOTH.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
a bad place to end the definition and so...
An agnostic atheist is atheistic because he or she does not believe in the existence of any deity and is also agnostic because he or she does not claim to have definitive knowledge that a deity does not exist. The agnostic atheist may be contrasted with the agnostic theist, who does believe that one or more deities exist but does not claim to have definitive knowledge of this.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I am an Agnostic atheist.....seriously
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
I guess agnostic in the sense that I will not claim to understand the first second of the universe and while I do not feel any superior being is involved until science discovers the cause I am willing to leave a window open for the invisible man.
but I don't think it is likely
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
So just to be safe we better throw in "it also could have been made by a lonely God in a big white dress so someone would worship him."
Fucking Christ.
About as delusional as you have to believe that a big human being in the sky that loves only humans made this all up 5000 years ago and is just throwing a bunch of tragedy at us to test our faith in him.
That was the predictable response I was expecting.
so what evidence are you basing your beliefs on?
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
'Closed minded'? How?
And yes... it is a random set of circumstances in a hostile environment that we live in.
At time time, in this space... life can exist. Move the Earth closer or further from the Sun... and things would be different. The Earth's core will cool, thus shutting down the machinery that creates the atmosphere... life ends. As the Sun cools, it will expand... consuming the terrestrial planets (Earth being one). The Milky Way Galaxy will collide with the Andromeda Galaxy... will more than likely change our planet (if it still even exists then).
Life on Earth exists because it is at the right distance, orbiting the right sized star... at this time... in this space in the Universe. This won't always be true.
Hail, Hail!!!