Voter ID

Gern Blansten · March 26

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

trump is making it a problem to try and gain a benefit....just like he keeps suing Comey and James

It's all bullshit. No need to blame dems

FiveBelow · March 26

ID is required for a multitude of "life" reasons. I would argue most are far more important than voting for who’s ultimately going to sell off the will of the people to the highest bidder. Both POOTWH and COOTWH had no problem coming up with the funds necessary to enable the obliteration of Gaza. Tell me we couldn't come up with a fraction of the cost to provide ID for those without. It’s not difficult, it just requires both sides to agree on common sense every once in a while. The majority support joining every other civilized country in requiring identification to vote, but duopoly gonna duopoly. Because they “can” and “do”.

mace1229 · March 26

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

The whole fact that it's up to each state on how to do federal elections is weird to me too. There should be federal guidelines, as far as mail in ballots, ID requirements, etc. Should be the same across the board for federal elections. Want to make it different on how you vote for city council, then fine. The fact that no one has ever done that is strange to me.

mace1229 · March 26

mickeyrat said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've never seen so many posts dedicated to excusing suppressing a right because of their own privilege.

Seriously, there are innumerable reasons why these "minimal hoops" could still be insurmountable, or at best, extremely difficult to jump through for a seemingly surprisingly large group of people. And following that up with "well these people probably don't even vote then" is a non sequitur.

According to this, you need ID to vote in Canada. So why is it wrong to implement the same policy here in the US?
https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=ids&document=index&lang=e

Someone without proof of residence or an ID will have the same trouble voting there as they would here if a standard ID is required. Seems pretty normal to require standard ID when voting to me.
Are you and PJSoul advocating for legislative change there if you're against ID for voting (serious question, do you think it should change)?

to be comparative though...did Canada attempt to pass a law requiring ID/passport six months before a major election?

I'm guessing probably not. But the same logic still applies, if standard ID is required in many countries around the world to vote, why is it acceptable there but suddenly inappropriate here? If no one should face any hurdles, no matter how big or small, then that should apply everywhere. But it seems like the US faces stronger criticism for the same thing.
Another reason I, and the majority of the country, is completely fine with requiring a standard ID check when voting and is a very reasonable request. Not a passport, but standard ID checks.

because its up to the individual states what they deem acceptable since they run elections.. you know as stated in the constitution.

I interpret that to mean the state is responsible for registration of voters, counting votes, fraud prevention, etc. I don't take it to mean the federal government can't set guidelines that each state must also follow.

HughFreakingDillon · March 26

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

it's pretty clear these days the democratic party is the party of wait and see.

PJ_Soul · March 26

mace1229 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've never seen so many posts dedicated to excusing suppressing a right because of their own privilege.

Seriously, there are innumerable reasons why these "minimal hoops" could still be insurmountable, or at best, extremely difficult to jump through for a seemingly surprisingly large group of people. And following that up with "well these people probably don't even vote then" is a non sequitur.

According to this, you need ID to vote in Canada. So why is it wrong to implement the same policy here in the US?
https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=ids&document=index&lang=e

Someone without proof of residence or an ID will have the same trouble voting there as they would here if a standard ID is required. Seems pretty normal to require standard ID when voting to me.
Are you and PJSoul advocating for legislative change there if you're against ID for voting (serious question, do you think it should change)?

I'm not against ID for voting. The situation in the US is particular to your country. But fwiw, if you show up at the polls here without ID, but instead with a utility bill with your name and address on it, plus just something with your name on it, like a credit card, you can still vote... or maybe even without the secondary piece, I can't quite recall. I just know there is a way around having ID.

Go Beavers · March 26

mace1229 said:

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

The whole fact that it's up to each state on how to do federal elections is weird to me too. There should be federal guidelines, as far as mail in ballots, ID requirements, etc. Should be the same across the board for federal elections. Want to make it different on how you vote for city council, then fine. The fact that no one has ever done that is strange to me.

It’s not weird when you factor in separation of power, states rights, and not funneling more power to the federal government.

Gern Blansten · March 26

PJ_Soul said:

mace1229 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I've never seen so many posts dedicated to excusing suppressing a right because of their own privilege.

Seriously, there are innumerable reasons why these "minimal hoops" could still be insurmountable, or at best, extremely difficult to jump through for a seemingly surprisingly large group of people. And following that up with "well these people probably don't even vote then" is a non sequitur.

According to this, you need ID to vote in Canada. So why is it wrong to implement the same policy here in the US?
https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=ids&document=index&lang=e

Someone without proof of residence or an ID will have the same trouble voting there as they would here if a standard ID is required. Seems pretty normal to require standard ID when voting to me.
Are you and PJSoul advocating for legislative change there if you're against ID for voting (serious question, do you think it should change)?

I'm not against ID for voting. The situation in the US is particular to your country. But fwiw, if you show up at the polls here without ID, but instead with a utility bill with your name and address on it, plus just something with your name on it, like a credit card, you can still vote... or maybe even without the secondary piece, I can't quite recall. I just know there is a way around having ID.

And compare this to here....after we bought a house and moved I had to go to the BMV because my license was expiring. I told them that we had just moved and had a different address. They wouldn't change it because I didn't have three bills or anything else that had my new address on it. I even brought them the closing statement and they still put my old address on my new ID. Ridiculous.

cincybearcat · March 26

Gern Blansten said:

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

trump is making it a problem to try and gain a benefit....just like he keeps suing Comey and James

It's all bullshit. No need to blame dems

I certainly blame all in power that did nothing despite some serious support from the people to do something. Dems, Old GOP, etc. We could have a reasonable solution in play now. It's a slam dunk issue, quit letting the fringe control your party.

Halifax2TheMax · March 26

*The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

To do what, exactly? Fix a problem that doesn’t exist? Makes perfect sense. Particularly seeing how the constitution specifically leaves the administration of elections to the states but fuck the constitution, eh?

Let’s federally legislate the disenfranchisement of millions of voters, or under the pier dwellers, and while we’re at it, let’s pick on the transgender. What a country.

HughFreakingDillon · March 26

Halifax2TheMax said:

*The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
To do what, exactly? Fix a problem that doesn’t exist? Makes perfect sense. Particularly seeing how the constitution specifically leaves the administration of elections to the states but fuck the constitution, eh?
Let’s federally legislate the disenfranchisement of millions of voters, or under the pier dwellers, and while we’re at it, let’s pick on the transgender. What a country.

if you send everyone a free ID, how is that disenfranchising anyone?

static111 · March 26

HughFreakingDillon said:

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

it's pretty clear these days the democratic party is the party of wait and see.

IMO they are currently the party of controlled opposition. “We are very sorry that a handful of different Dems keep breaking with the party to pass this abominable legislation, but that’s the reality of electoral politics in purple districts.” Over and over and over…

Halifax2TheMax · March 26

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

*The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
To do what, exactly? Fix a problem that doesn’t exist? Makes perfect sense. Particularly seeing how the constitution specifically leaves the administration of elections to the states but fuck the constitution, eh?
Let’s federally legislate the disenfranchisement of millions of voters, or under the pier dwellers, and while we’re at it, let’s pick on the transgender. What a country.

if you send everyone a free ID, how is that disenfranchising anyone?

*The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

“If” is a really big if and I don’t see the party of austerity, except when it comes to the 1%, providing free anything, particularly when it might result in more folks voting, especially the “others”. Many of the logistical hurdles will still exist even if issuing government ID is “free”.

Halifax2TheMax · March 26

*The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

From 1982 to 2025, Tennessee had 26 instances of election fraud. 26. The first one I clicked on and looked at was a convicted felon who shouldn’t have voted but did. 26 over 43 years in one state. The horror!

Virginia had 36 over the same time period and when I opened one instance to see what the fraud was, found this:

Robert Catron

Year:

2022

State:

VIRGINIA

Case Type:

CRIMINAL CONVICTION

Fraud Type:

BALLOT PETITION FRAUD

Outcome:

Robert Catron, of Virginia Beach, was charged with 10 felony counts of making false statements and election fraud. Catron, a campaign consultant for U.S. Rep. Scott Taylor, the GOP incumbent running for reelection in 2018 in the 2nd Congressional District of Virginia, signed notarized affidavits falsely claiming that he had witnessed voters signing ballot petitions to qualify Shaun Brown, a Democrat, on the ballot as an Independent in order to take away votes from the Democratic nominee (Taylor’s main opponent). The voters’ signatures were forgeries of deceased individuals and former residents. Catron pleaded no contest to three misdemeanor charges of willful neglect of duty by an election officer in exchange for dismissal of the other charges and received a three-year suspended sentence with an order to maintain good behavior for one year. He was also assessed $8,301 in fines and court costs.

I’m not sure requiring ID at the polls would have prevented this.

Regardless, someone do the maths and be honest about what is driving the purge of voter rolls, whether it’s proving citizenship to register to vote or providing government issued ID at the polls. Tejas needs to get its shit together, though, with 113 instances.

https://electionfraud.heritage.org/

Tim Simmons · March 27

cincybearcat said:

Tim Simmons said:

Because it is popular on both sides to have an ID to vote. The problem isn’t that. It’s the hurdles (however big or small, or however you personally deem them big or small) that people need to get an ID to vote which is a constitutional right to do with minimal impediment.

Here's the deal, you are right that it is popular. And instead of owning it and getting done a realistic proposal while they controlled the government, they became the party of "No", instead of "yes, but...". They lost control of the issue by doing nothing and then losing control of the government. And now we have the MAGA party doing crazy shit. Would they have done it anyhow...probably. Would it have gone over like a wet blanket if there were already reasonable requirements in place defined by the Dems...probably.

Sitting and doing nothing while you have control has become pretty standard it seems. Hell - they waited till the 11th hour on immigration. Had they done that early in Biden term, I'd be interested to see where we would be.

And yes I understand MAGA is different and trump is very different so maybe it wouldn't have mattered THIS TIME. But we had many many man many years for each of these issues.

That’s right. They should have fixed a thing that’s absolutely not been a problem.

Tim Simmons · March 27

To be more clear, my quoted opinion is only that BECAUSE Trump decided to whine about this. I’ve said it several times in this thread, voter fraud is not an issue. I’m glad we are spending so much time discussing it.

Tim Simmons · March 27

.

Tim Simmons · March 27

Only one party has dramatically shifted in an extreme direction. And normalization of that will make the other party seem like an extreme party as well.

Biden was middle of the road as fuck and everyone is all ‘oh he wants to provide some economic relief and to be nice to people, what a goddamned hippy Marxist’. Meanwhile the other party is ‘let’s get rid of the brown ones’ and everyone is ‘well that’s a troubling position but the other guys are way worse be cause we can’t use the r word when trying to be funny or mean’.

eddiec · March 27

Trump knows the Save America act won't pass, and he doesn't want it to pass. This way he can blame the midterms on voter fraud and blame the democrats for blocking it. And his followers will believe him.

And that's the same for red states- because if they fix the non-existent voter fraud, then what? They lose a big issue that they've created.

The democrats should call the bluff. They should make an easy and free path for all citizens in blue run states to obtain a state verfified voting ID.

Gern Blansten · March 27

Tim Simmons said:

Only one party has dramatically shifted in an extreme direction. And normalization of that will make the other party seem like an extreme party as well.

Biden was middle of the road as fuck and everyone is all ‘oh he wants to provide some economic relief and to be nice to people, what a goddamned hippy Marxist’. Meanwhile the other party is ‘let’s get rid of the brown ones’ and everyone is ‘well that’s a troubling position but the other guys are way worse be cause we can’t use the r word when trying to be funny or mean’.

So was Obama. As a former repub it kills me to keep hearing the ACA get trashed when it basically mimicked the MA plan that Romney championed.

Voter ID

Comments

Robert Catron

Year:

State:

Case Type:

Fraud Type:

Outcome:

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