Percentage of Canadians whose vote was impacted by their negative feelings towards Trump? Certainly not zero. Don't say Trump doesn't have coattails...he very well have delivered that victory yesterday.
Trump was a factor well before the 51st state stuff. I said it years ago, months ago, weeks ago..... if a Canadian Conservative Party wants to run Canada... they need to do everything in their power to avoid comparisons to the populist tactics that Trump uses daily. They did not. They lost.
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
Percentage of Canadians whose vote was impacted by their negative feelings towards Trump? Certainly not zero. Don't say Trump doesn't have coattails...he very well have delivered that victory yesterday.
Trump was a factor well before the 51st state stuff. I said it years ago, months ago, weeks ago..... if a Canadian Conservative Party wants to run Canada... they need to do everything in their power to avoid comparisons to the populist tactics that Trump uses daily. They did not. They lost.
Exactly. Additionally, Poilievre is an elitist who acts like he's holier than thou. Good on Bruce Fanjoy to unseat him in his Carleton riding. We haven't had any door visits from a provincial or federal candidate in eight years and we live 30 minutes from downtown Toronto. Part of Fanjoy's success story is that he apparently spent significant time the past two years going door-to-door asking for people's support. That's all it took.
Percentage of Canadians whose vote was impacted by their negative feelings towards Trump? Certainly not zero. Don't say Trump doesn't have coattails...he very well have delivered that victory yesterday.
Trump was a factor well before the 51st state stuff. I said it years ago, months ago, weeks ago..... if a Canadian Conservative Party wants to run Canada... they need to do everything in their power to avoid comparisons to the populist tactics that Trump uses daily. They did not. They lost.
Exactly. Additionally, Poilievre is an elitist who acts like he's holier than thou. Good on Bruce Fanjoy to unseat him in his Carleton riding. We haven't had any door visits from a provincial or federal candidate in eight years and we live 30 minutes from downtown Toronto. Part of Fanjoy's success story is that he apparently spent significant time the past two years going door-to-door asking for people's support. That's all it took.
One of my good friends is in Pierre's riding... a few days before the election I asked what the scene is like there. In the 7 or 8 days leading up to the election, he had NINE people at his door campaigning. 5 for Pierre, 4 for Bruce.
My only thought was 'that must have been crazy annoying' lol
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
Just seeing some of the American media's take on our election and the general consensus is that the Liberals were the "Anti-Trump" party.
Am I the only Canadian not buying that analogy? It also speaks volumes to America's liberal media.
I agree that Pierre and the Conservatives as a while used similar tactics... but I don't think any one of the parties were anywhere close to being "Pro-Trump." Thoughts?
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
Just seeing some of the American media's take on our election and the general consensus is that the Liberals were the "Anti-Trump" party.
Am I the only Canadian not buying that analogy? It also speaks volumes to America's liberal media.
I agree that Pierre and the Conservatives as a while used similar tactics... but I don't think any one of the parties were anywhere close to being "Pro-Trump." Thoughts?
I don't think that the liberals being "the anti-Trump party" leads to the Conservatives being the pro-Trump party at all, and i don't think that is what the US media was trying to suggest.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So now the Conservatives aren’t MAGA North? Seems like the election was run on just that premise but I’m too biased to see things clearly.
What??
PP definitely ran a campaign that reminded people of Trump in several ways, and that is very off-putting and makes a lot of people wary. His brand of populism is what will inch Canada closer and closer to a real MAGA-equivalent situation. That still doesn't mean PP ran a "pro-Trump" campaign.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So now the Conservatives aren’t MAGA North? Seems like the election was run on just that premise but I’m too biased to see things clearly.
What??
PP definitely ran a campaign that reminded people of Trump in several ways, and that is very off-putting and makes a lot of people wary. His brand of populism is what will inch Canada closer and closer to a real MAGA-equivalent situation. That still doesn't mean PP ran a "pro-Trump" campaign.
A claim I asked numerous times to be proven and all I’ve ever gotten was his style…that was incredibly reminiscent of Justin circa 2015.
I suppose it’s the supporters that are seen as MAGA.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
So now the Conservatives aren’t MAGA North? Seems like the election was run on just that premise but I’m too biased to see things clearly.
What??
PP definitely ran a campaign that reminded people of Trump in several ways, and that is very off-putting and makes a lot of people wary. His brand of populism is what will inch Canada closer and closer to a real MAGA-equivalent situation. That still doesn't mean PP ran a "pro-Trump" campaign.
A claim I asked numerous times to be proven and all I’ve ever gotten was his style…that was incredibly reminiscent of Justin circa 2015.
I suppose it’s the supporters that are seen as MAGA.
Some of his supporters are definitely presenting as a real problem IMO. The freedom trucker types, the ones hung up about LGBTQ and trans issues, the anti-choicers, etc etc... and the actual Canadian Trump supporters, who absolutely mystify me. Some of them actually donated to Trump's campaign. What the fuck is that about?? So weird. My mom's neighbor is one of them (and pretty fanatically religious). She just comes off as nuts.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I think what really took the wind out of PP's sails, though, wasn't anti-Trump sentiments. It was losing Trudeau as his punching bag. So many of his supporters seemed to emotionally thrive on hating JT, and once he was gone, a lot of the hot air was let out of the balloon.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So now the Conservatives aren’t MAGA North? Seems like the election was run on just that premise but I’m too biased to see things clearly.
What??
PP definitely ran a campaign that reminded people of Trump in several ways, and that is very off-putting and makes a lot of people wary. His brand of populism is what will inch Canada closer and closer to a real MAGA-equivalent situation. That still doesn't mean PP ran a "pro-Trump" campaign.
A claim I asked numerous times to be proven and all I’ve ever gotten was his style…that was incredibly reminiscent of Justin circa 2015.
I suppose it’s the supporters that are seen as MAGA.
Some of his supporters are definitely presenting as a real problem IMO. The freedom trucker types, the ones hung up about LGBTQ and trans issues, the anti-choicers, etc etc... and the actual Canadian Trump supporters, who absolutely mystify me. Some of them actually donated to Trump's campaign. What the fuck is that about?? So weird. My mom's neighbor is one of them (and pretty fanatically religious). She just comes off as nuts.
I wonder how representative the groups you listed are of the larger movement. Obviously here those types get played up and are used to belittle Conservatives in general.
And it needs to be recognized that the other side doesn’t see “progressives” in a positive light. What’s good for the goose, I guess.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
So now the Conservatives aren’t MAGA North? Seems like the election was run on just that premise but I’m too biased to see things clearly.
What??
PP definitely ran a campaign that reminded people of Trump in several ways, and that is very off-putting and makes a lot of people wary. His brand of populism is what will inch Canada closer and closer to a real MAGA-equivalent situation. That still doesn't mean PP ran a "pro-Trump" campaign.
A claim I asked numerous times to be proven and all I’ve ever gotten was his style…that was incredibly reminiscent of Justin circa 2015.
I suppose it’s the supporters that are seen as MAGA.
Some of his supporters are definitely presenting as a real problem IMO. The freedom trucker types, the ones hung up about LGBTQ and trans issues, the anti-choicers, etc etc... and the actual Canadian Trump supporters, who absolutely mystify me. Some of them actually donated to Trump's campaign. What the fuck is that about?? So weird. My mom's neighbor is one of them (and pretty fanatically religious). She just comes off as nuts.
I wonder how representative the groups you listed are of the larger movement. Obviously here those types get played up and are used to belittle Conservatives in general.
And it needs to be recognized that the other side doesn’t see “progressives” in a positive light. What’s good for the goose, I guess.
That's why I said "some". Obviously others are just economically conservative and thought PP could do better for the economy in the way they think it should be done. Others are super anti-immigrant (my family included - my sister is actually straight up racist), and/or really into the tough on crime thing... of course, who besides criminals isn't interested in being tough on crime?? I feel like all voters want change on that front. Hopefully Carney knows that. I'm pretty sure he does.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,163
Call me naive or, better yet, educate me. I thought Canada was above this.
Canada narrowly missed a far-right prime minister. But we’re not in the clear yet
After a snap election, weeks of breathless campaigning and a surprisingly close race, Mark Carney has been elected prime minister of Canada.
It’s a win for Liberals, who were rightly nervous that former prime
minister Justin Trudeau’s poor performance and late-stage missteps might
cost them this election. But Carney’s win isn’t as comforting as it
should be, especially when we look at all the events leading up to it.
Canada narrowly missed a far-right prime minister. But we’re not in the clear yet
After a snap election, weeks of breathless campaigning and a surprisingly close race, Mark Carney has been elected prime minister of Canada.
It’s a win for Liberals, who were rightly nervous that former prime
minister Justin Trudeau’s poor performance and late-stage missteps might
cost them this election. But Carney’s win isn’t as comforting as it
should be, especially when we look at all the events leading up to it.
More at link.
Ever since Trump's first term, that kind of shit has been slowly bleeding over the boarder and taking hold. No nation is immune to right wing populism.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,163
Canada narrowly missed a far-right prime minister. But we’re not in the clear yet
After a snap election, weeks of breathless campaigning and a surprisingly close race, Mark Carney has been elected prime minister of Canada.
It’s a win for Liberals, who were rightly nervous that former prime
minister Justin Trudeau’s poor performance and late-stage missteps might
cost them this election. But Carney’s win isn’t as comforting as it
should be, especially when we look at all the events leading up to it.
More at link.
Ever since Trump's first term, that kind of shit has been slowly bleeding over the boarder and taking hold. No nation is immune to right wing populism.
That's both sad and scary. Sometimes it feels like most of the world in going radical right. That just feels flat out crazy to me.
Canada narrowly missed a far-right prime minister. But we’re not in the clear yet
After a snap election, weeks of breathless campaigning and a surprisingly close race, Mark Carney has been elected prime minister of Canada.
It’s a win for Liberals, who were rightly nervous that former prime
minister Justin Trudeau’s poor performance and late-stage missteps might
cost them this election. But Carney’s win isn’t as comforting as it
should be, especially when we look at all the events leading up to it.
More at link.
Despite the assertions of most here, the Conservative Party of Canada is nowhere near far right. The closest would be Bernier’s PPC which were less of a contender in the election than the Green Party.
The article is long on claims but doesn’t back them up with more than innuendo and refuses to acknowledge the nastiness the other side has flung at the Conservatives (often led by the former Prime Minister). How long do people intend on holding a grudge against the Freedom Convoy, and continue shitting on their fellow citizens? A convoy that was supported by the Conservatives in no material way but gets tied directly to the party.
I sincerely hope that PJ Soul’s right that Carney will see that law and order needs to be addressed urgently but their proposals didn’t include any real change, even presenting a 40 year old law as if it didn’t exist. Time will tell.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
It's more far right than it was in the days of Joe Clark and Mulroney. Ever since Preston Manning entered the scene. It's been progressively swinging further right.
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I wouldn't go so far as to call the Conservatives "far right" ... like perhaps not even close. To Darth's point, I think that's being mis labelled in the media. If you buy into or read into what some.. not all.. but some media outlets are saying, you would think that the Conservatives are similar to the PPC which to what Darth is saying.. is nowhere even close.
No disrespect intended to Darth.. but more often than not... you reply with a lot of 'what about isms.' And giving the benefit of the doubt... there are of course issues with both parties as well as their supporters.
That said... the degree to which behaviour and language is used to throw shade at either party is to me at least remarkably one sided. And I cannot personally stress enough how important this is.
If you need any proof of that... show me the "F*ck Polievre" flags. I honestly feel bad for folks on the right who are just beyond rationale and class.
As an example... i work with one in particular and we were in a meeting yesterday. Someone at some point made a quip about "elbows up, eh!" and right on cue she instantly turned into an Eeyore and said quite loud "That is so ridiculously pathetic." To be clear, she is Pro-Trump Canadian. It boggles my mind personally... but what I cannot figure out is the behaviour. Any issue that is ever brought up about it, she turns quite simply mean and rude.
Setting aside the dumpster fire that is the internet... I personally know people and have spoken to people who have a burning hatred of all that is Liberal (including but not limited to the above). They believe anyone who voted Liberal is a moron. They despise Canada. They believe we are completely doomed and all of their problems are because of Liberals.
Where does this come from?
In the last few years... I can easily draw a line between that mentality, right wing media, Trump, and yes, very much so... Mr. Polievre. And I'm not the only one who saw this coming. If you read or watch real journalists discuss this stuff as well as former Conservatives like Erin O'Toole... they all warned against the rhetoric. Pierre doubled down on the rhetoric wherever possible. It hurt him, it hurt his party and I personally believe it hurts the country as a whole.
Contrast that with those who are Pro-Liberal. I don't see the vitriol and angst against Canadian Conservatism even in the face of recent populist tactics. I've seen them get uglier and band together against Trump of late. The 51st state talk is what is prompting that in my opinion.
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Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
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Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
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Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
"every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"
Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
agreed. I think a key X factor here is media. Every form of media.. but in particular non traditional media. YouTube, FC, insta.. you name it. These outlets are completely unchecked. Folks have become absurdly popular for no other reason other than echoing fearmongering sentiments in the name of a particular 'side.' And a lot of the public eat it up.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
agreed. I think a key X factor here is media. Every form of media.. but in particular non traditional media. YouTube, FC, insta.. you name it. These outlets are completely unchecked. Folks have become absurdly popular for no other reason other than echoing fearmongering sentiments in the name of a particular 'side.' And a lot of the public eat it up.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
One thing that Stephen Harper said that resonated with me - is to be skeptical of politicians that speak with a lot of emotionality, because it’s often an act.
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EV
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Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
agreed. I think a key X factor here is media. Every form of media.. but in particular non traditional media. YouTube, FC, insta.. you name it. These outlets are completely unchecked. Folks have become absurdly popular for no other reason other than echoing fearmongering sentiments in the name of a particular 'side.' And a lot of the public eat it up.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
One thing that Stephen Harper said that resonated with me - is to be skeptical of politicians that speak with a lot of emotionality, because it’s often an act.
I like my politicians the same way I like my news anchors and my hotdogs.... boring. lol (i only use mustard and mustard only)
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
agreed. I think a key X factor here is media. Every form of media.. but in particular non traditional media. YouTube, FC, insta.. you name it. These outlets are completely unchecked. Folks have become absurdly popular for no other reason other than echoing fearmongering sentiments in the name of a particular 'side.' And a lot of the public eat it up.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
One thing that Stephen Harper said that resonated with me - is to be skeptical of politicians that speak with a lot of emotionality, because it’s often an act.
I like my politicians the same way I like my news anchors and my hotdogs.... boring. lol (i only use mustard and mustard only)
I’m a ketchup on hot dog kind of guy, but I love a good mustard on a great sausage.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
agreed. I think a key X factor here is media. Every form of media.. but in particular non traditional media. YouTube, FC, insta.. you name it. These outlets are completely unchecked. Folks have become absurdly popular for no other reason other than echoing fearmongering sentiments in the name of a particular 'side.' And a lot of the public eat it up.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
One thing that Stephen Harper said that resonated with me - is to be skeptical of politicians that speak with a lot of emotionality, because it’s often an act.
I like my politicians the same way I like my news anchors and my hotdogs.... boring. lol (i only use mustard and mustard only)
I’m a ketchup on hot dog kind of guy, but I love a good mustard on a great sausage.
mustard isn't good for you on that part of the body.
"every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"
Canadian conservatives aren't far right. If you compare to the US, they aren't even really right. lol.
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
agreed. I think a key X factor here is media. Every form of media.. but in particular non traditional media. YouTube, FC, insta.. you name it. These outlets are completely unchecked. Folks have become absurdly popular for no other reason other than echoing fearmongering sentiments in the name of a particular 'side.' And a lot of the public eat it up.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
One thing that Stephen Harper said that resonated with me - is to be skeptical of politicians that speak with a lot of emotionality, because it’s often an act.
I know that some thought JT was full of shit, but I found him refreshing in his ability to be emotional. That spoke to me. I don't think he's good enough of an actor to pull that off.
"every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"
Comments
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
2013: LA 1 & LA 2, Vancouver
2018: Seattle 1 & Seattle 2
2022: LA 1 & LA 2
2024: Vancouver 1 & Vancouver 2, Portland, Seattle 1 & Seattle 2
2025: Nashville 1 & 2, Raleigh 1 & 2
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnmgL5CZqfs
My only thought was 'that must have been crazy annoying' lol
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
Am I the only Canadian not buying that analogy? It also speaks volumes to America's liberal media.
I agree that Pierre and the Conservatives as a while used similar tactics... but I don't think any one of the parties were anywhere close to being "Pro-Trump." Thoughts?
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
I suppose it’s the supporters that are seen as MAGA.
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
Some of his supporters are definitely presenting as a real problem IMO. The freedom trucker types, the ones hung up about LGBTQ and trans issues, the anti-choicers, etc etc... and the actual Canadian Trump supporters, who absolutely mystify me. Some of them actually donated to Trump's campaign. What the fuck is that about?? So weird. My mom's neighbor is one of them (and pretty fanatically religious). She just comes off as nuts.
And it needs to be recognized that the other side doesn’t see “progressives” in a positive light. What’s good for the goose, I guess.
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
That's why I said "some". Obviously others are just economically conservative and thought PP could do better for the economy in the way they think it should be done. Others are super anti-immigrant (my family included - my sister is actually straight up racist), and/or really into the tough on crime thing... of course, who besides criminals isn't interested in being tough on crime?? I feel like all voters want change on that front. Hopefully Carney knows that. I'm pretty sure he does.
Canada narrowly missed a far-right prime minister. But we’re not in the clear yet
After a snap election, weeks of breathless campaigning and a surprisingly close race, Mark Carney has been elected prime minister of Canada. It’s a win for Liberals, who were rightly nervous that former prime minister Justin Trudeau’s poor performance and late-stage missteps might cost them this election. But Carney’s win isn’t as comforting as it should be, especially when we look at all the events leading up to it.
Ever since Trump's first term, that kind of shit has been slowly bleeding over the boarder and taking hold. No nation is immune to right wing populism.
That's both sad and scary. Sometimes it feels like most of the world in going radical right. That just feels flat out crazy to me.
The article is long on claims but doesn’t back them up with more than innuendo and refuses to acknowledge the nastiness the other side has flung at the Conservatives (often led by the former Prime Minister). How long do people intend on holding a grudge against the Freedom Convoy, and continue shitting on their fellow citizens? A convoy that was supported by the Conservatives in no material way but gets tied directly to the party.
I sincerely hope that PJ Soul’s right that Carney will see that law and order needs to be addressed urgently but their proposals didn’t include any real change, even presenting a 40 year old law as if it didn’t exist. Time will tell.
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
2013: LA 1 & LA 2, Vancouver
2018: Seattle 1 & Seattle 2
2022: LA 1 & LA 2
2024: Vancouver 1 & Vancouver 2, Portland, Seattle 1 & Seattle 2
2025: Nashville 1 & 2, Raleigh 1 & 2
No disrespect intended to Darth.. but more often than not... you reply with a lot of 'what about isms.' And giving the benefit of the doubt... there are of course issues with both parties as well as their supporters.
That said... the degree to which behaviour and language is used to throw shade at either party is to me at least remarkably one sided. And I cannot personally stress enough how important this is.
If you need any proof of that... show me the "F*ck Polievre" flags. I honestly feel bad for folks on the right who are just beyond rationale and class.
As an example... i work with one in particular and we were in a meeting yesterday. Someone at some point made a quip about "elbows up, eh!" and right on cue she instantly turned into an Eeyore and said quite loud "That is so ridiculously pathetic." To be clear, she is Pro-Trump Canadian. It boggles my mind personally... but what I cannot figure out is the behaviour. Any issue that is ever brought up about it, she turns quite simply mean and rude.
Setting aside the dumpster fire that is the internet... I personally know people and have spoken to people who have a burning hatred of all that is Liberal (including but not limited to the above). They believe anyone who voted Liberal is a moron. They despise Canada. They believe we are completely doomed and all of their problems are because of Liberals.
Where does this come from?
In the last few years... I can easily draw a line between that mentality, right wing media, Trump, and yes, very much so... Mr. Polievre. And I'm not the only one who saw this coming. If you read or watch real journalists discuss this stuff as well as former Conservatives like Erin O'Toole... they all warned against the rhetoric. Pierre doubled down on the rhetoric wherever possible. It hurt him, it hurt his party and I personally believe it hurts the country as a whole.
Contrast that with those who are Pro-Liberal. I don't see the vitriol and angst against Canadian Conservatism even in the face of recent populist tactics. I've seen them get uglier and band together against Trump of late. The 51st state talk is what is prompting that in my opinion.
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
To your point, though, Parksy, I'm not excusing the behaviour, but we simply can't expect people to have the same derision towards politicians who haven't been in power, who they don't personally blame for all of their/the country's woes. They haven't been in power in a decade. I think it's natural that there is going to be at least some degree of higher doses of anger towards the party/PM that has had the reigns.
But you're right. You simply don't hear "c*ntservatives" or anything vile like that on the left that you see on the right. You don't see the level of glee from a liberal when a conservative is hurting like you see when a con has "owned the libs". Some, yes, but nowhere near the same amount.
It's always interesting to me to hear both sides saying how much hatred their values show. To me it's 100% clear who is more hateful and angry.
For those in the know... picture Rhea Perlman's character from Canadian Bacon when she was watching the propaganda news outlets purposely lying and engaging in misinformation to make people against Canada. (talk about foreshadowing)
While satirical, I think what we were watching then in 1993 I think is now extremely common for everyday people who don't need to wait until the 6 o clock news to get their brain sauce... they get it constantly 24/7. Mix in algorithms.... and here we are.
I often chat with people about the differences between Jordan Peterson and Noam Chomsky. One thing is very, very, very apparent. Emotion. Chomsky is dull and pedantic... where as Peterson rose to fame using anger and emotion. Any topic can be discussed and debated.... but usually to do that correctly it requires a substantial amount of time and information. Using fear and anger and sometimes humour is far more effective especially with folks nowadays who don't have patience or any kind of long attention span. Not only is it effective... it becomes lucrative.
Because of the election... I've been diversifying my social media portfolio for lack of a better term. I look up right wing pages, conservative politicians, etc. It's neat to see where the algorithms start directing me lol One lady who seemed fairly popular was ranting and raving about Carney and Trudeau destroying the country. The same old sky is falling and we're all doomed bullshit. Checked a few posts and a few weeks earlier she was bragging and showing off her and her girlfriends vacationing in Whistler living it up. I guess the Liberal economic destruction missed her. lol
I did notice a pattern with some though. There is an organization online called "Canada Proud." It's the same right wing, conservative talking points, misinformation, propaganda stuff... with of course a link to donate and a merch store lol. The Trump playbook.
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1