Ukraine

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  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,634
    Boy is there some whataboutism and Stockholm Syndrome baked into these statements lol
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,634
    This is like when people say "if Obama wasn't President we never would have gotten Trump" lol and the justification behind it. The mental gymnastics yeesh
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,975
    Jearlpam0925 said:
    Boy is there some whataboutism and Stockholm Syndrome baked into these statements lol
    Do tell.  I am actually surprised I received several rapid fire responses on this.  Obama did laugh off Russia as a threat.  And now we have MAGA pretending Russia is the victim instead of the aggressor.  We have come a long way from when all Americans (or most anyhow) understood the threat Russia is/was/will be.  


    hippiemom = goodness
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 10,354
    edited March 6
    My issue is that the statement made it seem that they were apples to apples comparisons, when really its that both are just fruit, to stick with the analogy. 

    The lack of Obama urgency and seriousness is in no way comparable to what MAGA thinks about Russia or Putin. Obama knew Putin was a threat, but it can also be that Putin pulled back knowing that Obama was a threat to him. Trump was always in Putins corner even before his run in 2015. So Putin got bolder and MAGA got warmer. But the 2 approaches to Russia are in now way similar. 
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,975
    Tim Simmons said:
    My issue is that the statement made it seem that they were apples to apples comparisons, when really its that both are just fruit, to stick with the analogy. 

    The lack of Obama urgency and seriousness is in no way comparable to what MAGA thinks about Russia or Putin. Obama knew Putin was a threat, but it can also be that Putin pulled back knowing that Obama was a threat to him. Trump was always in Putins corner even before his run in 2015. So Putin got bolder and MAGA got warmer. But the 2 approachers to Russia are in now way similar.


    Yeah wasn't my intent to make the equal in anyway.  Just that it is crazy that the MAGA of today aligns more closely with Obama's opinion of Russia in 2012 then it does their own party.  Freakin MAGA has changed the GOP from "tear down that wall", to "tear down your neighbors wall and build a condo"
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Lerxst1992
    Lerxst1992 Posts: 8,545
    Jearlpam0925 said:
    This is like when people say "if Obama wasn't President we never would have gotten Trump" lol and the justification behind it. The mental gymnastics yeesh
    “ It was April of 2011. For weeks, Donald Trump had been fanning the flames of the “birther” movement and attacking President Barack Obama on television — demanding that Obama produce his birth certificate, implying that he was not born in the United States, and questioning both his religious identity and the legality of his presidency.

    But on April 30, the tables were turned. Trump was the recipient of President Obama’s jokes at the White House Correspondents’ Dinner — and Trump political adviser Roger Stone tells FRONTLINE in The Choice 2016that the dinner was a turning point for Trump.

    “I think that is the night he resolves to run for president,” Stone says in the opening scene of FRONTLINE’s two-hour documentary on Trump and Clinton, which premieres on Tues., Sept. 27 at 9 p.m. EST/8 p.m. CST on PBS stations nationwide.

    “I think that he is kind of motivated by it: ‘Maybe I’ll just run. Maybe I’ll show them all,’” Stone adds.

    …

    definitely maybe.
  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,715
    Without Obama, we don't get Trump.

    That doesn't make it Obama's fault.
    1995 Milwaukee   1998 Alpine, Alpine     2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston     2004 Boston, Boston     2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty)     2011 Alpine, Alpine    2013 Wrigley     2014 St. Paul     2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley     2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley     2021 Asbury Park     2022 St Louis     2023 Austin, Austin   2024 Napa, Wrigley, Wrigley   2025 Nashville (II)
  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,818
    cincybearcat said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    My issue is that the statement made it seem that they were apples to apples comparisons, when really its that both are just fruit, to stick with the analogy. 

    The lack of Obama urgency and seriousness is in no way comparable to what MAGA thinks about Russia or Putin. Obama knew Putin was a threat, but it can also be that Putin pulled back knowing that Obama was a threat to him. Trump was always in Putins corner even before his run in 2015. So Putin got bolder and MAGA got warmer. But the 2 approachers to Russia are in now way similar.


    Yeah wasn't my intent to make the equal in anyway.  Just that it is crazy that the MAGA of today aligns more closely with Obama's opinion of Russia in 2012 then it does their own party.  Freakin MAGA has changed the GOP from "tear down that wall", to "tear down your neighbors wall and build a condo"
    Obama was a Putin sympathizer / apologist? 
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,975
    Merkin Baller said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    My issue is that the statement made it seem that they were apples to apples comparisons, when really its that both are just fruit, to stick with the analogy. 

    The lack of Obama urgency and seriousness is in no way comparable to what MAGA thinks about Russia or Putin. Obama knew Putin was a threat, but it can also be that Putin pulled back knowing that Obama was a threat to him. Trump was always in Putins corner even before his run in 2015. So Putin got bolder and MAGA got warmer. But the 2 approachers to Russia are in now way similar.


    Yeah wasn't my intent to make the equal in anyway.  Just that it is crazy that the MAGA of today aligns more closely with Obama's opinion of Russia in 2012 then it does their own party.  Freakin MAGA has changed the GOP from "tear down that wall", to "tear down your neighbors wall and build a condo"
    Obama was a Putin sympathizer / apologist? 
    More closely....sheesh this is tiring.  MAGA are Putin apologist....that is clsoer to Obama thinking Russia isn't an adversary vs Romney GOP position at the time that they are the biggest threat to the USA.  Regardless, I'm done here. 
    hippiemom = goodness
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 31,017
    cincybearcat said:
    Merkin Baller said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    My issue is that the statement made it seem that they were apples to apples comparisons, when really its that both are just fruit, to stick with the analogy. 

    The lack of Obama urgency and seriousness is in no way comparable to what MAGA thinks about Russia or Putin. Obama knew Putin was a threat, but it can also be that Putin pulled back knowing that Obama was a threat to him. Trump was always in Putins corner even before his run in 2015. So Putin got bolder and MAGA got warmer. But the 2 approachers to Russia are in now way similar.


    Yeah wasn't my intent to make the equal in anyway.  Just that it is crazy that the MAGA of today aligns more closely with Obama's opinion of Russia in 2012 then it does their own party.  Freakin MAGA has changed the GOP from "tear down that wall", to "tear down your neighbors wall and build a condo"
    Obama was a Putin sympathizer / apologist? 
    More closely....sheesh this is tiring.  MAGA are Putin apologist....that is clsoer to Obama thinking Russia isn't an adversary vs Romney GOP position at the time that they are the biggest threat to the USA.  Regardless, I'm done here. 
    Wait, what was the middle thing you said earlier?
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357

    Italian PM Meloni proposed extending NATO’s Article 5 to Ukraine without full membership.

    “This is not NATO accession but an expansion of the security umbrella that NATO countries have, including in Ukraine.”
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  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357
    The destruction of the US Defense industry continues as Denmark signs a deal with Norway to replace its US-made Harpoon missiles with Norwegian variants.

    And the best part? Denmark sent ts US missiles to Ukraine.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357
    French Eutelsat is preparing to replace Starlink in Ukraine and plans to send about 40,000 communication terminals.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 40,117
    Obama saying that was also 13 years ago. 
    Your boos mean nothing to me, for I have seen what makes you cheer



  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357
    "A ballistic missile struck an ordinary hotel. Just before the attack, volunteers from a humanitarian organization – citizens of Ukraine, the United States, and the United Kingdom – had checked into the hotel."
    -President Zelenskyy
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357
    Turkey says it will join Europe and Canada in deploying troops to Ukraine to ensure a lasting peace.

    - Reuters
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    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357

    Today, the Chinese said they are against peace talks without the EU and Ukraine. This statement carries a lot of weight. It means that any agreement that Trump and Putin agree on will have no international weight or acceptability. Certainly not without the EU and Ukraine, and now powerful China.

    "For China, Europeans are partners, not rivals." This was stated by Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi at the Munich Conference. This statement was not at all accidental, and now its meaning is ⬇️
    MAGA
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • BF25394
    BF25394 Posts: 4,940
    cincybearcat said:
    MAGA the pro-russian party....never thought I'd see it. 

    I keep going back to Obama debating Romney....Romney saying Russia was the biggest threat to the USA and Obama laughing him off.  I never thought that MAGA and Obama would be aligned.

    We shoulda listened to Romney.
    The difference is that Obama admits that he underestimated Russia and that Romney had a point. That was at a time (2012) when Medvedev was president and was putting forward a very different public and diplomatic face even though Putin as Prime Minister was the power behind the throne. Obama writes about this in his memoir. MAGA is siding with Russia because Trump is siding with Russia, and they'll never admit that they're wrong because that would mean admitting that their Dear Leader is wrong.
    I gather speed from you fucking with me.
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,357

    The Patriot air defense system is the most important component in US military aid to Ukraine. Operaters of the system would like to thank the American people for their support. Thank you🙏🇺🇲🇺🇦
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 40,117
    mickeyrat said:

    Today, the Chinese said they are against peace talks without the EU and Ukraine. This statement carries a lot of weight. It means that any agreement that Trump and Putin agree on will have no international weight or acceptability. Certainly not without the EU and Ukraine, and now powerful China.

    "For China, Europeans are partners, not rivals." This was stated by Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi at the Munich Conference. This statement was not at all accidental, and now its meaning is ⬇️
    MAGA
    YUGE
    Your boos mean nothing to me, for I have seen what makes you cheer



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