Pearl Jam albums in Dolby Atmos surround

bone · August 2021

strilo said:

I haven't had any issue with Match, Cloud Library or anything. I Basically switched my library to the Apple Music files for everything Apple has, including all ~200 of the Deep bootlegs. But all the boots I have that are not on streaming, I kept my files, which uploaded just fine.

You're lucky then or just haven't noticed it. If you have a version of the song on your device sometimes it cheats and plays that version instead of the one you're trying to listen to.

For example, say you are listening to Seattle 2000, and when Alive comes up next and you have a version of Alive on your phone from a different show, it sometimes grabs that other version instead of the version linked to the album. It's even worse with playlists.

I also hate how some CDs don't perfectly match resulting in one or two tracks uploading instead of matching. I wish there was a way to force match songs provided they are similar length with similar metadata. Sometimes the match fails simply because of the wrong format of apostrophe in your file tag, while other times it will match fine despite completely messing up the file tag.

foriginalsin · August 2021

So this is some experience. So what I have gathered is that there are 2 versions of this new release. One in dolby atmos and one in sony reality 360. I somehow figured out a way to listen to the 360 version without listening through my phone. I ended up airplaying from tidal the 360 version. The 360 logo in the app remained lit up. When I would cast the 360 version, the app would change to the HIFI version. The 360 version in surround, sounded really off. I then listened through headphones and it sounded way better.

However, I do not like these new mixes. It sounds like the band is playing in a garage or smaller. I really miss the hugeness of the Rick P. mix. I guess I like all the stuff he added to the mix. Also Jeffs bass is sorely buried in the mix. I switched back and forth with the 360 mix and the original. Whats funny is that the 360 technology is suppose to sound huge and open and with stuff coming at you from all angles. In fact, the opposite is true. The original mix sounds way more open with way more going on. To me most songs sound worse. Even Flow sounded good in the new mix. The intro to Black in the 360 mix where its stone playing over eddie before the band kicks in sounds PHENOMENAL. It literally sounds like stones guitar is 5 feet to the left in front of me. So the first 30 sec of Black almost sounds like im listening to my speaker and then when the band kicks in, it goes back to being closed in my head. This application of 360 audio is amazing, yet I feel like this wasnt done enough.

So far in preliminary testing, overall, cool tech, but I MUCH prefer the original mix.

foriginalsin · August 2021

chalon said:

Zod said:

KV4053 said:
I hear you, but I don't think the rear speakers of the vast majority of home theater systems are full range.... irrespective of budget

There's always in between. My rear speaks are bookshelf speakers, but the fronts are towers

Yeah, but in that case you may have a better music experience listening to the music in stereo rather than involving the surround, which I think is what KV means.

For my speaker setup, the frequency response specs say:
Center: 51-35,000 Hz ± 3dB
L/R (both front and back): 100-20,000 Hz ± 3db
4x overhead: 70Hz – 20,000 Hz ± 3db
Subwoofer: 24-200 Hz ± 3db, substantial output down to 20Hz

I'm not sure if that meets KV's criteria of good enough frequency response range . I'm pretty sure for me I can't hear anything past ~16kHz, so it's not a big deal for me that it tops off at 20 kHz. You could argue the low end of the L/R isn't low enough, but I have my crossover frequency set appropriately so it meshes well and I don't lose the bass.

Also if I REALLY went all-out I could've gotten the L/R speakers that got close to the center (54-35,000 Hz) but they were significantly more expensive and also I didn't quite have the space to fit them .

Anyway, back to the original topic, I've not been able to listen to either albums in Atmos yet. It seems like the only way to get it onto my setup right now is if I buy an Apple TV 4K which has an Apple Music app which can output Atmos over eARC. It sounds like Tidal has an app for my TV (LG) that supports Dolby Atmos, but I guess the Atmos mixes aren't available on that yet?

This is correct. Decent surround speakers are perfectly fine at reproducing the frequency range. Like you said, age is more of a factor and most people over 30 cant hear frequency over 15,000 khz.

foriginalsin · August 2021

strilo said:

foriginalsin said:

One other thing. I read people saying this particular guitar part or whatever is missing or low in the atmos mix. I listened to buddy holly, weezer, and i found the same thing, a certain guitar harmony was almost gone from the mix. I am wondering if this is because full atmos is 11.2.4. Thats a lot of channels and its possible certain parts are sent to channels that arent in the 5.1 mix.

That's not exactly how Atmos works. It's not strictly limited to channels. Basically you tell your receiver what type of Atmos you have, how many speakers and where they are. Then when the Atmos stream is decoded, all channels/objects are routed to the setup you have. Basically, it sends things to the nearest speaker you have. So no objects or channels would be missing due to a 5.1 setup vs 11.2.4. The sounds we are referring to as changed, buried or missing are that way in the mix by design. Atmos in headphones has all of the content folded down automatically to left and right, and the sounds we refer to are missing there too. It's an artistic mixing choice by Josh Evans, not a byproduct of how Atmos is mixed and decoded.

So if this is the case, then there are sounds that are suppose to be coming from a discreet channel/speaker and are being sent to the channel you have. This would result in an inaccurate representation of what the band intends i guess? I do however believe a 5.1 setup is a huge step forward in that there is a significant difference between that and a 2 channel stereo set up. Like I said, Riders on the storm sounded unbelievable in dolby atmos even though I dont have all the speakers required, 7.2.4 or 9.2.4.

Still haven't been able to listen to the dolby atmos versions of these albums, hopefully soon.

Ledbetterman10 · August 2021

foriginalsin said:

So this is some experience. So what I have gathered is that there are 2 versions of this new release. One in dolby atmos and one in sony reality 360. I somehow figured out a way to listen to the 360 version without listening through my phone. I ended up airplaying from tidal the 360 version. The 360 logo in the app remained lit up. When I would cast the 360 version, the app would change to the HIFI version. The 360 version in surround, sounded really off. I then listened through headphones and it sounded way better.

However, I do not like these new mixes. It sounds like the band is playing in a garage or smaller. I really miss the hugeness of the Rick P. mix. I guess I like all the stuff he added to the mix. Also Jeffs bass is sorely buried in the mix. I switched back and forth with the 360 mix and the original. Whats funny is that the 360 technology is suppose to sound huge and open and with stuff coming at you from all angles. In fact, the opposite is true. The original mix sounds way more open with way more going on. To me most songs sound worse. Even Flow sounded good in the new mix. The intro to Black in the 360 mix where its stone playing over eddie before the band kicks in sounds PHENOMENAL. It literally sounds like stones guitar is 5 feet to the left in front of me. So the first 30 sec of Black almost sounds like im listening to my speaker and then when the band kicks in, it goes back to being closed in my head. This application of 360 audio is amazing, yet I feel like this wasnt done enough.

So far in preliminary testing, overall, cool tech, but I MUCH prefer the original mix.

After the 2008 Brendan O'Brien remix, I've found the original mix to be unlistenable. I actually gave it a listen for the first time in years the other day, and I think it's terrible. Now, are you saying you prefer the Rick P. mix to this new Dolby Atmos mix? Or do you prefer the Rick P. mix to both the Dolby AND the O'Brien remix?

foriginalsin · August 2021

I prefer it to the sony 360 reality mix. Havent been able to hear the dolby atmos mix. I have to re-listen to the redux. I usually dont listen to studio in general and prefer listening to live recordings.

Ledbetterman10 · August 2021

foriginalsin said:

I prefer it to the sony 360 reality mix. Havent been able to hear the dolby atmos mix. I have to re-listen to the redux. I usually dont listen to studio in general and prefer listening to live recordings.

Yeah definitely give the redux another try. After listening to that for the past 10 years, I couldn't believe how bad the Rick P. mix sounded when I listened to it the other day.

Except Jeremy, I actually prefer the original Jeremy mix to the redux.

2-feign-reluctance · August 2021

foriginalsin said:

I prefer it to the sony 360 reality mix. Havent been able to hear the dolby atmos mix. I have to re-listen to the redux. I usually dont listen to studio in general and prefer listening to live recordings.

Get your ears on those Atmos mixes dude!

strilo · September 2021

Ledbetterman10 said:
After the 2008 Brendan O'Brien remix, I've found the original mix to be unlistenable. I actually gave it a listen for the first time in years the other day, and I think it's terrible. Now, are you saying you prefer the Rick P. mix to this new Dolby Atmos mix? Or do you prefer the Rick P. mix to both the Dolby AND the O'Brien remix?

I cannot help but agree. I've barely listened to the original mix of Ten since the Redux came out. I forgot how much insane reverb and douchey vocal effects with Ed's voice pushed all over the world. So much echo and reverb that it's actually harder to hear the amazing guitar work. And that horrible filter on his vocal for the second verse of "Oceans." God I forgot all about that. And to me, the Redux version of "Porch" actually SOUNDS like it ties directly to Vs. I much prefer the Redux mix. It sounds like the band that became the band who made Vs., instead of some weird still-stuck-in-the-80s arena rock band with tons of reverb.

cp3iverson · September 2021

Edit.... I upgraded

2-feign-reluctance · September 2021

Man, Off He Goes is SO fucking good! Those piano notes/chords at the end. I’ll say it again, this sounds like you are inside the music.

2-feign-reluctance · September 2021

New found appreciation for I’m Open. Damn. So much going on here.

strilo · September 2021

I've been a huge fan of music in surround for like 15 years. I've experienced these types of "holy shit" or inside the music moments on many other albums and artists. I never thought it would be something that Pearl Jam would do. Now that they have, I am beside myself with how amazing it is. And I've only listened to Ten and No Code in surround like twice through each! I feel like there's so much there to unpack...

bjmjpl · September 2021

This is truly amazing and I have been loving gigaton atmos and the fact that they are trailblazing and on The Cutting Edge with this is totally amazing go Josh and Pearl Jam!

chalon · September 2021

foriginalsin said:

So this is some experience. So what I have gathered is that there are 2 versions of this new release. One in dolby atmos and one in sony reality 360. I somehow figured out a way to listen to the 360 version without listening through my phone. I ended up airplaying from tidal the 360 version. The 360 logo in the app remained lit up. When I would cast the 360 version, the app would change to the HIFI version. The 360 version in surround, sounded really off. I then listened through headphones and it sounded way better.

However, I do not like these new mixes. It sounds like the band is playing in a garage or smaller. I really miss the hugeness of the Rick P. mix. I guess I like all the stuff he added to the mix. Also Jeffs bass is sorely buried in the mix. I switched back and forth with the 360 mix and the original. Whats funny is that the 360 technology is suppose to sound huge and open and with stuff coming at you from all angles. In fact, the opposite is true. The original mix sounds way more open with way more going on. To me most songs sound worse. Even Flow sounded good in the new mix. The intro to Black in the 360 mix where its stone playing over eddie before the band kicks in sounds PHENOMENAL. It literally sounds like stones guitar is 5 feet to the left in front of me. So the first 30 sec of Black almost sounds like im listening to my speaker and then when the band kicks in, it goes back to being closed in my head. This application of 360 audio is amazing, yet I feel like this wasnt done enough.

So far in preliminary testing, overall, cool tech, but I MUCH prefer the original mix.

I'm not surprised the Sony 360 doesn't sound great. Sony 360 has the same problem as they have with the object audio they're trying to push on PlayStation. It's not designed for true surround setups, and in fact no receiver actually even supports it (which is probably why it sounded terrible when you tried). Instead, they're focusing on making "fake surround" for people using a single Alexa speaker or whatever, I guess the goal is to try to make a crap speaker not sound as crap but I guess we aren't the target audience for that.

I'm pretty sure Sony just doesn't want to pay licensing fees to Dolby, so that's why they want to launch their own 3D audio formats. Hopefully it won't have any staying power if it's as bad as you made it seem!

KV4053 · September 2021

Josh Evans has reinvigorated this band. You can hear it in the remixes as well as the live mixes. I have never been more struck by what a producer can do.

mfc2006 · September 2021

Can't wait to dive into these this weekend.

strilo · September 2021

I need to give No Code another serious listen in Atmos on my surround system. I've only heard it twice that way.

Tim Simmons · September 2021

KV4053 said:

Josh Evans has reinvigorated this band. You can hear it in the remixes as well as the live mixes. I have never been more struck by what a producer can do.

Agreed. The album mixes, the new mixes on the live shows, they're all great. Great addition to the band inner circle.

strilo · September 2021

Is it me or are the drums a lot more present in the Atmos mix of Off He Goes?

Pearl Jam albums in Dolby Atmos surround

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