Biden vs Trump 2020 - vote now and discuss!

mace1229 · September 2020

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

jerparker20 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Media Bias website rates Townhall.com as a “ questionable” news source.

“A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence. Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact checked on a per article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source.”

*** Local news and Newsweek have both posted story now.

The site screamed biased, but still contained a video of the WH confirming and claims that the FBI has also confirmed. So I'm guessing its true.

Do you normally get news from people like Katie Pavlich and websites like Townhall though? How many times has Trumped praised her? She is not a journalist. And, I mean, it says this at the bottom of the article:

lol

Regardless, it's a blatantly politically motivated thing designed to help Trump to state who the ballots were cast for. Ironically, Luzerne County happens to be in the middle of the state which is as red as Alabama. Don't get me wrong though, it should be investigated. But we're talking about 9 ballots here.

I think, this time around, these stories of Trump trying to steal the election in the courts are going to motivate dems in to come out in droves, especially in my area of Pennyslvania (suburban Philly) which came through in 2018.

No I don’t, that’s why I never heard of that site like I said. My brother texted me and asked if I’d heard about the ballots, and when and did a Google search to check for myself it was only right wing sites like that that popped up with info at the time with the story in the search results. So I shared it, you can decide for yourself if you believe the comments from the FBI and WH or not.

Lerxst1992 · September 2020

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

OnWis97 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Pennsylvania is now off the table for Biden. This story alone is enough for Barr and Trump's court to overturn PA. Just do that with a few more states and it's over. Donald Trump is getting his second term. It's over.

If FL and NC go to trump, PA becomes a must win state.

Watching the news go crazy today over the peaceful transition of power comment, this really is starting to look like 2016.

Independents were not swayed by this topic last time. Where is the Biden message? Where is the constant talk about healthcare? Instead it’s about trump leaving peacefully if he loses. That does not get Biden any independents to vote for him . It’s like trump is punking the Dems and they don’t even know it.

Trump drives the news cycle with his crazy comments. If you're the programming director at CNN or MSNBC, which do you think draws more views? Trump being an idiot or Biden talking about healthcare? FTR, I don't think Trump talking about not transferring power helps him with independents. Trump's disapproval rating for the past three plus years is completely because of his lack of discipline. So I would disagree with your take on this.

Dems tried this in 2016 and independents just did not care. They don’t care about trump being unqualified or being a bad person. Late breaking undecideds went overwhelmingly to trump then.

If I were a news director at those stations, my programming decisions over the next month would be different than those I made during the prior 45 months and the next 46 months after 11/3. From Labor Day to Election Day every four years, my responsibilities are different. And that’s to the issues that will help or hurt people get center stage now. Don’t ignore trump antics, but don’t make it center stage. We have a major election. Lets pretend issues matter for just two months every 4 years

Trumps approval rating has been near 42% since 2015. It hasn’t moved. Tell the non progressives in the other 58% how you will make their lives better - that is not happening now nor was it in 2016.

mrussel1 · September 2020

Biden

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

OnWis97 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Pennsylvania is now off the table for Biden. This story alone is enough for Barr and Trump's court to overturn PA. Just do that with a few more states and it's over. Donald Trump is getting his second term. It's over.

If FL and NC go to trump, PA becomes a must win state.

Watching the news go crazy today over the peaceful transition of power comment, this really is starting to look like 2016.

Independents were not swayed by this topic last time. Where is the Biden message? Where is the constant talk about healthcare? Instead it’s about trump leaving peacefully if he loses. That does not get Biden any independents to vote for him . It’s like trump is punking the Dems and they don’t even know it.

Trump drives the news cycle with his crazy comments. If you're the programming director at CNN or MSNBC, which do you think draws more views? Trump being an idiot or Biden talking about healthcare? FTR, I don't think Trump talking about not transferring power helps him with independents. Trump's disapproval rating for the past three plus years is completely because of his lack of discipline. So I would disagree with your take on this.

Dems tried this in 2016 and independents just did not care. They don’t care about trump being unqualified or being a bad person. Late breaking undecideds went overwhelmingly to trump then.

If I were a news director at those stations, my programming decisions over the next month would be different than those I made during the prior 45 months and the next 46 months after 11/3. From Labor Day to Election Day every four years, my responsibilities are different. And that’s to the issues that will help or hurt people get center stage now. Don’t ignore trump antics, but don’t make it center stage. We have a major election. Lets pretend issues matter for just two months every 4 years

Trumps approval rating has been near 42% since 2015. It hasn’t moved. Tell the non progressives in the other 58% how you will make their lives better - that is not happening now nor was it in 2016.

1. Late breaking undecided typically go with teh challenger, and that number is consistent with teh approve/disapprove number. Hillary was certainly more of the incumbent in 16. So advantage Biden here, historically.

2. News directors are not the DNC or the Democrats. You blamed Biden for not talking about healthcare, when he has a major 60 second commercial everywhere (even in blue VA) that focuses on healthcare.

The debates are important. I say that even though I think they are silly, but that's for me personally.

Ledbetterman10 · September 2020

Biden

Ledbetterman10 said:

mickeyrat said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

OnWis97 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Pennsylvania is now off the table for Biden. This story alone is enough for Barr and Trump's court to overturn PA. Just do that with a few more states and it's over. Donald Trump is getting his second term. It's over.

Not sure about that but it definitely gives Trump a legitimate reason to rail against mail-in voting, which he already has been doing before he had a good reason.

I had applied to do mail-in just because I was sick of getting mail asking me to do it. But I’m gonna go to the polls now. I can still do that right? Even though I applied to do mail-in, if I don’t mail it in, I can show up in person and still vote right?

search here for your state

https://www.usvotefoundation.org/

Thanks. I should contact the election official whose contact info is on that site.

Well I called and actually got some useful information. If you have applied to do mail-in, but now don't want to do mail-in, you have two options (in Pennsylvania).

1. Email an election official (I was given an email address) with your name, phone number, DOB, and reason why you now want to vote in person. You'll receive a call saying that you're now okay to vote in person

2. Show up a the polls WITH YOUR MAIL-IN BALLOT, ask for the judge of elections, surrender your mail-in ballot, and sign some sort of affidavit. If you don't show up with you mail-in ballot, you won't be able to vote at the polls.

mickeyrat · September 2020

Biden

Ledbetterman10 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

mickeyrat said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

OnWis97 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Pennsylvania is now off the table for Biden. This story alone is enough for Barr and Trump's court to overturn PA. Just do that with a few more states and it's over. Donald Trump is getting his second term. It's over.

Not sure about that but it definitely gives Trump a legitimate reason to rail against mail-in voting, which he already has been doing before he had a good reason.

I had applied to do mail-in just because I was sick of getting mail asking me to do it. But I’m gonna go to the polls now. I can still do that right? Even though I applied to do mail-in, if I don’t mail it in, I can show up in person and still vote right?

search here for your state

https://www.usvotefoundation.org/

Thanks. I should contact the election official whose contact info is on that site.

Well I called and actually got some useful information. If you have applied to do mail-in, but now don't want to do mail-in, you have two options (in Pennsylvania).

1. Email an election official (I was given an email address) with your name, phone number, DOB, and reason why you now want to vote in person. You'll receive a call saying that you're now okay to vote in person

2. Show up a the polls WITH YOUR MAIL-IN BALLOT, ask for the judge of elections, surrender your mail-in ballot, and sign some sort of affidavit. If you don't show up with you mail-in ballot, you won't be able to vote at the polls.

thats cuz every issued ballot needs accounted for, used or not.

a principle of that website was on Michael Steele podcast last week. look for it. its interesting how it all came about and is also informative generally.

https://www.stitcher.com/s?eid=77660233&refid=asa

The Juggler · September 2020

Biden

mace1229 said:

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

jerparker20 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Media Bias website rates Townhall.com as a “ questionable” news source.

“A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence. Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact checked on a per article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source.”

*** Local news and Newsweek have both posted story now.

The site screamed biased, but still contained a video of the WH confirming and claims that the FBI has also confirmed. So I'm guessing its true.

Do you normally get news from people like Katie Pavlich and websites like Townhall though? How many times has Trumped praised her? She is not a journalist. And, I mean, it says this at the bottom of the article:

lol

Regardless, it's a blatantly politically motivated thing designed to help Trump to state who the ballots were cast for. Ironically, Luzerne County happens to be in the middle of the state which is as red as Alabama. Don't get me wrong though, it should be investigated. But we're talking about 9 ballots here.

I think, this time around, these stories of Trump trying to steal the election in the courts are going to motivate dems in to come out in droves, especially in my area of Pennyslvania (suburban Philly) which came through in 2018.

No I don’t, that’s why I never heard of that site like I said. My brother texted me and asked if I’d heard about the ballots, and when and did a Google search to check for myself it was only right wing sites like that that popped up with info at the time with the story in the search results. So I shared it, you can decide for yourself if you believe the comments from the FBI and WH or not.

I believe there is an investigation, sure. I googled it too but I found a much more reliable source than Townhall, which just parrots talking points from the White House. I mean do you consider Kayliegh McKenney a reliable source? I sure as hell don't.

There are reports today that Trump was talking about this on some radio show prior to this story becoming public. Personally, I think that the fact that the president is having his DOJ do this and announce who the ballots were for is much more of an issue than 9 ballots being tampered with in a deep red county of PA.

mace1229 · September 2020

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

jerparker20 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Media Bias website rates Townhall.com as a “ questionable” news source.

“A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence. Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact checked on a per article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source.”

*** Local news and Newsweek have both posted story now.

The site screamed biased, but still contained a video of the WH confirming and claims that the FBI has also confirmed. So I'm guessing its true.

Do you normally get news from people like Katie Pavlich and websites like Townhall though? How many times has Trumped praised her? She is not a journalist. And, I mean, it says this at the bottom of the article:

lol

Regardless, it's a blatantly politically motivated thing designed to help Trump to state who the ballots were cast for. Ironically, Luzerne County happens to be in the middle of the state which is as red as Alabama. Don't get me wrong though, it should be investigated. But we're talking about 9 ballots here.

I think, this time around, these stories of Trump trying to steal the election in the courts are going to motivate dems in to come out in droves, especially in my area of Pennyslvania (suburban Philly) which came through in 2018.

No I don’t, that’s why I never heard of that site like I said. My brother texted me and asked if I’d heard about the ballots, and when and did a Google search to check for myself it was only right wing sites like that that popped up with info at the time with the story in the search results. So I shared it, you can decide for yourself if you believe the comments from the FBI and WH or not.

I believe there is an investigation, sure. I googled it too but I found a much more reliable source than Townhall, which just parrots talking points from the White House. I mean do you consider Kayliegh McKenney a reliable source? I sure as hell don't.

There are reports today that Trump was talking about this on some radio show prior to this story becoming public. Personally, I think that the fact that the president is having his DOJ do this and announce who the ballots were for is much more of an issue than 9 ballots being tampered with in a deep red county of PA.

I had about 5 minutes to look at the time, maybe if I searched through pages I could have found more acceptable resources. But even today, doing a google search of "9 trump ballots in trash" on Google (my browser actually defaults to Bing, not Google), the entire first page of results are from sites I'm unfamiliar with but can easily tell they are not unbiased, with names like "coalregioncanary" "americanmilitarynews" and so on. If I add CNN to the search it comes up empty, although I'm sure they have mentioned it, it just isn't a big story they are pushing, and so they aren't among the top search results. I bet if it was 9 Biden ballots they would though.
Not sure why the source on a story like this is an issue. I posted a link, said I questioned the source but story seems real, and said decide for yourself. If the story is true, why does the source still matter at this point? I do believe right sources are happy to push the idea mail voting can't be trusted, but that's irrelevant when just sharing information.

OnWis97 · September 2020

Biden

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

jerparker20 said:

mace1229 said:

Not familiar with this news source, but seems to be confirmed by FBI and the WH press.
9 mail in ballots for Trump were in the trash.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2020/09/24/mcenany-pennsylvania-ballots-for-trump-were-found-in-the-trash-n2576851

Media Bias website rates Townhall.com as a “ questionable” news source.

“A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence. Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact checked on a per article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source.”

*** Local news and Newsweek have both posted story now.

The site screamed biased, but still contained a video of the WH confirming and claims that the FBI has also confirmed. So I'm guessing its true.

Do you normally get news from people like Katie Pavlich and websites like Townhall though? How many times has Trumped praised her? She is not a journalist. And, I mean, it says this at the bottom of the article:

lol

Regardless, it's a blatantly politically motivated thing designed to help Trump to state who the ballots were cast for. Ironically, Luzerne County happens to be in the middle of the state which is as red as Alabama. Don't get me wrong though, it should be investigated. But we're talking about 9 ballots here.

I think, this time around, these stories of Trump trying to steal the election in the courts are going to motivate dems in to come out in droves, especially in my area of Pennyslvania (suburban Philly) which came through in 2018.

No I don’t, that’s why I never heard of that site like I said. My brother texted me and asked if I’d heard about the ballots, and when and did a Google search to check for myself it was only right wing sites like that that popped up with info at the time with the story in the search results. So I shared it, you can decide for yourself if you believe the comments from the FBI and WH or not.

I believe there is an investigation, sure. I googled it too but I found a much more reliable source than Townhall, which just parrots talking points from the White House. I mean do you consider Kayliegh McKenney a reliable source? I sure as hell don't.

There are reports today that Trump was talking about this on some radio show prior to this story becoming public. Personally, I think that the fact that the president is having his DOJ do this and announce who the ballots were for is much more of an issue than 9 ballots being tampered with in a deep red county of PA.

I'm hearing mixed reports about 1) when PA releases its absentee ballots and 2) that these ballots may have been from the Primary.

Of course, my initial thought was "yeah, that doesn't seem staged at all."

Gern Blansten · September 2020

Biden

https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1309516591261011969

Hilarious...ballots were thrown out because the GOP won a lawsuit to have them thrown out

Halifax2TheMax · September 2020

Gern Blansten said:

https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1309516591261011969

Hilarious...ballots were thrown out because the GOP won a lawsuit to have them thrown out

That’ll be totally lost on some people.

Gern Blansten · September 2020

Biden

Halifax2TheMax said:

Gern Blansten said:

https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1309516591261011969

Hilarious...ballots were thrown out because the GOP won a lawsuit to have them thrown out

That’ll be totally lost on some people.

Including tRump

Halifax2TheMax · September 2020

Missing ballots reporting. The CNN article was updated at 10:00 something pm but I read it in the morning. Took 30 seconds. All were initially reported yesterday.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/24/politics/doj-trump-ballots-pennsylvania/index.html

https://www.npr.org/2020/09/24/916633925/feds-in-unusual-statement-announce-theyre-investigating-discarded-pa-ballots

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/518073-nine-military-ballots-that-were-cast-for-trump-found-improperly-discarded

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/24/us/politics/pennsylvania-mail-in-voter-fraud-investigation.html

mrussel1 · September 2020

Biden

Halifax2TheMax said:

Missing ballots reporting. The CNN article was updated at 10:00 something pm but I read it in the morning. Took 30 seconds. All were initially reported yesterday.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/24/politics/doj-trump-ballots-pennsylvania/index.html

https://www.npr.org/2020/09/24/916633925/feds-in-unusual-statement-announce-theyre-investigating-discarded-pa-ballots

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/518073-nine-military-ballots-that-were-cast-for-trump-found-improperly-discarded

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/24/us/politics/pennsylvania-mail-in-voter-fraud-investigation.html

Throw out all Luzerne county ballots. Problem solved for Trump.

Halifax2TheMax · September 2020

Way to be Bloomy! Will this be the first 5 or 6 Billion dollar campaign? Disgusting. "Corporations are people." Super PACS. All disgusting.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/elections/2020/09/25/trump-biden-supreme-court-live-updates/#link-JJGOMG2CKZBH3IA5U4OPZ53L3U

mrussel1 · September 2020

Biden

Halifax2TheMax said:

Way to be Bloomy! Will this be the first 5 or 6 Billion dollar campaign? Disgusting. "Corporations are people." Super PACS. All disgusting.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/elections/2020/09/25/trump-biden-supreme-court-live-updates/#link-JJGOMG2CKZBH3IA5U4OPZ53L3U

He also crowds out Trump's campaign with that buy.. raising the prices and cutting the slots.

mrussel1 · September 2020

Biden

One would think this is a proxy for the presidential race. And probably not one with "shy" voters.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/518257-poll-57-percent-of-americans-think-next-president-senate-should-fill-ginsburg

brianlux · September 2020

Biden

For fuck's sake (or is it fucks sake? Please let me know- I want this post to look professional), PLEASE don't blow it, Joe!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/25/joe-biden-disaffected-black-voters-election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election

Biden is trying to woo unhappy Republicans, when he should be mobilizing hundreds of thousands of Democrats

mrussel1 · September 2020

Biden

brianlux said:

For fuck's sake (or is it fucks sake? Please let me know- I want this post to look professional), PLEASE don't blow it, Joe!
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/25/joe-biden-disaffected-black-voters-election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election
Biden is trying to woo unhappy Republicans, when he should be mobilizing hundreds of thousands of Democrats

I'm trying to understand why the author believes that he isn't or can't do both. Why is it a binary choice between appealing to white working class and black working class? And looking at the vote total in 16 compared to 12 is disingenuous considering Obama is not on the ticket. The 16 levels dipped back to the 2004 levels, if I'm not mistaken. Biden put Harris on the ticket precisely to try and increase the levels back closer to 12. He won't get there, but he improving the number is definitely the goal.

brianlux · September 2020

Biden

mrussel1 said:

brianlux said:

For fuck's sake (or is it fucks sake? Please let me know- I want this post to look professional), PLEASE don't blow it, Joe!
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/25/joe-biden-disaffected-black-voters-election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election
Biden is trying to woo unhappy Republicans, when he should be mobilizing hundreds of thousands of Democrats

I'm trying to understand why the author believes that he isn't or can't do both. Why is it a binary choice between appealing to white working class and black working class? And looking at the vote total in 16 compared to 12 is disingenuous considering Obama is not on the ticket. The 16 levels dipped back to the 2004 levels, if I'm not mistaken. Biden put Harris on the ticket precisely to try and increase the levels back closer to 12. He won't get there, but he improving the number is definitely the goal.

True, M, doing both makes sense. I think this article concerns me because it is one of a couple I have seen recently that bring up the same concern. And why I am concerned, of course, is related to my intense worry that Trump could be re-elected. I want everything legal that could possibly be done to see to it that Biden wins.

mrussel1 · September 2020

Biden

brianlux said:

mrussel1 said:

brianlux said:

For fuck's sake (or is it fucks sake? Please let me know- I want this post to look professional), PLEASE don't blow it, Joe!
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/25/joe-biden-disaffected-black-voters-election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election
Biden is trying to woo unhappy Republicans, when he should be mobilizing hundreds of thousands of Democrats

I'm trying to understand why the author believes that he isn't or can't do both. Why is it a binary choice between appealing to white working class and black working class? And looking at the vote total in 16 compared to 12 is disingenuous considering Obama is not on the ticket. The 16 levels dipped back to the 2004 levels, if I'm not mistaken. Biden put Harris on the ticket precisely to try and increase the levels back closer to 12. He won't get there, but he improving the number is definitely the goal.

True, M, doing both makes sense. I think this article concerns me because it is one of a couple I have seen recently that bring up the same concern. And why I am concerned, of course, is related to my intense worry that Trump could be re-elected. I want everything legal that could possibly be done to see to it that Biden wins.

I hear you, but don't stress yourself out. People on both sides write these type of articles to get published. Being critical is how they make their money. I'm not saying that he isn't being true to his feelings, but people write articles to get clicks too.

Biden vs Trump 2020 - vote now and discuss!

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Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election

Joe Biden is repeating the same mistakes that cost Hillary Clinton the election

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