Police abuse

pjl44 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

pjl44 said:

cincybearcat said:

tempo_n_groove said:

tbergs said:

cincybearcat said:

PJNB said:

brianlux said:

PJNB said:

Does taunting police warrant groups being maced? I do not believe so imo. 

https://twitter.com/i/status/1267321172309544960

WTF indeed!  How do people like this get to be cops?   If they can't control themselves over a little taunting they are in the wrong line of work.  Fire these worthless sons of bitches.

I am really curious what their instructions are from their higher ups with these kinds of things. Was this guy a higher up taking the lead or are these guys going on their own knowing there is very little repercussions so far for bad behavior. 

You would think the leaderships guidance would be take the verbal abuse from the peaceful protesters. Suck it up and earn respect back from the public. Not this. This is causing more anger. 

It’s mind boggling. 

It looks bad from the segment we're shown, which is why I hate social media. We never get to see everything, not that it would justify what happened, but it may indicate what led to them moving in. I can't quite tell what the male does with his left hand right before they act. Maybe flips them off, maybe makes an obscene gesture, no idea. Still excessive if that's all he did.

It was posted for a knee jerk reaction.  The cops right now are all on edge and so are the people.  You want to protest then protest.  Leave the cops alone.
Excessive?  Maybe. But like said above you don't know what else happened.

I always think of a Jello Biafra quote "when you ape the cops it's not anarchy"

On another note whomever posted that Kareem piece thank you.  He is one of the more thought provoking atheletes out there.

The cops inaction in self policing doesn’t provide them any room for error here. Too many videos like that. 

Agree completely. If the public is confident in how they hold their own accountable, we'd give a pretty wide berth on self defense given how dangerous the job is. The reason they feel like people are turning on them is because we have almost no confidence that the first part is happening. 

Powerful statement.  It made me think and I thank you for that.

I appreciate your saying that. I really hope some change comes out of this moment.

Cuomo is wanting that change
https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-calls-standardized-police-misconduct-policies-across-america

What is sad though is the police force views certain things as a punch in the face.  Change can be good and it can be bad.  We shall see.

PJNB said:

I have asked what I consider good local police officers that are friends and family members of mine the same question as to what I am going to ask here and have never really gotten a good response. If there are only a few bad apples in the police force why are the good ones allowing the bad ones to tarnish their name and drag them in the mud too? Why are they not policing each other and calling the bad cops out more often? In my field of work if someone is not doing their job safely or putting someones else's life on the line that shit is called out immediately and the problem is fixed one way or another whether through retraining or suspension/being fired. Why are cops not able to control their own? It honestly baffles me. 

Same thing in the military.

You could have a good cop w a bad moment.  It happens.

You ask an interesting question but I think we have watched enough movies and read enough stories on why.

I don't want to say "nothing can be done"  I think you need to change the culture.

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

PJNB said:

I have asked what I consider good local police officers that are friends and family members of mine the same question as to what I am going to ask here and have never really gotten a good response. If there are only a few bad apples in the police force why are the good ones allowing the bad ones to tarnish their name and drag them in the mud too? Why are they not policing each other and calling the bad cops out more often? In my field of work if someone is not doing their job safely or putting someones else's life on the line that shit is called out immediately and the problem is fixed one way or another whether through retraining or suspension/being fired. Why are cops not able to control their own? It honestly baffles me. 

Same thing in the military.

You could have a good cop w a bad moment.  It happens.

You ask an interesting question but I think we have watched enough movies and read enough stories on why.

I don't want to say "nothing can be done"  I think you need to change the culture.

Something like "A Few Good Men" paints the picture well. Sure that's military and not police, but I'm sure it's similar. 

Commissioner Gordon in Batman, American Gangster, tons more.

Change the culture.

tempo_n_groove said:

PJNB said:

I have asked what I consider good local police officers that are friends and family members of mine the same question as to what I am going to ask here and have never really gotten a good response. If there are only a few bad apples in the police force why are the good ones allowing the bad ones to tarnish their name and drag them in the mud too? Why are they not policing each other and calling the bad cops out more often? In my field of work if someone is not doing their job safely or putting someones else's life on the line that shit is called out immediately and the problem is fixed one way or another whether through retraining or suspension/being fired. Why are cops not able to control their own? It honestly baffles me. 

Same thing in the military.

You could have a good cop w a bad moment.  It happens.

You ask an interesting question but I think we have watched enough movies and read enough stories on why.

I don't want to say "nothing can be done"  I think you need to change the culture.

It happens amongst doctors too.

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

my down the street neighbor had one of those thin blue line flags hanging from his house last week. yesterday, as i was working in the yard i witnessed a crew install not one, but two flagpoles in the front yard. when i drove home from dinner last night, i noticed that he now has two large thin blue line flags flying. one from each pole. i thought it was weird that they were still up on the pole at night. then i thought it would be a shame if someone ran those poles down with their car, haha.

Kind of weird to vilify an entire work force. Easy to bash them until you need them to save your life. Imagine every time a teacher sexually molests a minor , we looked at every teacher in that light. I think hanging a blue line flag and a BLM flag would have been a real statement. 

i do not believe that anybody would fly one of each. they are mutually exclusive.

and until cops can go a day without cracking skulls on innocent people or executing people over nonviolent crime they are unworthy of my respect. that is where i am right now.

to join that profession, with the thin blue line covering for all of the bad cops, you have to have some sort of mental pathology. i am more inclined to feel sorry for them than to support them.

All 4 Minneapolis cops will face trial now.

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

my down the street neighbor had one of those thin blue line flags hanging from his house last week. yesterday, as i was working in the yard i witnessed a crew install not one, but two flagpoles in the front yard. when i drove home from dinner last night, i noticed that he now has two large thin blue line flags flying. one from each pole. i thought it was weird that they were still up on the pole at night. then i thought it would be a shame if someone ran those poles down with their car, haha.

Kind of weird to vilify an entire work force. Easy to bash them until you need them to save your life. Imagine every time a teacher sexually molests a minor , we looked at every teacher in that light. I think hanging a blue line flag and a BLM flag would have been a real statement. 

i do not believe that anybody would fly one of each. they are mutually exclusive.

and until cops can go a day without cracking skulls on innocent people or executing people over nonviolent crime they are unworthy of my respect. that is where i am right now.

to join that profession, with the thin blue line covering for all of the bad cops, you have to have some sort of mental pathology. i am more inclined to feel sorry for them than to support them.

I disagree but I respect your stance wholeheartedly and appreciate your response. 

brianlux said:

PJNB said:

I have asked what I consider good local police officers that are friends and family members of mine the same question as to what I am going to ask here and have never really gotten a good response. If there are only a few bad apples in the police force why are the good ones allowing the bad ones to tarnish their name and drag them in the mud too? Why are they not policing each other and calling the bad cops out more often? In my field of work if someone is not doing their job safely or putting someones else's life on the line that shit is called out immediately and the problem is fixed one way or another whether through retraining or suspension/being fired. Why are cops not able to control their own? It honestly baffles me. 

Excellent question, PJNB. 

How many bad apples depends a lot on which police department you look at.  Not all law enforcement agencies hire under the same guidelines and not all place attract the same level of competency.  So in a town like mine, there isn't the same scenario where cops might need to reprimand the bad apples because they seem to be pretty decent cops for the most part.  In Minneapolis, not so.  None of the other cops did a thing to stop Chauvin from killing George Floyd.  All bad apples in that bunch.

It is so crazy to me. Everyone should support cops. They have an incredibly tough job in some areas but they also signed up for it. They are heroes just like people that go into the military are. I was close to choosing one of these two paths as a career when I was younger. Looking back I am glad I did not but respect those that did. 

Where I live I do not see this stuff everyday. Violence on cops is almost non existent here as is police brutality for the most part. Maybe that is why I just do not get it. A police officer got caught calling someone an asshole in their vehicle outside of a Tim Hortons and ticketed them for hanging out in the parking lot during Covid isolation. That was big news here. I do not live in this madness everyday as some civilians and police do and maybe pretending like I have an answer is me being tone deaf to the whole thing. It does not take much research however to see that there is a huge problem with police from the top down in a lot of areas that needs some kind of reform. I am willing to bet there are a lot of cops that would support some kind of change.  I would guess that they are the silent majority but fear to speak out due to career suicide or worse. You gotta have my back because some day you are going to need me to have yours mentality needs to be snuffed out and the bad apples however many there are needs to be dealt with as swiftly as any civilians crime would be. Just my two cents of babbling. 

PJNB said:

I have asked what I consider good local police officers that are friends and family members of mine the same question as to what I am going to ask here and have never really gotten a good response. If there are only a few bad apples in the police force why are the good ones allowing the bad ones to tarnish their name and drag them in the mud too? Why are they not policing each other and calling the bad cops out more often? In my field of work if someone is not doing their job safely or putting someones else's life on the line that shit is called out immediately and the problem is fixed one way or another whether through retraining or suspension/being fired. Why are cops not able to control their own? It honestly baffles me. 

I think the biggest part is the fraternity that comes from the union. It permeates everything - for example, I have an LEO buddy who has gotten out of drunk driving more than once by flashing his badge to the cop who pulled him over. That's the subtext behind the thin blue line iconography - from flags to bumper stickers.

Reason published a good opinion piece on this topic today.

https://reason.com/2020/06/03/its-time-to-bust-police-unions/?amp&__twitter_impression=true