The Democratic Presidential Debates

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  • benjs
    benjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,367
    CM189191 said:
    Bernie can fuck off
    This is purely opinion here, but in terms of who can 'fuck off', seems to me there are a few handfuls of politicians vying for a spot in office, all of whom are hungrier for power than they are hungry for progress. If running for President is a 'for the greater good', they'd coordinate and align drop-outs to help make the decision easier. If they each think they're smart enough to lead, they should be smart enough to elect, especially with the threat being so great. Any one of these people could be a sacrificial lamb and fuck off but elect not to. When I look at how stable Bernie has been, it makes sense to me because at this point his election is part of his 'movement' he's created (and arguably, pretty damn successfully), which is likely to have more stability in followers compared to candidates whose support probably wavers more easily. I happen to find him annoying, wish he would stop shouting at everyone, and don't think he'd be able to make good changes over his presidency, but I respect his right to stay there as much as anyone else's. 
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,879
    Bloomberg commercials on health care running during the playoffs.  Expensive spots that he can afford. Smart to run on health as trump is very vulnerable on the issue. 
  • Hi!
    Hi! Posts: 3,095
    mrussel1 said:
    Bloomberg commercials on health care running during the playoffs.  Expensive spots that he can afford. Smart to run on health as trump is very vulnerable on the issue. 
    Looking at a couple polls today, he seems to be rising. Tied with Buddha in one and Warren in another. 

    Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022

  • benjs
    benjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,367
    Hi! said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Bloomberg commercials on health care running during the playoffs.  Expensive spots that he can afford. Smart to run on health as trump is very vulnerable on the issue. 
    Looking at a couple polls today, he seems to be rising. Tied with Buddha in one and Warren in another. 
    538 has him around 5 points with Buttigieg at 7.5. Unless an event scares people away from liberalism or away from Biden just before the Primaries, though, it looks to me like Biden will occupy the moderate lane, Sanders and Warren will share the left lane and be unable to secure the votes to win it, and Biden takes it. I say this because these three candidates have had relatively stable poll floors, and Buttigieg's abysmal black support probably rules him out. If Bloomberg can challenge Biden's right to be the de facto DNC moderate candidate, maybe it works, but I guess time will tell.
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    edited January 2020
    List Bernie's legislative accomplishments 

    Go on I'll wait

    naming post offices don't count
    Post edited by CM189191 on
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    Did Bernie ever release his health records from his heart attach like he promised?
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    Refresh my memory.... How did Bernie vote in Magnitsky Act of 2012?

    Bernie is a joke
  • Hi!
    Hi! Posts: 3,095
    benjs said:
    Hi! said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Bloomberg commercials on health care running during the playoffs.  Expensive spots that he can afford. Smart to run on health as trump is very vulnerable on the issue. 
    Looking at a couple polls today, he seems to be rising. Tied with Buddha in one and Warren in another. 
    538 has him around 5 points with Buttigieg at 7.5. Unless an event scares people away from liberalism or away from Biden just before the Primaries, though, it looks to me like Biden will occupy the moderate lane, Sanders and Warren will share the left lane and be unable to secure the votes to win it, and Biden takes it. I say this because these three candidates have had relatively stable poll floors, and Buttigieg's abysmal black support probably rules him out. If Bloomberg can challenge Biden's right to be the de facto DNC moderate candidate, maybe it works, but I guess time will tell.
    I hadn’t seen the 538 polls. I’ll post the polls I was referring to. I agree that Biden is still the front runner. He has a strong base of support (in particular, blacks, older voters, moderate Dems) that aren’t going anywhere. Bloomberg is def at a disadvantage jumping in the race so late and not being in some of the early primaries. I do find it interesting that Bloomberg is polling better and rising in the polls as compared to  Steyer, who seems stagnant, but kind of running the same campaign, but got in a lot earlier. I think Warren is done and Bernie is a strong second and rising.


    Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022

  • Lerxst1992
    Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,860
    benjs said:
    Hi! said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Bloomberg commercials on health care running during the playoffs.  Expensive spots that he can afford. Smart to run on health as trump is very vulnerable on the issue. 
    Looking at a couple polls today, he seems to be rising. Tied with Buddha in one and Warren in another. 
    538 has him around 5 points with Buttigieg at 7.5. Unless an event scares people away from liberalism or away from Biden just before the Primaries, though, it looks to me like Biden will occupy the moderate lane, Sanders and Warren will share the left lane and be unable to secure the votes to win it, and Biden takes it. I say this because these three candidates have had relatively stable poll floors, and Buttigieg's abysmal black support probably rules him out. If Bloomberg can challenge Biden's right to be the de facto DNC moderate candidate, maybe it works, but I guess time will tell.


    Bloomberg’s plan is actually a smart one, and zero pundits on the two lefty news channels have identified it.

    He is trying to get enough of the vote, say 30%, that would prevent any of the front runners from getting a majority.

    that way, the nomination contest goes into a second ballot and those scary super delegates emerge. Bloomberg then tries to convince them he is their best bet. He might be. 


  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,879

    Lerxst1992 said:
    benjs said:
    Hi! said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Bloomberg commercials on health care running during the playoffs.  Expensive spots that he can afford. Smart to run on health as trump is very vulnerable on the issue. 
    Looking at a couple polls today, he seems to be rising. Tied with Buddha in one and Warren in another. 
    538 has him around 5 points with Buttigieg at 7.5. Unless an event scares people away from liberalism or away from Biden just before the Primaries, though, it looks to me like Biden will occupy the moderate lane, Sanders and Warren will share the left lane and be unable to secure the votes to win it, and Biden takes it. I say this because these three candidates have had relatively stable poll floors, and Buttigieg's abysmal black support probably rules him out. If Bloomberg can challenge Biden's right to be the de facto DNC moderate candidate, maybe it works, but I guess time will tell.


    Bloomberg’s plan is actually a smart one, and zero pundits on the two lefty news channels have identified it.

    He is trying to get enough of the vote, say 30%, that would prevent any of the front runners from getting a majority.

    that way, the nomination contest goes into a second ballot and those scary super delegates emerge. Bloomberg then tries to convince them he is their best bet. He might be. 


    Agreed.  There's a real chance for a brokered convention.  Of course one or two campaigns will whine and complain and point to some obscure sub voting group that makes it clear why they should just be handed the nomination, rather than following the defined process.  But in the end, I will enjoy watching it play out like that.  Conventions were real showdowns in the past.  Lately, they are just pep rallies.  Multiple votes would be fun.  
  • Lerxst1992
    Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,860
    edited January 2020
    Sorry Hi, I didnt know your comment was above mine.

    That polling demonstrates my point. The far left is getting 30% no matter what, and so is Biden. 

    If Bloomberg can grab a sizable chunk of the remaining vote, he prevents anyone from winning on the first ballot and he has an argument to made to the super delegates.

    He might be more polished than Biden, but his problem, which is common with the remaining delegates, is he doesn’t identify with a large % of the democratic base.
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    CM189191 said:
    List Bernie's legislative accomplishments 

    Go on I'll wait

    naming post offices don't count
    CM189191 said:
    Did Bernie ever release his health records from his heart attach like he promised?
    CM189191 said:
    Refresh my memory.... How did Bernie vote in Magnitsky Act of 2012?

    Bernie is a joke

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    mickeyrat said:
    brianlux said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    brianlux said:
    mickeyrat said:
    brianlux said:
    CM189191 said:
    Lerxst1992 said:
    brianlux said:
    It's been pointed out to me by a fellow forum member here (for which I am grateful, thanks!) that Bernie Sanders has been shunned by the press lately.  December was a very busy time for me, so that might account for my not having noticed this, but now with this head up, I have to wonder what is up with that?  The Hill posted a good article that talks about this.  Media bias- something to think about:




    CNN HATES Bernie. CNN makes a ton of money from big pharma. It’s not stop drug commercials on there.

    Media companies that survive from advertising hate Bernie. He is looking to kill the golden goose. And the wealthy scare people into disliking him. You won’t keep your doctor. You’ll lie in pain forever waiting for a doctor to treat you, etc.

     Capitalism begat Capitalism begat Capitalism
    Everyone hates Bernie because he sucks

    Not everyone thinks Bernie sucks.  And isn't that a rather vague and unnecessarily slanderous summation of Sanders?  What has the man done to make you so miserable?
    hijack a party apparatus he isnt a member of? lets start there........

    Well, at least that's a more articulate comment than "he sucks"...
    Is it Bernies fault we have a two party system and candidates running in those parties for national office have huge cash advantage?

    FWIW Bernie co founded the Progressive Caucus and was allowed by party leadership to caucus with the democrats since 1994.

    I would say "no".
    my reply is so fucking what. do the goddamned work.

    he claims democratic socialism. yet runs as independent for senate.

    making promises that will never be kept (as are others).

    frankly I am about done with 60 yr old plus candidates.

    I'm not completely done with any of them if one of them can beat Trump, but I can understand why you would feel that way.  None of them are what I would like to see out their, so yeah, I get it.  But obviously (to me) any of them would be better than the current situation!
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    benjs said:
    CM189191 said:
    Bernie can fuck off
    This is purely opinion here, but in terms of who can 'fuck off', seems to me there are a few handfuls of politicians vying for a spot in office, all of whom are hungrier for power than they are hungry for progress. If running for President is a 'for the greater good', they'd coordinate and align drop-outs to help make the decision easier. If they each think they're smart enough to lead, they should be smart enough to elect, especially with the threat being so great. Any one of these people could be a sacrificial lamb and fuck off but elect not to. When I look at how stable Bernie has been, it makes sense to me because at this point his election is part of his 'movement' he's created (and arguably, pretty damn successfully), which is likely to have more stability in followers compared to candidates whose support probably wavers more easily. I happen to find him annoying, wish he would stop shouting at everyone, and don't think he'd be able to make good changes over his presidency, but I respect his right to stay there as much as anyone else's. 

    Good summation, Ben.  I'm not a huge fan but at the same time I like some of his plans for change and I definitely like that he is forthright and sticks to his plans.  Not matter what happens as far as the election goes, I hope that he is at least somewhat successful in his efforts to  lessen corporate greed, make health care more affordable, and improve environmental protection .  He has some good idea. 
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,594
    This Iran nonsense is a gift to Joe Biden. Those Obama voters who voted Trump will appreciate his steady leadership over this impulsive fuck who may have started ww3....
    www.myspace.com
  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,527
    The Juggler said:
    This Iran nonsense is a gift to Joe Biden. Those Obama voters who voted Trump will appreciate his steady leadership over this impulsive fuck who may have started ww3....
    I think it could boost him in the primary, but I wouldn't be so sure about the general election. A lot of that depends on where this all goes in the near term.
  • darwinstheory
    darwinstheory LaPorte, IN Posts: 7,362
    I think donnie will own Biden or Warren in a debate. I think Pete would be the only Dem who could own donnie during a debate.
    "A smart monkey doesn't monkey around with another monkey's monkey" - Darwin's Theory
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,594
    darwinstheory said:
    I think donnie will own Biden or Warren in a debate. I think Pete would be the only Dem who could own donnie during a debate.
    Hillary owned Donnie in '16 all three times and what good did that do her?
    www.myspace.com
  • The Juggler
    The Juggler Posts: 49,594
    pjl44 said:
    The Juggler said:
    This Iran nonsense is a gift to Joe Biden. Those Obama voters who voted Trump will appreciate his steady leadership over this impulsive fuck who may have started ww3....
    I think it could boost him in the primary, but I wouldn't be so sure about the general election. A lot of that depends on where this all goes in the near term.
    See I think it plays better in a general than in a primary....
    www.myspace.com
  • benjs
    benjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,367
    The Juggler said:
    darwinstheory said:
    I think donnie will own Biden or Warren in a debate. I think Pete would be the only Dem who could own donnie during a debate.
    Hillary owned Donnie in '16 all three times and what good did that do her?
    I really don't agree with that perspective. Yes, the Democrat consensus seemed to be that Clinton debated better, but Trump regularly got her to stop talking mid-phrase by making an outrageous and embellished soundbite, which then lived on in the media far longer than anything pragmatic Clinton said. I'd hardly call that being "owned".
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
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