Donald Trump

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  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,965
    ikiT said:
    Coming out on the side of those loser Proudboys?  The ones the Anti Fascists were so against?  

    That is Fascism.

    fascism

     noun
    fas·​cism | \ ˈfa-ˌshi-zəm also ˈfa-ˌsi-  \

    Definition of fascism

    1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
    2: a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control
    The argument is a non sequitur.  I didn't say Trump doesn't have tendencies or even it's a fascist.  I said that situation is not evidence of fascism.
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,965
    ikiT said:
    mrussel1 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    Meltdown99 said:

    The union person was fine with it. 


    “This is just what Shell wanted to do and we went along with it,” Ken Broadbent, business manager for Steamfitters Local 449, told the newspaper. He said he wouldn’t “bad rap” the situation.

    “We’re glad to have the jobs. We’re glad to have the project built,” he said. “The president is the president whether we like him or dislike him. We respect him for the title.”

    America
    Everyone involved in that fascist move should fired. Including Trump. I am in a union, and if they tried to pull this, everyone would have shown up with fucking torches and pitchforks. And the Laboir board would have been on the company like a rabid pitbull. The fact that the workers actually felt cowed enough to tolerate this, and that the union rep actually felt like this was an option, definitely does speak volumes about where America is right now, both politically and in terms of workers' rights. Absolutely disgusting. Fascism has arrived in the USA.
    You must be operating under your own special definition of fascism.  As much as I hate Trump, this isn't fascism.  If the plant is closed, why would one be paid for not being onsite? That's part of the union contract. 
    He's a textbook fascist.

    Those union members would have gotten paid time off if they didn't attend.  The hate rally, being on a Friday, was all about being paid overtime.
    You don't get time and a half during weeks you take pto, by law.  It's straight time,  unless you have it negotiated. 
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    I contend the taxpayer funded "rally" is Fascism.


    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    The steamfitters reacted the way many people have.   Powerless to do anything.  It's the danger of fascism.
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    At $38.87 an hour...I hope the $350 dollars they earned by standing around for six hours waiting on him was worth it. 
    Seems like not enough.
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    $350 of OT pay for 6 hours

    PTO $233.22 for 6 hours

    I would have stayed home for the $116.78 difference.

    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,965
    ikiT said:
    I contend the taxpayer funded "rally" is Fascism.


    So communists, socialists, and other political philosophies could not have tax payer funded rallies?  What about when Obama would go to Silicon Valley and speak to business groups or employees at someplace like Cisco?  Fascism?  When does a 'speech' become a rally? Trump certainly has authoritarian tendencies and his worst impulses are likely closest to fascism, vs other political philosophies.  But many of those worst impulses have been checked by the courts, by Congress and even by some of his admin (increasingly few).  A fascist dictator would have none of these impulses checked.  

    Hyperbole does not help the case to remove Trump.  He's terrible enough without it.  
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    His "impulses" are never checked.
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    That's the problem.
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    Did you just type what about Obama?
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,965
    ikiT said:
    His "impulses" are never checked.
    He still has to have a budget, as an easy example. Congress still has the purse strings.  Why hasn't he just dissolved Congress?  Many of his EO's are hung up in court battles.  So that's not true.  .
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    mrussel1 said:
    ikiT said:
    I contend the taxpayer funded "rally" is Fascism.


    So communists, socialists, and other political philosophies could not have tax payer funded rallies?  What about when Obama would go to Silicon Valley and speak to business groups or employees at someplace like Cisco?  Fascism?  When does a 'speech' become a rally? Trump certainly has authoritarian tendencies and his worst impulses are likely closest to fascism, vs other political philosophies.  But many of those worst impulses have been checked by the courts, by Congress and even by some of his admin (increasingly few).  A fascist dictator would have none of these impulses checked.  

    Hyperbole does not help the case to remove Trump.  He's terrible enough without it.  
    When Obama gave speeches in Silicon Valley, were the employees told they would not be paid if they did not attend, and that furthermore they were not permitted to protest in any way? 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    edited August 2019
    Bad Policies are not impulse.  Flying to the DMZ to meet with KJU is impulsive.  Having no strategy to deal with KJU is bad policy.

    Everything related to Twitter and the hate rallies and the oval office press gatherings and the chopper talks are unchecked impulse.

    Real time and judicial time and legislative time are 3 different things.
    Post edited by ikiT on
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • ikiT
    ikiT USA Posts: 11,059
    edited August 2019
    Without dipping into hyperbole, he's literally nuts.
    Bristow 05132010 to Amsterdam 2 06132018
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,965
    oftenreading said:
    mrussel1 said:
    ikiT said:
    I contend the taxpayer funded "rally" is Fascism.


    So communists, socialists, and other political philosophies could not have tax payer funded rallies?  What about when Obama would go to Silicon Valley and speak to business groups or employees at someplace like Cisco?  Fascism?  When does a 'speech' become a rally? Trump certainly has authoritarian tendencies and his worst impulses are likely closest to fascism, vs other political philosophies.  But many of those worst impulses have been checked by the courts, by Congress and even by some of his admin (increasingly few).  A fascist dictator would have none of these impulses checked.  

    Hyperbole does not help the case to remove Trump.  He's terrible enough without it.  
    When Obama gave speeches in Silicon Valley, were the employees told they would not be paid if they did not attend, and that furthermore they were not permitted to protest in any way? 
    My guess is the employees Obama talked to were exempt employees, so it's not an accurate comparison.  But for the sake of argument, are you saying the Trump administration instructed the Shell management to to not pay them if they didn't show?  I have not read that the administration made that call and told Shell to go forth.
    Do you pay non-exempt employees when they don't come to work and out of PTO?  I don't.  
  • Bentleyspop
    Bentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,634
    Got to love supporters of the currently elected president.....

    https://youtu.be/gpMBk6e5rTg
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,997
    lol, when trump finds out the guy he called fat was a trumpster, he called him and left a voice mail. he apparently didn't apologize, but he called him. 

    what a loser. 
    Your boos mean nothing to me, for I have seen what makes you cheer



  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,646
    mrussel1 said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    mrussel1 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    Meltdown99 said:

    The union person was fine with it. 


    “This is just what Shell wanted to do and we went along with it,” Ken Broadbent, business manager for Steamfitters Local 449, told the newspaper. He said he wouldn’t “bad rap” the situation.

    “We’re glad to have the jobs. We’re glad to have the project built,” he said. “The president is the president whether we like him or dislike him. We respect him for the title.”

    America
    Everyone involved in that fascist move should fired. Including Trump. I am in a union, and if they tried to pull this, everyone would have shown up with fucking torches and pitchforks. And the Laboir board would have been on the company like a rabid pitbull. The fact that the workers actually felt cowed enough to tolerate this, and that the union rep actually felt like this was an option, definitely does speak volumes about where America is right now, both politically and in terms of workers' rights. Absolutely disgusting. Fascism has arrived in the USA.
    You must be operating under your own special definition of fascism.  As much as I hate Trump, this isn't fascism.  If the plant is closed, why would one be paid for not being onsite? That's part of the union contract. 
    Disgusting take on this.
    This about sums up the depth of your debating skills.  
    "But my MRI"
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,965
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    lol, when trump finds out the guy he called fat was a trumpster, he called him and left a voice mail. he apparently didn't apologize, but he called him. 

    what a loser. 
    The dude was probably honored to be subjected to Trump's ridicule.  
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,795
    mrussel1 said:
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    lol, when trump finds out the guy he called fat was a trumpster, he called him and left a voice mail. he apparently didn't apologize, but he called him. 

    what a loser. 
    The dude was probably honored to be subjected to Trump's ridicule.  
    Ahhh yes, the Don Rickles treatment!
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