The National Football League
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I've been against it for a long time. Even in regular season games shockingly enough.JK_Livin said:
It's too easy to ignore the OT of the NFC game.Poncier said:
I was surprised they kicked on 2nd down with 11 seconds left. Should have taken at least one more shot at the end zone...but then again, Andy Reid, so I shouldn't have been that surprised.JK_Livin said:Maybe the Chiefs shouldn't have settled for the FG. Maybe they should've tried one more toss or 2 to the endzone. Don't put your fate in a coin when you do have an option.
And why is nobody upset about how overtime played out in the NFC game? Saints won the toss, took the ball...and lost!
And there is a lot going on about that NFC game outside of the OT....got a mind full of questions and a teacher in my soul...0 -
The team winning the coin toss has won 52.7% of the time since they changed the rule in 2012 to require a TD to win on the opening possession. That's statistically a toss up.pjhawks said:
a team that win's the coin toss in overtime has a higher percentage to win than the team that loses the toss because of the rule that a TD wins it. is it fair to give one team a greater mathematical chance to win a game because of the coin toss? Especially in a playoff game? you have to be crazy to think that is ok.JK_Livin said:So if each team scores a td on their 1st possessions in OT , the team that scored 1st gets the ball again. Why is that fair then? The cycle will just continue. It fine the way it is. It's big boy professional football. I equate people that want to change the OT rules to people wanting participation trophies.
This weekend we rock Portland0 -
BoomPoncier said:
The team winning the coin toss has won 52.7% of the time since they changed the rule in 2012 to require a TD to win on the opening possession. That's statistically a toss up.pjhawks said:
a team that win's the coin toss in overtime has a higher percentage to win than the team that loses the toss because of the rule that a TD wins it. is it fair to give one team a greater mathematical chance to win a game because of the coin toss? Especially in a playoff game? you have to be crazy to think that is ok.JK_Livin said:So if each team scores a td on their 1st possessions in OT , the team that scored 1st gets the ball again. Why is that fair then? The cycle will just continue. It fine the way it is. It's big boy professional football. I equate people that want to change the OT rules to people wanting participation trophies.
"My brain's a good brain!"0 -
This is all correct.tbergs said:And for what it's worth, people dissing Belichek as not factoring in to the team being successful must not have ever suffered under poor coaching in any sport they played. An individual player in any sport can be great and lead his or her team to a successful season, but more often than not, they need a great coach to achieve a championship. I saw someone mention Phil Jackson as an example of someone benefitting from having great players, but it goes both ways. Neither the Lakers nor Bulls would have won as many championships (and weren't) without Jackson at the helm. A great coach also can't make a championship team with only 1 good player. The system Belichek created in NE works just as well as the system Jackson created in Chicago and LA worked. Lebron is a great player, but how many championships would he have if he had played for a team coached by someone like Jackson? A hell of a lot more. How about Malone and Stockton? There are examples all over sports history of players and coaches hosed by lacking the right chemistry in the locker room coupled with a great leader. We usually only hear about the players being hosed, but there are a lot of great coaches who suffered under subpar talent or egotistical stars and never got a championship before being canned or retiring.
And there's only one person dissing Belichek here....www.myspace.com0 -
would you bet your life on 2.7% of a chance? 2.7% is actually what has occurred and not the % of the team winning the coin toss has of winning. it's probably not a significantly percentage difference but even if it is around 2.7% what i said above is correct. the team winning the toss has a higher mathematical chance to win the game because of the stupid TD wins the game rule. even if it's small is that fair in a playoff game?Poncier said:
The team winning the coin toss has won 52.7% of the time since they changed the rule in 2012 to require a TD to win on the opening possession. That's statistically a toss up.pjhawks said:
a team that win's the coin toss in overtime has a higher percentage to win than the team that loses the toss because of the rule that a TD wins it. is it fair to give one team a greater mathematical chance to win a game because of the coin toss? Especially in a playoff game? you have to be crazy to think that is ok.JK_Livin said:So if each team scores a td on their 1st possessions in OT , the team that scored 1st gets the ball again. Why is that fair then? The cycle will just continue. It fine the way it is. It's big boy professional football. I equate people that want to change the OT rules to people wanting participation trophies.0 -
Yeah I don't get all the crying about it. It could be better but I like the way it's set up now. You lose the toss? Boohoo. Don't let the other team drive all the way down the field and score a touch down. Man up and play some defense.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
BoomPoncier said:
The team winning the coin toss has won 52.7% of the time since they changed the rule in 2012 to require a TD to win on the opening possession. That's statistically a toss up.pjhawks said:
a team that win's the coin toss in overtime has a higher percentage to win than the team that loses the toss because of the rule that a TD wins it. is it fair to give one team a greater mathematical chance to win a game because of the coin toss? Especially in a playoff game? you have to be crazy to think that is ok.JK_Livin said:So if each team scores a td on their 1st possessions in OT , the team that scored 1st gets the ball again. Why is that fair then? The cycle will just continue. It fine the way it is. It's big boy professional football. I equate people that want to change the OT rules to people wanting participation trophies.
I have a hard time thinking of fans back in the 60's and 70's whining about sudden death...www.myspace.com0 -
Well one side is going to have a higher percentage, but as I said a 2.7% advantage is statistically nil.pjhawks said:
would you bet your life on 2.7% of a chance? 2.7% is actually what has occurred and not the % of the team winning the coin toss has of winning. it's probably not a significantly percentage difference but even if it is around 2.7% what i said above is correct. the team winning the toss has a higher mathematical chance to win the game because of the stupid TD wins the game rule. even if it's small is that fair in a playoff game?Poncier said:
The team winning the coin toss has won 52.7% of the time since they changed the rule in 2012 to require a TD to win on the opening possession. That's statistically a toss up.pjhawks said:
a team that win's the coin toss in overtime has a higher percentage to win than the team that loses the toss because of the rule that a TD wins it. is it fair to give one team a greater mathematical chance to win a game because of the coin toss? Especially in a playoff game? you have to be crazy to think that is ok.JK_Livin said:So if each team scores a td on their 1st possessions in OT , the team that scored 1st gets the ball again. Why is that fair then? The cycle will just continue. It fine the way it is. It's big boy professional football. I equate people that want to change the OT rules to people wanting participation trophies.
In 2 years it could possibly flip to where its 48.9% for the team winning the toss, then what?
If the "advantage" was like 20%, you'd have a valid argument.
This weekend we rock Portland0 -
where the fuck am i dissing Belichick? jeezus you got a be a fucking moron to think he's not winning more because he has the greatest QB of all fucking time. My god is this hard to fucking understand? did Phil Jackson not win more because he had Michael fucking Jordan? even you can't be that fucking dumb or stubborn to admit that. my god...The Juggler said:
This is all correct.tbergs said:And for what it's worth, people dissing Belichek as not factoring in to the team being successful must not have ever suffered under poor coaching in any sport they played. An individual player in any sport can be great and lead his or her team to a successful season, but more often than not, they need a great coach to achieve a championship. I saw someone mention Phil Jackson as an example of someone benefitting from having great players, but it goes both ways. Neither the Lakers nor Bulls would have won as many championships (and weren't) without Jackson at the helm. A great coach also can't make a championship team with only 1 good player. The system Belichek created in NE works just as well as the system Jackson created in Chicago and LA worked. Lebron is a great player, but how many championships would he have if he had played for a team coached by someone like Jackson? A hell of a lot more. How about Malone and Stockton? There are examples all over sports history of players and coaches hosed by lacking the right chemistry in the locker room coupled with a great leader. We usually only hear about the players being hosed, but there are a lot of great coaches who suffered under subpar talent or egotistical stars and never got a championship before being canned or retiring.
And there's only one person dissing Belichek here....0 -
The Juggler said:
Yeah I don't get all the crying about it. It could be better but I like the way it's set up now. You lose the toss? Boohoo. Don't let the other team drive all the way down the field and score a touch down. Man up and play some defense.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
BoomPoncier said:
The team winning the coin toss has won 52.7% of the time since they changed the rule in 2012 to require a TD to win on the opening possession. That's statistically a toss up.pjhawks said:
a team that win's the coin toss in overtime has a higher percentage to win than the team that loses the toss because of the rule that a TD wins it. is it fair to give one team a greater mathematical chance to win a game because of the coin toss? Especially in a playoff game? you have to be crazy to think that is ok.JK_Livin said:So if each team scores a td on their 1st possessions in OT , the team that scored 1st gets the ball again. Why is that fair then? The cycle will just continue. It fine the way it is. It's big boy professional football. I equate people that want to change the OT rules to people wanting participation trophies.
I have a hard time thinking of fans back in the 60's and 70's whining about sudden death...This.
The love he receives is the love that is saved0 -
Worcester1 13, Worcester2 13, Hartford 13, San Diego 13, Los Angeles1 13, Los Angeles2 13
Trieste 14, Vienna 14, Gdynia 14, Leeds 14, Milton Keynes 14, Denver 14
Central Park 15
Fort Lauderdale 16, Miami 16, Tampa 16, Jacksonville 16, Greenville 16, Hampton 16, Columbia 16, Lexington 16, Philly1 16, Philly2 16, NYC1 16, NYC2 16, Quebec City 16, Ottawa 16, Toronto1 16, Toronto2 16, Fenway1 16, Fenway2 16, Wrigley1 16, Wrigley2 160 -
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Well, would Tom have as many rings if Andy Reid or Marty Schottenheimer was his coach? Hell no. They all benefited from having each other and that coach, and GM in most cases, helped build the team they needed.pjhawks said:
where the fuck am i dissing Belichick? jeezus you got a be a fucking moron to think he's not winning more because he has the greatest QB of all fucking time. My god is this hard to fucking understand? did Phil Jackson not win more because he had Michael fucking Jordan? even you can't be that fucking dumb or stubborn to admit that. my god...The Juggler said:
This is all correct.tbergs said:And for what it's worth, people dissing Belichek as not factoring in to the team being successful must not have ever suffered under poor coaching in any sport they played. An individual player in any sport can be great and lead his or her team to a successful season, but more often than not, they need a great coach to achieve a championship. I saw someone mention Phil Jackson as an example of someone benefitting from having great players, but it goes both ways. Neither the Lakers nor Bulls would have won as many championships (and weren't) without Jackson at the helm. A great coach also can't make a championship team with only 1 good player. The system Belichek created in NE works just as well as the system Jackson created in Chicago and LA worked. Lebron is a great player, but how many championships would he have if he had played for a team coached by someone like Jackson? A hell of a lot more. How about Malone and Stockton? There are examples all over sports history of players and coaches hosed by lacking the right chemistry in the locker room coupled with a great leader. We usually only hear about the players being hosed, but there are a lot of great coaches who suffered under subpar talent or egotistical stars and never got a championship before being canned or retiring.
And there's only one person dissing Belichek here....It's a hopeless situation...0 -
Brady has a better chance of having the same number or rings with almost any other coach than Belichick has of have as many with any other QB. how is this even disputable?tbergs said:
Well, would Tom have as many rings if Andy Reid or Marty Schottenheimer was his coach? Hell no. They all benefited from having each other and that coach, and GM in most cases, helped build the team they needed.pjhawks said:
where the fuck am i dissing Belichick? jeezus you got a be a fucking moron to think he's not winning more because he has the greatest QB of all fucking time. My god is this hard to fucking understand? did Phil Jackson not win more because he had Michael fucking Jordan? even you can't be that fucking dumb or stubborn to admit that. my god...The Juggler said:
This is all correct.tbergs said:And for what it's worth, people dissing Belichek as not factoring in to the team being successful must not have ever suffered under poor coaching in any sport they played. An individual player in any sport can be great and lead his or her team to a successful season, but more often than not, they need a great coach to achieve a championship. I saw someone mention Phil Jackson as an example of someone benefitting from having great players, but it goes both ways. Neither the Lakers nor Bulls would have won as many championships (and weren't) without Jackson at the helm. A great coach also can't make a championship team with only 1 good player. The system Belichek created in NE works just as well as the system Jackson created in Chicago and LA worked. Lebron is a great player, but how many championships would he have if he had played for a team coached by someone like Jackson? A hell of a lot more. How about Malone and Stockton? There are examples all over sports history of players and coaches hosed by lacking the right chemistry in the locker room coupled with a great leader. We usually only hear about the players being hosed, but there are a lot of great coaches who suffered under subpar talent or egotistical stars and never got a championship before being canned or retiring.
And there's only one person dissing Belichek here....
is there QB around you think Belichick was winning this many AFC Titles other than Brady? isn't the 14 games under .500 before Brady took over a telling stat?
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Brady is great, amazing. Everyone agrees. Even people who hate football love Tom Brady.Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback that god ever created.If Tom Brady wants to build a wall, who are we to say no?
In all seriousness, Brady is great.Bad Bill is the best coach I have ever seen and I give him more credit than Brady. Does not mean that I poo on Brady -- he is great. May be the greatest QB of all time. I think there is a better case for other QBs being nearly as great as TB12 as other coaches being nearly as great as BBAngry. Bad Bill is miles beyond any other head coach given how much more complex everything in football is these days and how he has sustained excellence for these years.The love he receives is the love that is saved0 -
You put TB12 in Cleveland and they ain’t having the same level of success. You put mad bill in Cleveland and they’re not having the same level of success. You put TB12 and mad bill in Cleveland and they’re not having the same level of success. It takes more than the greatest coach and qb of all time. Way more.F Me In The Brain said:Brady is great, amazing. Everyone agrees. Even people who hate football love Tom Brady.Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback that god ever created.If Tom Brady wants to build a wall, who are we to say no?In all seriousness, Brady is great.Bad Bill is the best coach I have ever seen and I give him more credit than Brady. Does not mean that I poo on Brady -- he is great. May be the greatest QB of all time. I think there is a better case for other QBs being nearly as great as TB12 as other coaches being nearly as great as BBAngry. Bad Bill is miles beyond any other head coach given how much more complex everything in football is these days and how he has sustained excellence for these years.09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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This would be correct. (Why are you and I agreeing so much today?)Halifax2TheMax said:
You put TB12 in Cleveland and they ain’t having the same level of success. You put mad bill in Cleveland and they’re not having the same level of success. You put TB12 and mad bill in Cleveland and they’re not having the same level of success. It takes more than the greatest coach and qb of all time. Way more.F Me In The Brain said:Brady is great, amazing. Everyone agrees. Even people who hate football love Tom Brady.Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback that god ever created.If Tom Brady wants to build a wall, who are we to say no?In all seriousness, Brady is great.Bad Bill is the best coach I have ever seen and I give him more credit than Brady. Does not mean that I poo on Brady -- he is great. May be the greatest QB of all time. I think there is a better case for other QBs being nearly as great as TB12 as other coaches being nearly as great as BBAngry. Bad Bill is miles beyond any other head coach given how much more complex everything in football is these days and how he has sustained excellence for these years.I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
I guess we just disagree. How many amazing quarterbacks have either never won a SB or only won 1? Brady is lucky to have played for that coach in that division in that geographic market. It takes vision and true leadership to succeed at that level for that long. Few NFL teams have either.pjhawks said:
Brady has a better chance of having the same number or rings with almost any other coach than Belichick has of have as many with any other QB. how is this even disputable?tbergs said:
Well, would Tom have as many rings if Andy Reid or Marty Schottenheimer was his coach? Hell no. They all benefited from having each other and that coach, and GM in most cases, helped build the team they needed.pjhawks said:
where the fuck am i dissing Belichick? jeezus you got a be a fucking moron to think he's not winning more because he has the greatest QB of all fucking time. My god is this hard to fucking understand? did Phil Jackson not win more because he had Michael fucking Jordan? even you can't be that fucking dumb or stubborn to admit that. my god...The Juggler said:
This is all correct.tbergs said:And for what it's worth, people dissing Belichek as not factoring in to the team being successful must not have ever suffered under poor coaching in any sport they played. An individual player in any sport can be great and lead his or her team to a successful season, but more often than not, they need a great coach to achieve a championship. I saw someone mention Phil Jackson as an example of someone benefitting from having great players, but it goes both ways. Neither the Lakers nor Bulls would have won as many championships (and weren't) without Jackson at the helm. A great coach also can't make a championship team with only 1 good player. The system Belichek created in NE works just as well as the system Jackson created in Chicago and LA worked. Lebron is a great player, but how many championships would he have if he had played for a team coached by someone like Jackson? A hell of a lot more. How about Malone and Stockton? There are examples all over sports history of players and coaches hosed by lacking the right chemistry in the locker room coupled with a great leader. We usually only hear about the players being hosed, but there are a lot of great coaches who suffered under subpar talent or egotistical stars and never got a championship before being canned or retiring.
And there's only one person dissing Belichek here....
is there QB around you think Belichick was winning this many AFC Titles other than Brady? isn't the 14 games under .500 before Brady took over a telling stat?It's a hopeless situation...0 -
Maybe I had ice in my red wine at lunch this afternoon?mcgruff10 said:
This would be correct. (Why are you and I agreeing so much today?)Halifax2TheMax said:
You put TB12 in Cleveland and they ain’t having the same level of success. You put mad bill in Cleveland and they’re not having the same level of success. You put TB12 and mad bill in Cleveland and they’re not having the same level of success. It takes more than the greatest coach and qb of all time. Way more.F Me In The Brain said:Brady is great, amazing. Everyone agrees. Even people who hate football love Tom Brady.Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback that god ever created.If Tom Brady wants to build a wall, who are we to say no?In all seriousness, Brady is great.Bad Bill is the best coach I have ever seen and I give him more credit than Brady. Does not mean that I poo on Brady -- he is great. May be the greatest QB of all time. I think there is a better case for other QBs being nearly as great as TB12 as other coaches being nearly as great as BBAngry. Bad Bill is miles beyond any other head coach given how much more complex everything in football is these days and how he has sustained excellence for these years.
09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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One guy is likely the greatest quarterback of all time.
The other guy is likely the greatest coach of all time.
To disparage one or the other means you're on the wrong side of the argument.www.myspace.com0 -
14 games under .500 before Brady too over.F Me In The Brain said:Brady is great, amazing. Everyone agrees. Even people who hate football love Tom Brady.Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback that god ever created.If Tom Brady wants to build a wall, who are we to say no?In all seriousness, Brady is great.Bad Bill is the best coach I have ever seen and I give him more credit than Brady. Does not mean that I poo on Brady -- he is great. May be the greatest QB of all time. I think there is a better case for other QBs being nearly as great as TB12 as other coaches being nearly as great as BBAngry. Bad Bill is miles beyond any other head coach given how much more complex everything in football is these days and how he has sustained excellence for these years.0
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