minimum wage (part II)

12467…10

Comments

  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    chadwick wrote:
    jeanwah i agree fully simply because it is the truth

    The top three countries by GDP per hours work are European countries with at least 5 weeks paid holidays (+'legal' days off such as Easter, May Day, etc. - approx 7/8 days per year) and a working week of an average of 37/38 hours. Number of working hours per week is regulated in Europe. An employer cannot make you work more than 48hours unless you agree. There are certain exceptions depending on type of employment and job but these are still regulated for safety reasons.

    'Working hard' is not automatically working silly hours.

    Being in the office for long hours, not wanting to take holidays, etc. does not help productivity. So much has research done on that already.
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    chadwick wrote:
    1. close all doors to shipping work overseas
    2. put work in our hands here in the u.s.
    3. a full work week is 40 hrs a week
    4. some prices may go up & some prices may go down
    5. eating out will cost more
    6. community service tasks should be done by ppl in jail & prison as well as mandatory voluntering or pay a little fine
    7. create public transportion in all states, counties, towns & cities & people should use the buses as much as possible or get beat w/ a hammer
    8. clotheslines
    9. legalize marijuana straight across the board
    10. growing hemp

    Especially clotheslines!! :lol:
  • even flow - question mark
    even flow - question mark Posts: 1,568
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    So what is it that everyone wants? That the government force all employers to pay workers so that they can make $50,000 a year all while only working 30-40 hours a week? I understand working yourself senseless and employers taking advantage of workers. But damn people, one must have a work ethic that includes being willing to work more than you want to.


    Seems economics may be your strong suit??? But math is not.

    10$ multiplied by 40 hours = 400 take that to 52 weeks in a year, and you and everybody else gets $20,800.00. I may assume here that may be a tad (well look at that) less then 50000.

    The poison from the poison stream caught up to you ELEVEN years ago and you floated out of here. Sept. 14, 08

  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    It is against the law to drive like that. I'm not a truck driver, but my dad was long ago. He would tell me stories how driver's would keep 2 log books. One for the law when they were stopped and one for their employer. Are u aware of this practice Chadwick?
    phuck no i am blind & soo mentally slow i have no fucking clue
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    chadwick wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:

    That's mind settling. To know that the truck driver driving next to me is working on little sleep and is overworked means they are at high risk of causing an accident. That should be against the law, but hey, the trucking owner needs his money and so does the driver, so to hell with the other drivers on the road...
    yes that driver could cause an accident. chances are it will not be his or her fault. truck drivers are professional drivers. yes they screw up. it's a fact that most of the time the accident was caused by a none truck driver.

    The accident I was in was caused initially by a tractor trailer driver who fell asleep at the wheel.
  • Kel Varnsen
    Kel Varnsen Posts: 1,952
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    So what is it that everyone wants? That the government force all employers to pay workers so that they can make $50,000 a year all while only working 30-40 hours a week? I understand working yourself senseless and employers taking advantage of workers. But damn people, one must have a work ethic that includes being willing to work more than you want to.

    One problem with that kind of thing is the fact that if you can make $50,000 a year working an entry level job with no skills and minimal training, what motivation do people have to improve their skills? I mean I worked a few crappy jobs in high school. And the fact that they didn't pay that great and I had to deal with annoying customers were an awesome motivation to go to university so that I didn't have to do those jobs the rest of my life.

    Plus really if everyone is making $50,000 how much does the price of things increase. I am not talking about costs related to the cost of paying employees I am just talking about general inflation costs. I mean things generally cost more in areas where people have more money. I mean a house (or even simple things like beer) generally cost more in somewhere like Boston than they do in somewhere like Detroit. Because people who sell stuff in Boston know there is more money out there and they can price things accordingly.
  • Last-12-Exit
    Last-12-Exit Charleston, SC Posts: 8,661
    even flow - question mark wrote:
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    So what is it that everyone wants? That the government force all employers to pay workers so that they can make $50,000 a year all while only working 30-40 hours a week? I understand working yourself senseless and employers taking advantage of workers. But damn people, one must have a work ethic that includes being willing to work more than you want to.


    Seems economics may be your strong suit??? But math is not.

    10$ multiplied by 40 hours = 400 take that to 52 weeks in a year, and you and everybody else gets $20,800.00. I may assume here that may be a tad (well look at that) less then 50000.

    I'll laugh at that as I was not referring to the actual number. But more to the point of people wanting more but not willing to work for it. I'm not accusing anyone here of a poor work ethic. I'm simply against the idea of the government mandating wages.
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    Besides making sure people are paid enough to live decently, but besides that, I suggest we could help by teaching younger people going into the work field how to maximize what they have. My wife and I are working with my step-daughter to formulate a budget that works for her. She's very excited about it because she's starting to see that it works. Besides budgeting I encourage the concept of month-ahead budgeting. Every month our income goes into the next months budget. For example, by March 31st, I will have money in my budget for the electricity bill and phone bills that will come in April. I set aside 1/12 of my auto insurance every month so that when the bill comes, the money is there. I just write the check. It can be difficult to do this at first- you have to have a months worth of income stocked up, but I even managed to do this several years ago when I was injured, lost my job and lived in my vehicle.

    Fair pay is just, careful spending and saving is wise.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Last-12-Exit
    Last-12-Exit Charleston, SC Posts: 8,661
    edited March 2013
    brianlux wrote:
    Besides making sure people are paid enough to live decently, but besides that, I suggest we could help by teaching younger people going into the work field how to maximize what they have. My wife and I are working with my step-daughter to formulate a budget that works for her. She's very excited about it because she's starting to see that it works. Besides budgeting I encourage the concept of month-ahead budgeting. Every month our income goes into the next months budget. For example, by March 31st, I will have money in my budget for the electricity bill and phone bills that will come in April. I set aside 1/12 of my auto insurance every month so that when the bill comes, the money is there. I just write the check. It can be difficult to do this at first- you have to have a months worth of income stocked up, but I even managed to do this several years ago when I was injured, lost my job and lived in my vehicle.

    Fair pay is just, careful spending and saving is wise.


    The best idea between these two threads. Teach young people how to budget and save.

    Edit: we are required, in school, to take many English, math, and writing classes. But how many economics classes? In most high schools, 1. And that's normally a split semester class with government.
    Post edited by Last-12-Exit on
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    edited March 2013
    Jeanwah wrote:
    chadwick wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:

    That's mind settling. To know that the truck driver driving next to me is working on little sleep and is overworked means they are at high risk of causing an accident. That should be against the law, but hey, the trucking owner needs his money and so does the driver, so to hell with the other drivers on the road...
    yes that driver could cause an accident. chances are it will not be his or her fault. truck drivers are professional drivers. yes they screw up. it's a fact that most of the time the accident was caused by a none truck driver.

    The accident I was in was caused initially by a tractor trailer driver who fell asleep at the wheel.
    happens all day. true it does. however, 54 million accidents a day are caused by 4wheelers. do not make believe you car operators have driven as much as a truck driver. you drive an average of 500-800 miles a day for 10 years. tell me about experience driving icey mountain ranges @ 3am.

    most drivers have exactly what the military have been trained to do. i call it sleep deprivation expert management. in todays day & age most cross country drivers travel with a co-driver. saves time & money & a quick turn around. one sleeps, one drives. it works well.

    most drivers also run on the nap system. they take a lot of naps out there. no matter what it is a difficult task & it can be deadly to everyone involved or nearby.
    Post edited by chadwick on
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    even flow - question mark wrote:
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    So what is it that everyone wants? That the government force all employers to pay workers so that they can make $50,000 a year all while only working 30-40 hours a week? I understand working yourself senseless and employers taking advantage of workers. But damn people, one must have a work ethic that includes being willing to work more than you want to.


    Seems economics may be your strong suit??? But math is not.

    10$ multiplied by 40 hours = 400 take that to 52 weeks in a year, and you and everybody else gets $20,800.00. I may assume here that may be a tad (well look at that) less then 50000.

    I'll laugh at that as I was not referring to the actual number. But more to the point of people wanting more but not willing to work for it. I'm not accusing anyone here of a poor work ethic. I'm simply against the idea of the government mandating wages.

    Why, so employers can pay below minimum wage? Is that what you want, to really stick it to people? Because people are already paid below, someone posted a link some pages back, I'll have to find it. Or is it because we should not be taking care of workers at all, "they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps" mentality? I bet you're a Lib.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    Jeanwah wrote:


    Americans are bred to work harder, faster, more than any other country. With that comes dysfunctional families (because parents aren't home raising their kids), health problems, a rise in mental dysfunction due to stress of overwork, loss in productivity time for business (not just sick time, but time on the job lost due to being stressed out), lack of a balance, and the list goes on and on. People are expected to work lots of overtime, to work on their "vacations", to feel guilty about taking personal time, etc. And one wonders about the state of Americans and their health... I can go on and on, I did research about work, time and the American a few years ago... European countries actually mandate leisure time because they know how important time off is to everyone, business included. The U.S. is just sabotaging itself here and people don't want to acknowledge that it's just another problem...
    I'm proud we are the hardest workers in the world ...far out!

    It really again comes down to a person's outlook. If you choose to be hard working it is good for you.
    If you must work hard but hate it the negativity will weigh you down like a chip on your shoulder.
    We see that, don't we?

    Gee as employers I have never experienced the above for workers. Even in life I have not.
    We can not or would not force anyone nor take from vacation time or make anyone guilty.
    We have let employees leave early for personal family business etc.
    I think the majority of employers do this and know employees like their personal time off.

    Again a person's health is directly related to our mind and hearts outlook...
    not how much they work.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    hedonist wrote:
    pandora wrote:
    They do not necessarily take a toll anymore than negativity, living lazy, or without goals.
    I think in a generalization hard working people are in much better shape mentally,
    physically and spiritually then their counterparts.
    It has to do with feeling good about yourself. Hard work does just this. Positive outlook makes all
    the difference in health.

    We are approaching 60. Many of our kids friend's fathers have passed. Those who have
    were not hard working nor good examples for their young men. Life styles and outlook on life
    is the key, the human body can take hard work, it needs hard work. But most importantly
    the body needs a mind and heart that is positive. It needs to be surrounded by others with the
    same.
    I'm not talking about working hard - I do that working a typically 40-hour week...I'm talking about working excessive hours that by design deprive one of time for themselves, for family/friends, for decompressing. Recharging, as riotgrl mentioned.
    Maybe read then my response to her... personal choice.
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    pandora wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:


    Americans are bred to work harder, faster, more than any other country. With that comes dysfunctional families (because parents aren't home raising their kids), health problems, a rise in mental dysfunction due to stress of overwork, loss in productivity time for business (not just sick time, but time on the job lost due to being stressed out), lack of a balance, and the list goes on and on. People are expected to work lots of overtime, to work on their "vacations", to feel guilty about taking personal time, etc. And one wonders about the state of Americans and their health... I can go on and on, I did research about work, time and the American a few years ago... European countries actually mandate leisure time because they know how important time off is to everyone, business included. The U.S. is just sabotaging itself here and people don't want to acknowledge that it's just another problem...
    I'm proud we are the hardest workers in the world ...far out!

    It really again comes down to a person's outlook. If you choose to be hard working it is good for you.
    If you must work hard but hate it the negativity will weigh you down like a chip on your shoulder.
    We see that, don't we?

    Gee as employers I have never experienced the above for workers. Even in life I have not.
    We can not or would not force anyone nor take from vacation time or make anyone guilty.
    We have let employees leave early for personal family business etc.
    I think the majority of employers do this and know employees like their personal time off.

    Again a person's health is directly related to our mind and hearts outlook...
    not how much they work.

    Simply not true.
  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    edited March 2013
    The Hardest Working Countries In The World

    "Everyone likes to think they work harder than everyone else, but the latest OECD data may surprise some Europeans and Americans who expected to be at the top of the world's hard work list.

    The latest data from the OECD sheds light on not just paid work, but also unpaid work such as cooking and other housework.

    Notable absentees from the top 14 include Germany, France, and the UK. All of the countries listed have a work day longer than the OECD average.

    Note: This list only considers OECD countries. Data released April 12, 2011."



    http://www.businessinsider.com/the-hard ... 011-4?op=1

    Oops... USA not no. 1... :oops:
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    Kel Varnsen wrote:
    Last-12-Exit wrote:
    So what is it that everyone wants? That the government force all employers to pay workers so that they can make $50,000 a year all while only working 30-40 hours a week? I understand working yourself senseless and employers taking advantage of workers. But damn people, one must have a work ethic that includes being willing to work more than you want to.

    One problem with that kind of thing is the fact that if you can make $50,000 a year working an entry level job with no skills and minimal training, what motivation do people have to improve their skills? I mean I worked a few crappy jobs in high school. And the fact that they didn't pay that great and I had to deal with annoying customers were an awesome motivation to go to university so that I didn't have to do those jobs the rest of my life.

    Plus really if everyone is making $50,000 how much does the price of things increase. I am not talking about costs related to the cost of paying employees I am just talking about general inflation costs. I mean things generally cost more in areas where people have more money. I mean a house (or even simple things like beer) generally cost more in somewhere like Boston than they do in somewhere like Detroit. Because people who sell stuff in Boston know there is more money out there and they can price things accordingly.
    which is kinda wild really. groceries in western washington... thru the ceiling compared to midwest prices. stores gotta pay shipping costs. diesel is what $5.00 per gallon?

    tractor trailers get 5 miles per gallon. two tanks each holds 150 gallon. that's 300 gallons of diesel & that can last about 24 hrs. 300 gallons X $5 per gallon = $1,500.00
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    pandora wrote:
    Again a person's health is directly related to our mind and hearts outlook...
    not how much they work.
    I'd say partly related.

    Genes do play a part as well, no? Environment? Shit simply going wrong within a person's body?

    Whole lotta factors, known and unknown, affect one's physical and mental health.

    Anyway, that's neither here nor there as relates to the topic.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    Jeanwah wrote:

    Are you kidding? No one, NO ONE has said on their death bed that they wished that they worked more in their life. Yet it is very common to be on your death bed and wished you spent more time with their kids, spent more time enjoying life, enjoy more time living. Studies prove that working too much leads to health problems, stress and balance problems, family problems, and productivity problems on the job. Do your research.
    Really no one wished they had worked harder towards a dream or a goal? really?
    Maybe you haven't thought through that statement.

    Too many people do not connect as they should when they have time together. They regret
    not being kind, giving, celebrating traditions, making memories, speaking their hearts.
    Enjoying holidays. Too many are distracted by the meaningless, by negativity, constantly
    finding fault when it comes time to enjoy, they can not rid themselves of the cloud.

    On the death bed this becomes extremely clear. Their shortcomings in relationships.
    How they shorted themselves.
    This is what people are talking about. Not working too hard at something they enjoyed.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    hedonist wrote:
    Yup. Still have yet to read the rest of this thread, but I know the time I spent with my father at the hospice three days before he died had NOTHING to do with work, but of the life he lived and the kind of man and father he was. A fucking good one at that.

    Pandora, I don't get your comment about those fathers who've passed were not hardworking nor good examples. If you've clarified or corrected this subsequent to your post up there, then my apologies.
    My father is remembered by the world for the work he did. I remember him for his heart.
    Unfortunately there are fathers who fail not only those who love them but life itself.
  • Last-12-Exit
    Last-12-Exit Charleston, SC Posts: 8,661
    Why, so employers can pay below minimum wage? Is that what you want, to really stick it to people? Because people are already paid below, someone posted a link some pages back, I'll have to find it. Or is it because we should not be taking care of workers at all, "they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps" mentality? I bet you're a Lib.[/quote]

    Really?
This discussion has been closed.

Categories