***The Official Philadelphia Phillies 2012 Thread***

jamminpearls wrote:

Cliffy,i think what he's trying to say is that because of are 5th hitter Howard gets shit to hit. Does Howard look real bad and swing at too much junk for sure. But it's hard to knock in RBI's when you rarely get a fastball or see a strike. We have 2.5 hitters in are lineup at the moment so completely pitching around Howard is alot easier then pitching around the Yanks 4 hitter.

this never bothered bonds when he had pedro feliz hitting behind him. or pujols with a washed up jim edmonds behind him.

the lineup protection thing is nonsense. good hitters should be able to hit any type of pitch

The Fixer wrote:

jamminpearls wrote:

Cliffy,i think what he's trying to say is that because of are 5th hitter Howard gets shit to hit. Does Howard look real bad and swing at too much junk for sure. But it's hard to knock in RBI's when you rarely get a fastball or see a strike. We have 2.5 hitters in are lineup at the moment so completely pitching around Howard is alot easier then pitching around the Yanks 4 hitter.

this never bothered bonds when he had pedro feliz hitting behind him. or pujols with a washed up jim edmonds behind him.

the lineup protection thing is nonsense. good hitters should be able to hit any type of pitch

Which is why Bonds was better,the Phillies might have the worse 5-8 hitters in the game.

as I said last week, beltran would be perfect in RF for this team. make it happen raj


In a season in which teams are scratching for runs and general managers are scanning other teams' rosters and trying to identify players who could be potential trade targets, Carlos Beltran is developing into a very interesting option. He slammed three homers on Thursday and is hitting .295 with eight homers, a .387 on-base percentage and a .590 slugging percentage.



Beltran, who's eligible for free agency in the fall, is making a whopping $18.5 million this year, and it will be interesting to see how his salary plays into other teams' pursuit of him. Last year, only two teams -- the Rangers and the Yankees -- spent $5 million or more in midseason additions. If Beltran were to be traded at midseason without the Mets kicking in any money, his next team would be on the hook for $9 million.



Presumably, the Mets will wind up kicking in some money to offset the salary, but the better that Beltran plays, the better his trade value will be as one of the very few available position players who could be a difference-maker. New York could wind up getting a decent prospect in return for him if he continues to play this well.



From Stats & Info: Beltran became the eighth Met to hit three home runs in a game -- and the first since Jose Reyes in 2006. Two of his home runs Thursday came off pitches that were up and away. Of his eight home runs this season, half have come on pitches in that location. Since 2008, Beltran is hitting .325 and slugging .695, and has belted 14 home runs on pitches up and away. The 14 homers are the most he has hit among the nine pitch locations even though he has seen more pitches in two other spots: down and away and down and in.



Beltran is the first player this season with a three-homer game. Last year, there were 13 such games. The last four players to hit three or more home runs in a game at Coors Field were visitors. Dustin Pedroia was the most recent, in 2010. From Elias: Carlos Beltran homered to all three fields (left, center, right). The only player to do that in one game last season was Adam Dunn.

jamminpearls wrote:

Avg OBP SLG
R Cano 2b .291 .317 .560
N Swisher RF .218 .333 .303
B Gardner LF .260 .357 .420
E Nunez SS .300 .364 .400
F Cervelli C .231 .286 .538


R Ibanez LF .232 .289 .360
B Francisco RF .229 .343 .373
B Schneider C .173 .218 .327 W Valdez 2b .238 .273 .286
P Orr PH-2b .265 .333 .327

and the point is...

jamminpearls wrote:

The Fixer wrote:

jamminpearls wrote:

Avg OBP SLG
R Cano 2b .291 .317 .560
N Swisher RF .218 .333 .303
B Gardner LF .260 .357 .420
E Nunez SS .300 .364 .400
F Cervelli C .231 .286 .538


R Ibanez LF .232 .289 .360
B Francisco RF .229 .343 .373
B Schneider C .173 .218 .327 W Valdez 2b .238 .273 .286
P Orr PH-2b .265 .333 .327

and the point is...

This is for Cliffy and it's pretty obvious there 5-8,9 is alot better then are's.

I don't really believe in protection all that much. As I said, good hitters get hits regardless of who is behind them, sure they may get one better pitch to hit an AB at times but I don't think it has that big of an impact. Posada is not on that list though and my point was Cano does fine with Swisher and Posada behind him.

The Fixer wrote:

as I said last week, beltran would be perfect in RF for this team. make it happen raj


In a season in which teams are scratching for runs and general managers are scanning other teams' rosters and trying to identify players who could be potential trade targets, Carlos Beltran is developing into a very interesting option. He slammed three homers on Thursday and is hitting .295 with eight homers, a .387 on-base percentage and a .590 slugging percentage.



Beltran, who's eligible for free agency in the fall, is making a whopping $18.5 million this year, and it will be interesting to see how his salary plays into other teams' pursuit of him. Last year, only two teams -- the Rangers and the Yankees -- spent $5 million or more in midseason additions. If Beltran were to be traded at midseason without the Mets kicking in any money, his next team would be on the hook for $9 million.



Presumably, the Mets will wind up kicking in some money to offset the salary, but the better that Beltran plays, the better his trade value will be as one of the very few available position players who could be a difference-maker. New York could wind up getting a decent prospect in return for him if he continues to play this well.



From Stats & Info: Beltran became the eighth Met to hit three home runs in a game -- and the first since Jose Reyes in 2006. Two of his home runs Thursday came off pitches that were up and away. Of his eight home runs this season, half have come on pitches in that location. Since 2008, Beltran is hitting .325 and slugging .695, and has belted 14 home runs on pitches up and away. The 14 homers are the most he has hit among the nine pitch locations even though he has seen more pitches in two other spots: down and away and down and in.



Beltran is the first player this season with a three-homer game. Last year, there were 13 such games. The last four players to hit three or more home runs in a game at Coors Field were visitors. Dustin Pedroia was the most recent, in 2010. From Elias: Carlos Beltran homered to all three fields (left, center, right). The only player to do that in one game last season was Adam Dunn.

milton bradley.

The Juggler wrote:

The Fixer wrote:

as I said last week, beltran would be perfect in RF for this team. make it happen raj


In a season in which teams are scratching for runs and general managers are scanning other teams' rosters and trying to identify players who could be potential trade targets, Carlos Beltran is developing into a very interesting option. He slammed three homers on Thursday and is hitting .295 with eight homers, a .387 on-base percentage and a .590 slugging percentage.



Beltran, who's eligible for free agency in the fall, is making a whopping $18.5 million this year, and it will be interesting to see how his salary plays into other teams' pursuit of him. Last year, only two teams -- the Rangers and the Yankees -- spent $5 million or more in midseason additions. If Beltran were to be traded at midseason without the Mets kicking in any money, his next team would be on the hook for $9 million.



Presumably, the Mets will wind up kicking in some money to offset the salary, but the better that Beltran plays, the better his trade value will be as one of the very few available position players who could be a difference-maker. New York could wind up getting a decent prospect in return for him if he continues to play this well.



From Stats & Info: Beltran became the eighth Met to hit three home runs in a game -- and the first since Jose Reyes in 2006. Two of his home runs Thursday came off pitches that were up and away. Of his eight home runs this season, half have come on pitches in that location. Since 2008, Beltran is hitting .325 and slugging .695, and has belted 14 home runs on pitches up and away. The 14 homers are the most he has hit among the nine pitch locations even though he has seen more pitches in two other spots: down and away and down and in.



Beltran is the first player this season with a three-homer game. Last year, there were 13 such games. The last four players to hit three or more home runs in a game at Coors Field were visitors. Dustin Pedroia was the most recent, in 2010. From Elias: Carlos Beltran homered to all three fields (left, center, right). The only player to do that in one game last season was Adam Dunn.

milton bradley.

Pjhawks Gload comment in 543........

The Fixer wrote:

jamminpearls wrote:

Cliffy,i think what he's trying to say is that because of are 5th hitter Howard gets shit to hit. Does Howard look real bad and swing at too much junk for sure. But it's hard to knock in RBI's when you rarely get a fastball or see a strike. We have 2.5 hitters in are lineup at the moment so completely pitching around Howard is alot easier then pitching around the Yanks 4 hitter.

this never bothered bonds when he had pedro feliz hitting behind him. or pujols with a washed up jim edmonds behind him.

the lineup protection thing is nonsense. good hitters should be able to hit any type of pitch

and it's not bothering ryan because he has been damn productive this year as usual.

my biggest argument against fixer and cliffy is you two suggest that anyone could drive in the runs that Arod and Howard do if they were in the same spot and i call that utter nonsense. only a handful or more could. if it was true Jimmy Rollins would be in the top 5 in RBIs since he spent the 1st 75% of the season hitting behind a guy who was leading the league in on-base percentage at the time - oh and he had a whopping 5 RBIs in those 1st 30 games with that. not quite as easy as you say.

and i'll take an above average but productive OBS on a great team over a we-suck-but-i-got-3-hits-when-the-game-was-7-0 guy any day of the week. as i said before ill take 1 for 4 with a big hit in a big spot for agood team over a meaningless hit late in a game that means nothing.

pjhawks wrote:

The Fixer wrote:

jamminpearls wrote:

Cliffy,i think what he's trying to say is that because of are 5th hitter Howard gets shit to hit. Does Howard look real bad and swing at too much junk for sure. But it's hard to knock in RBI's when you rarely get a fastball or see a strike. We have 2.5 hitters in are lineup at the moment so completely pitching around Howard is alot easier then pitching around the Yanks 4 hitter.

this never bothered bonds when he had pedro feliz hitting behind him. or pujols with a washed up jim edmonds behind him.

the lineup protection thing is nonsense. good hitters should be able to hit any type of pitch

and it's not bothering ryan because he has been damn productive this year as usual.

my biggest argument against fixer and cliffy is you two suggest that anyone could drive in the runs that Arod and Howard do if they were in the same spot and i call that utter nonsense. only a handful or more could. if it was true Jimmy Rollins would be in the top 5 in RBIs since he spent the 1st 75% of the season hitting behind a guy who was leading the league in on-base percentage at the time - oh and he had a whopping 5 RBIs in those 1st 30 games with that. not quite as easy as you say.

did you read the article cliffy sent? howard has the most ABs with runners on base in MLB. and it's not even close.

any good hitter will knock in runs if they are in the right spot of the lineup. RBI are more indicative of lineup production than individual performance. (that's not a knock on howard...just pointing out that RBI are an awful way to gauge individual performance).