Whites Five Times Richer Than Blacks In U.S

HeidiJam wrote:

None of my comments reflect racisim, my statement about them liking being taken care of seems to be backed up quite signifigantly, Blacks make up 14% of the population in the US and 40% is on welfare.

Just because a higher percentage of minorities are receiving government assistance doesn't necessarily mean that they "like being taken care of". Have you considered the possibility that they may actually need more assistance than the average white guy?

Eliot Rosewater wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

None of my comments reflect racisim, my statement about them liking being taken care of seems to be backed up quite signifigantly, Blacks make up 14% of the population in the US and 40% is on welfare.

Just because a higher percentage of minorities are receiving government assistance doesn't necessarily mean that they "like being taken care of". Have you considered the possibility that they may actually need more assistance than the average white guy?

I think that's the exact issue ... Many people need the help, and should not be denigrated for taking advantage of the opportunity. Large-scale societal factors can also be a cause of people's failures to exercise responsibility. Look at the bullshit reserve system in both the US and Canada, and the effects this has had on the ability of aboriginal people to integrate into society. Sorry, but that's not all their fault. If you're Metis (mixed white-Native), you get to take advantage of opportunities because you can slip right into the mainstream society (or perhaps you there all along, like I was). If you are born on a reserve, good luck.

I have been reading this discussion and think there is fault in both sides, a minorities had it very difficult for a long time, but there has been improvement. I think that some "handouts" while intended to me helpful also could be a cause for other problems. I know many people from all different races that worked very hard to be in a good situation financially. There are lazy people from all sides, white, black, latino, asian, etc... I am also under the impression that the United States has far too many opportunities to improve and racism is not as big of a factor anymore. There is still racism in this country but it is not a one way street anymore.

well check out what is on the front page of msnbc.com right now.....

Percentage of high-poverty schools rises
Report: Children at these schools are less likely to graduate from college

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37380825/ns/us_news-life/

By CHRISTINE ARMARIO

updated 1 hour, 23 minutes ago
The percentage of public schools where more than three quarters of students are eligible for free or reduced price lunch — a key indicator of poverty — has increased in the past decade, and children at these schools are less likely to attend college or be taught by teachers with advanced degrees.

The findings come from a special report on high poverty schools included in the 2010 Condition of Education study, which reports on a broad range of academic indicators across K-12 and higher education.

The U.S. Department of Education report released Thursday found that the percent of high poverty schools rose from 12 to 17 percent between the 1999-2000 and 2007-2008 school years, even before the current recession was fully felt. By comparison, the overall poverty rate for children increased from 17 to 18 percent, leading researchers to believe that that a higher percentage of poor kids were signing up for the meal program.

Persistent challenge
In all, there were 16,122 schools considered high poverty.

Students at these schools face a number of disadvantages:

A smaller percentage of teachers at high poverty elementary and secondary schools have earned at least a master's degree and a regular professional certification than those in low poverty schools.
They are less likely to graduate from high school; on average, 68 percent of 12th grade students in high poverty-schools graduated with a diploma in 2007-2008, compared to 91 percent at low poverty schools. The numbers have actually gotten worse for students at high poverty schools, dropping from 86 to 68 percent since 1999-2000.
After graduating from a high poverty school, 28 percent enrolled in a four-year institution, compared to 52 percent of graduates from low poverty schools. And while college enrollment has increased by 8 percent since 1999-2000 for graduates from higher income schools, the numbers have remained stable for those in poor schools.
"It's a persistent challenge," said Val Plisko, associate commissioner for early childhood, international and crosscutting studies at the National Center for Education Statistics, which produced the report.

Daria Hall, director of K-12 policy development at the Education Trust, a nonpartisan Washington, D.C.-based think tank, said students at high poverty schools tend to start out behind their counterparts at low poverty schools and get less support at school.

"We take those students who have less outside of school, and we give them less of everything we know contributes to achievement inside of school, too," Hall said.

Cities have most high-poverty schools
Cities were more likely to have a larger percentage of high poverty schools. About 40 percent of city elementary schools fell into that category in 2007-2008, compared to 15 percent in towns and 13 percent in suburbs, according to the study. The report found a similar trend at the secondary school level.

The South and West had a higher percentage of public elementary schools that were high poverty than the Northeast and Midwest, 24 percent compared to 16 and 12 percent, respectively. Mississippi had the highest percentage nationwide — 52 percent of its public elementary schools are considered high poverty. Louisiana, New Mexico, the District of Columbia and California were also pointed out as having higher percentages of low income elementary schools.

Students at high poverty schools are more likely to be minorities.

Hispanic students, for example, made up 46 percent of students at high poverty elementary schools and 11 percent of students at low poverty schools in the 2007-2008 school year. White students, by comparison, made up 14 percent of students at high poverty elementary schools, and 75 percent at low poverty elementary schools.
High poverty schools also have a larger percentage of students with limited English proficiency.

Lower average scores
Students at these schools had lower average scores on the National Assessment of Educational Progress in reading and math than those at low poverty schools, though their scores have steadily increased in both subjects, and in some areas, such as 4th-grade reading, the achievement gap has decreased.

The Condition of Education report also included a number of other academic indicators, including overall figures on enrollment, high school graduation rates, and college attainment.

Enrollment among children 3 to 4 has increased from 20 to 53 percent between 1970 and 2008. Plisko said the increase, which leveled off at about 2000, could be attributed to an increase in the number of women entering the labor force during those decades, and the start of research suggesting early education for disadvantaged students.

The percentage of 16 to 24-year-old students not enrolled in school, and who do not have a high school diploma or equivalent degree, has dropped from 14 to 8 percent between 1980 and 2008. The total number of college post-secondary degrees earned has also risen markedly, from 2.3 to 3.1 million from 1997-1998 and 2007-2008.

"We're holding our own given the difficult times we live in," Plisko said.


...........what was someone saying about how easy minorities have it? with shitty education they have no hope of bettering themselves or their communities. it is a vicious cycle...bad education ---> poor money making potential---> little chance of self improvement----> continued generational poverty with little hope for their children's futures...
this is becoming institutionalized poverty...

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

really???? they provide jobs for americans? most corporations have shipped their production overseas, thus taking jobs away from american workers. they also moved their headquarters to other countries so they avoid paying US taxes.

Are you being serious? Sure some jobs have gone overseas but to say they don't provide a large number of americans with jobs is pretty dumb.

in an economic environment with an unemployment rate near 10% and record corporate profits, to discount the amount of jobs lost by taking corporations overseas is pretty fucking dumb.

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHH You said fucking dumb. You win tough guy.

Jesus, I never "discount the amount of jobs lost by taking corporation overseas". read again, and again since you seem to need to. Then read it again.

I just said that it was dumb to say corporations do not provide a lot of jobs for americans. Pretty fucking dumb even.

HeidiJam wrote:

I would also love to see the attendance stats at these low poverty schools. You have to actuall show up to school in order to learn. Blaming everything on the system and teachers is a joke. Kids in low poverty area and school districts don't care about school or learnin.g

that's is not a hasty generalization or anything....care to use an industrial sized paint roller next time?

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

HeidiJam wrote:

I would also love to see the attendance stats at these low poverty schools. You have to actuall show up to school in order to learn. Blaming everything on the system and teachers is a joke. Kids in low poverty area and school districts don't care about school or learnin.g

that's is not a hasty generalization or anything....care to use an industrial sized paint roller next time?

I wonder how much of the apathy for school in some low income areas is due to the inherent disadvantages of the people in the school, is due to the environment with a lack of opportunity so they figure why bother... or is due to an unstable "family" environment where children are allowed to do as they please and not expected to comply with rules or due to a group of individuals that have been given (food stamps, etc) without required to work, etc and they have developed a sense of entitlement and do not fully value the need for education/work.

I think it's some of both, and the former has potentially created the latter.

cincybearcat wrote:

I wonder how much of the apathy for school in some low income areas is due to the inherent disadvantages of the people in the school, is due to the environment with a lack of opportunity so they figure why bother... or is due to an unstable "family" environment where children are allowed to do as they please and not expected to comply with rules or due to a group of individuals that have been given (food stamps, etc) without required to work, etc and they have developed a sense of entitlement and do not fully value the need for education/work.

I think it's some of both, and the former has potentially created the latter.

a lot of this is funding too ... the schools in poorer neighbourhoods are inherently underfunded which translates into everything else ...

there was a cool story in cnnsi about a girls softball team from a poorer school playing against a top ranked school ... the coach from the top ranked school offered to forfeit the game and instead take the time to teach the girls how to play the game ... the story blew up and now the girls from that school have had equipment donated and a better field to practice on ... sometimes all you need is the same opportunity others have for their to be a difference ...

polaris_x wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

I wonder how much of the apathy for school in some low income areas is due to the inherent disadvantages of the people in the school, is due to the environment with a lack of opportunity so they figure why bother... or is due to an unstable "family" environment where children are allowed to do as they please and not expected to comply with rules or due to a group of individuals that have been given (food stamps, etc) without required to work, etc and they have developed a sense of entitlement and do not fully value the need for education/work.

I think it's some of both, and the former has potentially created the latter.

a lot of this is funding too ... the schools in poorer neighbourhoods are inherently underfunded which translates into everything else ...

there was a cool story in cnnsi about a girls softball team from a poorer school playing against a top ranked school ... the coach from the top ranked school offered to forfeit the game and instead take the time to teach the girls how to play the game ... the story blew up and now the girls from that school have had equipment donated and a better field to practice on ... sometimes all you need is the same opportunity others have for their to be a difference ...

Yep, good point re:funding.

cincybearcat wrote:

I wonder how much of the apathy for school in some low income areas is due to the inherent disadvantages of the people in the school, is due to the environment with a lack of opportunity so they figure why bother... or is due to an unstable "family" environment where children are allowed to do as they please and not expected to comply with rules or due to a group of individuals that have been given (food stamps, etc) without required to work, etc and they have developed a sense of entitlement and do not fully value the need for education/work.

I think it's some of both, and the former has potentially created the latter.

i think all of what you wrote contributes to it. i think they realize they were dealt a bad hand. it is very difficult to overcome things like growing up in a bad neighborhood or a poor community. i will bet many of them are from households with single parents where working one job will not pay the bills and allow them to move anywhere else. i am sure many of them see no way out. what kid does not want to do better than their parents? if the parent has a dead end job and little money, the kids see that as a glass ceiling or they might think "if mom or dad can't get us out of here, nobody can"...it leads to learned helplessness all of which leads to apathy and eventual failure. it fosters the mentality of "work is for suckers" and that "i can do better hustling on the streets", and that is where people turn to fast money and crime. i think everything you said contributes to the overall problem, but i think it is the inherent disadvantages of poverty that is the worst part.