What's wrong with the US you ask?
Comments
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FiveB247x wrote:I never claimed violent, bloody revolt... I merely stated education is the key to any serious progress. Also, progress typically doesn't come from the voting booth, it comes from citizens gathering on their own and forcing changes.soulsinging wrote:maybe it is, but i never claimed there was anything wrong with someone sitting on their hands. you did. and while your non-profit work is admirable, it's a long way from the violent, spilling into the streets revolution you and others seem to be wanting.
if education is the key we are in some serious trouble. when 70% of the country relies on a propaganda network passed off as news and is too ignorant to realize it, then it is quite difficult to instill the desire for change..."You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."0 -
Which is exactly why I feel there truly is no hope. We've set the course, so sit back and enjoy the ride.gimmesometruth27 wrote:if education is the key we are in some serious trouble. when 70% of the country relies on a propaganda network passed off as news and is too ignorant to realize it, then it is quite difficult to instill the desire for change...CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
soulsinging wrote:it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
well - i guess in the end you will lose because you got hung up on the hyprocisy rather than the issue ...
i don't loathe hypocrisy because we ARE ALL hypocrites ... i am pretty sure I am and i'm pretty sure you are ... we need to see those hypocrisies for what they are and deal with them accordingly ...
things aren't bad here for one simple reason: people don't care ... if people cared - it is pretty bad0 -
But here in itself is the main problem whether you're talking about smoking or things that effect everyone... if you're smoking, it can negatively effect others... and to put it in perspective about politics, whether its taxes, foreign policy or whatever the issue, these policies do not simply effect a single person or group, instead they have long standing, wide spreading results (home and abroad), so to simply say, "don't lecture me" because this is how I like something (whether its a political opinion or habit), at some point the notion of selfishness and self-interest goes into the discussion because the singular action effects the group.soulsinging wrote:it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
I'm enjoying the dabate going on here in these last few pages. It's refreshing not to have to read the mindless scribble from certain posters. You all know who I'm talking about.
That's all, I don't really have an opinion. Just enjoying the debate.0 -
polaris_x wrote:soulsinging wrote:it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
well - i guess in the end you will lose because you got hung up on the hyprocisy rather than the issue ...
i don't loathe hypocrisy because we ARE ALL hypocrites ... i am pretty sure I am and i'm pretty sure you are ... we need to see those hypocrisies for what they are and deal with them accordingly ...
things aren't bad here for one simple reason: people don't care ... if people cared - it is pretty bad
not true. people do care. they just dont care about what you and some others around here think they should be caring about.0 -
You can say that about many fringe issues like legalization of drugs or free cuba or things of that nature, but not for things like healthcare, foreign policy, education, the environment and many other significant issues and topics which effect everyone.soulsinging wrote:not true. people do care. they just dont care about what you and some others around here think they should be caring about.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
FiveB247x wrote:Which is exactly why I feel there truly is no hope. We've set the course, so sit back and enjoy the ride.
pick up some howard zinn for fucks sake. or arundhati roy.
they've had it worse in the past than we have. imagine striking at gunpoint, while your labor organizer was killed in front of you. or picketing under gunfire.
we have it easy today and here you are giving up. fuck all that. the rights we enjoy today were paid for in blood, i'm not about to give up on that.0 -
I'm very familiar with both of those writers and their writings and enjoy them very much. My opinions are based on our society and how people are now, not that I personally don't agree with you. I feel people just don't care so nothing changes.Commy wrote:pick up some howard zinn for fucks sake. or arundhati roy.
they've had it worse in the past than we have. imagine striking at gunpoint, while your labor organizer was killed in front of you. or picketing under gunfire.
we have it easy today and here you are giving up. fuck all that. the rights we enjoy today were paid for in blood, i'm not about to give up on that.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
FiveB247x wrote:You can say that about many fringe issues like legalization of drugs or free cuba or things of that nature, but not for things like healthcare, foreign policy, education, the environment and many other significant issues and topics which effect everyone.soulsinging wrote:not true. people do care. they just dont care about what you and some others around here think they should be caring about.
which is exactly my point. who says these things are fringe issues? why do you get to decide which issues are most important?0 -
As the richest nation in the industrialized world, we have no excuses why every citizen in our nation doesn't have the basic necessities every human should have. The fact that people don't care or aren't interested in the most obvious of injustices in our nation is merely a warning sign of how little people truly care about fixing our nation or world. Whether its homelessness, hunger, poverty or healthcare, we've just created a society which as a whole doesn't give a crap. And if you think these are things that "important" or it's ok to ignore, I either question that persons morals, their true sense of what our nation is based upon and role in the world or simply put, what kind of character that person has. For such a "religious" nation, we certainly don't practice the tenets of moral behavior these religions preach... shows you how full of crap people in our country really are.soulsinging wrote:which is exactly my point. who says these things are fringe issues? why do you get to decide which issues are most important?CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
FiveB247x wrote:As the richest nation in the industrialized world, we have no excuses why every citizen in our nation doesn't have the basic necessities every human should have. The fact that people don't care or aren't interested in the most obvious of injustices in our nation is merely a warning sign of how little people truly care about fixing our nation or world. Whether its homelessness, hunger, poverty or healthcare, we've just created a society which as a whole doesn't give a crap. And if you think these are things that "important" or it's ok to ignore, I either question that persons morals, their true sense of what our nation is based upon and role in the world or simply put, what kind of character that person has. For such a "religious" nation, we certainly don't practice the tenets of moral behavior these religions preach... shows you how full of crap people in our country really are.
I hear ya man I have been saying this for a long time as far as people not caring anymore,but I do think there is a large percentage of the population that does care about where we are heading as nation and do care about other people in general. As far as people not having the basic necessities that you mention there is help avalible for just about anything that a person might need. You just have to ask. I know what Im talking about I have been there. I was homeless for a few months and I didnt' have a job all due to some bad choices that I made, I lost everything,but I was able to pick myself up and start over with the help of a local Crisis Ministries shelter. I know some people will disagree with me when I say this but, alot of people think that are in 50 and above age group think that when we stoped having prayer in public schools things started to go downhill. Im just sayin.... I don't want to turn this into a discusson abou religion
If you ask me some of the stuff that is TV these days like Mtv is really screwin up the kids. Have you ever watched an episode of Parental control :shock: :wtf: Not to mention all the kids without a father in the home. I read not that long ago that 70% of african americans are born out of wedlock. I think that the break up of families has a major impact on our society.0 -
polaris_x wrote:OffHeGoes29 wrote:Best thing going for people here who like "living the American dream". There isn't anything wrong with Canada or Europe, or anywhere else, but for the MAJORITY of American's (I have to stress this, because not every one wants to live this way, but most of America does) there is no other place that makes it possible. Like I have said before, there isn't anything wrong with how Europe or Canada or Whoville does things, because its the best system for them and their people. Most of you on the board aren't the norm here in the states, and while most of you would be happy with living in "utopia" ......most of American's aren't.
You're a small majority of the voting population, so its going to take some time to subscrib to the things people want on this board.
Some of the most patriotic people I've ever met are immigrents here in the states. The US is still the number one spot for immigration, and there is a reason for it.
I've seen some really beautiful places and met some really nice people in my life travelling the world. But for a specific way of living, this is it. And most of America is pretty happy chasing that dream, you don't have to like it, its the way it is. Don't be pissed at me, I don't live the "American Dream", you're family, coworkers, and neighbors do.
uhhh ... i am not the least bit pissed at you or anyone you know ... it was a simple question which if i'm reading correctly is that it's the best thing for you and the people you know because of the "american dream" ...
is it safe to say that it is the ability to get a job and accumulate wealth to buy things and the freedom to do so that qualifies as the american dream?
Yep, thats it.BRING BACK THE WHALE0 -
FiveB247x wrote:As the richest nation in the industrialized world, we have no excuses why every citizen in our nation doesn't have the basic necessities every human should have. The fact that people don't care or aren't interested in the most obvious of injustices in our nation is merely a warning sign of how little people truly care about fixing our nation or world. Whether its homelessness, hunger, poverty or healthcare, we've just created a society which as a whole doesn't give a crap. And if you think these are things that "important" or it's ok to ignore, I either question that persons morals, their true sense of what our nation is based upon and role in the world or simply put, what kind of character that person has. For such a "religious" nation, we certainly don't practice the tenets of moral behavior these religions preach... shows you how full of crap people in our country really are.soulsinging wrote:which is exactly my point. who says these things are fringe issues? why do you get to decide which issues are most important?
I get the sense that you've given up and are projecting that on the rest of the nation...0 -
prfctlefts wrote:FiveB247x wrote:As the richest nation in the industrialized world, we have no excuses why every citizen in our nation doesn't have the basic necessities every human should have. The fact that people don't care or aren't interested in the most obvious of injustices in our nation is merely a warning sign of how little people truly care about fixing our nation or world. Whether its homelessness, hunger, poverty or healthcare, we've just created a society which as a whole doesn't give a crap. And if you think these are things that "important" or it's ok to ignore, I either question that persons morals, their true sense of what our nation is based upon and role in the world or simply put, what kind of character that person has. For such a "religious" nation, we certainly don't practice the tenets of moral behavior these religions preach... shows you how full of crap people in our country really are.
I hear ya man I have been saying this for a long time as far as people not caring anymore,but I do think there is a large percentage of the population that does care about where we are heading as nation and do care about other people in general. As far as people not having the basic necessities that you mention there is help avalible for just about anything that a person might need. You just have to ask. I know what Im talking about I have been there. I was homeless for a few months and I didnt' have a job all due to some bad choices that I made, I lost everything,but I was able to pick myself up and start over with the help of a local Crisis Ministries shelter. I know some people will disagree with me when I say this but, alot of people think that are in 50 and above age group think that when we stoped having prayer in public schools things started to go downhill. Im just sayin.... I don't want to turn this into a discusson abou religion
If you ask me some of the stuff that is TV these days like Mtv is really screwin up the kids. Have you ever watched an episode of Parental control :shock: :wtf: Not to mention all the kids without a father in the home. I read not that long ago that 70% of african americans are born out of wedlock. I think that the break up of families has a major impact on our society.
nice post prfct...I agree with you that there is help out there for those who need it...I'm glad you were able to work things out...kudos to you...
I agree with your point about prayer in schools....many felt it would be end of times...and many still do, well, we're still chugging along...
I think some spend too much time focusing on the bad and not enough time focusing on the good...0 -
Perhaps the deeper issue of why people don't care is the fall of morals, responisbility and accountability in our society.. whether through the family, government, business or similar, but in the end that is a circular arguement. I don't think its necessary to get into the entire religion debate on this issue, but someone could make a case that religion amd its role in government and society has been on the rise, which is the opposite of your point. Also, no matter what's on tv, radio, internet or whatever medium, it's a parents responsibility to guide their child through life, not the FCC nor similar. It's a very weak arguement to expect everyone in a society to curb things simply because others aren't willing to put forth the energy, time or effort. As far as I recall, all of the tvs, radios and other items have dials and on and off switches... use them. Very simple answer. Which all of this leads to my point, people don't care because they want everything done for them and take on no responsibility. Teachers have become babysitters, entertainers have become role models and moral leaders and the similar. All of these things are the slow build up from people not acting, staying on top of whats necessary to have a just and fair society for all. And as someone eluded to, it's not that I've given up on the causes, I've merely accepted that the people aren't up for the task because of all the items and issues I've mentioned.prfctlefts wrote:I hear ya man I have been saying this for a long time as far as people not caring anymore,but I do think there is a large percentage of the population that does care about where we are heading as nation and do care about other people in general. As far as people not having the basic necessities that you mention there is help avalible for just about anything that a person might need. You just have to ask. I know what Im talking about I have been there. I was homeless for a few months and I didnt' have a job all due to some bad choices that I made, I lost everything,but I was able to pick myself up and start over with the help of a local Crisis Ministries shelter. I know some people will disagree with me when I say this but, alot of people think that are in 50 and above age group think that when we stoped having prayer in public schools things started to go downhill. Im just sayin.... I don't want to turn this into a discusson abou religion
If you ask me some of the stuff that is TV these days like Mtv is really screwin up the kids. Have you ever watched an episode of Parental control :shock: :wtf: Not to mention all the kids without a father in the home. I read not that long ago that 70% of african americans are born out of wedlock. I think that the break up of families has a major impact on our society.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
OffHeGoes29 wrote:polaris_x wrote:is it safe to say that it is the ability to get a job and accumulate wealth to buy things and the freedom to do so that qualifies as the american dream?
Yep, thats it.
soo ... what if i told you that ability comes at the expense of war in foreign lands, exploited workers in developing countries and at the destruction of the planet?0 -
FiveB247x wrote:As the richest nation in the industrialized world, we have no excuses why every citizen in our nation doesn't have the basic necessities every human should have. The fact that people don't care or aren't interested in the most obvious of injustices in our nation is merely a warning sign of how little people truly care about fixing our nation or world. Whether its homelessness, hunger, poverty or healthcare, we've just created a society which as a whole doesn't give a crap. And if you think these are things that "important" or it's ok to ignore, I either question that persons morals, their true sense of what our nation is based upon and role in the world or simply put, what kind of character that person has. For such a "religious" nation, we certainly don't practice the tenets of moral behavior these religions preach... shows you how full of crap people in our country really are.soulsinging wrote:which is exactly my point. who says these things are fringe issues? why do you get to decide which issues are most important?
clearly you don't know much about the puritans and calvinists that largely founded this country. our nation acts exactly as our heritage would lead you to expect. as to us not having basic necessities, i think at their core most americans acknowledge that they have it pretty good here. as pftclft pointed out, there are many resources out there, even for those in the most dire straits here. that is not so everywhere in the world. why are people not demanding more? perhaps a bit of perspective and realizing we're already blessed beyond the wildest dreams of most of the world and perhaps also a lot of the puritan american spirit of hard work. like it or not, that's just who we are as a country. it's who we always have been. it's not going to change anytime soon. the fact that you don't like that philosophy doesn't mean we're headed for some sort of apocalypse as a nation.0 -
It's clear that you are a complete cynic as I haven't read one positive thing from you. I'm not saying anything you're saying about society is wrong (much of it is right), but here's what you're not seeing that others have mentioned. For as many people ignorant, clueless, careless, greedy, apathetic and arrogant, there are people out there, MANY people out there who are compassionate, selfless, generous, caring, philanthropists and practicing advocacy that you're refusing to see. Pull the cynical wool off your eyes, because stating the worse of society is not contributing to the best of society. You're refusing to see it. Here's a challenge for you -- for all the problems you see, try coming up with solutions. Because stating the obvious doesn't really help matters.FiveB247x wrote:Perhaps the deeper issue of why people don't care is the fall of morals, responisbility and accountability in our society.. whether through the family, government, business or similar, but in the end that is a circular arguement. I don't think its necessary to get into the entire religion debate on this issue, but someone could make a case that religion amd its role in government and society has been on the rise, which is the opposite of your point. Also, no matter what's on tv, radio, internet or whatever medium, it's a parents responsibility to guide their child through life, not the FCC nor similar. It's a very weak arguement to expect everyone in a society to curb things simply because others aren't willing to put forth the energy, time or effort. As far as I recall, all of the tvs, radios and other items have dials and on and off switches... use them. Very simple answer. Which all of this leads to my point, people don't care because they want everything done for them and take on no responsibility. Teachers have become babysitters, entertainers have become role models and moral leaders and the similar. All of these things are the slow build up from people not acting, staying on top of whats necessary to have a just and fair society for all. And as someone eluded to, it's not that I've given up on the causes, I've merely accepted that the people aren't up for the task because of all the items and issues I've mentioned.
I'm a natural pessimist and there's plenty to claim what's wrong with society. I do it all the time, but I try and balance that with working for the greater good, keeping hope and seeing the good in people, as well as focusing on solutions rather than the problems. It's amazing what it does to your spirit.0 -
Because you ask such broad questions, I'm not good with coming up with quick, short answers. But here goes. What we need to protest about - war, human rights, the corrupt two-party system that will never work for the People, Veteran's rights and treatment, -ANYTHING- that needs attention brought to it, that deserves a second look at. I know I'm being broad, but there are so MANY issues. The gov't needs to be overhauled. That alone deserves a revolt.SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:
Because when i have asked you simple questions .....
What is it that we need to protest about??
What is is exactly that wants people like you to revolt??
What is so wrong with the USA that you want to start a revolution??
You gave me some strange answer about Television and twitter.......Then you mentioned someting about police firing the shots and starting all the violence......
I'm not interested in the so-called "American Dream" of capitalism, greed, and owning a bunch of crap to call "mine". I have a child with a disability, which believe it or not, puts me in a different mindframe from those who have perfect little lives. I care about justice and equality.Post edited by Jeanwah on0
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