There is a large movement for change that some on here love to try to discredit ........they are not lazy, they are not all scholars, most are just average middle class people.......but it is the only movement I have found that is not showing any favoritism to either political party.......Basically they want honesty in the administration that runs this country, and politicians decisions to be made according to what they can do for the country ......Maybe instead of trying to over haul the health care system we should over haul the legal system so that there will be no doubt ( because of a persons wealth or how connected they are) who has broken the law and deserves punishment.
Great Idea!
VINNY GOOMBA
2010 we vote all incumbents out, plain and simple. Where I'm divided is whether we take a GIANT step and try and get everyone to support a third party, maybe even a third party with no real platform other than they are simply not democrat or republican? Or, we just stick with the "two" parties and vote opposite of whoever the incumbent is. What does that require? It requires 1 minute of research prior to the 2010 election to simply know who your rep is, and if he or she is running again to simply vote against him or her through the other major party. A 100% turnover in the House of Representatives may actually send the message to Washington that this is, in fact, their final warning.
I like the Third Party idea, personally. No one can claim it has a bias. No one can ask "WHERE WERE YOU WHEN THE REPUBLICANS HAD THE CONGRESS?"
It's time we took the stance that they should ALL be fired, for their collective failure across the board. I can't think of a bigger, and more threatening statement to make to the people in power, without use of actual force
Can it be done?
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
Before shots get fired, I'd love to see one giant statement made by the American people as a collective. It would require each and every one of us to put all partisanship aside completely, and it has to be incredibly simple and catchy since most of the voting public really firmly believe that they only have 2 options at the polls, and probably can't name their representatives.
Without knowing exaclty how, or why, I think we can all agree that we are getting screwed, and that it's coming at the hands of almost all or our elected officials.
2010 we vote all encumbants out, plain and simple. Where I'm divided is whether we take a GIANT step and try and get everyone to support a third party, maybe even a third party with no real platform other than they are simply not democrat or republican? Or, we just stick with the "two" parties and vote opposite of whoever the encumbant is. What does that require? It requires 1 minute of research prior to the 2010 election to simply know who your rep is, and if he or she is running again to simply vote against him or her through the other major party. A 100% turnover in the House of Representatives may actually send the message to Washington that this is, in fact, their final warning.
I like the Third Party idea, personally. No one can claim it has a bias. No one can ask "WHERE WERE YOU WHEN THE REPUBLICANS HAD THE CONGRESS?"
It's time we took the stance that they should ALL be fired, for their collective failure across the board. I can't think of a bigger, and more threatening statement to make to the people in power, without use of actual force.
So let me get this straight....
Your idea for the BIG revolution(before actual shots are fired)
Is for people to do ONE MINUTE of research before the next big election.....
And just blindly vote for whoever is running against the incumbent????
No matter what their views are..
No matter what their political views, on any and all issues are........
Just vote out the incumbents....................
Again..
I dont see many people joining the revolution...........
Take me piece by piece..... Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
you see FiveB247x, you can join the Ariel and the Teabaggers, a.k.a. Tea Party Patriots, and their quest for change...
are you in..?
?????
what are you hoping to accomplish with this baiting post?
what are you talking about...the OP is claiming everyone is uneducated, uninformed, and lazy...another poster shared their experience in their quest for change, I was wondering if FiveB wanted to join in...
and since you asked Speedy what it would take for him to revolt, let me ask you this, where are you protesting in the coming days...? I assume you're taking it to the street, you know because the world sucks so much...what's your issue du jour...?
That the reason we are supposed to get together and revolt.....
Is because the world is going to shit??? And our leaders are screwing us?????
Thats it???
Thats all you have for me????
I have a feeling not many people are going to join the revolution.....
you see, some are content with the world going to shit because they don't have to worry about any problems other than what to watch tonight.
some things i don't like being done in my name, especially when i strongly disagree. you ask what is there to protest about, i say look around! pollution, extinctions, wars, waste of our taxpayer money, robbery of our taxpayer money, crimes, occupations, genocide, taxpayer funded segregation and attacks on civilians.....
some people ask is it worth it? do the ends really justify the means? while others are content to shrug and just not care because it doesn't affect their little sphere
our kids are like, "Poor little polar bears," and nobody's even talking about the facts. Nobody talks about the facts at all. "Poor little polar bears." Let's use the polar bear to our advantage. Guys, listen to me. You want that big screen TV? You want the plasma TV? Yes or no? Your wife... (mumbling). "Honey. Honey, I was listening to the show. I heard a commercial.......
-- honey, it's not just the polar bears. It's our children. I really don't want a 60-inch plasma. I mean, we could -- you know, we could do the 40-inch but shouldn't we really, for our kids, for the polar bears. Shouldn't we go for the 60?
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
I'm very familar with varying protestors and groups. I think another main issue with all the protest groups and activists is that they can't find a general consensus to make change occur. Everyone has a side issue or is too caught up in conspiracies or party politics or whatever. The polarization of American politics and society is so great, in my opinion, we can't even come to common ground on generic things for everyone's betterment. It is more important to be on a particular side than have progress.
Also, just for the record and to be clear, I've made it clear everyone is not like this, but as a whole, this is how our society is.
you see FiveB247x, you can join the Ariel and the Teabaggers, a.k.a. Tea Party Patriots, and their quest for change...
are you in..?
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I'm very familar with varying protestors and groups. I think another main issue with all the protest groups and activists is that they can't find a general consensus to make change occur. Everyone has a side issue or is too caught up in conspiracies or party politics or whatever. The polarization of American politics and society is so great, in my opinion, we can't even come to common ground on generic things for everyone's betterment. It is more important to be on a particular side than have progress.
Also, just for the record and to be clear, I've made it clear everyone is not like this, but as a whole, this is how our society is.
You made a suggestion about teabaggers, etc... and in reply I told you why I don't think groups and activists are successful in terms of large scale things.
I'm very familar with varying protestors and groups. I think another main issue with all the protest groups and activists is that they can't find a general consensus to make change occur. Everyone has a side issue or is too caught up in conspiracies or party politics or whatever. The polarization of American politics and society is so great, in my opinion, we can't even come to common ground on generic things for everyone's betterment. It is more important to be on a particular side than have progress.
Also, just for the record and to be clear, I've made it clear everyone is not like this, but as a whole, this is how our society is.
you see FiveB247x, you can join the Ariel and the Teabaggers, a.k.a. Tea Party Patriots, and their quest for change...
are you in..?
huh...? :?
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
what are you talking about...the OP is claiming everyone is uneducated, uninformed, and lazy...another poster shared their experience in their quest for change, I was wondering if FiveB wanted to join in...
and since you asked Speedy what it would take for him to revolt, let me ask you this, where are you protesting in the coming days...? I assume you're taking it to the street, you know because the world sucks so much...what's your issue du jour...?
i'm fairly active with my protests - i send on average 5 emails a week to local and national representatives on various issues especially now with copenhagen in the headlines ... i also make consumer choices that takes into consideration issues that are important to me ...
regardless of that - it is irrelevant what i do or don't do ... i don't understand people's fascination with trying to shoot people who care down ... if you don't care - that's fine ... but why try and tear someone who does down?
it's like people who campaign for animal rights asking them if they eat meat ... simply a distraction from what the issue really is ...
Before shots get fired, I'd love to see one giant statement made by the American people as a collective. It would require each and every one of us to put all partisanship aside completely, and it has to be incredibly simple and catchy since most of the voting public really firmly believe that they only have 2 options at the polls, and probably can't name their representatives.
Without knowing exaclty how, or why, I think we can all agree that we are getting screwed, and that it's coming at the hands of almost all or our elected officials.
2010 we vote all encumbants out, plain and simple. Where I'm divided is whether we take a GIANT step and try and get everyone to support a third party, maybe even a third party with no real platform other than they are simply not democrat or republican? Or, we just stick with the "two" parties and vote opposite of whoever the encumbant is. What does that require? It requires 1 minute of research prior to the 2010 election to simply know who your rep is, and if he or she is running again to simply vote against him or her through the other major party. A 100% turnover in the House of Representatives may actually send the message to Washington that this is, in fact, their final warning.
I like the Third Party idea, personally. No one can claim it has a bias. No one can ask "WHERE WERE YOU WHEN THE REPUBLICANS HAD THE CONGRESS?"
It's time we took the stance that they should ALL be fired, for their collective failure across the board. I can't think of a bigger, and more threatening statement to make to the people in power, without use of actual force.
So let me get this straight....
Your idea for the BIG revolution(before actual shots are fired)
Is for people to do ONE MINUTE of research before the next big election.....
And just blindly vote for whoever is running against the incumbent????
No matter what their views are..
No matter what their political views, on any and all issues are........
Just vote out the incumbents....................
Again..
I dont see many people joining the revolution...........
With research there is no blind voting...ok maybe they should spend more than a minute...ok?...but voting everyone out would surly send a BIG message!
Any better Ideas?
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
what are you talking about...the OP is claiming everyone is uneducated, uninformed, and lazy...another poster shared their experience in their quest for change, I was wondering if FiveB wanted to join in...
and since you asked Speedy what it would take for him to revolt, let me ask you this, where are you protesting in the coming days...? I assume you're taking it to the street, you know because the world sucks so much...what's your issue du jour...?
i'm fairly active with my protests - i send on average 5 emails a week to local and national representatives on various issues especially now with copenhagen in the headlines ... i also make consumer choices that takes into consideration issues that are important to me ...
regardless of that - it is irrelevant what i do or don't do ... i don't understand people's fascination with trying to shoot people who care down ... if you don't care - that's fine ... but why try and tear someone who does down?
becos we don't like being told by self-righteous twats (in a general sense, not anyone here in particular, you're all cool) to care and go out and do things that said people aren't even willing to do themselves. some people here act like we should all be in the streets tearing shit down... yet they haven't lifted a finger to do anything remotely like that other than to tell other people to do it.
Before shots get fired, I'd love to see one giant statement made by the American people as a collective. It would require each and every one of us to put all partisanship aside completely, and it has to be incredibly simple and catchy since most of the voting public really firmly believe that they only have 2 options at the polls, and probably can't name their representatives.
Without knowing exaclty how, or why, I think we can all agree that we are getting screwed, and that it's coming at the hands of almost all or our elected officials.
2010 we vote all encumbants out, plain and simple. Where I'm divided is whether we take a GIANT step and try and get everyone to support a third party, maybe even a third party with no real platform other than they are simply not democrat or republican? Or, we just stick with the "two" parties and vote opposite of whoever the encumbant is. What does that require? It requires 1 minute of research prior to the 2010 election to simply know who your rep is, and if he or she is running again to simply vote against him or her through the other major party. A 100% turnover in the House of Representatives may actually send the message to Washington that this is, in fact, their final warning.
I like the Third Party idea, personally. No one can claim it has a bias. No one can ask "WHERE WERE YOU WHEN THE REPUBLICANS HAD THE CONGRESS?"
It's time we took the stance that they should ALL be fired, for their collective failure across the board. I can't think of a bigger, and more threatening statement to make to the people in power, without use of actual force.
So let me get this straight....
Your idea for the BIG revolution(before actual shots are fired)
Is for people to do ONE MINUTE of research before the next big election.....
And just blindly vote for whoever is running against the incumbent????
No matter what their views are..
No matter what their political views, on any and all issues are........
Just vote out the incumbents....................
Again..
I dont see many people joining the revolution...........
Speedy--
How many people already BLINDLY VOTE based on a single letter next to someone's name at the booth: (D) or (R)? The majority.
How many people do feel like they are being screwed by their elected representatives, but aren't exaclty sure how the system really works? The majority.
How many politicians actually deliver on their campaign promises? How many actually even remain consistent in their own views, let alone policies? How many politicians actually have to vote against their own legislation because it becomes hijacked, and tacked onto bills that they can't support? What percentage of our Congress have held their seats forever, and have long-standing relationships with the lobbyists and the special interests as a result? 100% new blood wouldn't route out entirely, the special interests would still find new people to latch on to, but let them start from square one.
They won't impose term limits on themselves for obvious reasons. This idea is essentially term limits imposed on them. It would be a powerful statement. Could we really be any worse off with 435 new faces, in the House than the same old crowd year after year?
I suppose I should move to where you live. It seems you firmly believe that yourself and everyone you talk to is OK with how things are going. It's the opposite for me-- the more I ask around the more people I find that are genuinely pissed off with the way things are going. For me, the reasons for a revolution of sorts are similar to the ones that our founding fathers had. The primary reasons go back long before Bush:
Our Federal Government is too powerful, and each branch no longer sticks to their original duties making checks and balances worthless. There are more agencies that already exist at state levels that do nothing but increase our tax burden and force us to work harder (those of us that actually do work). Our economy is centrally planned by a quasi-private bank (The Federal Reserve), which can literally counterfeit all of the money it wants, without any oversight or audit, to fund anything it wants from senseless wars to welfare-- but still, the money, that took NOTHING to create is re-paid through taxes. Taxpayers bare the burden for the mistakes and greed of banks and other major corporations, and such has been the struggle for a good chunk of American history. Inflation (created by the Fed) has destroyed the value of our currency by 95%, and debt to foreign countries and other foreign central banks effectively makes us DEPENDENT on them when we were supposed to be a nation of independence.
The tax code is thousands of pages long, confusing, and wrongfully taxes us on our labor, in which there is no profit or gain (income is GAIN from corporate activity, not the even exchange of labor for a service). The IRS can seize your property for whatever reason it deems necessary, and there is nothing you can do it about it. We have effectively abridged the right to free speech and press, we no longer are secure in our persons or homes nor have the right to privacy thanks to laws like the Patriot Act, and agencies such as the NSA. Federal law trumps every state law despite the fact that the 10th amendment guaranteed us otherwise. Our elected officials have adopted a policy of pre-emptive war which undermines our national security, not strengthen it. Our military presence is felt in 130 countries around the world, and it brings us more contempt than gratitude from most of these countries. We try to maintain a world empire that costs trillions of dollars a year when we have no constitutional authority to do so. Even if we WERE supposed to be the policemen of the world, we are not viewed that way-- we are not seen as cops, we are seen as "PIGS." Our right to self-govern locally has been traded in for global governance by un-elected officials without our consent, through NATO, the UN, and other supranatinal groups where you or I have no say. Social Security is a bigger Ponzi scheme than anything Bernie Madoff could ever dream of. The health care system is a joke and it worked a lot better before the government decided to cater to insurance companies and HMOs which have since driven up costs, which becomes more and more painful with a devauling dollar. Our currency is not sound in any way shape or form, and it is getting riskier and riskier to hold on to dollars-- unlike a stock, there should be little to no risk in holding your own country's currency, as their should be some attempt to maintain that currency's value for benefit of the people.
The worst part: as time goes on, each one of these problems gets magnified, and it will eventually lead to our collapse. Maybe you honestly believe that things aren't going to get any worse? That a status quo does, in fact, exist. I don't see it this way. All of these things have been incrementally happening throughout our history, and the backbone of this country, the middle class is about to break. That's when all hell breaks loose. I don't want to see it happen. I love America, namely what it is SUPPOSED to stand for, which is sadly what we have long forgotten.
The first step in making anything happen is to "see" it happening. If you're content, you're content. I see what is happening here, and I try and make steps towards changing it everyday through peaceful means-- I think it has to be something simple, yet powerful. The fact is something you've said before. Look in the mirror. Change starts right there. I agree 100%.
Ok, I'll take the bait cause I'll assume your comments are directed towards me. Where exactly did you ask me what I'm doing to help the world around me? You didn't, you simply make the assumption that everyone who replies in the manner that I have is dumping on activists or cause driven groups while sitting on their hands and doing nothing. As I previously also stated, it is better to do something than nothing, but in my opinion, the efforts will not rectify the problems we face in our nation or world. In terms of your original comment about what I do (which is what you questioned), I've made the decision a long time ago to work for the non-profit industry and specifically political and social driven organizations in my career. So to sum it up, I do plenty and am not an arm-chair qb.
Also, to reiterate as stated before, not that everyone must "revolt" as some have stated, but isn't it really sitting on your hands if you don't speak up or simply respond to all the worlds problems or nations problems by saying "it doesn't effect me" so why bother - ie - I'm comfortable so who cares about everyone else?
becos we don't like being told by self-righteous twats (in a general sense, not anyone here in particular, you're all cool) to care and go out and do things that said people aren't even willing to do themselves. some people here act like we should all be in the streets tearing shit down... yet they haven't lifted a finger to do anything remotely like that other than to tell other people to do it.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
becos we don't like being told by self-righteous twats (in a general sense, not anyone here in particular, you're all cool) to care and go out and do things that said people aren't even willing to do themselves. some people here act like we should all be in the streets tearing shit down... yet they haven't lifted a finger to do anything remotely like that other than to tell other people to do it.
but is the animosity in the perceived hypocrisy or it is simply a defensive mechanism to not actually do anything yourself ...
if someone tells me that eating french fries for every meal is bad for me ... does it really matter if said person does it himself?
Ok, I'll take the bait cause I'll assume your comments are directed towards me. Where exactly did you ask me what I'm doing to help the world around me? You didn't, you simply make the assumption that everyone who replies in the manner that I have is dumping on activists or cause driven groups while sitting on their hands and doing nothing. As I previously also stated, it is better to do something than nothing, but in my opinion, the efforts will not rectify the problems we face in our nation or world. In terms of your original comment about what I do (which is what you questioned), I've made the decision a long time ago to work for the non-profit industry and specifically political and social driven organizations in my career. So to sum it up, I do plenty and am not an arm-chair qb.
Also, to reiterate as stated before, not that everyone must "revolt" as some have stated, but isn't it really sitting on your hands if you don't speak up or simply respond to all the worlds problems or nations problems by saying "it doesn't effect me" so why bother - ie - I'm comfortable so who cares about everyone else?
becos we don't like being told by self-righteous twats (in a general sense, not anyone here in particular, you're all cool) to care and go out and do things that said people aren't even willing to do themselves. some people here act like we should all be in the streets tearing shit down... yet they haven't lifted a finger to do anything remotely like that other than to tell other people to do it.
maybe it is, but i never claimed there was anything wrong with someone sitting on their hands. you did. and while your non-profit work is admirable, it's a long way from the violent, spilling into the streets revolution you and others seem to be wanting.
becos we don't like being told by self-righteous twats (in a general sense, not anyone here in particular, you're all cool) to care and go out and do things that said people aren't even willing to do themselves. some people here act like we should all be in the streets tearing shit down... yet they haven't lifted a finger to do anything remotely like that other than to tell other people to do it.
but is the animosity in the perceived hypocrisy or it is simply a defensive mechanism to not actually do anything yourself ...
if someone tells me that eating french fries for every meal is bad for me ... does it really matter if said person does it himself?
it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
I never claimed violent, bloody revolt... I merely stated education is the key to any serious progress. Also, progress typically doesn't come from the voting booth, it comes from citizens gathering on their own and forcing changes.
maybe it is, but i never claimed there was anything wrong with someone sitting on their hands. you did. and while your non-profit work is admirable, it's a long way from the violent, spilling into the streets revolution you and others seem to be wanting.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I never claimed violent, bloody revolt... I merely stated education is the key to any serious progress. Also, progress typically doesn't come from the voting booth, it comes from citizens gathering on their own and forcing changes.
maybe it is, but i never claimed there was anything wrong with someone sitting on their hands. you did. and while your non-profit work is admirable, it's a long way from the violent, spilling into the streets revolution you and others seem to be wanting.
if education is the key we are in some serious trouble. when 70% of the country relies on a propaganda network passed off as news and is too ignorant to realize it, then it is quite difficult to instill the desire for change...
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
if education is the key we are in some serious trouble. when 70% of the country relies on a propaganda network passed off as news and is too ignorant to realize it, then it is quite difficult to instill the desire for change...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
well - i guess in the end you will lose because you got hung up on the hyprocisy rather than the issue ...
i don't loathe hypocrisy because we ARE ALL hypocrites ... i am pretty sure I am and i'm pretty sure you are ... we need to see those hypocrisies for what they are and deal with them accordingly ...
things aren't bad here for one simple reason: people don't care ... if people cared - it is pretty bad
But here in itself is the main problem whether you're talking about smoking or things that effect everyone... if you're smoking, it can negatively effect others... and to put it in perspective about politics, whether its taxes, foreign policy or whatever the issue, these policies do not simply effect a single person or group, instead they have long standing, wide spreading results (home and abroad), so to simply say, "don't lecture me" because this is how I like something (whether its a political opinion or habit), at some point the notion of selfishness and self-interest goes into the discussion because the singular action effects the group.
it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I'm enjoying the dabate going on here in these last few pages. It's refreshing not to have to read the mindless scribble from certain posters. You all know who I'm talking about.
That's all, I don't really have an opinion. Just enjoying the debate.
it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
well - i guess in the end you will lose because you got hung up on the hyprocisy rather than the issue ...
i don't loathe hypocrisy because we ARE ALL hypocrites ... i am pretty sure I am and i'm pretty sure you are ... we need to see those hypocrisies for what they are and deal with them accordingly ...
things aren't bad here for one simple reason: people don't care ... if people cared - it is pretty bad
not true. people do care. they just dont care about what you and some others around here think they should be caring about.
You can say that about many fringe issues like legalization of drugs or free cuba or things of that nature, but not for things like healthcare, foreign policy, education, the environment and many other significant issues and topics which effect everyone.
not true. people do care. they just dont care about what you and some others around here think they should be caring about.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Which is exactly why I feel there truly is no hope. We've set the course, so sit back and enjoy the ride.
pick up some howard zinn for fucks sake. or arundhati roy.
they've had it worse in the past than we have. imagine striking at gunpoint, while your labor organizer was killed in front of you. or picketing under gunfire.
we have it easy today and here you are giving up. fuck all that. the rights we enjoy today were paid for in blood, i'm not about to give up on that.
I'm very familiar with both of those writers and their writings and enjoy them very much. My opinions are based on our society and how people are now, not that I personally don't agree with you. I feel people just don't care so nothing changes.
pick up some howard zinn for fucks sake. or arundhati roy.
they've had it worse in the past than we have. imagine striking at gunpoint, while your labor organizer was killed in front of you. or picketing under gunfire.
we have it easy today and here you are giving up. fuck all that. the rights we enjoy today were paid for in blood, i'm not about to give up on that.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
You can say that about many fringe issues like legalization of drugs or free cuba or things of that nature, but not for things like healthcare, foreign policy, education, the environment and many other significant issues and topics which effect everyone.
Comments
Great Idea!
Can it be done?
what would it take for you to revolt?
are you in..?
Your idea for the BIG revolution(before actual shots are fired)
Is for people to do ONE MINUTE of research before the next big election.....
And just blindly vote for whoever is running against the incumbent????
No matter what their views are..
No matter what their political views, on any and all issues are........
Just vote out the incumbents....................
Again..
I dont see many people joining the revolution...........
Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
?????
what are you hoping to accomplish with this baiting post?
what are you talking about...the OP is claiming everyone is uneducated, uninformed, and lazy...another poster shared their experience in their quest for change, I was wondering if FiveB wanted to join in...
and since you asked Speedy what it would take for him to revolt, let me ask you this, where are you protesting in the coming days...? I assume you're taking it to the street, you know because the world sucks so much...what's your issue du jour...?
you see, some are content with the world going to shit because they don't have to worry about any problems other than what to watch tonight.
some things i don't like being done in my name, especially when i strongly disagree. you ask what is there to protest about, i say look around! pollution, extinctions, wars, waste of our taxpayer money, robbery of our taxpayer money, crimes, occupations, genocide, taxpayer funded segregation and attacks on civilians.....
some people ask is it worth it? do the ends really justify the means? while others are content to shrug and just not care because it doesn't affect their little sphere
mentality like this
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
Also, just for the record and to be clear, I've made it clear everyone is not like this, but as a whole, this is how our society is.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
huh...? :?
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
i'm fairly active with my protests - i send on average 5 emails a week to local and national representatives on various issues especially now with copenhagen in the headlines ... i also make consumer choices that takes into consideration issues that are important to me ...
regardless of that - it is irrelevant what i do or don't do ... i don't understand people's fascination with trying to shoot people who care down ... if you don't care - that's fine ... but why try and tear someone who does down?
it's like people who campaign for animal rights asking them if they eat meat ... simply a distraction from what the issue really is ...
Any better Ideas?
becos we don't like being told by self-righteous twats (in a general sense, not anyone here in particular, you're all cool) to care and go out and do things that said people aren't even willing to do themselves. some people here act like we should all be in the streets tearing shit down... yet they haven't lifted a finger to do anything remotely like that other than to tell other people to do it.
Speedy--
How many people already BLINDLY VOTE based on a single letter next to someone's name at the booth: (D) or (R)? The majority.
How many people do feel like they are being screwed by their elected representatives, but aren't exaclty sure how the system really works? The majority.
How many politicians actually deliver on their campaign promises? How many actually even remain consistent in their own views, let alone policies? How many politicians actually have to vote against their own legislation because it becomes hijacked, and tacked onto bills that they can't support? What percentage of our Congress have held their seats forever, and have long-standing relationships with the lobbyists and the special interests as a result? 100% new blood wouldn't route out entirely, the special interests would still find new people to latch on to, but let them start from square one.
They won't impose term limits on themselves for obvious reasons. This idea is essentially term limits imposed on them. It would be a powerful statement. Could we really be any worse off with 435 new faces, in the House than the same old crowd year after year?
I suppose I should move to where you live. It seems you firmly believe that yourself and everyone you talk to is OK with how things are going. It's the opposite for me-- the more I ask around the more people I find that are genuinely pissed off with the way things are going. For me, the reasons for a revolution of sorts are similar to the ones that our founding fathers had. The primary reasons go back long before Bush:
Our Federal Government is too powerful, and each branch no longer sticks to their original duties making checks and balances worthless. There are more agencies that already exist at state levels that do nothing but increase our tax burden and force us to work harder (those of us that actually do work). Our economy is centrally planned by a quasi-private bank (The Federal Reserve), which can literally counterfeit all of the money it wants, without any oversight or audit, to fund anything it wants from senseless wars to welfare-- but still, the money, that took NOTHING to create is re-paid through taxes. Taxpayers bare the burden for the mistakes and greed of banks and other major corporations, and such has been the struggle for a good chunk of American history. Inflation (created by the Fed) has destroyed the value of our currency by 95%, and debt to foreign countries and other foreign central banks effectively makes us DEPENDENT on them when we were supposed to be a nation of independence.
The tax code is thousands of pages long, confusing, and wrongfully taxes us on our labor, in which there is no profit or gain (income is GAIN from corporate activity, not the even exchange of labor for a service). The IRS can seize your property for whatever reason it deems necessary, and there is nothing you can do it about it. We have effectively abridged the right to free speech and press, we no longer are secure in our persons or homes nor have the right to privacy thanks to laws like the Patriot Act, and agencies such as the NSA. Federal law trumps every state law despite the fact that the 10th amendment guaranteed us otherwise. Our elected officials have adopted a policy of pre-emptive war which undermines our national security, not strengthen it. Our military presence is felt in 130 countries around the world, and it brings us more contempt than gratitude from most of these countries. We try to maintain a world empire that costs trillions of dollars a year when we have no constitutional authority to do so. Even if we WERE supposed to be the policemen of the world, we are not viewed that way-- we are not seen as cops, we are seen as "PIGS." Our right to self-govern locally has been traded in for global governance by un-elected officials without our consent, through NATO, the UN, and other supranatinal groups where you or I have no say. Social Security is a bigger Ponzi scheme than anything Bernie Madoff could ever dream of. The health care system is a joke and it worked a lot better before the government decided to cater to insurance companies and HMOs which have since driven up costs, which becomes more and more painful with a devauling dollar. Our currency is not sound in any way shape or form, and it is getting riskier and riskier to hold on to dollars-- unlike a stock, there should be little to no risk in holding your own country's currency, as their should be some attempt to maintain that currency's value for benefit of the people.
The worst part: as time goes on, each one of these problems gets magnified, and it will eventually lead to our collapse. Maybe you honestly believe that things aren't going to get any worse? That a status quo does, in fact, exist. I don't see it this way. All of these things have been incrementally happening throughout our history, and the backbone of this country, the middle class is about to break. That's when all hell breaks loose. I don't want to see it happen. I love America, namely what it is SUPPOSED to stand for, which is sadly what we have long forgotten.
The first step in making anything happen is to "see" it happening. If you're content, you're content. I see what is happening here, and I try and make steps towards changing it everyday through peaceful means-- I think it has to be something simple, yet powerful. The fact is something you've said before. Look in the mirror. Change starts right there. I agree 100%.
Also, to reiterate as stated before, not that everyone must "revolt" as some have stated, but isn't it really sitting on your hands if you don't speak up or simply respond to all the worlds problems or nations problems by saying "it doesn't effect me" so why bother - ie - I'm comfortable so who cares about everyone else?
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
but is the animosity in the perceived hypocrisy or it is simply a defensive mechanism to not actually do anything yourself ...
if someone tells me that eating french fries for every meal is bad for me ... does it really matter if said person does it himself?
maybe it is, but i never claimed there was anything wrong with someone sitting on their hands. you did. and while your non-profit work is admirable, it's a long way from the violent, spilling into the streets revolution you and others seem to be wanting.
it does to me. if you wanna stand there smoking cigs and telling me cigs are bad, you can go fuck yourself. don't lecture me on how i need to adopt lifestyles and ideals you can't even uphold yourself. i feel the same way about christian politics. i loathe hypocrisy. there's nothing defensive about it becos i openly admit i don't do shit and don't care that i don't. i don't need a defense mechanism to rationalize it. things aren't that bad here, certainly not so bad that armed revolution makes any sense or is necessary.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
if education is the key we are in some serious trouble. when 70% of the country relies on a propaganda network passed off as news and is too ignorant to realize it, then it is quite difficult to instill the desire for change...
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
well - i guess in the end you will lose because you got hung up on the hyprocisy rather than the issue ...
i don't loathe hypocrisy because we ARE ALL hypocrites ... i am pretty sure I am and i'm pretty sure you are ... we need to see those hypocrisies for what they are and deal with them accordingly ...
things aren't bad here for one simple reason: people don't care ... if people cared - it is pretty bad
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
That's all, I don't really have an opinion. Just enjoying the debate.
not true. people do care. they just dont care about what you and some others around here think they should be caring about.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
pick up some howard zinn for fucks sake. or arundhati roy.
they've had it worse in the past than we have. imagine striking at gunpoint, while your labor organizer was killed in front of you. or picketing under gunfire.
we have it easy today and here you are giving up. fuck all that. the rights we enjoy today were paid for in blood, i'm not about to give up on that.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
which is exactly my point. who says these things are fringe issues? why do you get to decide which issues are most important?