Palestinian kindergarten graduation ceremony

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Comments

  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I'd like to see the usual suspects come out but they wont.

    i'll just patiently wait for the "Israel killed another child thread" to appear

    Keep on waitin and baitin...

    Your video doesn't prove anything any more than the pics of the little Israeli girls signing the bombs were going to Lebanon last year. Neither examples speaks for those groups of people as a whole.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • binger
    binger Posts: 179
    I find it much more disturbing that our DEAR LEADER says he talks to God. God tells him he's righteous and who the "axis of evil" is and that roughly half of our ADULT population buys into this shit.
    I want to point out that people who seem to have no power, whether working people, people of color, or women -- once they organize and protest and create movements -- have a voice no government can suppress. Howard Zinn
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Neither examples speaks for those groups of people as a whole.
    I agree with that. but dont pretend this type of activity isn't the norm in a large portion of islamic society. compared to israel, america, or europe
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    binger wrote:
    I find it much more disturbing that our DEAR LEADER says he talks to God. God tells him he's righteous and who the "axis of evil" is and that roughly half of our ADULT population buys into this shit.
    you find it much more disturbing then the video you just saw? those are little kids dude or dudette.
  • OneLove
    OneLove Posts: 563
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I'd like to see the usual suspects come out but they wont.

    i'll just patiently wait for the "Israel killed another child thread" to appear


    I trust you won't be waiting long.

    I have to admit, as far as propaganda goes, that is effective. No one wants to think that 5 year olds could be subjected to brainwashing like this. It happens everywhere though, to some extent.

    Then intellect takes over and I realize that the only way to have an honest dialogue is to understand that there are humans on both sides of the conflict who are innocent. Rather than focusing on the radicalized segments of society, perhaps focusing on the good that exists in all walks of life & encouraging those people to find their voice and affect change is the way to go.

    Or, we could just keep throwing bombs and pointing at "those people" who are all wrong, while we are all right. Its a luxury I enjoy sitting here and attemtping to fix world problems from the comfort of my home.

    Last I checked no one was keeping me in a police state, or blowing themselves up to kill others around them. So I guess its pretty easy for me to judge either of them, since I have NO IDEA what the have gone through as combative societys for decades.
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    OneLove wrote:
    I trust you won't be waiting long.

    I have to admit, as far as propaganda goes, that is effective. No one wants to think that 5 year olds could be subjected to brainwashing like this. It happens everywhere though, to some extent.
    what bothers me is to the great extent it is, in palastine, saudia arbia, pakistan, etc.
    OneLove wrote:
    Then intellect takes over and I realize that the only way to have an honest dialogue is to understand that there are humans on both sides of the conflict who are innocent. Rather than focusing on the radicalized segments of society, perhaps focusing on the good that exists in all walks of life & encouraging those people to find their voice and affect change is the way to go.

    Or, we could just keep throwing bombs and pointing at "those people" who are all wrong, while we are all right. Its a luxury I enjoy sitting here and attemtping to fix world problems from the comfort of my home.

    Last I checked no one was keeping me in a police state, or blowing themselves up to kill others around them. So I guess its pretty easy for me to judge either of them, since I have NO IDEA what the have gone through as combative societys for decades.
    well said.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I agree with that. but dont pretend this type of activity isn't the norm in a large portion of islamic society. compared to israel, america, or europe


    Each of these societies has their own unique way of disregarding human life.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Vedderlution_Baby
    Vedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    Isn't there a movie called Jesus Camp where they dress up kids in fatigues and tell them they are going to be soldiers in gods war? This is what im reminded regarding this video.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I agree with that. but dont pretend this type of activity isn't the norm in a large portion of islamic society. compared to israel, america, or europe


    Israel is innocent. It doesn't send it's children to kill Palestinians. It waits until they are old enough to do their forced military service, and then lets them go and kill Palestinian men, women, and children. Israeli children mostly live lives of wealth and prosperity. They are good, moral, upstanding citizens who respect the lives of all people. The Palestinians as a whole are inherently evil and sadistic, and therefore they should be herded into Apartheid style bantustans and bombed and sniped at will.
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Israel is innocent. It doesn't send it's children to kill Palestinians. It waits until they are old enough to do their forced military service, and then lets them go and kill Palestinian men, women, and children. Israeli children mostly live lives of wealth and prosperity. They are good, moral, upstanding citizens who respect the lives of all people. The Palestinians as a whole are inherently evil and sadistic, and therefore they should be herded into Apartheid style bantustans and bombed and sniped at will.

    I never said Israel is innocent.

    I guess it would be nice to know the % of children who go through this type of graduation. if it's 1%, I'd so no big deal. someone mentioned those jesus camps and they are equally as sickening.

    I also wonder how your attitude would be if you saw Israel children doing the same thing. is it safe to say would be outraged? safe to say you'd make your own thread showing this outrageousness?
  • Vedderlution_Baby
    Vedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I never said Israel is innocent.

    I guess it would be nice to know the % of children who go through this type of graduation. if it's 1%, I'd so no big deal. someone mentioned those jesus camps and they are equally as sickening.

    I also wonder how your attitude would be if you saw Israel children doing the same thing. is it safe to say would be outraged? safe to say you'd make your own thread showing this outrageousness?



    personally, I wouldnt be surprised. Children soldiers have been in use for countless years now by everyone.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I also wonder how your attitude would be if you saw Israel children doing the same thing. is it safe to say would be outraged? safe to say you'd make your own thread showing this outrageousness?

    It is disgusting that children of such a young age are made to dress up to look like suicide bombers. I suspect this is merely a way of sending out a message to Israel that Palestinian children, when old enough, will carry on the fight for freedom when their elders have been killed off. I think it's terrible that Palestinians have been forced into such desperation and anger. But then I suspect that anyone else would behave the same way if subjected to the same daily oppression and terror.
  • OneLove
    OneLove Posts: 563
    jlew24asu wrote:
    what bothers me is to the great extent it is, in palastine, saudia arbia, pakistan, etc.

    well said.


    Thank you. I have a feeling that you and I, if forced to designate sympathies to one side or the other would differ. As long as we are busy pointing fingers, nothing will change. Those are mistakes often made by governments, that could change if the good in both societies could rise up.

    That is the one thing I am ashamed of my gov't for these days (everything else is petty by comparison)... choosing to fear the negative rather than encourage the light to shine through.

    So perhaps rather than focusing your energy on pointing out those extremes, we could try to evolve some by discussing that grey area that isn't entertained often. I wonder what people think could be done to move towards peace...

    I just don't have the energy to engage in the finger pointing
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    personally, I wouldnt be surprised. Children soldiers have been in use for countless years now by everyone.
    just look at where that takes place. take a look at this list. the countries mentioned have been at war for decades. http://hrw.org/campaigns/crp/index.htm

    would you be surprised if we had schools like this all over america? I certainly would.
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    OneLove wrote:
    Thank you. I have a feeling that you and I, if forced to designate sympathies to one side or the other would differ. As long as we are busy pointing fingers, nothing will change. Those are mistakes often made by governments, that could change if the good in both societies could rise up.

    That is the one thing I am ashamed of my gov't for these days (everything else is petty by comparison)... choosing to fear the negative rather than encourage the light to shine through.

    So perhaps rather than focusing your energy on pointing out those extremes, we could try to evolve some by discussing that grey area that isn't entertained often. I wonder what people think could be done to move towards peace...

    I just don't have the energy to engage in the finger pointing

    I agree with you. pointing the finger doesnt solve anything. peace is a good thing. no one can win the argument against it.

    there are just too many countries and people who want Israel gone. they do not believe they have a right to be there. I would like peace as much as you. but with that type of thinking peace can not happen.

    I am no expert on the subject but the 1967 borders seem to be the major issue. go back to them and we have peace? good then lets do it.

    and then lets see the muslim world call for these schools to be closed. and they can teach their children peace. I promise to do the same.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    [quote="jlew24asuI am no expert on the subject but the 1967 borders seem to be the major issue. go back to them and we have peace? good then lets do it.

    and then lets see the muslim world call for these schools to be closed. and they can teach their children peace. I promise to do the same.[/quote"]

    This is all I've been asking for all this time Jeff. And this is all that the international community has been asking for the past 40 years. Unfortunately the U.S has singularly vetoed every single U.N resolution calling for a withdrawal to the 1967 borders, and for a two state solution.
  • OneLove
    OneLove Posts: 563
    jlew24asu wrote:
    I agree with you. pointing the finger doesnt solve anything. peace is a good thing. no one can win the argument against it.

    there are just too many countries and people who want Israel gone. they do not believe they have a right to be there. I would like peace as much as you. but with that type of thinking peace can not happen.

    I am no expert on the subject but the 1967 borders seem to be the major issue. go back to them and we have peace? good then lets do it.

    and then lets see the muslim world call for these schools to be closed. and they can teach their children peace. I promise to do the same.


    Agreed. I think it goes waaaay beyond borders. Can you imagine the amount of healing that has to take place on a human level inorder for there to truely be peace? How many fatherless kids are there, who can't help but blame the other side.

    I have to entertain the thought that America's backing of Israel has something to do with how America and Israel both are viewed in arabic societies. It is uncomfortable to consider, but there is a reason why America and Israel is disliked. Again, not in their entirity, but those segments and gov't actions that are ment to represent all citizens of both countries.

    Can you imagine as an American (or whatever nationality you happen to be) strapping a bomb to yourself and blowing it up just for collateral damage? Religous perversion... yes. But in reality this is a human being straping explosives to themselves, and blowing themselves up. I can't imagine living in a society that has gotten to that point.

    I guess I am not full of answers...
  • jeffbr
    jeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    Isn't there a movie called Jesus Camp where they dress up kids in fatigues and tell them they are going to be soldiers in gods war? This is what im reminded regarding this video.

    I just watched that movie last week. That DVD, and this video JLew posted, tell me all I need to know about the danger of organized religion and religious zealots. Let's get this holy war over with and have all religionists killed each other off so the rest of us can live happily ever after.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    As sick as this sounds.....if there was ever an excuse to not feel as bad for wasting a few kids...this type of thing would be it.

    Seems like totally backwards result to their efforts...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Byrnzie wrote:
    This is all I've been asking for all this time Jeff. And this is all that the international community has been asking for the past 40 years. Unfortunately the U.S has singularly vetoed every single U.N resolution calling for a withdrawal to the 1967 borders, and for a two state solution.
    then we should be having a discussion of the six day war. even I have much to learn about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War

    there are reasons why Israel hasnt gone back to those borders. i.m not defending those reasons because i dont quite fully understand it. but I know war was brought onto to Israel in 1967.

    seems like this has now turned into the loser of a poker game asking for his money back.

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