Abortion

catefrances wrote:

who said anything about a relationship?

I did. You quoted me.

catefrances wrote:

my point being that i'm tired of these abortion threads threads. it's not like women wake up one day and think they'll terminate their pregnancy. it's no one's business and it doesn't make you a bad person or any different than the day before if you choose not to continue with a pregnancy. it's a private issue.

I understand your opinion of the threads.

I suppose that if it was an issue of circumcision a woman should have no voice?

The debate about abortion isn't solely between conservative men and women. I believe women exist that don't condone abortion either. I think what we need to resolve the debate is total understanding of the issue.

The belief held by many fundamental christians is that at the exact time that conception occurs a soul is born. Honestly, that is a matter of a belief system, and I don't think it should apply to this at all.

Then the question arises of at what point during the process of prenatal development is it acceptable to terminate the life. I will say that it is in fact killing a living organism. It is very well known that fetuses are somewhat aware and learn even within the whom. In my opinion there is a line at which prenatal death should not be available. As another poster mentioned, you should be able to decide rather quickly if you are going to abort. The third trimester in my opinion is basically like murdering a newborn. It is a fully functional, aware, human being.

I fully respect a woman's choice to abort within the first 10 weeks. Even that is quite a long time to choose abortion. It's not a tough decision, you have two options, think about when you have to buy a car or something. You have a lot of options and the decision becomes more difficult. It's all a lot easier if you know the facts first. You can avoid pregnancy as well. That's really the best option.

I never used condoms in my last relationship and she didn't use birth control either. I just pulled out, or technically coitus interruptus, worked every time and I didn't chance it. She obviously trusted me and she had predetermined that she would get an abortion. Well, when she met her husband, she got pregnant almost right away and ended up giving birth to Ayden. I have pictures.

That brings me to happiness. People don't know what they want. Even synthetic happiness is just as good as any other. I argue it's not really synthetic then. One of the happiest dudes I ever met was crippled. He was a great guy to hang with back in the day. I've met some really unhappy people with money. So what I"m saying is, I know people with 4 kids that wouldn't trade them for anything. Guy I work with has 2 jobs and his wife has 1. They have three incomes to support 4 kids and they are basically floating with a house and two vehicles. They don't expect anything else. He works 16 hours a day, 8 in the freezing weather outside. But the guy is great, really happy.

I feel like I can't father a child, but yet I do want a child, a little person. But I'm not with anyone, I'd have to adopt and I can't take care of myself. On the other hand, my life would probably totally change, I wouldn't be so important anymore. I would end up excelling just for the love of a child. Maybe, or maybe I would end up a crackwhore. lol. But anyway, I just think the issue needs some conversation and it's unfortunate that it was turned into a chat thread. :(

Ahnimus wrote:

I suppose that if it was an issue of circumcision a woman should have no voice?

Huh? Did I miss something earlier in this thread?

catefrances wrote:

though there's no comparison between circumcision and abortion, if you want to trim the hood off your litttle man then i say it's your decision.

I have some strong feelings on this topic. I started a thread on it once. I don't think we'll get into it now.

Scubascott wrote:

I have some strong feelings on this topic. I started a thread on it once. I don't think we'll get into it now.

It's a rough topic too. There are a lot of people on both sides.

Ahnimus wrote:

It's a rough topic too. There are a lot of people on both sides.

Actually, I think its far more cut and dried than the abortion issue.

Ha! Cut and dried! Get it? I crack myself up.

catefrances wrote:

i get aggressive( though until today in this thread i thought i was showing some restraint) ahnimus because it's no one's business but the woman's. she's the one that has to live with the decision she makes. yes if she is in a relationship she can, if she chooses, discuss it with her partner, but ultimately it is her decision.

I'm not sure I completely agree with that sentiment. If a woman is in a relationship with the father of the baby I think he has a right to have some say in the matter.

I hope to never be in that situation, but if I was, I think I'd like to have a say in what happened.

catefrances wrote:

well i don't expect you would. but surely you understand that you can't force a woman to continue a pregnancy to term against her will.

Of course not.

But if I was in a relationship with a woman and found out that she'd had an abortion without even consulting me I think I'd be pretty upset about it.

catefrances wrote:

and you'd deal with it, just as she was doing.

I guess so, but if she felt that she had to deal with it alone it'd probably be a pretty lousy relationship anyway right?

catefrances wrote:

maybe.

I'll just agree to disagree with you on this one Cate. Sounds like it touches a bit of a nerve. I've never been in the situation, so I'm only guessing how I'd feel about it. Just please don't think that I'd ever try to force a woman to have a baby that she didn't want. That's not me at all.