Call for lethal injection boycott

Ahnimus · October 2007

BetterThanYou wrote:

i've been back and forth with agreeing and opposing the death penalty. at the end of it all, if the person is 100% guilty and you have hard evidence that can't be argued with, put them to death. if there's a sliver of a chance the person didn't do it even though they're found guilty, put them in prison.

I suppose this depends on your theory of what a person is. Whether they are capable of having a capacity for good or evil, or whether those are circumstantial traits based on value judgments of society at large. I personally don't feel that humans consist of anything but matter strictly obeying the laws of thermodynamics. No person or animal is wholey responsible for their own fate. My understanding of psychology, sociology and neurology has led me to believe that the social dysfunction of one individual is as much the responsibility of their social environment as it is the responsibility of the individual. It's a causal system, but which came first, the society or the individual, clearly the society exacted first, it's influence on the individual. So who is to blame? No one. But we can all share in the responsibility, educate ourselves and work together to make society a more inviting place to all people, the result may be a surprising decrease in crime. Or we can maintain our selfish paradigms and externalize all problems.

callen · October 2007

BetterThanYou wrote:

i've been back and forth with agreeing and opposing the death penalty. at the end of it all, if the person is 100% guilty and you have hard evidence that can't be argued with, put them to death. if there's a sliver of a chance the person didn't do it even though they're found guilty, put them in prison.

humans have the ability to create hard evidence
many humans are mean
thus you never know

you okay with a few innocents being killed?
it has happened
and will continue to happen

what we really need to boycott is ole 810mbe

810wmb · October 2007

soulsinging wrote:

well, now that we've managed to finally agree on the facts, perhaps you can explain to me what you meant by this:

"and back to cost - as long as we're willing to pay for it, it's fine...i think it stinks"

you're telling me you'd rather pay more for an execution than it would cost for life imprisonment? the execution is worth the extra money? me, i'd rather have that tax money given back to me... the murderer isn't hurting anyone who doesn't deserve it in prison.

here's an honest answer - my first post in this thread...i meant...but it was also meant to be a little funny too.

not thinking about all the appeals, etc, that go on, the logical answer would be kill 'em quick. researching on the net, i have found what you have stated to be true.

as i said, i wasn't thinking about all the appeals....just which was cheaper...i also said something like "box of ammo $15"...seems a lot cheaper than locking them away and paying for everything. by the way, that was supposed to be funny too.

"it stinks" was to the fact that the guilty can and do, tie up the system, put a drain on tax dollars, all the while getting to live after they have been sentenced to die.

soulsinging · October 2007

810wmb wrote:

here's an honest answer - my first post in this thread...i meant...but it was also meant to be a little funny too.

not thinking about all the appeals, etc, that go on, the logical answer would be kill 'em quick. researching on the net, i have found what you have stated to be true.

as i said, i wasn't thinking about all the appeals....just which was cheaper...i also said something like "box of ammo $15"...seems a lot cheaper than locking them away and paying for everything. by the way, that was supposed to be funny too.

"it stinks" was to the fact that the guilty can and do, tie up the system, put a drain on tax dollars, all the while getting to live after they have been sentenced to die.

i knew the $15 bullet thing was a joke, and it was funny at that. i've made worse myself round here. the women don't much like me.

as to the appeals, what do you see as the big benefit of execution? there are only a few options here:

1. keep it as it is and keep going with incredibly expensive executions rather than the cheaper life in prison. is it worth it? why?

2. drop the appeals process to make executions cheaper than life in prison. but since people are released from prison almost every month when it is found on appeal that they were actually innocent, this tactic is going to execute a lot of innocents. is it worth it? why?

3. abolish the death penalty and switch to life in prison with no parole. offenders don't get out of jail, ever, but they don't die either. is that not good enough? why not? what does execution add?

Kel Varnsen · October 2007

AFGHANISTAN, ALGERIA, BAHAMAS, BAHRAIN, BANGLADESH, BELARUS, BENIN, BOTSWANA, BRUNEI DARUSSALAM, BURKINA FASO, BURUNDI, CHINA, CONGO (Democratic Republic), EGYPT, GUINEA, GUYANA, INDIA, INDONESIA, IRAN, IRAQ, JAPAN, JORDAN, KAZAKSTAN, KENYA, KOREA (North), KOREA (South), KUWAIT, KYRGYZSTAN, LAOS, LIBYA, MALAYSIA, MALI, MONGOLIA, MOROCCO, MYANMAR, NIGERIA, PAKISTAN, QATAR, SAUDI ARABIA, SINGAPORE, SOMALIA, SRI LANKA, SUDAN, SYRIA, TAIWAN, TANZANIA, THAILAND, TOGO, TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO, UGANDA, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, UZBEKISTAN, VIET NAM, YEMEN, ZAMBIA

Above is a list of countries that used the death penalty in 2006. I am curious as to what people for capital punishment have as a reason as to why the only developed industrialized nations on the list are the US and Japan? A lot of those nations are pretty scary places that I know I wouldn't want to live in.

Ahnimus · October 2007

Kel Varnsen wrote:

AFGHANISTAN, ALGERIA, BAHAMAS, BAHRAIN, BANGLADESH, BELARUS, BENIN, BOTSWANA, BRUNEI DARUSSALAM, BURKINA FASO, BURUNDI, CHINA, CONGO (Democratic Republic), EGYPT, GUINEA, GUYANA, INDIA, INDONESIA, IRAN, IRAQ, JAPAN, JORDAN, KAZAKSTAN, KENYA, KOREA (North), KOREA (South), KUWAIT, KYRGYZSTAN, LAOS, LIBYA, MALAYSIA, MALI, MONGOLIA, MOROCCO, MYANMAR, NIGERIA, PAKISTAN, QATAR, SAUDI ARABIA, SINGAPORE, SOMALIA, SRI LANKA, SUDAN, SYRIA, TAIWAN, TANZANIA, THAILAND, TOGO, TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO, UGANDA, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, UZBEKISTAN, VIET NAM, YEMEN, ZAMBIA

Above is a list of countries that used the death penalty in 2006. I am curious as to what people for capital punishment have as a reason as to why the only developed industrialized nations on the list are the US and Japan?

They sustained a developmental disorder. Oh you said "people for capital punishment", nevermind.

soulsinging · October 2007

Kel Varnsen wrote:

AFGHANISTAN, ALGERIA, BAHAMAS, BAHRAIN, BANGLADESH, BELARUS, BENIN, BOTSWANA, BRUNEI DARUSSALAM, BURKINA FASO, BURUNDI, CHINA, CONGO (Democratic Republic), EGYPT, GUINEA, GUYANA, INDIA, INDONESIA, IRAN, IRAQ, JAPAN, JORDAN, KAZAKSTAN, KENYA, KOREA (North), KOREA (South), KUWAIT, KYRGYZSTAN, LAOS, LIBYA, MALAYSIA, MALI, MONGOLIA, MOROCCO, MYANMAR, NIGERIA, PAKISTAN, QATAR, SAUDI ARABIA, SINGAPORE, SOMALIA, SRI LANKA, SUDAN, SYRIA, TAIWAN, TANZANIA, THAILAND, TOGO, TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO, UGANDA, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, UZBEKISTAN, VIET NAM, YEMEN, ZAMBIA

Above is a list of countries that used the death penalty in 2006. I am curious as to what people for capital punishment have as a reason as to why the only developed industrialized nations on the list are the US and Japan?

john wayne and ninjas.

don't get it? let me explain: we're bad ass motherfuckers and we don't mind spilling a little (or a lot) of blood to get our job done.

Ahnimus · October 2007

I think the U.S. is suffering from a developmental disorder. It's part of american culture that individual responsibility is paramount to collective responsibility. The United States is one of the only developed nations that rejects research into the efficacy of parental leave. Granting maternity leave that is insufficient for the development of a healthy child. In contrast to this, nations like Sweden offer ample maternity leave and high-quality government funded daycare services with specially trained caregivers.

soulsinging · October 2007

Ahnimus wrote:

I think the U.S. is suffering from a developmental disorder. It's part of american culture that individual responsibility is paramount to collective responsibility. The United States is one of the only developed nations that rejects research into the efficacy of parental leave. Granting maternity leave that is insufficient for the development of a healthy child. In contrast to this, nations like Sweden offer ample maternity leave and high-quality government funded daycare services with specially trained caregivers.

i don't know if it's a developmental disorder so much as an obsessive compulsive disorder. in america one thing counts and one thing only: profit. that's why maternity leave sucks here. it's all about the bottom line. nothing else matters. period.

Kel Varnsen · October 2007

even flow? wrote:

We had an episode here in Canada about a year or so ago where the RCMP got called to a drug lair in the middle of butt f'k park. So they show up and the guy who was there, had a hard on for cops. He blows a couple of them (four) away, you know because of their job. So aside from the paranoid in you that says that people can be crooked. When you have a guy/girl and you know as in this case as he was the only person there, who did it. Put the goof to death. Easy as pie. Instead the asshat took his own life. Unfortunately we don't have the death penalty up here anymore. So if he didn't x himself, he would be able to free everything on my tax dollar. My tax dollar says kill him.

Hear that Bernardo. YOU SHOULD BE DEAD!!!! YOUR FUCKING WIFE TOO!!!

Actually Bernado can't hear you because he is locked in a tiny cell by himself with only an hour outside of it each day and very little human contact. And he is stuck there for the rest of his life alone with his thoughts. I am fine with the fact that part of my tax dollar goes to punishing him like this for every last minute of his life, the sweet relief of death is way more than that guy deserves.

Ahnimus · October 2007

soulsinging wrote:

i don't know if it's a developmental disorder so much as an obsessive compulsive disorder. in america one thing counts and one thing only: profit. that's why maternity leave sucks here. it's all about the bottom line. nothing else matters. period.

Right, but I think that was par for any industrialized nation. But since then others have developed beyond that into more socialized nations, excercising economic power for greater social benefits.

Scubascott · October 2007

soulsinging wrote:

i don't know if it's a developmental disorder so much as an obsessive compulsive disorder. in america one thing counts and one thing only: profit. that's why maternity leave sucks here. it's all about the bottom line. nothing else matters. period.

So how does america profit from capital punishment?

Ahnimus · October 2007

Kel Varnsen wrote:

Actually Bernado can't hear you because he is locked in a tiny cell by himself with only an hour outside of it each day and very little human contact. And he is stuck there for the rest of his life alone with his thoughts. I am fine with the fact that part of my tax dollar goes to punishing him like this for every last minute of his life, the sweet relief of death is way more than that guy deserves.

How do you know what Bernardo deserves? What his intentions were? His mental processes or anything about him except a particular behavioral example? One incident speaks not for the man's entirety. None of us are in a position to know with absolute knowledge what any other man deserves. Most of us don't even know what our selves deserve.

Ahnimus · October 2007

Scubascott wrote:

So how does america profit from capital punishment?

I just remarked the other day, I haven't seen Scubascott for awhile.

BetterThanYou · October 2007

callen wrote:

humans have the ability to create hard evidence
many humans are mean
thus you never know

you okay with a few innocents being killed?
it has happened
and will continue to happen

what we really need to boycott is ole 810mbe

give me the percentages of people on death row because of doctored video of them killing someone, or 100 eyewitnesses that were all paid off by the prosecution.

you have video, you have multiple outstanding citizens that witnessed the crime, i'm gonna believe he/she did it. with the technology of today, any defense team could come up with someone that could prove a video was doctored if it in fact was.

and i'm not saying put every single person that's being tried for murder up for execution. hard irrefutable (sp?) evidence? death. circumstantial evidence? prison. that's how i feel. sorry if it offends you.

Ahnimus · October 2007

I dislike ignorance more than indifference.

soulsinging · October 2007

Scubascott wrote:

So how does america profit from capital punishment?

beats me. violent catharsis? the same kind of smug self-righteous comfort we get from obsessing over celebrities and delighting in watching them fall.

Byrnzie · October 2007

even flow? wrote:

I'm sorry. If putting that nice human being in jail isn't revenge then what is it?

If the answer is justice. Then them getting the same as they dolled out is justice too.

Murder the murderer! Right. So if capital punishment is a deterrent - which it isn't - then why are executions not broadcast live across the nation on prime time t.v?

Byrnzie · October 2007

MahoganySouls wrote:

Sodium Pentathol is a barbituate that causes an anesthetic effect. In other words, it puts the recipient to sleep. It is commonly used in various types of surgery. There is no pain felt because the person is unconscious.

When this "cocktail" is used in lethal injections, SP is given first to anesthetize the person. Then the remaing drugs that eventually stop the heart are given.

The only trauma the criminal experiences is that of knowing their life is about to end. Mental anguish yes, physical pain no.

You didn't read the article Joseph Mengele. In many cases the man being executed wakes up.

soulsinging · October 2007

Byrnzie wrote:

Murder the murderer! Right. So if capital punishment is a deterrent - which it isn't - then why are executions not broadcast live across the nation on prime time t.v?

too many people would watch and eagerly wait to tune in next week.

Call for lethal injection boycott

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