Sun Symbols, Society, Ancient History, and Barack Obama...

DriftingByTheStorm

... and more.
This should be fun.
I've been amassing a everloving pile of links, so here goes.

My intention here is not to make any specific claim, only to present certains collected materials for you to interpret for yourselves. Question the very organizing structure of your world itself. What is planned, and what is random? What is random and what is planned? What is old and what is new? How does power sustain itself through the ages, particularly in the post-monarchial\dynastic\imperial world?

SUN SYMBOLISM.

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A million places i could start,
but lets take this back to the source first.
I mean, lets see where MUCH of the inspiration for sun symbolism is derived:
Ancient Egypt.

Stanford University Solar Center: Solar Symbolism, Ancient and Modern

Ancient Egyptian Sun Symbol
The Alchemical Symbol for GOLD, the most perfect metal


Book: Alchemical Keys to Masonic Ritual

Masonry and Alchemy are entwined together through the ages, in ways few today understand.
Alchemy also claims origins back to the Heremtic traditions of Helenistic Egypt. (Rosicrucianism and The Order of The Golden Dawn also both claim this Egyptian lineage)

And, of course, to modern day:


Speaking of major retailers,
Wal-Mart used to have a 5 pointed star symbol

itself a VERY significant symbol both in the occult world, and also "coincidentally" a major organizing patern within society at a larger level. I'm sure i don't need to get you thinking too hard to find some conspicious examples of the 5 pointed star. You could google "Freemasonry five points of fellowship", but that is for another day...

Because Wal-Mart CHANGED their logo:

What do you think THAT image is supposed to be?

Fuck Wal-Mart.
Lets go back to Egypt again.

Egyptian Symbols for Ra, The SUN God:

These symbols and what they represent are all interchangeable.

In the progression of Eyptian culture the Sun,
and the God represented in the Sun, were known,
among several other names,
as HORUS, then RA, and then AMEN-RA.

The symbolism is for the sun AND the god.
Thus, when we see the "EYE OF RA" or the "EYE OF HORUS",


it is both the eye of [a] god, and also the sun itself. The symbolism is again, as with the sun\gold and masonry\alchemy, deeply intertwined.

Thus, when you see

on your dollar bills,
you can know for certain that this is a thinly veiled reference to the Eye of Horus, or THE SUN.

Here is wikipedia on The Eye of Providence.
Here is the direct connection to Freemasonry

A Masonic "Eye of Providence" from the 1700's

A Masonic Symbols chart depicting the "Eye of Providence"


An Ancient Alchemist Wood Carving:


Here it can be seen on the side of the Aachen Cathedral, in Aachen, Germany.
Aachen Cathedral is the oldest Roman Catholic cathedral in all of northern europe,
dating back to the middle ages circa 800 A.D,
and the burial place of two Holy Roman Emperors: Charlegmagne, King of the Franks\ Charles the Great \ Charles I \ Imperor Augustus, and also Otto III.

One can not place enough importance upon the association of this symbol with the greatest power structure the human world has ever known, the Roman Catholic Church, Germanic Royal Lineage, and the Holy Roman Empire itself.

Here we see it yet again, eye, pyramid, and all, in
the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen, 1789
the resultant product of the oh-so-often alleged illuminist-led French Revolution


This is the front facade of Bracken House in London:

The Black Sun is the MOST sacred of occult illuminist symbols.
It is referenced in Revelations 6:12, and probably over a dozen other times in various books of the bible,
in association with the 2nd coming of christ.
To the occult elite it is the ultimate symbol of ultimate change. (hope and change?)
The Bracken House is named after , Bernard Bracken, the once chairman of the Elite's most vaunted newspaper, The Financial Times [of London]. The face in the center is Bracken's close friend, and certainly a very central elite (illuminist?) figure of the time, Winston Churchill.

The Nazis were deeply interested in the Black Sun. Their version was 3 swastikas together.

wiki on The Black Sun and The Nazis

There is even a modern chapter of the Ordo Templi Orientis in Akron, Oh known as The Black Sun. They perform the gnostic Catholic mass ritual on a daily basis.

Apparently the Merovingians (once again we go back to ancient Germany here, folks, probably THE major power center of ancient the world) wore metal discs representing the black sun.

Here is a Merovingian Sun Disc, although this is inlaid with garnet (which is a deep, dark, red)
which has long been thought to be a "power stone", is considered to have healing properties, and was used in Noah's lantern to guide the Arc in the bible:


Since we just touched on Nazis, the Black Sun, and The Triple Swastika\Black Sun emblem,
we must now move briefly over to another symbol, the Swastika

The Swastika is an ancient symbol with roots in many cultures. It is known as a "Bent Cross" and also as "THE SUN WHEEL". Its meaning has varied, but a continuous thread, with roots in Hinduism and Judaism both (as well as many other cultures, just search that wiki page for "sun"), is AS A SYMBOL OF THE SUN.
In fact, we find this example, from Wikipedia itself, of an 18th Century Kabbalistic work written by a Rabbi, of a swastika composed of hebrew letters, surrounded by a disc, and rays of aramaic text that compose a poem about THE SUN:


We could go on at length about the Swastika, the Nazis, their obsession with the Occult, the implications, and the nature of this once-and-often sun symbol, but we must move forward...

... and back to Egypt once more, for continuity\circularity:
Worship of Aten\Aton, the "briefly" celebrated Sun Disc God of Egypt


Now that some groundwork has been laid, some familiarity accquired, lets go hard and heavy in to modern sun symbolism. We've seen that this symbolism traces back to major importance in the time of the Egyptian kingdoms, prominence in Holy Rome, and we've seen that it has been "lifted" and given great importance as well by Masons and "illuminists" both.

MODERN SUN SYMBOLS

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Hotels & Motels, Real Estate Being Second Only To Banking Itself, and Maybe Oil.
(and we will get to BOTH banking and oil, don't worry)











Can't tell if this is really a sun symbol?

Here it is plain as day (har har):


Besides Comfort, and Clarion,
Choice Hotels International owns all of the following,
count the number of sun symbols (6 out of 10? 1 triangle, and one ambiguous circle):


But Econolodge has a new logo, that makes 7 out of 10.
Sun\Eye Symbol:


Here is one that is tricky:


We didn't talk about this symbol, and it is stylized to boot, but it is the same thing as the
Military Intelligence Insignia


which, according to the Army's own website (source at bottom of page):
"The Sun, composed of four straight and four wavy alternating rays, is the symbol of Helios who, as God of the Sun, could see and hear everything. The four straight rays of the Sun symbol also allude to the four points of the compass and the worldwide mission of the Military Intelligence Branch..."

Since we are already on the subject of Military Intelligence, and we have already shown the US Military ADMITS to using sun symbolism for their insignia, lets take a quick detour, and look at the most prestigious intelligence organization in the world, The Queen's
MI5

AN EYE ATOP A PYRAMID.
Shocker!


Out of Dubai, here is one of the worlds largest real estate companies with hugely diverse operations,
not particularly well known, unless you have lots of money though, as they are a luxury brand:



And here are two more, for the road:

Howard Johnson, Sun rising over Pyramid


Microtel, Sun rising over Pyramid


Anyway,
as you can see the Hotel world is full of sun symbolism.
I've passed exits on the highway where there were 8 hotels, and ALL of them contained sun symbols.

Lets move on to OIL.
The Oil world is full of all sorts of symbols that have occult meaning.

Standing out at the top, is Exxon with it's Double-Cross, or Cross of Lorraine.

This Cross of Lorraine in the Exxon logo is authentic,
down to the measurable length of the lower "cross" being longer than the top.

It is the "original coss"
interesting use of Cross of Lorraine

Wikipedia itself will give you the direct link between this Cross, The Knights Templar and Alchemy. And remember that Masonry is connected to BOTH Alchemy and The Knights Templar.
Wiki on The Cross of Lorraine
And don't forget, THE CROSS IS A SUN SYMBOL ITSELF. And with its mention (the Catholic Cross, with its circle in the middle, being the most obvious sun image of all crosses), we again reference The Roman Catholic Church. And mentioning Exxon, we must mention the Rockefeller family, of which Exxon is born.

Anyhow, trying not to get too mired down in commentary or deep analysis, lets move on.

How about Shell?

As of the 1950's, Shell began using clear sun symbol imagery in their logos:

Note that in the 50's and 60's this symbol was seemingly its own distinct "symbol within a symbol" at the base of the "shell", and by the 70's the ENTIRE shell (save for two inverted PYRAMIDS in the lower corners) had become a solitary SUN SYMBOL.

Who are the big 4 in Oil these days?
Exxon, Shell, and ...

BP logo as of 2001

If you want to argue that this is just "energy", and NOT a sun symbol,
then you are free to "see the stars, and still not see the light", in the words of the Eagles. har har.
But here is something interesting:
The logo is made up of 4 different 18-pointed stars --> 4 x 18 = 72
According to the Kabbalah, there are 72 names of God.

Everything "by the numbers" for the occult elite, right?

Note that the 4th giant gas company is Texaco, with it's 5 pointed star.
The most repeatedly occuring symbol in the entire occult world.

This is Exxon's Little Buddy, Mobil

It doesn't take too much imagination in the present context, to theorize what that big red "O" might be.

But here is one that couldn't be easier:
Sunoco doesn't even need a sun logo. Its in the name. Until 1998 it was known as
Sun Co. or Sun Oil Co.


Worth a mention, even though it is not a sun symbol,
is Chevron, the chevron being the Masonic "double ashlar" or "double square",
representing the duality of order and chaos both.
Chevron is an old Standard Oil (read: Rockefeller) company,
former employer of Condoleeza Rice, and many more.
The Chevron can be found all over American culture, from the Military, to the Seal of the Treasury and beyond.

Citgo, while again not a sun logo, per se, is certainly a Pyramid, which we have seen can have a direct reference back to much of the same.

Anyhow, moving on, lets hit up a bank or three:

How about the most braindead of conclusions first:

Interestingly, SunTrust is the part child of The Trust Company of Georgia, which did the IPO for Coca-Cola a long time ago. Coke has its own long and well documented connection to the CIA, bulldog agency of the occult elite. SunTrust has $170 Billion in assets or more, as of 2008. SunTrust failed at a hostile bid to takeover First Union (which became Wachovia) back in the 1990's, just like Citi (even with government backing) failed to accquire it last year.

This one is pretty obvious, with its CLEAR and LONG history of ties to the tip top of the elite, the Rockefellers, the Federal Reserve, and beyond:

Citigroup is the largest banking conglomorate in the world by retail service centers owned and also by net revenue, and is a major primary US Bonds broker. It is the recipient of untold billions in bailout money.
The red half circle (sun symbol) replaces the Red Umbrella of the Travelers Group logo (which it merged with and accquired in 1998's largest bank merger of all time).

Of paticular note should be
Mitsubishi UFJ Bank Holding Corp's Logo:

Again, one of the oldest symbols of the sun we have on record.
Mitsubishi UFJ is the world's largest bank holding company (it sometimes slides to #2), holding OVER A TRILLION DOLLARS on deposit, and is by far the largest portion of Mitsubishi, the parent company, which itself has some interesting connections\links, and their logo also forms a pyramid\triangle.

Another very important Bank to look at is JP Morgan Chase, the godfather of all international banks, JP Morgan and Chase Manhattan merged earlier last century, forming a monolith among banks. The House of Morgan was possibly the premier banking house of the 20th century, falling out of favor during the time of FDR (he tried to get rid of this pervasive bankster influence in government, but succeeded only at turning over the reins more to the Rockefellers and their crew rather than the Morgans) but the name and legacy remain, and so does the logo... A SWASTIKA, or SUN WHEEL

Here is one of several sources noting the connections between the House of Morgan and the Nazi regime. It is well documented that JP Morgan was complicit in Nazi funding. For the record, BOTH JP Morgan & Co. (the bank) and Chase Manhattan Bank (the Rockefeller bank, which at the time was NOT merged with JP Morgan & Co.) were heavily involved with the transfer of funds to the 3rd Reich. JP Morgan Chase is worth more than 2 TRILLION dollars in assets, has the largest market cap\deposit base in America, and is #1 of the "Big 4" banks in the United States.

This is Macqauire Bank's Logo

The oldest of sun symbols we have, dating again back to The Egyptian Symbol of Ra above.
It is representative both of the Sun, and of The Eye of Ra (both being, to the layman, one and the same).
Mcquaire Bank is Australia's "preeminent" (per wiki) investment bank, the largest player in australian corporate mergers\acquisitions, their largest capital raising firm, and holder of $220billion AUD in assets.

Here is another no-brainer:

SunCorp is Australia's 5th largest bank, and 2nd largest general insurance group.
Formed by merger in 1996, it sold all of its credit card accounts to Citigroup last year.
The logo looks to contain not only the explicit sun symbol, but also a red "eye" (of Ra?)

This one is fantastic!

Keystart is actually an Australian Government Home Mortgage Agency\Bank
(sort of akin to the US HUD Authority and FannieMay)
The Logo is a very clear pyramid and rising sun.
"Keystart" is actually itself a very clever play on words, concealing "Keystar"
which is a reference to The Key of Solomon the many stars in that book, and its direct connection to Freemasonry which is mildly obsessed with Solomon's Temple.

From the ancient book, The Key of Solomon:



Jumping from banks to their sisters, Investment Firms, we have, just like Keystart:
Fidelity Investments Logo


Another Sun and Pyramid in Banking:


Yet another sun and pyramid:


One of Asia's largest banks (Over-Sea Chinese Banking Corporation) Sun-Target and Sun Rays Logo:


The TCF Logo has both an actual sun in the left margin, and a stylized sun "band" around the font:


I can't even find this Company or Logo anymore, as it looks like Union Fidelity was bought out,
but if you look in the lower left corner, Union Fidelity,
yet another bank with a rising sun as a logo.

And don't forget the credit card companies (which are almost as bad as the banks):
Discover is CLEARLY a sun image, and Mastercard may be as well:


At this point we may as well move on. Other logos (like Capital One, BOK, or Credit Europe Bank) start getting so stylized that the intended message may lose it's effect (reader skepticism may reach critical mass).

Before we switch, lets look at one last bank, just because of the namesake:

Zions Bank logo, showing a floor grid, and sun rays out the top:


So lets hit up the media, entertainment, and more general business, remembering we already covered Target & Wal-Mart.


The Preeminent Cable Company, ultra-establishment mega-merger conglomorate, TimeWarner Cable
CLEARLY the All Seeing Eye of Horus\Ra

It is VERY important to understand that this IS The Eye Of Ra.
The suggestion that, "of course a cable company would have an eye logo", loses some of its initial sensibility when one understands that this IS the Eye of Ra, not just "an eye".
This is a sun symbol.
Period.

This is the logo for CBS:

While it may not fit the traits of the explicit eye of ra as the Time Warner Cable logo does,
it certainly meets the requirements of the SYMBOL OF RA as noted far above.
CIRCLE & DOT.
The old TV ad logo above places the CBS eye over a backdrop of clouds,
helping to substantiate the All Seeing Eye of Ra \ Sun connection.
CBS is the oldest and most prestigous broadcast network,
and has long been used an a implement of control by the ruling occult elite.
Most notable (to me) would be CBS's role in America's perception of the JFK assassination,
and of their long time employment of Admitted World Federalist, Walter Cronkite (check out the end where he gets an homage from Hillary Clinton).

This is the Lucas Arts logo:


Note that the arc with rays is clear sun symbolism,
and the hands and head of the man, along with the sun arch, make up an EYE,
and the rays make the lashes.
What a coincidence!

Here is the company that merged with Time-Warner (also of Eye of Ra infamy):

An eye in a pyramid. Hmm.

This is Trion World Network's logo, Sun and Pyramid, straight up:

This is a videogame and content provider company, with very high ambitions:
aiming "to leverage all the inherent capabilities of broadband, provide original entertainment, and define the future of media in the global broadband era". The company is the brainchild of Jon Van Caneghem, who founded New World Computing in 1983. For any oldschool gamers, he is responsible for the Might & Magic series (which was awesome when it came out, i remember quite well).

The New World Computing logo is a picture of the sun shining on the earth from space,
with a sword running through the earth:



This is Vodafone, the UK based cellphone company: largest mobile phone company in the world.

They recently ditched the latent "666" in this logo. See the 3 "drops" that could all be "6"s?

Here is Bell Labs' Lucent Technologies Logo:

Again with the red circle. Lots of love for the red circle sun symbol in the corporate world.
Although the sun can certainly be red, the use of the red circle may have obscure alchemical refrences.
Here is a site that shows 3 or 4 red "suns" from Alchemist art.

This is SIIG, Saudi Industrial Investment Group, i found them looking at soundcards on Newegg.
They make lots of technology crap.


This is Creative Labs, probably the preeminent manufacturer of soundcards:

Is that a Pyramid? What is it suggesting? Something? Nothing?

Here is another funny little triangle, in what is probably the largest GPS manufacturer's logo:

It could be nothing. But maybe it isn't?

This is United Technologies, seperated sister company of Boeing.
It is a "high-technology", aerospace and defense firm.
Among other things it has produced the Black Hawk helicopter.


Here is a brand that is everywhere,
the worlds LARGEST producer of fruits and vegetables,
and anyone with a cursory knowledge of the 20th century should understand Dole's prominence in exploitation of indigenous peoples, and of using the CIA or paramilitary troops to maintain control of its resources.


This is the Lays logo:

Once a huge name in snack food itself, Lays actually merged with Pepsi Co. in 1965.

Pepsi Co. is itself one of a large list of companies that changed its logo to something resembling a sun symbol (like shell) in the 1950's:

Red Sun Rising Over The Ocean Waves?


This is 7Up in 1947:
no dot
Looks like once in 37 it was a red circle (scroll his photos to see more logos)

And this is 7up now:
(Pepsi bought, and owns 7up):

Red sun?


Pepsi has several historically documented ties to the CIA as well.
Coca-Cola, Pepsi, The CIA, and The Courts
It also had direct connections to Richard Nixon.
Here is Nixon IN Dallas with the president of Pepsi, the day before Kennedy was killed there.

and Coca-Cola, again,
Red Sun?


Largest HMO, and 5th largest Private Company In America:


This is ACN, or American Communications Network,
it is the largest provider of direct-sales telecommunications services in the world:


Last but not least,
HERE IS BARACK OBAMA'S CAMPAIGN LOGO:


This is the logo for Lucis Trust, originally headquartered at 666 United Nations Plaza. It is a publishing company of esoteric\occultist\illuminist Alice Bailey, herself a disciple of fabled Theosophist, Madame Blavatsky. Lucis Trust actually has a small temple in the United Nations Building, and is an officialy recognized entity OF the united nations, having been granted "consultative status", and thereby having influence over several actual UN boards. It was originaly named The Lucifer Trust.

Lucis Trust has a cornocopia of connections to a a whose-who of the super-elite, including having their Temple of Understanding funded by John D Rockefeller IV (1962 Newspaper Source.
Lucis Trust, Alice Bailey, World Goodwill and the False Light of the World
Barack Obama & Lucis Trust: "Let the Future Stand Revealed"
open your mind.

Shew.
I have to hang it up for today.
Spent WAY too long doing this on a fine sunday, but it is SUNday, afterall.
Do your OWN homework.
Draw your OWN conclusions.
I'm just holding up "points of light" for scrutiny.

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APPENDED FROM POST ON 3RD PAGE:
Here is The Information Awareness Office,
a subgroup of The Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA),
itself an agency of the United States Department of Defense:


Here is CAT or Caterpillar Inc. ,
the worlds largest construction equipment manufacturer, 50 on Fortune 500 List, $30 Billion in Assets
yellow pyramid (spelling it out for the obtuse):


INSIDE OF A MASONIC LODGE:

larger photo for the blind

Extremely old "Master Mason" Apron presented to high level Freemasons:


Here is a special "payment" coin for "Mark Masons":

source page

Masonic Lodge Sign Displaying the Cross Of Lorraine, for those doubting the Exxon logo connection:

Also note the SKULL & BONES, another very important symbol of high level masonry.

Another Masonic Master Mason's Apron, PYRAMID WITH SUN RAYS, CIRCLE AND DOT:


Another Apron, EYE IN PYRAMID:


Sun with Black Sun in the Center of a Zodiac inside a Masonic Lodge,
Remember the Sun and Zodiac on Bracken House?


From a Masonic Degree Chart, RISING SUN OVER PYRAMID in the center:


And finally, for today, the symbol of the 33rd Degree of Freemasonry:

Commy

ok. there's a ton of info above...



i believe that corporations are like any institution, governments- churches whatever...where inevitably power corrupts.


the goal through the past few centuries seems to be profit and control. they have enough influence to get even the US mobilized into opening up markets for them through force...resources=profit=power.

what are you suggesting? that they serve a sun god or have some hidden board of directors that decides all of it?


even if that is the case, we know what they are doing.


some of these corporations make more money than Greece. the country. they are in the top 20 world list of institutions, including governments. Wall mart makes more money than most countries on the planet.

They have considerable power, there's no denying that.


but what are you suggesting?


We can see what they've done for the last century-none of it is good. from dumping toxic waste into the ocean to dumping oil into the jungles to influencing governments -to get minimum wage down, to raise prices on water in poor areas, to all sorts of terrible practices. And according to the UN 11-13 million people die every year in this fucked up world they've had a hand in creating...so we can be sure their motives are purely selfish.


But where does that leave us? right where i've been all along.

capitalism has a hand in all of this, which i believe they've had a hand in implementing in the first place. Ever wonder WHY vietnam was even important in the first place? or WHY venezuela is considered a threat? Or Cuba? or why the Branch Davidians were taken out with violence at home? or why Ruby Ridge ok'd a sniper to fire on an unarmed mother holding a baby?

all of these have a one thing in common. Each scenario presents a situation that is an alternative to capitalism. A way of life that transcends the idea that personal gain and selfishness and greed are the best way to run a society/home/community.

ANY scenario that provides an alternative to capitalism is removed, usually with violence, to make set an example.


Which gets us back to the real problem in all of this....institutions. Power corrupts, every time, with very few exceptions. Its why we need to democratize institutions. or do away with them altogether. we supposedly have a democracy regarding our government, and that hasn't worked out to well for most of the world. and corporate influence remains strong.


Anarchy is the solution. end power. give it all to the people. we can do what politicians and CEO's and managers have been doing for centuries-which usually involves them looking out for their own positions of power.

Fuck all that. end political corruption. end corporate greed. end the idea that we are competing against one another.


The answer is in anarchy. or libertarianism if you prefer. and in socialism. or collectivism. end the motivation for shit like this in the first place, or the environment where these secret societies are allowed to flourish, and chances are you eliminate their symptoms. that's a solution.

jlew24asu

driftin, can you give me the cliff notes version. what should I be concerned about this time?

commy, anarchy is not the solution.

VINNY GOOMBA

I will not be able to listen to No Code the same way ever again...

ajedigecko

and look at the riot act skull.....it has a crown(sun rising)above two eyes. thus proving that pj are a piece of the global illuminati.

if you think i am crazy.....ed even has a circle sticker on a guitar.

ledvedderman

....wow

jlew24asu

ledvedderman wrote:

....wow

thats right, just put your head in the sand!

ledvedderman

As someone that has taken some marketing and advertising classes...I must have been sick the day they were talking about using the sun and circles for these reasons. I guess I was just wrongly under the impression that it is because yellow=bright which gets a possible customers attentio.and the sun is...well, the fucking sun. Your explanation makes much more sense though

DriftingByTheStorm

.

ajedigecko

i attribute the linear commonalities of the symbols to.............................timeless design. similiar to, denim jeans, they will never go out of style and look good, regardless of who is wearing them.

i guarantee if ra would have wore denim jeans.............george washington would have been wearing them while crossing the potomac.

regardless...........i do like the topics you bring to discuss.

Restless Soul

I'm not knocking what you're saying, Drifting, but to be honest, a lot of this can be considered OTT.

A sun rising over a roof in a hotel logo doesn't necessarily mean it's referring to a pyramid - it's probably referring to the hotel roof!

And the 6s in Vodafone? I really don't think so. I think the 6s refer to "quotation" marks as in for speech. (Like when people talk on the phone.)

If there is some element of ancient conspiracy (?) in all these logos then why don't we know more about it? Especially as it's so widespread. I'm sure there are graphic designers everywhere that would be spilling the beans about their designs if they had secret illuminati connections (or whatever).

Anyway, I'm not really sure what your point is, tbh.

Sludge Factory

I, for one, enjoyed this post.

DriftingByTheStorm

Restless Soul wrote:

I'm not knocking what you're saying, Drifting, but to be honest, a lot of this can be considered OTT.

A sun rising over a roof in a hotel logo doesn't necessarily mean it's referring to a pyramid - it's probably referring to the hotel roof!

And the 6s in Vodafone? I really don't think so. I think the 6s refer to "quotation" marks as in for speech. (Like when people talk on the phone.)

If there is some element of ancient conspiracy (?) in all these logos then why don't we know more about it? Especially as it's so widespread. I'm sure there are graphic designers everywhere that would be spilling the beans about their designs if they had secret illuminati connections (or whatever).

Anyway, I'm not really sure what your point is, tbh.

There is "more information" on this ALL OVER THE PLACE.
With the advent of the web, thousands of websites have sprung up dealing with various -- and often deeply misled -- aspects of "this thing"; everything from Babylon, 666, & The Apocalypse, to Planet Nibiru and 20112, down on to more "legitimate" theories about ruling bloodlines, ancient power, secret societies, and the "New World Order". The only limit to the amount of information you can find on this stuff, is the amount of time you have to spend on it. I have such a backlog of interesting bookmarks on various related subjects that i will probably NEVER read most of it. Now, with google books and scribd, you can now find free online a great many multi-hundred page treatise on these subjects, from Masonic symbolism (some of it straight from the source) and Occult ideology, to Illuminist\Masonic legend, to the nature of Skull and Bones, and even to more modern accounts of the Anglo-American etsablishment.

Those books are just a smattering of some of the "great" works.
You can find endless regurgitations, alternative takes, and far out derivations based on this stuff.
To ask why there "isn't more out there" is to admit to not having looked very hard.

These people counted on two things (rightly or wrongly)
a. the relative self-maintained igorance of your everyday person
b. the relative control over methods of information distribution
[check out Lessig's Free Culture for more information on copywrights, common law, information monopolies, the free dissemenation of culture and knowledge in "enlightened" British tradition , and the hindered progress of man by ancient rulers]

These days, depending on how you see "this thing" and what you believe to be "the plan",
"they" are either up shit creek, fighting a losing battle against the turning tide of a newly empowered humanity (the internets are awesomez), or have intended all along to use the groundswell of "awakening" as a catalyst to ferment their very own revolution and new order. In other words, maybe finding out is part of the plan? All you can do is be a sponge. I can't tell you the answers, only show you the questions. Questions man has been dealing with as a social animal for ages. Who holds the power, how do they keep it, and what are their aims & beliefs?

yahamita

Brilliant! Thanks for getting the word out. People just think I am some sort of end times freak, but thank goodness there are others out there who understand and know where I am coming from.
Keep up the great posts. Alot of this info can be found at
www.zeitgeistmovie.com
for those who need to watch something instead of reading long posts...
Peace..

DriftingByTheStorm

yahamita wrote:

Brilliant! Thanks for getting the word out. People just think I am some sort of end times freak, but thank goodness there are others out there who understand and know where I am coming from.
Keep up the great posts. Alot of this info can be found at
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com
for those who need to watch something instead of reading long posts...
Peace..

No problem!
Just trying to help inform people, while i learn myself.
Honestly folks, this is as much for me as for you, as the process of posting helps me clarify my own thought process.

I UPDATED THE OP with the additon of information on THE SWASTIKA and JP MORGAN CHASE, along with a few extra technology companies at the bottom.

I have a few more things to add tonight, and this post will probably be as long as it will get.

dunkman

ajedigecko wrote:

i attribute the linear commonalities of the symbols to.............................timeless design.

yep... drifting ignored this on his last thread...

having been a logo designer and i still involved in graphic design.. i just want to say that its purely out of laziness that the logos look the same.

we beg, borrow and steal... its been done since the conception of marketing and will never change..

drfiting had it in his head that tv companies are evil because they use the EYE as part of their logo... its basically because we use out eyes to watch the TV but he thought otherwise...

like electrical companies... their logos usually have some form of electrical symobology in their ident... just as boating comanies have boats or oceans... just as airplane companies have their logos as tailfins...

its creating a brand identity... its about product recognition... if i was asked by a gardening company to create a new branding, i'd use leafs, sun, flowers, etc.. thats because it matches the products that they are marketing..

Jimmydean55

Driftin... I'm not trying to be a dick here, but I honestly have to ask. Do you have a job?

DriftingByTheStorm

dunkman,

i'm not ignoring it. if i seem to be, its simply because a lengthy retort hardly seems worthy to me, but i'll give it a quick go.

i'm all for archetypal symbols, commonality of culture based on similarity of fundamental experience, the perplexing nature of the duality between chaos and order, and the cache-all of collective consciousness.

I will acknowledge that freely, and any day. it accounts for a lot.
it has also been TAKEN in to account for AGES by the brightest in the learned class of any half developed society.

Much of what i am writing about is real.
You, or I, or most of us here may not know a great deal about it, because that is the very meaning of "the occult".

In the simplest sense one can think of esoterica and exoterica just as what they are: schools of thought, or vehicles. To borrow from Budhism, one could consider these like the greater vehicle, and the lesser vehicle respectively.

The populus is the domain of exoterica: popular "knowledge", facts that aren't necessarily untrue, as they are held in general acceptance, and yet this teaching and learning is based on a limited spectrum of the available knowledge and is therefore limited in its true "understanding".

The elite of any age, those born in to the nobility of a more structured order, or those of special talent and/or birth in a more "free" society, are natural candidates for a more select school of thinking (the greater vehicle). These ideas may be no more or less valid than those generally accepted by the greater populus, but they may be radically different in principle, as they may be based on a "deeper" understanding of commonly held beliefs. Thus is the case with esoterica.

Clearing up this basic technical divide between bodies of knowledge, one can also come to understand that the body of knowledge (or gnosis, if you will) held in secret by the privelaged class serves as a potential to create a further imbalance of power between them and the masses. This is partly because of the conflux of situations that brought them to the esoteric realm, partly because of the esoteric knowledge itself, and partly self fufiling prophecy created through the influence of the above-outlined forces that we both seem to agree upon.

I can't really hold an open and honest debate with you or anyone on this subject, since the very nature of the information we seek to discuss is held in private, over long periods of time, by mostly secret groups.

I have hardly read enough on the subject (and it is a VAST subject) to truly comprehend ANYthing.
However, i can vouch for having read through many of the degrees of the OTO (as they are listed near the end of Occult Theocracy; description of OTO starting pg571, degrees outlined in manifesto starting pg671), and it reads exactly like what it is, a secret government!

Now from my limited understanding, the appendages of this "government" (or "order") are outlined as "degrees" and "steps", and while the progression is linear, some have actual "degree" numbers while others are mere "steps". url=http://www.geocities.com/nu_isis/deg_syn.html]see here[/url

The 5th Degree is Sovereign Prince of Rose Croix, the next "step" is Member of the Senate of Knight Hermetic. The 7th Degree is Very Illustrious Sovereign Grand Inspector General, and the next step is Member of the Supreme Grand Council.

This goes on and on, of course, until you get to the top. However these degrees and steps should not be overlooked as mere titles of tradition. These degrees function just as they sound. A "Member of the Senate" sits upon a body, and is privy to its knowledge, and to the decisions it makes. It has discretion and influence upon certain other degrees and steps of the order, as do certain other degrees and steps have their influence and control upon and over it. The "Very Illustrious Sovereign Grand Inspector General" IS just that. He is a sovereign in the decisions he makes with that "step", and he is responsible for taking note of the nature of the activities and the character of the agents of certain other degrees and steps, and he is responsible for reporting this information back to one or more other degrees or steps within the order.

In this way, checks and balances appear to be imposed within the order. In fact, and while i do not see this now i do believe it was in the secton about the OTO in which i was reading this, there is a step just below the top degree of which the member is entrusted with the duty of revolution. He is instructed specifically such that he must challenge the wills and wants of the highest degree, even if he should so agree with that man. Thus it is from his duty to directly oppose the actions of the highest degree that a sort of balance is brought to the order. At least, this is what i was reading.

Any how,
i hope just even a cursory, and ill informed, to be honest, run down of the workings of one of these groups would help a person to see just what it is we are discussing here. These are secret governments, through and through. Now what is their charge, and what is their jurisdiction? THAT is a good question, but it seems to me, and with titles and duties like those listed above, that the nature of their work is very serious indeed.

This is not to make one paranoid or to spread fear, only to cast light on what once was a subject of the shadows. Some of these books are volumes whose original pressings bore explicit warning that the contents was for the exclusive eyes of initiates only, ie. they were secrets.



PS-
PEANUT GALLERY: "Driftin... I'm not trying to be a dick here, but I honestly have to ask. Do you have a job?"
Yes, i'm self employed, and also picking up some catering work with my buddy's company (i never turn down easy money). and i volunteer on a farm to feed poor people sometimes too. i have a life. i make the most of it.
thanks. Got my tix for Chicago, any one else? Friend said i need to buy Toronto too, "or else". Sigh.

DriftingByTheStorm

dunkman wrote:

ajedigecko wrote:

i attribute the linear commonalities of the symbols to.............................timeless design.

yep... drifting ignored this on his last thread...

having been a logo designer and i still involved in graphic design.. i just want to say that its purely out of laziness that the logos look the same.

we beg, borrow and steal... its been done since the conception of marketing and will never change..

drfiting had it in his head that tv companies are evil because they use the EYE as part of their logo... its basically because we use out eyes to watch the TV but he thought otherwise...

like electrical companies... their logos usually have some form of electrical symobology in their ident... just as boating comanies have boats or oceans... just as airplane companies have their logos as tailfins...

its creating a brand identity... its about product recognition... if i was asked by a gardening company to create a new branding, i'd use leafs, sun, flowers, etc.. thats because it matches the products that they are marketing..

so a company that sells gas and has the name "SHELL" should turn their logo in to a SUN?
Oh i know, i know, the sun is energy!
Yep. And 8 out of 10 hotels should have suns for logos, because people only go to hotels in the sun!
Yep! And Walmart should have a sun in their logo because ...
yep!
And a bunch of MASSIVE banks should have a sun in their logo because ...
yep!

And the fact that all these things are so circular just goes to show the massive commanality of human experience.
Yep.

Hey,
i've been acknowledging your points repeatedly,
if not half jokingly to point out that your assertion that there is NEVER any intended meaning behind a symbol is just as silly as the (not asserted here) notion that EVERY case of a symbol begs the same meaning.

Here is an old book (1919) on gematria in the greek texts of the bible, just reading some of that should be enough to challenge the notion that symbols can't and don't ever have intended hidden meanings. The very foundation of western culture (the bible) is littered with instances of a word that is convertable in to a numberor numbers of significant meaning. To those with the scholastic ability to "translate" this knowledge and the cultural ideas necessary to grasp it, there is a whole world of "occult" information to be found there. Given that this notion runs back to near the dawn of man itself, what is there to think that those who profess such great interest in the subject today are not still using such forms of communication?

Is it not only logical to assume?

dunkman

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

dunkman,

i'm not ignoring it. if i seem to be, its simply because a lengthy retort hardly seems worthy to me, but i'll give it a quick go.

i'm all for archetypal symbols, commonality of culture based on similarity of fundamental experience, the perplexing nature of the duality between chaos and order, and the cache-all of collective consciousness.

I will acknowledge that freely, and any day. it accounts for a lot.
it has also been TAKEN in to account for AGES by the brightest in the learned class of any half developed society.

Much of what i am writing about is real.
You, or I, or most of us here may not know a great deal about it, because that is the very meaning of "the occult".

In the simplest sense one can think of esoterica and exoterica just as what they are: schools of thought, or vehicles. To borrow from Budhism, one could consider these like the greater vehicle, and the lesser vehicle respectively.

The populus is the domain of exoterica: popular "knowledge", facts that aren't necessarily untrue, as they are held in general acceptance, and yet this teaching and learning is based on a limited spectrum of the available knowledge and is therefore limited in its true "understanding".

The elite of any age, those born in to the nobility of a more structured order, or those of special talent and/or birth in a more "free" society, are natural candidates for a more select school of thinking (the greater vehicle). These ideas may be no more or less valid than those generally accepted by the greater populus, but they may be radically different in principle, as they may be based on a "deeper" understanding of commonly held beliefs. Thus is the case with esoterica.

Clearing up this basic technical divide between bodies of knowledge, one can also come to understand that the body of knowledge (or gnosis, if you will) held in secret by the privelaged class serves as a potential to create a further imbalance of power between them and the masses. This is partly because of the conflux of situations that brought them to the esoteric realm, partly because of the esoteric knowledge itself, and partly self fufiling prophecy created through the influence of the above-outlined forces that we both seem to agree upon.

I can't really hold an open and honest debate with you or anyone on this subject, since the very nature of the information we seek to discuss is held in private, over long periods of time, by mostly secret groups.

I have hardly read enough on the subject (and it is a VAST subject) to truly comprehend ANYthing.
However, i can vouch for having read through many of the degrees of the OTO (as they are listed near the end of Occult Theocracy; description of OTO starting pg571, degrees outlined in manifesto starting pg671), and it reads exactly like what it is, a secret government!

Now from my limited understanding, the appendages of this "government" (or "order") are outlined as "degrees" and "steps", and while the progression is linear, some have actual "degree" numbers while others are mere "steps". url=http://www.geocities.com/nu_isis/deg_syn.html]see here[/url

The 5th Degree is Sovereign Prince of Rose Croix, the next "step" is Member of the Senate of Knight Hermetic. The 7th Degree is Very Illustrious Sovereign Grand Inspector General, and the next step is Member of the Supreme Grand Council.

This goes on and on, of course, until you get to the top. However these degrees and steps should not be overlooked as mere titles of tradition. These degrees function just as they sound. A "Member of the Senate" sits upon a body, and is privy to its knowledge, and to the decisions it makes. It has discretion and influence upon certain other degrees and steps of the order, as do certain other degrees and steps have their influence and control upon and over it. The "Very Illustrious Sovereign Grand Inspector General" IS just that. He is a sovereign in the decisions he makes with that "step", and he is responsible for taking note of the nature of the activities and the character of the agents of certain other degrees and steps, and he is responsible for reporting this information back to one or more other degrees or steps within the order.

In this way, checks and balances appear to be imposed within the order. In fact, and while i do not see this now i do believe it was in the secton about the OTO in which i was reading this, there is a step just below the top degree of which the member is entrusted with the duty of revolution. He is instructed specifically such that he must challenge the wills and wants of the highest degree, even if he should so agree with that man. Thus it is from his duty to directly oppose the actions of the highest degree that a sort of balance is brought to the order. At least, this is what i was reading.

Any how,
i hope just even a cursory, and ill informed, to be honest, run down of the workings of one of these groups would help a person to see just what it is we are discussing here. These are secret governments, through and through. Now what is their charge, and what is their jurisdiction? THAT is a good question, but it seems to me, and with titles and duties like those listed above, that the nature of their work is very serious indeed.

This is not to make one paranoid or to spread fear, only to cast light on what once was a subject of the shadows. Some of these books are volumes whose original pressings bore explicit warning that the contents was for the exclusive eyes of initiates only, ie. they were secrets.

look.. i read all that but if you search for something hard enough you'll find it... you're searching for this occult business in the logos of companies... it's nonsense i'm afraid.

The Mobil logo and Chase were created by Ivan Chermayeff and Thomas Geismar... very famous logo and brand identity producers... you should read about how they come up with the logos... very informative.

Their logo for Mobil, in a typeface they designed for the corporation, is based on the circle and cylinder motif of filling stations and other architectural elements of the corporate program that were established by the late architect Eliot Noyes. Chermayeff and Geismar have reinforced that motif by singling out the circle in the corporate name and coloring it red. It is a surprising element, but on fundamentally consistent with the overall design program of circles.

Among their techniques of surprise is a device they call "expressive typography" in which type is placed to show—literally—the message or the form of the subject. They have printed the word "dead" with the final "d" turned at a 90° angle, fallen down to reinforce the meaning of the word. This is repetition in two languages, both words and pictures.

Chermayeff & Geismar developed a more modern scheme. ''The idea of the red 'o' came about partly to reinforce a design concept to use circular canopies, circular pumps, circular display elements, et cetera, for a distinctive look,'' continued Mr. Geismar, who designed an entire Mobil alphabet from which the word is formed. ''The logo also served to help people pronounce the name correctly -- MO-bul, not mo-BEAL -- and, of course, it added a single memorable and distinctive element to an otherwise very simple lettering style.'' The recognition value of the flying red horse was understood, however, and a streamlined version of it has a prominent place on service station buildings.

this is the same for all of the logos you've mentioned... the company itself doesnt normally dictate the idea of a new brand identity... its normally a process whereby the designer will produce several variants of a theme and allow the company to choose its favey-wavey... the concepts behind each design will be put forward in the design portfolio... to try and suggest that all graphic designers/logo designers are somehow occultists seems ridiculous to me i'm afraid..

the earth, stars, sun, etc will ALWAYS be used for logos and idents... they represent energy, regrowth, power, recognition, etc... all the kinda shit you get taught in 1st year of design school.... so a potato snack company uses a sun for its logo? big deal... the potato needs the sun to grow... its a maleable iconic symbol... ergo it gets used by the company to symbolise growth, life, potatoes growing...

its like the Bible Code... you look long and hard enough you'll come up with a theory... but company logos?


i used to work with the guy who created this>

http://www.scottish-building.co.uk/User ... 20logo.jpg


its circular... but its a thistle... not a sun... just like Pepsi is a bottle lid... not a sun.

redrock

Wow... I'm speechless ***goes back and looks at all her creative work to check out all the hidden meanings, afterall, her grandfather was a freemason so.....***

Of course there is symbolism in logos, etc. Dunk explained it quite nicely and most of the logos you mention can be 'explained' VERY INNOCENTLY - none of this esoteric or very indepth/hidden message/thought you mention.... Very OTT.

jlew24asu

even though I believe Dunk is 100% correct....I'm failing to see the conspiracy presented in all that information. sun and eyes are suppose to be doing what to me exactly? I really dont get it. driftin, it would help if you can sum it up in like a paragraph.

jlew24asu

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

so a company that sells gas and has the name "SHELL" should turn their logo in to a SUN?
Oh i know, i know, the sun is energy!
Yep. And 8 out of 10 hotels should have suns for logos, because people only go to hotels in the sun!
Yep! And Walmart should have a sun in their logo because ...
yep!
And a bunch of MASSIVE banks should have a sun in their logo because ...
yep!

And the fact that all these things are so circular just goes to show the massive commanality of human experience.
Yep.

SO WHAT?!!!?!?!?!?! a sun is sun like a sun. right? or am I missing something. seeing a sun on everything really is making me into an obedient drone?

Byrnzie

Where does Hamburglar fit in all of this? :?

redrock

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

so a company that sells gas and has the name "SHELL" should turn their logo in to a SUN??

It's a stylized shell... not a sun :roll:

Real shell....



Logo shell....

jlew24asu

redrock wrote:

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

so a company that sells gas and has the name "SHELL" should turn their logo in to a SUN??

It's a stylized shell... not a sun :roll:

I see you've fallen under the spell of corporate obedience. they want you to think its a shell. its a trap!

DriftingByTheStorm

jlew24asu wrote:

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

so a company that sells gas and has the name "SHELL" should turn their logo in to a SUN?
Oh i know, i know, the sun is energy!
Yep. And 8 out of 10 hotels should have suns for logos, because people only go to hotels in the sun!
Yep! And Walmart should have a sun in their logo because ...
yep!
And a bunch of MASSIVE banks should have a sun in their logo because ...
yep!

And the fact that all these things are so circular just goes to show the massive commanality of human experience.
Yep.

SO WHAT?!!!?!?!?!?! a sun is sun like a sun. right? or am I missing something. seeing a sun on everything really is making me into an obedient drone?

well,
one assumption would be that secret symbology is used amongst and between participants of the ruling elite in order to more easily communicate ownership. another would be this whole business of an occult elite that belives in the magical properterties of certain symbols that somehow gives them power.

If i had to go with just one theory, i would go with the first though.
The use of symbols that are familiar to eachother allows members to support, buy stock in, and generally promote the business interests of the firms which are "of the brotherhood", so to speak.

Of course, i'm sure it will take all of 5 minutes for someone to tell me that this is a hairbrained way to run a secret group, and SURELY there are easier ways to communicate this stuff.

But like i said, if i had to guess, thats what i would go with, right now.
??? i dunno ???

Dunkman, you are probably right about SOME of these logos.
But you will never convince me that TIme Warner and AOL, who MERGED together, BOTH are sporting DIRECT SYMBOLS OF THE SUN in their logos. I don't mean JUST eyes. Youve got TimeWarner that is CLEARLY the EYE OF RA. See that little curl hanging down and to the right? Thats not JUST an eye. And the AOL logo is an EYE in a Pyramid. What, are you going to tell me it represents an iCam or something?

redrock

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

The use of symbols that are familiar to eachother allows members to support, buy stock in, and generally promote the business interests of the firms which are "of the brotherhood", so to speak.?

I think you may be on to something there.... the sun again.....



Whilst I get your drift and all this symbolism is very interesting indeed, one needs to look into this objectively and not try to read something esoteric, mysterious or even devious into everything.

Sure all the symbols such as the sun, eye, circle, etc. are very important in a lot of ancient cultures/cults/religions, etc. their 'meaning' was perceived very differently then because of the beliefs in those times.

What comes out nowadays in various books (The Da Vinci Code being one of them), is very far fetched.

jlew24asu

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

well,
one assumption would be that secret symbology is used amongst and between participants of the ruling elite in order to more easily communicate ownership. another would be this whole business of an occult elite that belives in the magical properterties of certain symbols that somehow gives them power.

If i had to go with just one theory, i would go with the first though.
The use of symbols that are familiar to eachother allows members to support, buy stock in, and generally promote the business interests of the firms which are "of the brotherhood", so to speak.

again SO WHAT? beyond the so what factor however, I will say you're really stretched deep with this crap.

Restless Soul

I think its very easy to read too much into all this conspiracy lark. There may have been some truth at an ancient level and if there was I'm sure it was very localised, as in contained within one or two societies or organisations, it was probably not as global as you may think.

Nowadays, because the world is so globally interconnected there isn't so much of a need to have secret symbols to spell things out to others. Everything is stolen anyway and used by whoever, so if one company uses the eye and another a pyramid and another a sun doesn't mean that they are communicating secret signals to each other. They probably just copied each other's ideas!

Remember everything has to go through marketing and PR departments too - believe me PR people aren't going to want to get their brand entangled with giving out secret messages etc. The potential for PR disaster would be too huge for them to even consider it!

ajedigecko

Byrnzie wrote:

Where does Hamburglar fit in all of this? :?

easy........when viewed from above, his sombreo resembles the sun and the obivious 666 is on his forehead.

this topic makes me smile.