Teenagers make me sad!

GreenTeaDisease

Heineken Helen wrote:

I agree completely... we have it ALL wrong. Capitalism is not the way to go. 'Stuff' just distracts us from the REAL issues. There is even a big difference in the things you mentioned: attitudes; values & ethics, from when I was a kid. It's just all wrong.

"capitalism" isn't the issue...we'd still live in a capitalist society even if we all consumed far less...capitalism is a type of economic structure, it just means that markets are privatized rather than all provided by a central government as in socialism. What you are saying is that our obsession with CONSUMERISM is the problem. And this I agree with. People are bored, shopping is all they have to do. That energy that is put into shopping needs to be redirected.

Heineken Helen

redrock wrote:

My daughter is just a teenager. She wants to change the world, stop children going hungry/dying for nothing, etc. but she also looks after herself and her loved ones before anything else. She does have high aspirations for herself, but will that change as she becomes more of a teen? I don't know.

You have a responsibility to try and keep it in her though... I never saw much of that at home, wasn't encouraged much so it was kinda disheartening when I had ideas to just hear 'yip, that's nice'. You eventually give up.

Emma, you too are in one of the best positions... maybe not with 7 year olds but you can still inspire them in some ways!

dunkman

Jennytree wrote:

There's better things in the world to worry about.

I think you have a misconception of teenagers these days - not all of them want to fight the world. I'm pretty sure fuck all of them do. There's sex and drugs to be worrying about, fuck fighting the government. Why fight things we know we can't change, no matter how much you delusion yourself, we just can't. I'd rather use my energy to look after myself and my family, instead of trying to get world peace.

well said Jennington... world peace is for hippies.. and hippies wear beige cardigans and smell like Cleopatras fudd...

i look after myself, my family, and i try and live a happy and fun life...

redrock

wash_ wrote:

I've seen our future and it's shocking (although am I dealing with a representative sample?!)

I was just about to ask you where you teach? The schools I worked at (and the ones my daughter went to), the majority of the children were from a decent socio-economic class - various cultures and ethnic groups, but largely what the french would call 'bourgeois' families. That does make a difference in aspirations.

redrock

Heineken Helen wrote:

You have a responsibility to try and keep it in her though...

That's the responsibility of all parents and thus the background of the parents make a huge difference as to how the child behaves and perceives the world.

Heineken Helen

gobrowns19 wrote:

Granted I feel i don't 'have' to be as rebellious as I once did, but it feels good to break those chains all the time, even if it's doing something small and stupid to 'fuck' with normal society like wear shorts in winter or a coat in summer. Anything to make people be like 'wow that kid is weird you're not *supposed* to do that.' Why are you *supposed* to do a lot of things? Some things are understandable, but why am I *supposed* to do some things? I'll do whatever it takes to set my self away from those people who think they are *supposed* to spend every minute at work, buy the biggest house, buy the biggest car, and die.

absolutely! I'll be making a pretty big change in my life this year and some people think I'm nuts and wondering why I want to give up 'everything I have here' and I think 'what is it I REALLY have here?' it's all material stuff! That's not what life's about.... well it's certainly not what my life is about and I refuse to be tied down by what other people think I should be about.

GreenTeaDisease

redrock wrote:

Joke apart, if what the kid sees is auntie at TK Max (17 years old, uneducated and maybe even pregnant) that's what this kid thinks is cool/normal/whatever. They do say education starts at home and if your home is full of couch potato slobs (wayne and waynette spring to mind!), what can one expect from the offspring?

yeah but these kids are just little. once they get older, some of them will realize that being like auntie isn't what they want for themselves. When I was very little, I only knew about traditional "women's" jobs- I wanted to be a secretary like my mum or a nurse. Once you get exposed to more as you get older, that will change for SOME. It takes a lot of open-mindedness to break out. Those will be the lucky kids.

Heineken Helen

wash_ wrote:

I was just about to add to my little speech....

I've seen our future and it's shocking (although am I dealing with a representative sample?!) I think in 10 years time there will be a huge change, government will (seriously) realise the mistakes they've made and people will want to change for the better. The 'future' can't get much worse than what it's set to become.

Despite my negativity on this thread, I actually agree with you. I believe the tide IS turning very very very slightly for the better... how long it's gonna take to come full circle, obviously I can't predict but I hope it doesn't have to get worse before it gets better... although I've a feeling it will.

GreenTeaDisease

dunkman wrote:

i look after myself, my family, and i try and live a happy and fun life...

see dunk, I like you, I don't have any beef...but this attitude isn't being an adult, it is being selfish. You have a lot to offer people outside of your family.

You sound like my parents. Whenever I go to volunteer, they say "what are you doing that for??"

dunkman

Originally Posted by wash_
but when I ask 'what do you want to be when you grow up' and get the response 'shop assistant in TK Max, just like my 17 yr old Auntie'...kinda brings me to a silence. I was a bit shocked!

my daughter is 6 and she wants to grow up to be a teacher... my youngest is 4 and she wants to be Sonic The Hedgehog... (she even wears wee white gloves all day cos thats what Sonic wears)


to be a shop assistant at TK Max when your aged 7 seems quite cool.. . if that was their job aspirations at aged 14 i'd be concerned... but at age 7 they think its like a scene from a Mary-Kate and Ashley film... girls trying on clothes and puttingon make-up.. at age 7 kids shouldnt be asked what they want to be when they grow up anyway.. why make them think about a fucking job... let them play for a while... the responsibilities come later.. we try and age our kids too soon these days...

redrock

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

yeah but these kids are just little. once they get older, some of them will realize that being like auntie isn't what they want for themselves. When I was very little, I only knew about traditional "women's" jobs- I wanted to be a secretary like my mum or a nurse. Once you get exposed to more as you get older, that will change for SOME. It takes a lot of open-mindedness to break out. Those will be the lucky kids.

Absolutely. This is where schools, etc. can help. Obviously it is a lot more difficult for the young person to break through if the support is not there at home. If like HH, all you here is 'that's nice' with nothing else, it's not easy.

Heineken Helen

redrock wrote:

That's the responsibility of all parents and thus the background of the parents make a huge difference as to how the child behaves and perceives the world.

absolutely... although I know many people who found their inspiration elsewhere... a teacher, a family friend, somebody in the community.

wash_

redrock wrote:

I was just about to ask you where you teach? The schools I worked at (and the ones my daughter went to), the majority of the children were from a decent socio-economic class - various cultures and ethnic groups, but largely what the french would call 'bourgeois' families. That does make a difference in aspirations.

I work in low socio economic school. With this comes foreign languages, bad behaviour and laziness. It's hard to have an affect when that's what you're faced with (I exclude children who have English as a second language as their parents have moved to England for a better life and have a decent work ethic).

I do feel that if I worked in a middle class school my opinions would be different. But I still feel thats something is amiss in children these days.

dunkman

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

see dunk, I like you, I don't have any beef...but this attitude isn't being an adult, it is being selfish. You have a lot to offer people outside of your family.

i am selfish... i know that.. and i'm ok with that

redrock

Personally, I think for every crappy teen around, there is a shitload of them with inspiration and drive. Maybe I'm too optimistic, but what I see around me is not that bad at all.

Heineken Helen

redrock wrote:

Absolutely. This is where schools, etc. can help. Obviously it is a lot more difficult for the young person to break through if the support is not there at home. If like HH, all you here is 'that's nice' with nothing else, it's not easy.

there wasn't more support at school either, they just came to simply teach and not inspire. There was one teacher though, who left when I was in third year, who opened my mind to a lot of stuff and I always left his class feeling that the world really was there for the taking . I often wonder if things could be different were he to remain for my final two years.

Heineken Helen

redrock wrote:

Personally, I think for every crappy teen around, there is a shitload of them with inspiration and drive. Maybe I'm too optimistic, but what I see around me is not that bad at all.

that's good though... I suppose the only interaction I seem to have with teens these days is when they're hanging around the shop and asking me to buy cigarettes for them :rolleyes: . I just wanna shake them and somehow inspire them... but how do ya do that? Books? What? We studied to kill a mockingbird, romeo and juliet, the plough and the stars, wuthering heights in school... and, while all great books, none really give you that kick up the arse that makes you wanna just get out there and live.

wash_

dunkman wrote:

my daughter is 6 and she wants to grow up to be a teacher... my youngest is 4 and she wants to be Sonic The Hedgehog... (she even wears wee white gloves all day cos thats what Sonic wears)


to be a shop assistant at TK Max when your aged 7 seems quite cool.. . if that was their job aspirations at aged 14 i'd be concerned... but at age 7 they think its like a scene from a Mary-Kate and Ashley film... girls trying on clothes and puttingon make-up.. at age 7 kids shouldnt be asked what they want to be when they grow up anyway.. why make them think about a fucking job... let them play for a while... the responsibilities come later.. we try and age our kids too soon these days...

I agree that children should focus on being children. It's something that is lacking these days, they want to grow up more quickly. When I was 7 I wanted to be a vet. I wasn't allowed to wear make up till I was at least 12.
Aspirations to be a shop assistant at 7 might be cool but there is a cycle to these things, I hope that they realise they want more for themselves and their future than a shopping mall. Their environment dictates what they will become and if its shopping malls at 7 I doubt it'll change.

surfanddestroy

Heineken Helen wrote:

that's good though... I suppose the only interaction I seem to have with teens these days is when they're hanging around the shop and asking me to buy cigarettes for them :rolleyes: . I just wanna shake them and somehow inspire them... but how do ya do that? Books? What? We studied to kill a mockingbird, romeo and juliet, the plough and the stars, wuthering heights in school... and, while all great books, none really give you that kick up the arse that makes you wanna just get out there and live.

They are young, let them have some fun, they will grow up and learn in their own time.

wash_

Heineken Helen wrote:

that's good though... I suppose the only interaction I seem to have with teens these days is when they're hanging around the shop and asking me to buy cigarettes for them :rolleyes: . I just wanna shake them and somehow inspire them... but how do ya do that? Books? What? We studied to kill a mockingbird, romeo and juliet, the plough and the stars, wuthering heights in school... and, while all great books, none really give you that kick up the arse that makes you wanna just get out there and live.

I say get secondary schools to read Ishmael myself. That book may have flaws but it has a type of urgency and inspiration that could spark in the minds of a 15 year old.