They are not on equal footing. Embargoes don't exist in any Randian vacuum.
Hehe...you're entirely right. They don't exist in a vacuum. They exist in a world where countries are more productive than others. Yet those who blame an embargo pretend they are in a vacuum.
That was back when I was talking about cats as a metaphor. Would "kick in the wallet" better suit you?
Hehe...you're entirely right. They don't exist in a vacuum. They exist in a world where countries are more productive than others. Yet those who blame an embargo pretend they are in a vacuum.
There's never going to be only one reason. There's never only one reason for anything. Yet you seem to suggest that the embargo isn't having much of an effect at all.
Yes, we do exist in a world where countries are more productive than others. We also exist in a world where some countries have more innate capacity for production than others. So we're back to my original point - the embargo hurts Cuba more than it hurts America because of the differences in size; size of economy, size of production capacity, size of influence, etc.
There's never going to be only one reason. There's never only one reason for anything. Yet you seem to suggest that the embargo isn't having much of an effect at all.
Yes, we do exist in a world where countries are more productive than others. We also exist in a world where some countries have more innate capacity for production than others. So we're back to my original point - the embargo hurts Cuba more than it hurts America because of the differences in size; size of economy, size of production capacity, size of influence, etc.
It's a political embargo more than an economic one.
Seriously, nearly all the posts here assume an attitude as though we're on the newly formed Cuban-American Fair Trade Commission, or some such shit. The reality is, is that embargo is still in place, and there's no good reason for it. Cuba wants to conduct it's economic affairs as it sees fit; they don't want another Batista-like era of private interest shlups from the US slashing and burning their countryside, and taking with it the culture and identity that they have so hard won. America can't do shit to lift the embargo because our current and long standing "government" interests involve doing just that.
Yes, I understand that. But based on the logic of embargo-as-primary-cause-of-misery, how come the embargo's effects on America are not equal to its effects on Cuba? I mean, I can't buy Cuban products just like they can't by mine. Yet how come things are better for me?
Things are better for you because the US can prove many things that people need without having to import them. Food, medicine, clothing, building materials, metal ore, etc... can all be produced here. Cuba on the other hand does not have the abundat natural resources that we do. So an Embrago would have a far greater impact on them.
"When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
Seriously, nearly all the posts here assume an attitude as though we're on the newly formed Cuban-American Fair Trade Commission, or some such shit. The reality is, is that embargo is still in place, and there's no good reason for it. Cuba wants to conduct it's economic affairs as it sees fit; they don't want another Batista-like era of private interest shlups from the US slashing and burning their countryside, and taking with it the culture and identity that they have so hard won. America can't do shit to lift the embargo because our current and long standing "government" interests involve doing just that.
Things are better for you because the US can prove many things that people need without having to import them. Food, medicine, clothing, building materials, metal ore, etc... can all be produced here. Cuba on the other hand does not have the abundat natural resources that we do. So an Embrago would have a far greater impact on them.
Umm...all the things you list are largely imported by Americans other than food and medicine. Furthermore, Cuba may import all those things as well from others.
What everyone here is ignoring is that, absent the embargo, Cuba would still have to trade for the things they want, giving value for value. And Cuba has very little to offer. It was the same before the embargo. It will be the same after the embargo.
Again, I'm all for lifting the embargo. But it isn't going to make the situation in Cuba much better.
Cuba wants to conduct it's economic affairs as it sees fit; they don't want another Batista-like era of private interest shlups from the US slashing and burning their countryside, and taking with it the culture and identity that they have so hard won.
That's the impression I got from most locals when I was there.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
Umm...all the things you list are largely imported by Americans other than food and medicine. Furthermore, Cuba may import all those things as well from others.
What everyone here is ignoring is that, absent the embargo, Cuba would still have to trade for the things they want, giving value for value. And Cuba has very little to offer. It was the same before the embargo. It will be the same after the embargo.
Again, I'm all for lifting the embargo. But it isn't going to make the situation in Cuba much better.
It will improve slightly, but you are right in stating that it will not make a dramatic change. To lifting the embargo is more of a diplomatic improvment than an economic one.
"When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
No. It fractionalizes a community for simply being a community. And it propogates and supports all the malicious rhetoric involved with "Castro's Cuba" as something "we" can do without. Now, if you think about that carefully, where is the freedom of the people in that?
No. It fractionalizes a community for simply being a community. And it propogates and supports all the malicious rhetoric involved with "Castro's Cuba" as something "we" can do without. Now, if you think about that carefully, where is the freedom of the people in that?
Huh? I don't understand this. How does the US government stepping aside and dropping the embargo do these things?
It will improve slightly, but you are right in stating that it will not make a dramatic change. To lifting the embargo is more of a diplomatic improvment than an economic one.
I agree. I tend to look at the lifting of the embargo as a moral improvement, but we're pretty much saying the same thing there. Cheers.
It will improve slightly, but you are right in stating that it will not make a dramatic change. To lifting the embargo is more of a diplomatic improvment than an economic one.
I dont know about this. dont you think american investment would greatly improve the cuban economy?
I'll let Cubans decide about Castro. He does nothing for or against me. The only beef I ever had with him was routinely jailing reporters. Now, it seems, our government isn't above doing the same thing.
I'm more interested with what's going to happen on that island when he dies. Wonder how long it takes for our monied interests to start getting their hands on things.
One thing I always thought about -- until I started figuring out that I didn't want to get a hospitality and tourism degree -- was that Castro would die about the time I was due to graduate (May 2007) and it would be the wild west there for a while.
Eventually, after the dust settled -- and assuming there wasn't another dictatorship the US government didn't like -- it would make one heckuva get-in-on-the-ground-floor place to go to carve out a living in the resort business.
"Almost all those politicians took money from Enron, and there they are holding hearings. That's like O.J. Simpson getting in the Rae Carruth jury pool." -- Charles Barkley
"Almost all those politicians took money from Enron, and there they are holding hearings. That's like O.J. Simpson getting in the Rae Carruth jury pool." -- Charles Barkley
It will bring more money to the island, but little of that will filter down to the people.
even with a freely elected government in place (if)? I know it will take alot of time for that to work in cuba. that doesnt happen overnight but the people are the ones who create economies. it would create alot of jobs as well. but you know cuba much better then I, so I wont disagree with you.
i got a dvd, audioslave in Cuba, and there's a lot of footage of the Cuban people. They live in absolute poverty, just run down cities, yet they have spirit, a strong sense of community. they don't have tv's, they have neighborhoods and friends and they all seemed to have such a positive spirit. despite the impoverished conditions-due in large part to the sanctions-it was truly inspiring to see the people so upbeat.
when they're not trained from birth to compete against eachother it really is inspiring to see the results.
i got a dvd, audioslave in Cuba, and there's a lot of footage of the Cuban people. They live in absolute poverty, just run down cities, yet they have spirit, a strong sense of community. they don't have tv's, they have neighborhoods and friends and they all seemed to have such a positive spirit. despite the impoverished conditions-due in large part to the sanctions-it was truly inspiring to see the people so upbeat.
when they're not trained from birth to compete against eachother it really is inspiring to see the results.
Yes, cause God knows it's impossible to "have spirit", "a strong sense of community", "neighborhoods", "friends" and "a positive spirit" in America...
Comments
this is getting good. I can see why people confuse our posts as being the same.
That was back when I was talking about cats as a metaphor. Would "kick in the wallet" better suit you?
Hehe...you're entirely right. They don't exist in a vacuum. They exist in a world where countries are more productive than others. Yet those who blame an embargo pretend they are in a vacuum.
Yes, it would.
Yes, we do exist in a world where countries are more productive than others. We also exist in a world where some countries have more innate capacity for production than others. So we're back to my original point - the embargo hurts Cuba more than it hurts America because of the differences in size; size of economy, size of production capacity, size of influence, etc.
It's a political embargo more than an economic one.
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again with a comment that makes no sense. you are on fire today
Put that bong away dude! :rolleyes:
What?
Seriously, nearly all the posts here assume an attitude as though we're on the newly formed Cuban-American Fair Trade Commission, or some such shit. The reality is, is that embargo is still in place, and there's no good reason for it. Cuba wants to conduct it's economic affairs as it sees fit; they don't want another Batista-like era of private interest shlups from the US slashing and burning their countryside, and taking with it the culture and identity that they have so hard won. America can't do shit to lift the embargo because our current and long standing "government" interests involve doing just that.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Things are better for you because the US can prove many things that people need without having to import them. Food, medicine, clothing, building materials, metal ore, etc... can all be produced here. Cuba on the other hand does not have the abundat natural resources that we do. So an Embrago would have a far greater impact on them.
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except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
So, what does our government do?
Anyone?
Anyone?
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Umm...all the things you list are largely imported by Americans other than food and medicine. Furthermore, Cuba may import all those things as well from others.
What everyone here is ignoring is that, absent the embargo, Cuba would still have to trade for the things they want, giving value for value. And Cuba has very little to offer. It was the same before the embargo. It will be the same after the embargo.
Again, I'm all for lifting the embargo. But it isn't going to make the situation in Cuba much better.
there you go talking to yourself again. dude you are pure entertainment
Get the fuck out of the way. That's what.
That's the impression I got from most locals when I was there.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
It will improve slightly, but you are right in stating that it will not make a dramatic change. To lifting the embargo is more of a diplomatic improvment than an economic one.
No. It fractionalizes a community for simply being a community. And it propogates and supports all the malicious rhetoric involved with "Castro's Cuba" as something "we" can do without. Now, if you think about that carefully, where is the freedom of the people in that?
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Huh? I don't understand this. How does the US government stepping aside and dropping the embargo do these things?
I agree. I tend to look at the lifting of the embargo as a moral improvement, but we're pretty much saying the same thing there. Cheers.
You lost me. I'm speaking in the present. No "what if's?".
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Cuba isn't "ripe enough" yet for the embargo to be lifted. Speaking through the eyes of our present government, if I may.
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I dont know about this. dont you think american investment would greatly improve the cuban economy?
I'm more interested with what's going to happen on that island when he dies. Wonder how long it takes for our monied interests to start getting their hands on things.
One thing I always thought about -- until I started figuring out that I didn't want to get a hospitality and tourism degree -- was that Castro would die about the time I was due to graduate (May 2007) and it would be the wild west there for a while.
Eventually, after the dust settled -- and assuming there wasn't another dictatorship the US government didn't like -- it would make one heckuva get-in-on-the-ground-floor place to go to carve out a living in the resort business.
cubans dont have a choice. oops
It will bring more money to the island, but little of that will filter down to the people.
even with a freely elected government in place (if)? I know it will take alot of time for that to work in cuba. that doesnt happen overnight but the people are the ones who create economies. it would create alot of jobs as well. but you know cuba much better then I, so I wont disagree with you.
when they're not trained from birth to compete against eachother it really is inspiring to see the results.
Yes, cause God knows it's impossible to "have spirit", "a strong sense of community", "neighborhoods", "friends" and "a positive spirit" in America...