Ok then so you think the goverment was complicit in it, so do i. But why hasn't anyone come forward to admit that.
Why would it take thousands of people to be involved to pull this one off?
What about if the CIA funded the cave people who allegedly masterminded the whole thing. That could well have happened.
After all it's what the CIA are known for.
The think that makes me laugh about people on these boards and i'm not saying you specifically is that they can believe that people from a cave can pull this off, but that there own goverment is to stupid to pull it off. Can no one see the stupidity in that thought.
had to repost this because for some reason it had somehow switched and said it was a post by me; this was originally posted by spiralout. i noticed when g under p quoted it and sent the chomsky material. just wanted to clear that up, because obviously it would have been pretty odd if i'd posted this, considering everything i've been saying thus far, lol.
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
Yes popular mechnics have been debunked in some of the rubbish they wrote, google is your friend.
even if popular mechanics had flaws that were discovered, tell me what credible rebuttal was ever raised to the national institue of standards and technology's findings found here: http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/factsheets/faqs_8_2006.htm
Question presented on site: "Why did NIST not consider a “controlled demolition” hypothesis with matching computer modeling and explanation as it did for the “pancake theory” hypothesis? A key critique of NIST’s work lies in the complete lack of analysis supporting a “progressive collapse” after the point of collapse initiation and the lack of consideration given to a controlled demolition hypothesis.
NIST's response: NIST conducted an extremely thorough three-year investigation into what caused the WTC towers to collapse, as explained in NIST’s dedicated Web site, http://wtc.nist.gov. This included consideration of a number of hypotheses for the collapses of the towers.
Some 200 technical experts—including about 85 career NIST experts and 125 leading experts from the private sector and academia—reviewed tens of thousands of documents, interviewed more than 1,000 people, reviewed 7,000 segments of video footage and 7,000 photographs, analyzed 236 pieces of steel from the wreckage, performed laboratory tests and sophisticated computer simulations of the sequence of events that occurred from the moment the aircraft struck the towers until they began to collapse.
Based on this comprehensive investigation, NIST concluded that the WTC towers collapsed because: (1) the impact of the planes severed and damaged support columns, dislodged fireproofing insulation coating the steel floor trusses and steel columns, and widely dispersed jet fuel over multiple floors; and (2) the subsequent unusually large jet-fuel ignited multi-floor fires (which reached temperatures as high as 1,000 degrees Celsius) significantly weakened the floors and columns with dislodged fireproofing to the point where floors sagged and pulled inward on the perimeter columns. This led to the inward bowing of the perimeter columns and failure of the south face of WTC 1 and the east face of WTC 2, initiating the collapse of each of the towers. Both photographic and video evidence—as well as accounts from the New York Police Department aviation unit during a half-hour period prior to collapse—support this sequence for each tower.
NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse, which is premised on a progressive failure of the floor systems in the WTC towers (the composite floor system—that connected the core columns and the perimeter columns—consisted of a grid of steel “trusses” integrated with a concrete slab; see diagram below). Instead, the NIST investigation showed conclusively that the failure of the inwardly bowed perimeter columns initiated collapse and that the occurrence of this inward bowing required the sagging floors to remain connected to the columns and pull the columns inwards. Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon."
that's just a little taste for you.
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
9/11 – Acceleration Study Proves Explosive Demolition
Frank Legge (Ph D)
Logical Systems Consulting
Abstract
The topic of the downward acceleration of the buildings at the World Trade Centre has been frequently discussed. The discussion is usually brief and combined with other lines of evidence for explosive demolition and its significance is thereby obscured. Acceleration is an important topic because it is based on evidence readily available to all, namely videos, and also because the calculations involved are not complex and can easily be verified by the reader. The conclusion reached that explosives were used in the demolition of these buildings is therefore not only compelling but readily accessible.
PROOF THAT THE THERMAL AND GRAVITATIONAL ENERGY AVAILABLE WERE INSUFFICIENT TO MELT STEEL IN THE TWIN TOWERS AND 7 WORLD TRADE CENTER ON 9/11/01
Terry Morrone.
Professor Emeritus of Physics, Adelphi University
Conclusions
Since there was molten steel in the wreckage of the World Trade Center, and since the temperatures of the fires were insufficient to melt steel, and since the gravitational energy was shown to be very much smaller than the energy needed to melt steel, the Twin Towers and 7 WTC could only have been brought down by explosives or cutter charges.
does anyone, particularly onelovesong, or anyone else have any articles they could share that counter the few articles i've posted on the past 3 pages? i'm interested in reading those
..and you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable
PROOF THAT THE THERMAL AND GRAVITATIONAL ENERGY AVAILABLE WERE INSUFFICIENT TO MELT STEEL IN THE TWIN TOWERS AND 7 WORLD TRADE CENTER ON 9/11/01
Terry Morrone.
Professor Emeritus of Physics, Adelphi University
does anyone, particularly onelovesong, or anyone else have any articles they could share that counter the few articles i've posted on the past 3 pages? i'm interested in reading those
what exactly is wrong with NIST's studies, investigations, and findings? also, steel wouldn't have to melt for the buildings to fall. steel may not melt at the temperature at which the fires were burning, but it would have lost half of its strengh, which--with floors of skyscraper bearing down--would be more than enough to cause the tumble.
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
besides, there are plenty of credible organizations, web sites, and articles that support the conventional explaination of what happened...do you have anything available to reference besides that same CT-obsessed 911journal site?
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
even if popular mechanics had flaws that were discovered, tell me what credible rebuttal was ever raised to the national institue of standards and technology's findings found here: http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/factsheets/faqs_8_2006.htm
Question presented on site: "Why did NIST not consider a “controlled demolition” hypothesis with matching computer modeling and explanation as it did for the “pancake theory” hypothesis? A key critique of NIST’s work lies in the complete lack of analysis supporting a “progressive collapse” after the point of collapse initiation and the lack of consideration given to a controlled demolition hypothesis.
NIST's response: NIST conducted an extremely thorough three-year investigation into what caused the WTC towers to collapse, as explained in NIST’s dedicated Web site, http://wtc.nist.gov. This included consideration of a number of hypotheses for the collapses of the towers.
Some 200 technical experts—including about 85 career NIST experts and 125 leading experts from the private sector and academia—reviewed tens of thousands of documents, interviewed more than 1,000 people, reviewed 7,000 segments of video footage and 7,000 photographs, analyzed 236 pieces of steel from the wreckage, performed laboratory tests and sophisticated computer simulations of the sequence of events that occurred from the moment the aircraft struck the towers until they began to collapse.
Based on this comprehensive investigation, NIST concluded that the WTC towers collapsed because: (1) the impact of the planes severed and damaged support columns, dislodged fireproofing insulation coating the steel floor trusses and steel columns, and widely dispersed jet fuel over multiple floors; and (2) the subsequent unusually large jet-fuel ignited multi-floor fires (which reached temperatures as high as 1,000 degrees Celsius) significantly weakened the floors and columns with dislodged fireproofing to the point where floors sagged and pulled inward on the perimeter columns. This led to the inward bowing of the perimeter columns and failure of the south face of WTC 1 and the east face of WTC 2, initiating the collapse of each of the towers. Both photographic and video evidence—as well as accounts from the New York Police Department aviation unit during a half-hour period prior to collapse—support this sequence for each tower.
NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse, which is premised on a progressive failure of the floor systems in the WTC towers (the composite floor system—that connected the core columns and the perimeter columns—consisted of a grid of steel “trusses” integrated with a concrete slab; see diagram below). Instead, the NIST investigation showed conclusively that the failure of the inwardly bowed perimeter columns initiated collapse and that the occurrence of this inward bowing required the sagging floors to remain connected to the columns and pull the columns inwards. Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon."
that's just a little taste for you.
Yes i see what you are saying but generally when you investigate something you often study the cause that looks most likely to have happened. Now in the case of the twin towers, controlled demoltion has not even been given any thought by the goverment payed people as it is a big taboo. So they have gone out of there way to explore every other avenue other than the one that seemed most likely.
And really how can i trust NIST anymore than anyone else when the building remains were never studied as they were shiped out of the country before anyone got the chance to look at them.
You are only going to get people not approved of by the goverment exploring those theorys, who if they do not agree with the offical story can be passed of as nutters.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
besides, there are plenty of credible organizations, web sites, and articles that support the conventional explaination of what happened...do you have anything available to reference besides that same CT-obsessed 911journal site?
can you share some with me? i like to read both sides
..and you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable
So they have gone out of there way to explore every other avenue other than the one that seemed most likely.
Most likely?!?! Why do you say that? Do you have any idea what it takes to demolish a building using explosives? If you did you would not think the explosives "theory" likely at all.
Most likely?!?! Why do you say that? Do you have any idea what it takes to demolish a building using explosives? If you did you would not think the explosives "theory" likely at all.
Conversely it may not have been too complex to have explosives inserted in the buildings as Marvin Bush, brother of George W Bush, had been on the board of directors during 2000, of the company that was providing security, and his cousin Wirt Walker III was CEO on 11th Sept. This company, Securacom, also provided security at Dulles International Airport from which American Airlines Flight 77 departed.
any of that sound fishy to anyone with an objective and open-mind?
and wait, haven't some of the reported hijackers been found alive? and wait, weren't some of the hijackers not even on the flight manifest? yet they got on board?
..and you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable
0
Options
g under p
Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,122
I am curently reading my way through Noams books. He's a great source of information.
I respect his opinion, but do you not think that it is in his best interest to say what he said about it. What would happen if the guy said anything other than what he said?
He would lose any respect people had for him as a writer and would be considered a nut job till the day he died.
But thats not to say that i disagree with what he said. I was mearly putting other ideas out there.
9/11 to me was their "pearl harbour" it was allowed to happen. And i think that thats as much as anyone can really say on the subject without speculating.
Whether it was in his best interest or not matters noe to me. I respect NC and I like him it's just I want to post something that others here might be interested in what he had to say.
As for me since day one when this event occured I said I cannot believe this nation, I mean thyis government had NO IDEA, NO CLUE this event was about to happen. They have been spying on Americans since before 9/II and we knew NOTHING, I dont think so.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Most likely?!?! Why do you say that? Do you have any idea what it takes to demolish a building using explosives? If you did you would not think the explosives "theory" likely at all.
Ok i'm a big fan of watching buildings be demolished and have watched a few for real when they have taken down tower blocks in london, so yes i know all the work that goes into them setting it up correctly so they don't harm any of the very near by buildings. I also watch programs on this subject when they are on TV and they look exactly the same. Not seen many since 9/11 though.
Thats what i mean by most likely. Forget the how did they rig the building's question or any other questions and look at it for what it looked like.
They had to really manipulate the data to even get it to look closely like any other reason they have come up with.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
any of that sound fishy to anyone with an objective and open-mind?
If by "objective and open-mind" you mean defective to the point of mental retardation then, yes!
and wait, haven't some of the reported hijackers been found alive?
No. That's been disproven.
Waleed and Wail were both mistakenly reported to have been found alive and well, by the BBC later in 2001. They were initially reported in error by a Saudi newspaper editor as the sons of Ahmed Alshehri, a senior Saudi diplomat stationed in Bombay, India. On September 16, 2001, the diplomat Ahmed Alshehri denied that he was the father of the two hijackers. Wail claims he did attend Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach, Florida - but was the victim of mistaken identity, since he used that training to secure his current position with a Moroccan airline company. Saudi Arabia has confirmed his story, and suggested he was the victim of identity theft.
Muhammad Ali Al-Shihri, the hijacker al-Shehri brothers' true father, was identified prior to September 17, 2001, and told Arab News that he hadn't heard from his sons in ten months prior to September 2001. An ABC News story in March 2002 repeated this, and during a report entitled "A Saudi Apology" for Dateline NBC on Aug 25 2002, NBC's reporter John Hockenberry traveled to 'Asir, where he interviewed the third brother, Salah, who agreed that his two brothers were dead and claimed they had been "brainwashed".
Furthermore another article explains that the pilot who lives in Casablanca was named Walid al-Shri (not Waleed M. al-Shehri) and that much of the BBC information regarding "alive" hijackers was incorrect according to the same sources used by BBC.
and wait, weren't some of the hijackers not even on the flight manifest? yet they got on board?
"Employees at Advance Travel Service in Totowa, N.J., told The Star-Ledger of Newark that Hanjour and Moqed bought single, first-class tickets for Flight 77 on Aug. 31. Hanjour spoke little English, the employees said, so Moqed did most of talking.
The two tried to pay with a credit card, but it did not get an authorization. They then tried to pay with a check, but were refused. A short time later, they returned with $1,842.25 in cash.
At the men's request, Hanjour was given a seat in the front row of first class."
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
It's authored by experts in the demolition industry.
Yes i read it.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
If by "objective and open-mind" you mean defective to the point of mental retardation then, yes!
No. That's been disproven.
Waleed and Wail were both mistakenly reported to have been found alive and well, by the BBC later in 2001. They were initially reported in error by a Saudi newspaper editor as the sons of Ahmed Alshehri, a senior Saudi diplomat stationed in Bombay, India. On September 16, 2001, the diplomat Ahmed Alshehri denied that he was the father of the two hijackers. Wail claims he did attend Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach, Florida - but was the victim of mistaken identity, since he used that training to secure his current position with a Moroccan airline company. Saudi Arabia has confirmed his story, and suggested he was the victim of identity theft.
Muhammad Ali Al-Shihri, the hijacker al-Shehri brothers' true father, was identified prior to September 17, 2001, and told Arab News that he hadn't heard from his sons in ten months prior to September 2001. An ABC News story in March 2002 repeated this, and during a report entitled "A Saudi Apology" for Dateline NBC on Aug 25 2002, NBC's reporter John Hockenberry traveled to 'Asir, where he interviewed the third brother, Salah, who agreed that his two brothers were dead and claimed they had been "brainwashed".
Furthermore another article explains that the pilot who lives in Casablanca was named Walid al-Shri (not Waleed M. al-Shehri) and that much of the BBC information regarding "alive" hijackers was incorrect according to the same sources used by BBC.
"Employees at Advance Travel Service in Totowa, N.J., told The Star-Ledger of Newark that Hanjour and Moqed bought single, first-class tickets for Flight 77 on Aug. 31. Hanjour spoke little English, the employees said, so Moqed did most of talking.
The two tried to pay with a credit card, but it did not get an authorization. They then tried to pay with a check, but were refused. A short time later, they returned with $1,842.25 in cash.
At the men's request, Hanjour was given a seat in the front row of first class."
oh now you're just rubbing it in...
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
I'm looking to see the official word somewhere as the final holy grail instead of just more circular opinion. Spin go the wheels in the sand....
Till then demolition by proxy is another very apparent reality not to be missed.
Amazing what one can see when they raise their heads up and take a look around.
Or look the other way so to speak...
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
I'm looking to see the official word somewhere as the final holy grail instead of just more circular opinion. Spin go the wheels in the sand....
Till then demolition by proxy is another very apparent reality not to be missed.
Amazing what one can see when they raise their heads up and take a look around.
Or look the other way so to speak...
i was simply amused that absolutely EVERYBODY had heard about the 'hijackers found alive' deal that got kicked up awhile ago, and yet somebody's using it on this thread after i'd thought EVERYBODY had ALSO heard they were hoaxes and mistakes that were proven by family and by witness to be false.
it just makes me wonder if a website or source still makes that faulty information available, how much stock can you put in the OTHER information they provide??...you've REALLY got to be determined to stick to a CT if you're still posting items that have been proven to be wrong. i'm not even talking about the respective scientific theories behind the towers' collapse because god knows nobody's going to change anybody's mind on this thread about that shit...but i'm talking more just about this hijacker material. if you're truly a credible site or source of information, how can you expect to be trusted and to retain that reputation of credibility if you don't even modify the information you make available based on things that have been proven. i'll gladly admit that both sides present very decent theories, models, and articles pertaining to the towers collapsing, but if you're still going to flaunt this hijacker story, then that's just getting ridiculous.
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
i was simply amused that absolutely EVERYBODY had heard about the 'hijackers found alive' deal that got kicked up awhile ago, and yet somebody's using it on this thread after i'd thought EVERYBODY had heard they were hoaxes and mistakes that were proven by family and by witness to be false.
it just makes me wonder if a website or source still makes that faulty information available, how much stock can you put in the other information they provide??...
The whole 9/11 conspiracy drama is moot to me now. The reality is that Iraq has been taken over and forever changed (conquered) because of some guys from Saudi Arabia.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
The whole 9/11 conspiracy drama is moot to me now. The reality is that Iraq has been taken over and forever changed (conquered) because of some guys from Saudi Arabia.
this is very true and i couldn't agree more. it is sad that in the midst of all the fervor and debates over who can wrangle up the most online articles and arguments, it seems to be forgotten that it was a nation that suffered the worst hijacking; a culture that has been dessimated and destroyed after living as it had for so, so long. we got our war, now they'll get their walmarts?
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
The whole 9/11 conspiracy drama is moot to me now. The reality is that Iraq has been taken over and forever changed (conquered) because of some guys from Saudi Arabia.
first of all 9-11 will never be "moot".
it was the excuse for : Afghanistan "war"
Iraq "war"
Patriot act
Patriot Act II
Military Commissions Act
"Homeland security"
illegal wire tapping
Trillions added to the deficit
etc,etc,etc
moot? is your freedom being lost "moot"
proving 9-11 was an inside job is VERY IMPORTANT to the future of our country/freedom/children
it will never be "moot" ,as a matter of fact it's the FUCKING EXACT OPPOSITE!!!!
it's funny.they tell us we were attacked because "they" hate our freedom.yet your government has done more to take away your freedom than any "terrorist" ever could!!!
"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot". Mark Twain
"I would rather die on my feet than to live on my knees."
Emiliano Zapata
And nothing, i can pull another demolition expert thoughts on it with the oposite view point, but whats the point i don't agree with you and i'm always going to have my suspicions about what really happened, just as you are always going to believe anyone who is a "goverment approved expert"
At the end of the day anyone can word what happened anyway they like. And some poeple will believe and others won't.
Now if i hadn't read any history or learnt about goverments and the way they work, i would have swallowed any bullshit they put out there but as i have read up about it, i can't just pretend things are exactly how they like to tell it.
But whatever, there are more important things happening now, that people can't deny.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
proving 9-11 was an inside job is VERY IMPORTANT to the future of our country/freedom/children
it will never be "moot" ,as a matter of fact it's the FUCKING EXACT OPPOSITE!!!!
it's funny.they tell us we were attacked because "they" hate our freedom.yet your government has done more to take away your freedom than any "terrorist" ever could!!!
Just the "is it a conspiracy about how the towers fell" part. That part is trivial in comparison to the numerous far encompassing realities you outlined.
Make no mistake, Bush and clan are seriously insane.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
You must be living in a chicken coop, i don't believe this person will take to read anything that may cause doubt but let it be blasted over our media and he'll quickly believe it.
This is the same person who talked about me attracting attention to myself because I have stickers on the back of my truck. After I told him/her what was actually OLS quietly ran away. Do you remember? Do some reading.
Peace
so leaving for the hospital is now quietly sneeking away? interesting. the stickers were my theory. nobody else suggested any other theory. yesterday i flew by a cop at 90 mph only to have him stop the car behind me. when i passed that car i noticed that the occupants looked like stoners. so what attracted the cop to stop them when i was clearly going faster? i also had a broken tail light and didn't have mudflaps on my truck. for some reason; they attracted his attention more than i did.
all these stories you speak of have been refuted by evidence. evidence you choose not to see. if you want to waste your life with this; go right ahead. i choose to live and enjoy my life. you can search for the magic explosives that don't need det wire or blasting caps and don't leave any traces like normal explosives. it's your time.
now let's say someone proves one of these conspiracy theories. what is gained? how is your life made better?
[quote="onelongsong
now let's say someone proves one of these conspiracy theories. what is gained? how is your life made better?[/quote"]
don't worry, not gonna happen
Do you see the way that tree bends?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
Comments
had to repost this because for some reason it had somehow switched and said it was a post by me; this was originally posted by spiralout. i noticed when g under p quoted it and sent the chomsky material. just wanted to clear that up, because obviously it would have been pretty odd if i'd posted this, considering everything i've been saying thus far, lol.
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
Question presented on site: "Why did NIST not consider a “controlled demolition” hypothesis with matching computer modeling and explanation as it did for the “pancake theory” hypothesis? A key critique of NIST’s work lies in the complete lack of analysis supporting a “progressive collapse” after the point of collapse initiation and the lack of consideration given to a controlled demolition hypothesis.
NIST's response: NIST conducted an extremely thorough three-year investigation into what caused the WTC towers to collapse, as explained in NIST’s dedicated Web site, http://wtc.nist.gov. This included consideration of a number of hypotheses for the collapses of the towers.
Some 200 technical experts—including about 85 career NIST experts and 125 leading experts from the private sector and academia—reviewed tens of thousands of documents, interviewed more than 1,000 people, reviewed 7,000 segments of video footage and 7,000 photographs, analyzed 236 pieces of steel from the wreckage, performed laboratory tests and sophisticated computer simulations of the sequence of events that occurred from the moment the aircraft struck the towers until they began to collapse.
Based on this comprehensive investigation, NIST concluded that the WTC towers collapsed because: (1) the impact of the planes severed and damaged support columns, dislodged fireproofing insulation coating the steel floor trusses and steel columns, and widely dispersed jet fuel over multiple floors; and (2) the subsequent unusually large jet-fuel ignited multi-floor fires (which reached temperatures as high as 1,000 degrees Celsius) significantly weakened the floors and columns with dislodged fireproofing to the point where floors sagged and pulled inward on the perimeter columns. This led to the inward bowing of the perimeter columns and failure of the south face of WTC 1 and the east face of WTC 2, initiating the collapse of each of the towers. Both photographic and video evidence—as well as accounts from the New York Police Department aviation unit during a half-hour period prior to collapse—support this sequence for each tower.
NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse, which is premised on a progressive failure of the floor systems in the WTC towers (the composite floor system—that connected the core columns and the perimeter columns—consisted of a grid of steel “trusses” integrated with a concrete slab; see diagram below). Instead, the NIST investigation showed conclusively that the failure of the inwardly bowed perimeter columns initiated collapse and that the occurrence of this inward bowing required the sagging floors to remain connected to the columns and pull the columns inwards. Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon."
that's just a little taste for you.
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
Frank Legge (Ph D)
Logical Systems Consulting
http://www.journalof911studies.com/volume/200611/911-Acceleration-Study-Proves-Explosive-Demolition.pdf
PROOF THAT THE THERMAL AND GRAVITATIONAL ENERGY AVAILABLE WERE INSUFFICIENT TO MELT STEEL IN THE TWIN TOWERS AND 7 WORLD TRADE CENTER ON 9/11/01
Terry Morrone.
Professor Emeritus of Physics, Adelphi University
http://www.journalof911studies.com/volume/200704/ProfMorroneOnMeltingWTCsteel.pdf
does anyone, particularly onelovesong, or anyone else have any articles they could share that counter the few articles i've posted on the past 3 pages? i'm interested in reading those
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
Yes i see what you are saying but generally when you investigate something you often study the cause that looks most likely to have happened. Now in the case of the twin towers, controlled demoltion has not even been given any thought by the goverment payed people as it is a big taboo. So they have gone out of there way to explore every other avenue other than the one that seemed most likely.
And really how can i trust NIST anymore than anyone else when the building remains were never studied as they were shiped out of the country before anyone got the chance to look at them.
You are only going to get people not approved of by the goverment exploring those theorys, who if they do not agree with the offical story can be passed of as nutters.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
can you share some with me? i like to read both sides
Most likely?!?! Why do you say that? Do you have any idea what it takes to demolish a building using explosives? If you did you would not think the explosives "theory" likely at all.
any of that sound fishy to anyone with an objective and open-mind?
and wait, haven't some of the reported hijackers been found alive? and wait, weren't some of the hijackers not even on the flight manifest? yet they got on board?
Whether it was in his best interest or not matters noe to me. I respect NC and I like him it's just I want to post something that others here might be interested in what he had to say.
As for me since day one when this event occured I said I cannot believe this nation, I mean thyis government had NO IDEA, NO CLUE this event was about to happen. They have been spying on Americans since before 9/II and we knew NOTHING, I dont think so.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Ok i'm a big fan of watching buildings be demolished and have watched a few for real when they have taken down tower blocks in london, so yes i know all the work that goes into them setting it up correctly so they don't harm any of the very near by buildings. I also watch programs on this subject when they are on TV and they look exactly the same. Not seen many since 9/11 though.
Thats what i mean by most likely. Forget the how did they rig the building's question or any other questions and look at it for what it looked like.
They had to really manipulate the data to even get it to look closely like any other reason they have come up with.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
Yeah, let's do that. :rolleyes:
Classic CT logic at work here:
Sounds like bomb = must be bomb
as opposed to:
Sounds like bomb = let's find out what it was and not assume anything till we know for sure
READ THIS...
http://www.implosionworld.com/Article-WTC%20STUDY%208-06%20w%20clarif%20as%20of%209-8-06%20.pdf
If by "objective and open-mind" you mean defective to the point of mental retardation then, yes!
No. That's been disproven.
Waleed and Wail were both mistakenly reported to have been found alive and well, by the BBC later in 2001. They were initially reported in error by a Saudi newspaper editor as the sons of Ahmed Alshehri, a senior Saudi diplomat stationed in Bombay, India. On September 16, 2001, the diplomat Ahmed Alshehri denied that he was the father of the two hijackers. Wail claims he did attend Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach, Florida - but was the victim of mistaken identity, since he used that training to secure his current position with a Moroccan airline company. Saudi Arabia has confirmed his story, and suggested he was the victim of identity theft.
Muhammad Ali Al-Shihri, the hijacker al-Shehri brothers' true father, was identified prior to September 17, 2001, and told Arab News that he hadn't heard from his sons in ten months prior to September 2001. An ABC News story in March 2002 repeated this, and during a report entitled "A Saudi Apology" for Dateline NBC on Aug 25 2002, NBC's reporter John Hockenberry traveled to 'Asir, where he interviewed the third brother, Salah, who agreed that his two brothers were dead and claimed they had been "brainwashed".
Furthermore another article explains that the pilot who lives in Casablanca was named Walid al-Shri (not Waleed M. al-Shehri) and that much of the BBC information regarding "alive" hijackers was incorrect according to the same sources used by BBC.
They were. The lists are avaliable as evidence from the Moussawi Trail. Also...
http://www.boston.com/news/packages/underattack/news/planes_reconstruction.htm
"Employees at Advance Travel Service in Totowa, N.J., told The Star-Ledger of Newark that Hanjour and Moqed bought single, first-class tickets for Flight 77 on Aug. 31. Hanjour spoke little English, the employees said, so Moqed did most of talking.
The two tried to pay with a credit card, but it did not get an authorization. They then tried to pay with a check, but were refused. A short time later, they returned with $1,842.25 in cash.
At the men's request, Hanjour was given a seat in the front row of first class."
If you say so mate.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
READ THIS...
http://www.implosionworld.com/Article-WTC%20STUDY%208-06%20w%20clarif%20as%20of%209-8-06%20.pdf
It's authored by experts in the demolition industry.
Yes i read it.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
and?
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
Till then demolition by proxy is another very apparent reality not to be missed.
Amazing what one can see when they raise their heads up and take a look around.
Or look the other way so to speak...
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
it just makes me wonder if a website or source still makes that faulty information available, how much stock can you put in the OTHER information they provide??...you've REALLY got to be determined to stick to a CT if you're still posting items that have been proven to be wrong. i'm not even talking about the respective scientific theories behind the towers' collapse because god knows nobody's going to change anybody's mind on this thread about that shit...but i'm talking more just about this hijacker material. if you're truly a credible site or source of information, how can you expect to be trusted and to retain that reputation of credibility if you don't even modify the information you make available based on things that have been proven. i'll gladly admit that both sides present very decent theories, models, and articles pertaining to the towers collapsing, but if you're still going to flaunt this hijacker story, then that's just getting ridiculous.
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
The whole 9/11 conspiracy drama is moot to me now. The reality is that Iraq has been taken over and forever changed (conquered) because of some guys from Saudi Arabia.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle
first of all 9-11 will never be "moot".
it was the excuse for : Afghanistan "war"
Iraq "war"
Patriot act
Patriot Act II
Military Commissions Act
"Homeland security"
illegal wire tapping
Trillions added to the deficit
etc,etc,etc
moot? is your freedom being lost "moot"
proving 9-11 was an inside job is VERY IMPORTANT to the future of our country/freedom/children
it will never be "moot" ,as a matter of fact it's the FUCKING EXACT OPPOSITE!!!!
it's funny.they tell us we were attacked because "they" hate our freedom.yet your government has done more to take away your freedom than any "terrorist" ever could!!!
"I would rather die on my feet than to live on my knees."
Emiliano Zapata
And nothing, i can pull another demolition expert thoughts on it with the oposite view point, but whats the point i don't agree with you and i'm always going to have my suspicions about what really happened, just as you are always going to believe anyone who is a "goverment approved expert"
At the end of the day anyone can word what happened anyway they like. And some poeple will believe and others won't.
Now if i hadn't read any history or learnt about goverments and the way they work, i would have swallowed any bullshit they put out there but as i have read up about it, i can't just pretend things are exactly how they like to tell it.
But whatever, there are more important things happening now, that people can't deny.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
Just the "is it a conspiracy about how the towers fell" part. That part is trivial in comparison to the numerous far encompassing realities you outlined.
Make no mistake, Bush and clan are seriously insane.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
pot... meet kettle
—Dorothy Parker
http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/6902/conspiracytheoriesxt6qt8.jpg
I ain't killing anyone or invading countries in the name of blatant greed numbnuts
sigh...some people...
I now return you to your fresh plate of hay...
http://www.foxnews.com/
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
so leaving for the hospital is now quietly sneeking away? interesting. the stickers were my theory. nobody else suggested any other theory. yesterday i flew by a cop at 90 mph only to have him stop the car behind me. when i passed that car i noticed that the occupants looked like stoners. so what attracted the cop to stop them when i was clearly going faster? i also had a broken tail light and didn't have mudflaps on my truck. for some reason; they attracted his attention more than i did.
all these stories you speak of have been refuted by evidence. evidence you choose not to see. if you want to waste your life with this; go right ahead. i choose to live and enjoy my life. you can search for the magic explosives that don't need det wire or blasting caps and don't leave any traces like normal explosives. it's your time.
now let's say someone proves one of these conspiracy theories. what is gained? how is your life made better?
now let's say someone proves one of these conspiracy theories. what is gained? how is your life made better?[/quote"]
don't worry, not gonna happen
Does it inspire?
Leaning out to catch the sun's rays...
A lesson to be applied.
Best night of my life. . .
Noblesville, IN 06-22-03.
myspace.com/justonemorebottle