What do a billion muslims actually think about Bin Laden?
the face
Posts: 192
Ever wondered? I mean there are an awful lot of them. And none of them has crashed a single plane into a building in a very long time now. Im guessing that the average educated Muslim finds Bin Laden repulsive while only a small number of mostly poor uneducated find his ideas attractive. I dunno. Anyone?
Post edited by Unknown User on
0
Comments
By Robin Wright
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, July 15, 2005; Page A13
Osama bin Laden's standing has dropped significantly in some pivotal Muslim countries, while support for suicide bombings and other acts of violence has "declined dramatically," according to a new survey released yesterday.
Predominantly Muslim populations in a sampling of six North African, Middle Eastern and Asian countries share to a "considerable degree" Western concerns about Islamic extremism, according to the poll by the Pew Global Attitudes Project, conducted by the Pew Research Center, a nonpartisan and nonprofit organization.
"Most Muslim publics are expressing less support for terrorism than in the past. Confidence in Osama bin Laden has declined markedly in some countries, and fewer believe suicide bombings that target civilians are justified in the defense of Islam," the poll concluded.
The one exception is attitudes toward suicide bombings of U.S and Western targets in Iraq, a subject on which Muslims were divided. Roughly half of Muslims in Lebanon, Jordan and Morocco said such attacks are justifiable, while sizable majorities in Turkey, Pakistan and Indonesia disagreed. Yet, support for suicide bombings in Iraq still declined by as much as 20 percent compared with a poll taken last year.
The results, which also reveal widespread support for democracy, show how profoundly opinions have changed in parts of the Muslim world since Pew took similar surveys in recent years. The poll attributed the difference in attitudes toward extremism to both the terrorist attacks in Muslim nations and the passage of time since the U.S. invasion of Iraq.
In May 2003, many Muslims "saw a worldwide threat to Islam and [bin Laden] represented opposition to the West and the United States," said Andrew Kohut, president of the Pew Research Center and project director. "Tempers have since cooled."
The poll results are a rare piece of good news for the Bush administration, which has faced difficulties seeing gains in its two top foreign policy goals -- combating terrorism and promoting democracy in the Islamic world.
"These are eye-catching results, but not surprising," said Augustus Richard Norton, a Middle East specialist at Boston University. "Muslims, like non-Muslims, are plugged into the world. . . . It is one thing to be caught up in the supposed glamour of attacking the superpower or global bully, but it is quite another to have to pay the consequences economically, politically -- not to mention personally. This is what has happened in places like Indonesia, Morocco, Pakistan and Turkey, where many people now see extremist Islam as a threat to their lives, not a fantasy game of kick Uncle Sam."
The survey, conducted from April through mid-June, before the London bombings, polled 17,000 people in the six Muslim-dominated countries and in 11 major Western and Asian nations, including the United States. They were asked about their attitudes toward Islam, Muslim nations and extremist violence. More than 6,200 interviews in Muslim countries were conducted in person, while interviews in the West and in Asia were done by telephone and in person.
The new poll also found that growing majorities or pluralities of Muslims now say that democracy can work in their countries and is not just a Western ideology. Support for democracy was in the 80 percent range in Indonesia, Jordan, Lebanon and Morocco. It was selected by 43 percent in Pakistan and 48 percent in Turkey -- the largest blocks of respondents in both countries because significant numbers were unsure.
"They are not just paying lip service. They are saying they specifically want a fair judiciary, freedom of expression and more than one party in elections. It wasn't just a vague concept," Kohut said. "U.S. and Western ideas about democracy have been globalized and are in the Muslim world."
At the same time, most Muslims surveyed said they think Islam is playing an increasing role in their politics, a development they view as a positive shift in response to economic problems, growing immorality and concern about Western influence. Jordan was the only exception.
The survey results indicate that growing numbers of Muslims differentiate between what they consider the peaceful influence of Islamic values in politics and the use of religion to justify attacks. "The people who see Islam playing an important role in political life are the ones most worried about extremism," Kohut said.
Yet solid majorities in five of the six Muslim countries surveyed -- Indonesia, Jordan, Lebanon, Pakistan and Turkey -- also now have unfavorable views of the United States. In the sixth, Morocco, views are divided. The governments in all six countries are U.S. allies and receive U.S. aid.
The survey found only 2 percent of the people polled in Lebanon and 7 percent in Turkey expressing confidence that bin Laden would "do the right thing regarding world affairs." The proportion that expressed confidence in the al Qaeda leader dropped from almost half to about a quarter in Morocco, and from 58 percent to 37 percent in Indonesia. Bin Laden's standing went up slightly in Pakistan, to 51 percent, and in Jordan, to 60 percent.
Three factors, Kohut said, contributed to the notable shift in views on bin Laden and suicide bombings: incidents of terrorism in Muslim countries, an increase in positive feelings about events at home, and the passage of time since the 2003 survey conducted after the U.S. invasion of Iraq.
The decline in support for suicide bombings was largest in Indonesia, which has witnessed deadly bombings at a Marriott hotel in Jakarta and at a Bali tourist hotel -- attacks that seriously affected tourism and foreign investment. Jordan was the only country where the majority surveyed -- 57 percent -- still support terrorist acts in defense of Islam, possibly because the majority Palestinian population is tied to the conflict with Israel, Kohut said.
But Norton also noted: "As the events in London show, it does not take too many people to cause big problems. If only 1/10,000 of 1 percent [of the Muslim world] is inclined to terrorism, that is still 1,200 potential mass killers."
One of the starkest findings was the divide in views on religion. Most of those surveyed in nine Western countries -- including the United States, Britain, Canada, France and Russia -- said they have favorable views of Muslims, although the non-Muslims surveyed were more likely to say Islam is more violent than Christianity, Judaism or Hinduism.
The Muslims surveyed had mixed views on Christians, and anti-Jewish sentiment was "endemic," the survey reported.
Muslims in those countries are winning, not losing. This is why they can afford to cool their tempers. They are not the ones who should be angry - we should. We are failing to fight the enemy decisively.
They're coming into the west in much larger numbers than we're coming into their countries. We send troops, but they send potential voters. Which is more dangerous to an institution? A soldier can kill a martyr, but hundreds will take the martyr's place. A foreigner can gain citizenship and vote, and he can effectively cripple our democracy.
Civilizations destroy themselves from within first, as any good historian knows. We are destroying ourselves by allowing vast numbers of foreign people into our country who have no intention of supporting our democracy or respecting its institutions. Their culture is foreign and immoral.
-Enoch Powell
one of the best posts ive read in a long time
That's the most xenophobic post I have ever read.
naděje umírá poslední
http://groups.colgate.edu/aarislam/response.htm
lots of links of muslims groups and leaders condemning what happened on 9/11
also lots of pics of muslims in muslim countries holding vigils and moments of silence for the victims of 9/11.
did ya know In Iran, Tehran's main soccer stadium observed a minute's silence for the victims?
or 1 million Palestinian students in the Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, stood five minutes in silence to express their solidarity with the hundreds of American children who have been struck?
or Palestinians in East Jerusalem held a candle-light vigils on 12 and 14 September to express their grief and solidarity with the American families struck by this tragedy? or that Mr. Abdel Qader Al-Husseini, son of the late Palestinian leader Faisal Al-Husseini led one of the vigils?
or the Palestine Legislative Council condemned the terrorist attack on the United States and sent an urgent letter of condolences to Mr. J Dennis Hasterd, Speaker of the House of Representatives?
were you aware the terrorist act was strongly condemned by every single Palestinian organization including Fatah, the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Hamas, Workers Unions and Committees, Human Right organizations (AlHaq, Law, Palestine Center for Human Rights), student associations, municipalities, mosques and churches...?
did ya hear Iran's Ayatollah Imami Kashani spoke of a catastrophic act of terrorism which could only be condemned by all Muslims, adding the whole world should mobilise against terrorism?
did ya see the pics of a candlelight vigil on the streets of Tehran, Iran, in which over a million Iranians took part in on 9/18/01?
and what have you done w/ that support since then?
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
My god...I don't even know where to begin. This is a scary post.
I think the vast majority of arab muslims and muslims throughout the middle east will come to see 9/11 as a catasphrophe for islam and the interests of the arab world. Look at the results. It helped give rise to Hamas, a devastating and unnecessary war in Iraq, the liklihood of war with Iran and war between Israel and it's neighbors. No right thinking muslim will be saying 9/11 was good for them at the end of the day. Only the Jihadi's will sing it's praises and most of them are already so disenfranchised they won't care how much harm that did to the region
American made, Israeli fired missles and bullets is what gave rise to Hamas, the war in Iraq again was planned before 9/11. America has always wanted to go up against Iran due to Iran not kissing Americas feet.
It did, 100%, it was a blessing for Bush and Co. That's what they needed. Like I mentioned in my other post, they sold the Iraq war by pushing 9/11.
The looney left can always find a way to blame bush and co
I did'nt blame Bush for 9/11, But it's just fact that he and his friends used it to push what they wanted. 9/11 was the slogan. it's just true. sorry.
well, who's fault is the failed plan <if you want to call it that> of iraq??? who's fault is it that the troops weren't properly equipped?
and techinically...if you don't want to think there was any help from certain governmental officials on 9/11 you can still fault the administration for the shitty handling of it:
had they not taken away the authority for NORAD and the military to even react to hijacked planes or planes that lost contact or went off course perhaps NORAD and the military would've reacted a lot earlier than waiting over 1 1/2 hours...i mean, andrew's air force base isn't even 10 miles from dc...yet we are to believe some ppl hiding in caves were able to penetrate our trillion $ defeneses and 1 1/2 hours after the first plane hit were able to fly towards dc, fly thru it's no fly zone, turn back around, fly back into dc's no fly zone and hit the pentagon before jets could be scrambled??? i have a feeling NORAD and the military would've reacted a lot sooner than waiting right before the pentagon got hit to do something.
oh, and all the budget cuts they made concerning terrorism and al qaeada....:D
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
really?
http://www.wishlistfoundation.org
Oh my, they dropped the leash.
Morgan Freeman/Clint Eastwood 08' for President!
"Make our day"
It's one thing to be in "solidarity" with the innocent victims of terrorism. That's a political stunt.
It's another thing to completely and undeniably support the terrorist groups that caused those innocent people to be butchered.
September 11, 2006 Poll by Al-Jazeera; the results of a questionnaire taken by 41,260 Arab viewers:
2) Do you support Osama bin Laden?
Yes - 49.9 %
No - 50.1 %
Okay, so they had candelight vigils, how nice! 50% of them still support the guy who ran those planes into our buildings. That's half. That's 20,630 in just that poll.
That's a lot of people, eh?
What do they REALLY think? They support the guy who killed our people.
-Enoch Powell
Too many of you are angry at the "xenophobe." The problem is, you aren't looking at history. Why should we let WAY more immigrants here than we've EVER allowed in the past? The number of people we fail to assimilate is the number of failures we will be forced to deal with in the future.
Just ask Britain and the Netherlands.
Just ask Theo Van Gogh:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_van_Gogh_(film_director)
-Enoch Powell
I agree with MrBrian on this one. Im no leftist, and more slightly right of center these days, and I never voted for Bush but I was sold on that war from the outset. And 9/11 was the selling point. The reality is Bush Jr. was going to get his payback on Saddam for trying to kill his daddy with or without 9/11.
I think many come over here to enjoy something of a Democracy, no?
What assimilation are you talking about? That sounds odd coming from a self-professed Christian. Are you saying assimilate to your notion of America and Christianity?
That's ridiculous. I was born in America and I don't even assimilate myself with that.
I do agree we need to keep immigration in check, but not for the same reasons you do. We simply neeed to take care of our own problems better before welcoming slews of immigrants.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I don't think the daddy thing played much into it. It was and still is the people who surround and encourage him with their corporate expansionist dreams.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
what i think is this is the ONLY time you will be in support of something by al jazeera and that if it had been an article criticizing us from them you'd dismiss it b/c its from al jazeera...pick and choose, pick and choose....
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
and if you read pnac's <cheney, rummy, wolfowitz, perle, libby...> policy paper redfining america's defenses written 9/00: '...the need for a substantial American force presence in the Gulf transcends the issue of the regime of Saddam Hussein.'
and if you listen to anoher pnac member, midge decter, in 2004:
“We’re not in the Middle East to bring sweetness and light to the world. We’re there to get something we and our friends in Europe depend on. Namely, oil.”
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
This was proven to not be what they were dancing about. The celebration had nothing to do with September 11th.
An article can have opinions. This is a statistical fact. That number of Arab Muslims support Osama bin Laden, plus or minus. Nothing to argue about.
-Enoch Powell
Cleveland 5/20/2006 Columbus 5/6/2010 Chicago 7/19/2013
Cincinnatti 6/24/2006 Noblesville 5/7/2010. Buffalo 10/12/2013
Lollapalooza 8/5/2007 Mountain View 10/23/2010 Cincinnatti 10/1/2014
Washington D.C. 6/22/2008 Mountain View 10/24/2010 St. Louis 10/3/2014
Chicago 8/22/2008(EV Solo) St. Louis 7/1/2011 (EV Solo) St. Paul 10/19/2014
Kansas City 5/3/2010 East Troy 9/3/2011 Milwaukee 10/20/2014
Hampton 4/18/2016 Columbia 4/21/2016 Lexington 4/26/2016
NYC 5/2/2016
One lowly congressman, a Muslim, brings you to this.
And I suppose, like that Virgil whatever-his-name is from Virginia. You people need a place to sit, really. You see, its childish crap like this that spoils the civil table and takes the focus off of meaningful discussion. The little brats are at it again, Paw. Well, Maw, you shouldn't have gave them so much of that candy before dinner. What are we gonna do about this, Paw? Well, if I could whoop em with my belt, I would, but, you know, that would be amoral.
Amoral? Like the Muslims, Daddy?
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
ya but, if they're coming here to vote, how is that not "supporting our democracy or respecting its institutions" ????
Another habit says its long overdue
Another habit like an unwanted friend
I'm so happy with my righteous self
Well actually there is. Al Jazeera is not exactly a neutral chanel. It's kind of like (it's a bit exagerrated but it carries the idea) asking fox viewers if they support Bush.