Bush's Reaction To The Virginia Tech Shootings

onelongsong

gue_barium wrote:

"Gentlemen of the jury, the best friend a man has in this world may turn against him and become his enemy. His son or daughter or buffalo whom he has reared with loving care may prove ungrateful. Those who are nearest and dearest to us -- those whom we trust with our happiness and good name -- may become traitors in their faith. The money that a rock star has he may lose. It flies away from him, perhaps when he needs it most. A man's reputation may be sacrificed in a moment of ill-considered action. The people who are prone to fall on their knees to do us honor when success is with us may be the first to throw the stone of malice when failure settles its cloud upon our heads. The one absolute, unselfish friend that man can have in this selfish world -- the one that never proves ungrateful or treacherous -- is his God.

"Gentlemen of the jury, a buffaloman's God stands by him in prosperity and poverty, in health and sickness. He will sleep on the cold ground, where the wintry winds blow, and the snow drives fiercely, if only he can be near his master's side. He will kiss the hand that has no food to offer; he will lick the wounds and sores that come in encounter with the roughness of the world. He guards the sleep of his pauper master as if he were a prince. When all other friends desert, he remains. When riches take wings and reputation falls to pieces, he is as constant in his love as the sun in its journey through the heavens.

"If fortune drives the master forth an outcast in the world, friendless and homeless, the faithful God asks no higher privilege than that of accompanying him to guard against danger, to fight against his enemies. And when the last scene of all comes, and gun laws takes the master in its embrace, and his body is laid away in the cold ground, no matter if all other friends pursue their way, there by his graveside will the noble God be found, his head between his paws, his eyes sad but open in alert watchfulness, faithful and true even to death."

great piece. do you have a link or case caption? i'd like to read the entire case.

gue_barium

onelongsong wrote:

great piece. do you have a link or case caption? i'd like to read the entire case.

It's somewhere near the corner of the pony express trail and the old lincoln hwy.

onelongsong

gue_barium wrote:

It's somewhere near the corner of the pony express trail and the old lincoln hwy.

at my front door?

gue_barium

onelongsong wrote:

at my front door?

Consdering everything, I would have guessed your back door.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

They shot Old Drum... Gue you plagiarist :P

http://bioguide.congress.gov/scripts/biodisplay.pl?index=V000091

onelongsong

gue_barium wrote:

Consdering everything, I would have guessed your back door.

nope; front door. the historical monument marking the pony express stage stop location is out the back door but the trail intersects the linclon hwy at the front door.

hippiemom

hippiemom wrote:

On second thought, I'm not going to wait for you to explain Article V. You can't, because you clearly don't understand it. So how about you try to wrap your genius brain around this:

The Bill of Rights consists of the first ten amendments to the U.S. Constitution. They thus became a part of the Constitution itself, as did all subsequent amendments. The process for amending any part of the Constitution is laid out in Article V. There are two ways that it can be done.

1. Both houses of Congress approve, by a 2/3 majority, a resolution calling for an amendment. The proposed amendment must then be approved by the legislatures of 3/4 of the states.

2. Alternatively, the legislatures of 3/4 of the states vote to call for a convention at which constitutional amendments can be proposed. Any amendments proposed by the convention would then require approval by the legislatures of 3/4 of the states.

Now you explain to me why it is that you think the first ten amendments are somehow immune to this process.

Seems you somehow skipped over this post. Really, I'm very curious as to how these amendments are immune to the amendment process. Please explain.

Cosmo

onelongsong wrote:

i RETIRED at age 40. i take it you're still working???

...
Retired or Fired... I guess it al depends on how you interpret it.

Cosmo

onelongsong wrote:

our laws are based on the 619 commandments (known as the 10 commandments) handed down to moses by God. in there it states the right to defend our rights.
the words "thou shalt not kill" is a mistranslation and the hebrew wording is "thou shalt not murder". killing is allowed for protection of self and rights.

...
So... all of those people who translated the Bible into English are wrong? Doesn't it mean that if they got 'Kill' and 'Murder' mixed up... they probably got some other stuff mixed up? Like, does 'Thou Shalt Not Steal' actually mean, 'Thou Shalt Not Commit Armed Robbery'... making embezzlement okay?

redrock

Cosmo wrote:

...
So... all of those people who translated the Bible into English are wrong? Doesn't it mean that if they got 'Kill' and 'Murder' mixed up... they probably got some other stuff mixed up? Like, does 'Thou Shalt Not Steal' actually mean, 'Thou Shalt Not Commit Armed Robbery'... making embezzlement okay?

:D Made me laugh :D

norm

onelongsong wrote:

our laws are based on the 619 commandments (known as the 10 commandments) handed down to moses by God. in there it states the right to defend our rights.
the words "thou shalt not kill" is a mistranslation and the hebrew wording is "thou shalt not murder". killing is allowed for protection of self and rights.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CitfTtMIx8

GEORGE CARLIN ON THE 10 COMMANDMENTS
from "Complaints and Grievances" (HBO special)

Here is my problem with the ten commandments- why exactly are there 10?

You simply do not need ten. The list of ten commandments was artificially and deliberately inflated to get it up to ten. Here's what happened:

About 5,000 years ago a bunch of religious and political hustlers got together to try to figure out how to control people and keep them in line. They knew people were basically stupid and would believe anything they were told, so they announced that God had given them some commandments, up on a mountain, when no one was around.

Well let me ask you this- when they were making this shit up, why did they pick 10? Why not 9 or 11? I'll tell you why- because 10 sound official. Ten sounds important! Ten is the basis for the decimal system, it's a decade, it's a psychologically satisfying number (the top ten, the ten most wanted, the ten best dressed). So having ten commandments was really a marketing decision! It is clearly a bullshit list. It's a political document artificially inflated to sell better. I will now show you how you can reduce the number of commandments and come up with a list that's a little more workable and logical. I am going to use the Roman Catholic version because those were the ones I was taught as a little boy.

Let's start with the first three:

I AM THE LORD THY GOD THOU SHALT NOT HAVE STRANGE GODS BEFORE ME

THOU SHALT NOT TAKE THE NAME OF THE LORD THY GOD IN VAIN

THOU SHALT KEEP HOLY THE SABBATH

Right off the bat the first three are pure bullshit. Sabbath day? Lord's name? strange gods? Spooky language! Designed to scare and control primitive people. In no way does superstitious nonsense like this apply to the lives of intelligent civilized humans in the 21st century. So now we're down to 7. Next:

HONOR THY FATHER AND MOTHER

Obedience, respect for authority. Just another name for controlling people. The truth is that obedience and respect shouldn't be automatic. They should be earned and based on the parent's performance. Some parents deserve respect, but most of them don't, period. You're down to six.

Now in the interest of logic, something religion is very uncomfortable with, we're going to jump around the list a little bit.

THOU SHALT NOT STEAL

THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS

Stealing and lying. Well actually, these two both prohibit the same kind of behavior- dishonesty. So you don't really need two you combine them and call the commandment "thou shalt not be dishonest". And suddenly you're down to 5.

And as long as we're combining I have two others that belong together:

THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTRY

THOU SHALT NOT COVET THY NEIGHBOR'S WIFE

Once again, these two prohibit the same type of behavior. In this case it is marital infidelity. The difference is- coveting takes place in the mind. But I don't think you should outlaw fantasizing about someone else's wife because what is a guy gonna think about when he's waxing his carrot? But, marital infidelity is a good idea so we're gonna keep this one and call it "thou shalt not be unfaithful". And suddenly we're down to four.

But when you think about it, honesty and infidelity are really part of the same overall value so, in truth, you could combine the two honesty commandments with the two fidelity commandments and give them simpler language, positive language instead of negative language and call the whole thing "thou shalt always be honest and faithful" and we're down to 3.

THOU SHALT NOT COVET THY NEIGHBOR"S GOODS

This one is just plain fuckin' stupid. Coveting your neighbor's goods is what keeps the economy going! Your neighbor gets a vibrator that plays "o come o ye faithful", and you want one too! Coveting creates jobs, so leave it alone. You throw out coveting and you're down to 2 now- the big honesty and fidelity commandment and the one we haven't talked about yet:

THOU SHALT NOT KILL

Murder. But when you think about it, religion has never really had a big problem with murder. More people have been killed in the name of god than for any other reason. All you have to do is look at Northern Ireland, Cashmire, the Inquisition, the Crusades, and the World Trade Center to see how seriously the religious folks take thou shalt not kill. The more devout they are, the more they see murder as being negotiable. It depends on who's doin the killin' and who's gettin' killed. So, with all of this in mind, I give you my revised list of the two commandments:

Thou shalt always be honest and faithful to the provider of thy nookie.

&

Thou shalt try real hard not to kill anyone, unless of course they pray to a different invisible man than you.

Two is all you need; Moses could have carried them down the hill in his fuckin' pocket. I wouldn't mind those folks in Alabama posting them on the courthouse wall, as long as they provided one additional commandment:

Thou shalt keep thy religion to thyself.

duggro

fuck the bloody 2nd amendment, its a load of shit

onelongsong

cutback wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CitfTtMIx8

GEORGE CARLIN ON THE 10 COMMANDMENTS
from "Complaints and Grievances" (HBO special)

using a comedians skit or commandments abridged so a child can understand them have no place in a debate.
why didn't you post the original 619 laws of God as quoted in the koran? you can then cross reference them with modern law and debate intelligently.

hippiemom

onelongsong wrote:

using a comedians skit or commandments abridged so a child can understand them have no place in a debate.
why didn't you post the original 619 laws of God as quoted in the koran? you can then cross reference them with modern law and debate intelligently.

If you knew enough about modern law to debate it intelligently, you'd be explaining to me about the amendment process.

mammasan

hippiemom wrote:

If you knew enough about modern law to debate it intelligently, you'd be explaining to me about the amendment process.

It seems that our friends arguement is that since the Bill of Rights has bever been amended that it make shim right. Just because it hasn't doesn't mean that it can't seems to be the part he is having trouble grasping.

norm

hippiemom wrote:

If you knew enough about modern law to debate it intelligently, you'd be explaining to me about the amendment process.

I've given up......his response to the actual text of the constitution was a christian based website.......so I brought humor (logic) into the argument and well.........

therover

Guns are useless without the intent to kill. That is the real problem.


Don't blame the tools, blame the hands.

soulsinging

onelongsong wrote:

furthermore; this citizenry you speak of is unarmed. if armed; they would be fighting for the right to defend themselves. anti-gun forces bearing arms to protect themselves makes no sense what so ever.
you also forget that military and guardsmen are fighting and dying to protect their rights. in the history of the us; hundreds of thousands of people died protecting the constitution. with most of these people being owners of personal weapons; they too will join these "rednecks" and secret militias.

i like how you just pretend like i didn't say anything about your shoddy constitutional scholarship. the military and police uphold the laws and constitution of the united states. if the constitution was amended to repeal the 2nd amendment and guns were outlawed, you would be an enemy of the united states and the military and police would be against you to enforce our laws. you and your ilk are (thank god) a small minority.

it's pretty sad that you, a self-proclaimed unbeatable attorney, has been owned by a first year law student and two freelance citizens in constitutional jurisprudence. how many people did you have to threaten at gunpoint to pass the bar?

soulsinging

onelongsong wrote:

i RETIRED at age 40. i take it you're still working???

was that before or after you were a musician in a famous rock band? did your clients have to have their court dates postponed while you toured?

RolandTD20Kdrummer

cutback wrote:

I've given up......his response to the actual text of the constitution was a christian based website.......so I brought humor (logic) into the argument and well.........

life without humor is death...