What is God?

sponger

Yes, ahnimus is mostly right about babies. Crying is their way of communicating, so that is what they do when they need to communicate.

When you smile, you are sending cooler blood to your brain. This makes you feel happy. When you smile at a baby, it mimics your facial expressions and smiles back. This causes the baby to feel good because cool blood is going to its brain. It then associates smiling with feeling good. So, the next time it feels good, it smiles to show that it is.

I think babies are born with feelings, but the manner in which those feelings are expressed are learned behaviors. I'm not absolutely sure on that, though. I don't think anyone is sure about that at this point.

angelica

sponger wrote:

Yes, ahnimus is mostly right about babies. Crying is their way of communicating, so that is what they do when they need to communicate.

When you smile, you are sending cooler blood to your brain. This makes you feel happy. When you smile at a baby, it mimics your facial expressions and smiles back. This causes the baby to feel good because cool blood is going to its brain. It then associates smiling with feeling good. So, the next time it feels good, it smiles to show that it is.

I think babies are born with feelings, but the manner in which those feelings are expressed are learned behaviors. I'm not absolutely sure on that, though. I don't think anyone is sure about that at this point.

I read that babies are immersed in and comprehending of the emotional climate they exist in. They read our emotions and our emotional states as it is the way they understand before developing other methods. I've read that babies who are not shown love become sick and even die. Also, babies are fused to their environments in the sense that they do not realize they are separate beings from their mother until around 18 months of age. They see their mother and environment as extensions of themselves.

Ahnimus

angelica wrote:

I read that babies are immersed in and comprehending of the emotional climate they exist in.

Yup

They read our emotions and our emotional states as it is the way they understand before developing other methods.

Not sure what that means. But babies are very aware, even before birth, they are taking in everything. Though their vision is drastically impaired at birth, they do observe others and begin to formulate a concept of reality

I've read that babies who are not shown love become sick and even die.

Hmm, nope, don't think so. They won't be very happy babies, though. Without any stimulation, they may die. For example if you don't feed them.

Also, babies are fused to their environments in the sense that they do not realize they are separate beings from their mother until around 18 months of age. They see their mother and environment as extensions of themselves.

Not exactly. They don't have the perceptual of reality as an adult, they are even more self-centered than adults. However, I doubt they view reality as an extension of themselves. They are well aware that they have limited control within their environment.

sponger

angelica wrote:

I read that babies are immersed in and comprehending of the emotional climate they exist in. They read our emotions and our emotional states as it is the way they understand before developing other methods. I've read that babies who are not shown love become sick and even die. Also, babies are fused to their environments in the sense that they do not realize they are separate beings from their mother until around 18 months of age. They see their mother and environment as extensions of themselves.

Babies are born knowing that they need to be taken care of, and that's about it. It needs, so it cries to show that it needs.

I think what you're getting at is that babies can sense the emotions of others. This is correct. It can sense when people are happy, sad...etc. But, it doesn't really know what those emotions mean, only how they feel.

For example, if a baby is walking around and then falls on its ass, it first looks toward its mother/father to see what their reaction is before having a reaction of its own. This is assuming that it is not a painful fall.

If the parents have a look of panic on their faces, then the baby will panic. It is mimicking their emotions. But, this is because it is trying to relate to its parents, not because it really feels that way.

This is evident in the fact that genetics are considered to be the code for personality traits as well as the more commonly known traits such as physical characteristics.

As you probably already know, babies are born with more brain matter than it needs. How much of that brain matter is kept all depends on how often that brain is being stimulated. If the baby is not being intellectually stimulated, it will lose brain matter.

That is why you hear of babies who die when they are not being loved. Parental interaction is considered the most stimulating activity for a baby's brain. Studies have shown that human interaction is a more reliable factor in determining intelligence than any "baby genius" video or "educational" board game.

So, if the baby is not being "loved", it is not being stimulated. The brain loses matter at an increased rate, and it is possible that the immune system will follow suit.

An example of this is a case of some eastern bloc child I saw a documentary on a while back. Her mother had kept her in a room by herself ever since she was born. As a result, her brain did not bother to keep most of its cognitive functions. It became underdeveloped and she now has a brain that is significantly smaller in size than a normal brain for someone her age.

Ahnimus

I've yet to see evidence that a baby will die if it's not "loved". There are plenty of cases where babies were not loved and didn't die. SIDS is not a result of lack of love.

sponger

Ahnimus wrote:

I've yet to see evidence that a baby will die if it's not "loved". There are plenty of cases where babies were not loved and didn't die. SIDS is not a result of lack of love.

Neither have I, but I was giving her the beenfit of the doubt. Truthfully, however, the brain does essentially "die" if the baby is not being loved.

Ahnimus

sponger wrote:

Neither have I, but I was giving her the beenfit of the doubt. Truthfully, however, the brain does essentially "die" if the baby is not being loved.

I agree that the brain will essentially die if the baby is not being stimulated wether positively or negatively. There is a lot of evidence to support that.

But love is only one kind of stimulation.

gue_barium

Ahnimus wrote:

I agree that the brain will essentially die if the baby is not being stimulated wether positively or negatively. There is a lot of evidence to support that.

But love is only one kind of stimulation.

Love as intellectual. Interesting, Ahnimus.

Well,




























not really.


You big doof you.

Ahnimus

gue_barium wrote:

Love as intellectual. Interesting, Ahnimus.

Well,

not really.


You big doof you.

Huh?

sponger

Yes, in terms of a baby's brain, love = intellectual stimulation. Love in this sense is plain old fashion interaction. Of course, yelling and insults are also interaction. But, I would think that the baby would then develop nervousness, which could stunt development in some form or another.

Happiness can have a profound effect on a person's well-being.

gue_barium

Ahnimus wrote:

Huh?

Hello Ahnimus. I'm coming to you from the beginning of time. At least that what my Mom says.

I'm paddling my canoe over the the river Ego. This river is not characteristic of the fluid water you know, it is made of stars. Galaxies rise and fall with each paddlestroke, echoing, echoing, echoing.

I love you, man.

Ahnimus

gue_barium wrote:

Hello Ahnimus. I'm coming to you from the beginning of time. At least that what my Mom says.

I'm paddling my canoe over the the river Ego. This river is not characteristic of the fluid water you know, it is made of stars. Galaxies rise and fall with each paddlestroke, echoing, echoing, echoing.

I love you, man.

Hey, I'm not very good at reading poetry and that. I have no idea what you are saying.

Ahnimus

sponger wrote:

Yes, in terms of a baby's brain, love = intellectual stimulation. Love in this sense is plain old fashion interaction. Of course, yelling and insults are also interaction. But, I would think that the baby would then develop nervousness, which could stunt development in some form or another.

Happiness can have a profound effect on a person's well-being.

Absolutely a baby that does not get proper positive stimulation (Love) will learn to evoke negative stimulation to compensate. Or perhaps develope some kind of self-esteem complex. I just don't think a baby would in fact die if it only received negative stimulation from the care-giver.

sponger

Ahnimus wrote:

Absolutely a baby that does not get proper positive stimulation (Love) will learn to evoke negative stimulation to compensate. Or perhaps develope some kind of self-esteem complex. I just don't think a baby would in fact die if it only received negative stimulation from the care-giver.

I don't think it would die either. What I'm talking about is retention of brain matter. Whether that retention results from positive or negative stimulation is something I am not aware of.

Ahnimus

sponger wrote:

I don't think it would die either. What I'm talking about is retention of brain matter. Whether that retention results from positive or negative stimulation is something I am not aware of.

My understanding is that retention results from any kind of stimulation.

A study performed put newborn monkeys in a dark room, the monkey never perceived light. They were later found to be blind.

Had the monkeys seen any form of light, anything at all, they could have developed a working visual cortex, V1, V2 and V4 regions. I would assume that a baby that was never loved wouldn't know how to love, but they would still have an amygdala, the emotional center of the brain.

catefrances

about the baby thing. at the moment my 3 month old granddaughter lives in my house. she cries when she wants something. she cries because she can not tell us what she wants. we, as her caregivers must decipher it for ourselves through a process of elimination. she also vocalises like she is trying to tell us something and we respond to her when she does so as if we were ahving aconversation with her. she cries when we leave her alone. she wants to held all the time (which of course we can not do). but if we soothe her by touching and talking with her then she is fine. she gets the reassurance she needs that she is not being left alone entirely.
you can say the most obscene and disparaging things to an infant and if you say it in a pleasing voice they smile. they are responding to both your vocal tone and physical tone.
it is my opinion after 20 years of watching my own children and those around me that babies are born knowing nothing, except perhaps how to suck. all they came to be, is learned behaviour through the living experience. just as baby birds have the ability to fly they nonetheless have to learn to fly in order to survive. likewise human babies must learn walk and talk if they are able, in order to survive. if they are uanble to walk and talk then they must be shown alternatives.

gue_barium

Ahnimus wrote:

Absolutely a baby that does not get proper positive stimulation (Love) will learn to evoke negative stimulation to compensate. Or perhaps develope some kind of self-esteem complex. I just don't think a baby would in fact die if it only received negative stimulation from the care-giver.

There are, in fact, reported cases, of such concentric, ego-involved, within a tribe, as to cause the death of a younger person just by a certain condemnatative word.

*I think I made a new word there.

It is written, I have read about it. Early English explorers in 19th century Africa.

Ahnimus

catefrances wrote:

about the baby thing. at the moment my 3 month old granddaughter lives in my house. she cries when she wants something. she cries because she can not tell us what she wants. we, as her caregivers must decipher it for ourselves through a process of elimination. she also vocalises like she is trying to tell us something and we respond to her when she does so as if we were ahving aconversation with her. she cries when we leave her alone. she wants to held all the time (which of course we can not do). but if we soothe her by touching and talking with her then she is fine. she gets the reassurance she needs that she is not being left alone entirely.
you can say the most obscene and disparaging things to an infant and if you say it in a pleasing voice they smile. they are responding to both your vocal tone and physical tone.
it is my opinion after 20 years of watching my own children and those around me that babies are born knowing nothing, except perhaps how to suck. all they came to be, is learned behaviour through the living experience. just as baby birds have the ability to fly they nonetheless have to learn to fly in order to survive. likewise human babies must learn walk and talk if they are able, in order to survive. if they are uanble to walk and talk then they must be shown alternatives.

That's interesting that you mention sucking. It's called a reflex action I believe. There are several of them, like kicking the feet, this is almost universal amongst babies. They seem to share innate behaviors, I believe they are called reflex actions, because they aren't like complex behaviors. They also go through stages. I'll have to look it up later on.

Ahnimus

gue_barium wrote:

There are, in fact, reported cases, of such concentric, ego-involved, within a tribe, as to cause the death of a younger person just by a certain condemnatative word.

*I think I made a new word there.

It is written, I have read about it. Early English explorers in 19th century Africa.

I'd be skeptical of that, but if you can find a source, I'll have a look at it.

catefrances

Ahnimus wrote:

That's interesting that you mention sucking. It's called a reflex action I believe. There are several of them, like kicking the feet, this is almost universal amongst babies. They seem to share innate behaviors, I believe they are called reflex actions, because they aren't like complex behaviors. They also go through stages. I'll have to look it up later on.

interesting that those so called reflex actions are actions that babies do in utero.
and yes we all know babies go through stages. as they acquire one skill they go on to accomplish a more complex skill. one can not run before one learns to walk, so to speak. my son never crawled in the conventional sense. he would pull himself along the ground like a little commando going under the razor wire. he was never on his hands and knees. when he was ten months old he started to walk.
sucking is a skill a baby requires in order to survive. i wouldn't call it a reflex. all mammals need to suckle to survive.