What is God?

Byrnzie

angelica wrote:

I'm guessing you are familiar with Stanislov Grof and his extensive experiments with LSD. And his mind-boggling understandings of non-ordinary states of consciousness. And how he eventually found non-pharmacological means of accessing the same states?

I confess to not knowing this dude, although the name rings a bell. I'll check him out. Along with Stuart Wilde, I'll add him to my list of New Years things to do/read.

angelica

Byrnzie wrote:

I think that connecting with this underlying reality requires a profound effort of concentration (or some damn good drugs! DMT for instance! ). Although this energy is what infuses us, we're a bit like the man in Plato's cave with his back to the world looking at shadows on the cave wall and believing that what he's seeing is 'reality'. There are different ways of accessing higher states of consciousness and visionary states of mind, although I'm not sure that any modern Christians have any idea about this. Gnostic christians, on the other hand, believed in, and practised ways of experiencing 'God' firsthand through the medium of trance and meditation.

If you are talking in terms of "enlightening" experiences, or direct experiences with this energy, yes, it takes exceptional circumstances to get there. (tuning to non-consensual frequencies by some method, for sure) I definitely agree we're in the cave for the most part, taking the shadows to be real. At the same time, the brilliance in Jesus' word was that this energy is the parent of our thought word and deed--our Father, so to speak. And therefore we are one with it and CAN tap it at any moment, merely by believing in it. Now we could debate on whether or not Jesus actually existed. It's a moot point for me, for it's the "spirit" of the message that is meaningful to me, and I have had varying experiences that have shown me how we can simply and easily access and personalize this non-personal energy at any and all times. And that it's our birthright to do so.

For example, I had a deceased friend come to me once, and he showed me experientially how to tap this energy--that I can just by knowing I am. What freaked me out is that we have tuned out value in life and therefore many of us don't realize we ARE this energy. I used to go to great lengths to tap this energy, but by this spiritual experience, I came to know that all I have to do is 'know'. Because I had such a unique otherworldly experience, I KNEW I could actively do so. People in church, or who don't have the direct access take this on faith--and also based on an inner resonating to the idea. Our intuition is the part of us that knows it's connection to this energy, and when we feel ourselves resonating with truth on a deeper level, many trust that. Rightly so.

Now granted, this non-direct knowing is different than direct knowing. There is much more room for doubt and separation and therefore bad action or "sin". Evil is the word live spelled backwards. Those who have this indirect knowing don't "know" to the degree of becoming en-Lightened. Therefore their behaviours will be at the level of where they are, and not necessarily where their faith is. This is normal and par for the course, considering they are bridging this consciousness gap based on faith, rather than understanding. And contrarily, since you are seemingly quite well-read in this area, I'm thinking you are more similar to me. For one, I can see you have a natural high intuition, and yet it looks like you need to understand and not just 'trust'. Many are other-wise predisposed though, and I can see the validity to their experiences. And, I am actively aware of my intuned-ness to this energy throughout the day. It shows me things and interacts with me. It reveals itself in meaningful coincidences that regularly humble me by how amazing they are--all because I have personalized this source and returned it's value to my life, beyond my one-time imagined delusion of separation.

angelica

Byrnzie wrote:

I confess to not knowing this dude, although the name rings a bell. I'll check him out. Along with Stuart Wilde, I'll add him to my list of New Years things to do/read.

Cool. I think I got most of my knowledge of him from "The Holographic Universe" where they go on about his years of experiments with people and LSD. You may not like Stuart Wilde. He's a bit "out there". Or maybe you will.

On Grof and where he talks about LSD and what you referred to regarding tapping non-consensual experiences: http://www.lightparty.com/Spirituality/LSD.html
"What he found were some highly unusual experiences - including encounters with archetypal beings, visits to mythological realms of various cultures, past incarnation memories, extrasensory perception and episodes of out-of-body states - that could not be described by the narrow and superficial conceptual model used in academic psychology. Convinced that such experiences were not simply drug- induced, but rather represented natural and normal manifestations of the deeper dynamics of the human psyche, Grof saw the need for a much larger cartography of the psyche than had previously been allowed. This, he felt, would not only require revision of our ideas about the human mind, but revision of traditional beliefs about the nature of reality. ...

What's most important, at least on a social level, is the need to recognize there is an extremely powerful drive in human nature for transcendence. The need for a transcendental experience is stronger than sex. If you study history, you find that every other culture, except the industrial civilization, honored it. They had rituals and technologies for people to access transcendental experiences in a socially-sanctioned framework, in the context of rituals, ceremonies and so on."

and about naturally reproducing the same LSD type experiences: "My wife and I developed holotropic breathwork, where the whole spectrum of psychedelic experience can be induced by very simple methods." http://www.healthy.net/scr/interview.asp?Id=200

Byrnzie

angelica wrote:

Cool. I think I got most of my knowledge of him from "The Holographic Universe" where they go on about his years of experiments with people and LSD. You may not like Stuart Wilde. He's a bit "out there". Or maybe you will.

On Grof and where he talks about LSD and what you referred to regarding tapping non-consensual experiences: http://www.lightparty.com/Spirituality/LSD.html
"What he found were some highly unusual experiences - including encounters with archetypal beings, visits to mythological realms of various cultures, past incarnation memories, extrasensory perception and episodes of out-of-body states - that could not be described by the narrow and superficial conceptual model used in academic psychology. Convinced that such experiences were not simply drug- induced, but rather represented natural and normal manifestations of the deeper dynamics of the human psyche, Grof saw the need for a much larger cartography of the psyche than had previously been allowed. This, he felt, would not only require revision of our ideas about the human mind, but revision of traditional beliefs about the nature of reality. ...

What's most important, at least on a social level, is the need to recognize there is an extremely powerful drive in human nature for transcendence. The need for a transcendental experience is stronger than sex. If you study history, you find that every other culture, except the industrial civilization, honored it. They had rituals and technologies for people to access transcendental experiences in a socially-sanctioned framework, in the context of rituals, ceremonies and so on."

and about naturally reproducing the same LSD type experiences: "My wife and I developed holotropic breathwork, where the whole spectrum of psychedelic experience can be induced by very simple methods." http://www.healthy.net/scr/interview.asp?Id=200

I knew it rang a bell. I read 'The holographic universe' years ago. It is such a great book. I'll need to reaquaint myself with it.

dunkman

Byrnzie... you do realise that Angelica is a hottie... well I was thinking if you hold the mistletoe above us I'll do the deed

I've enjoyed reading this thread, even though its way below me in terms of its intellectual meanderings... i think i've dumbed myself down enough to comprehend the poor philosophies on offer... so if you'll excuse me i have to go put my witty retorts on the "who'd make the best cake? Matt or Jeff" thread on the Porch


:cool:

Byrnzie

dunkman1974 wrote:

Byrnzie... you do realise that Angelica is a hottie... well I was thinking if you hold the mistletoe above us I'll do the deed

What? You wanna kiss me? :eek:



And yeah, she is a hottie! A hottie with a brain and soul. You don't find many of them around. Canada should be proud. :cool:

dunkman

Byrnzie wrote:

Canada should be proud. :cool:

come now... lets not get carried away


and i didnt mean 'come now' literally...

Byrnzie

dunkman1974 wrote:

come now... lets not get carried away


and i didnt mean 'come now' literally...

Too late!

dunkman

Byrnzie wrote:

Too late!

I was going to post that very same thing a moment earlier... but i see you suffer from premature interjection!

angelica

Oh man, you guys are slaying me!! There's some serious laughing out loud going on over here!!

dunkman

angelica wrote:

Oh man, you guys are slaying me!! There's some serious laughing out loud going on over here!!

its a shame that you didnt miss off the 's' from 'slaying' there

Byrnzie

dunkman1974 wrote:

I was going to post that very same thing a moment earlier... but i see you suffer from premature interjection!

You can use the mistletoe to clean my mess off your trousers. You were a sloppy kisser anyway! :( :eek:

angelica

dunkman1974 wrote:

its a shame that you didnt miss off the 's' from 'slaying' there

Yiiikkes!!! And I was hyper aware of wording my post in a way that it couldn't be misconstrued with impropriety! Curses! I like being the center of attention, but not quite in that way!!

angelica

Hey, where'd everybody go??? Was it something I said?? .... Or was it the shame of such bawdy behaviour in the "God-thread"?

dunkman

angelica wrote:

Yiiikkes!!! And I was hyper aware of wording my post in a way that it couldn't be misconstrued with impropriety!!!

i find innuendo in everything... :cool:

except coffins...

Byrnzie

angelica wrote:

Hey, where'd everybody go??? Was it something I said?? .... Or was it the shame of such bawdy behaviour in the "God-thread"?

Actually I was thinking of a witty reply but everything I thought of involved an image of Dunkman naked, and so in the end I just upped and scarpered! :rolleyes:

angelica

Byrnzie wrote:

Actually I was thinking of a witty reply but everything I thought of involved an image of Dunkman naked, and so in the end I just upped and scarpered! :rolleyes:

It was so cute seeing the two of you getting all worked up in the thread, only to both "happen" to disappear at the same time. And THEN to show up again at the same time. It makes me feel almost irrelevent. :(

angelica

dunkman1974 wrote:

i find innuendo in everything... :cool:

Yeah, what is that you're always harping on about....testosterone? I get that innuendo thing about you, though, as my words echo around in my head from different perspectives in these conversations. I'm surprised you let "bawdy" go, though. That one I realized the potential for in hindsight.;)

Byrnzie

angelica wrote:

It was so cute seeing the two of you getting all worked up in the thread, only to both "happen" to disappear at the same time. And THEN to show up again at the same time. It makes me feel almost irrelevent. :(

Well, ahem...us..err..men..have..errm..needs, young lady! :eek:

Edit: And I was holding mistletoe over our heads afterall!

2nd Edit: This is so wrong! See what effect you have Angelica! :mad: :rolleyes:

angelica

Byrnzie wrote:

Well, ahem...us..err..men..have..errm..needs, young lady! :eek:

Edit: And I was holding mistletoe over our heads afterall!

2nd Edit: This is so wrong! See what effect you have Angelica! :mad: :rolleyes:

hahaha!

(nice redeeming yourself with the "Angelica effect" comment.;) You're a smooth one, I see! )