again, are you going to address what you're talking about or are you just going to post 666 in other languages?
As long as you are going to conveniently change words and pick and choose metaphors, then what I say is irrelevant.
Why are some passages metaphorical and others not?
Why is Noah a metaphorical story, but Christ is not?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Religion believes at "death" the soul leaves the body...or the soul leaving the body is what death is...but with new science doctors are seeing our body for what it is physically: trillions of living cells still alive after consciousness is lost or "death has occurred"
"In an emergency department, you work like mad for half an hour on someone whose heart stopped, and finally someone says, 'I don't think we're going to get this guy back,' and then you just stop," Becker says. The body on the cart is dead, but its trillions of cells are all still alive. Becker wants to resolve that paradox in favor of life."
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
Nice condescension. Way to resort to personal attacks because you can't adequately defend your religious lies.
actually you were the one who originally attacked my beliefs. calling it lies and telling me that i am infecting society by it, that's pretty harsh stuff dude... no matter how you put it. you seem very confident that what you have is the truth, and i'm sure it is, but only for you. you said that i was infecting society with my beliefs as if i am the reason for poverty, sickness and pretty much every bad stuff you can think of. maybe that's not what you meant, but that's what you made it sound like. i wasn't attacking you. nor was i condescending you. i'm only trying to make you realize how you try so hard so much to try and make people believe the way you do. ahnimus, from the bottom of my heart, i love you. now let's make out. i'm sorry if i said you needed an assessment for behavioral health.
This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
actually you were the one who originally attacked my beliefs. calling it lies and telling me that i am infecting society by it, that's pretty harsh stuff dude... no matter how you put it. you seem very confident that what you have is the truth, and i'm sure it is, but only for you. you said that i was infecting society with my beliefs as if i am the reason for poverty, sickness and pretty much every bad stuff you can think of. maybe that's not what you meant, but that's what you made it sound like. i wasn't attacking you. nor was i condescending you. i'm only trying to make you realize how you try so hard so much to try and make people believe the way you do. ahnimus, from the bottom of my heart, i love you. now let's make out. i'm sorry if i said you needed an assessment for behavioral health.
Make-out? You must be a woman. In which case, why not?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
As long as you are going to conveniently change words and pick and choose metaphors, then what I say is irrelevant.
Why are some passages metaphorical and others not?
Why is Noah a metaphorical story, but Christ is not?
i'm not conveniently changing words, I'm telling you the accurate translation that biblical scholars use...if i could find a wiki source for you I'd use it
I don't believe the Noah story is metaphorical.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
Why are some passages metaphorical and others not?
there are different types of book in the bible. There is history, poetry, prophetic literature contained in the bible. You have to read each individual book in the correct context and in the apporpriate genre. Again, that is why true Bible study is very difficult. It requires having other references to rely on to help with reading / interpreting.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
there are different types of book in the bible. There is history, poetry, prophetic literature contained in the bible. You have to read each individual book in the correct context and in the apporpriate genre. Again, that is why true Bible study is very difficult. It requires having other references to rely on to help with reading / interpreting.
you are going the long way around if you're going to be throwing this to ahnimus. trust me.
This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
there are different types of book in the bible. There is history, poetry, prophetic literature contained in the bible. You have to read each individual book in the correct context and in the apporpriate genre. Again, that is why true Bible study is very difficult. It requires having other references to rely on to help with reading / interpreting.
Who makes these determinations? Why can't the whole damn thing be an anthropomorphism?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Who makes these determinations? Why can't the whole damn thing be an anthropomorphism?
b/c i said so. Seems to work for your opinions and what you say.
I'm not getting into this with you. I've told you places to look for information if you're really interested in it; I'm not getting sucked into another debate where we can find out who can cut and paste more, b/c you'll win that contest.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
Oh, by zee way, Noah's ark was originally alot older
7 days!
[edit] Mesopotamian flood stories
The majority of modern Biblical scholars accept the thesis that the Biblical flood story is linked to a cycle of Assyro-Babylonian mythology with which it shares many features. The Mesopotamian flood-myth had a very long currency—the last known retelling dates from the 3rd century BC. A substantial number of the original Sumerian, Akkadian and Assyrian texts, written in cuneiform, have been recovered by archaeologists, but the task of recovering more tablets continues, as does the translation of extant tablets.
The earliest of these extant tablets, the epic of Atrahasis, can be dated by colophon (scribal identification) to the reign of Hammurabi's great-grandson, Ammi-Saduqa (1646–1626 BC). Written in Akkadian (the language of ancient Babylon), it tells how the god Enki warns the hero Atrahasis ("Extremely Wise") of Shuruppak to dismantle his house (which is made of reeds) and build a boat to escape a flood with which the god Enlil, angered by the noise of the cities, plans to wipe out mankind. The boat is to have a roof "like Apsu" (the underworld ocean of freshwater of which Enki is lord), upper and lower decks, and must be sealed with bitumen. Atrahasis boards the boat with his family and animals and seals the door. The storm and flood begin. Even the gods are afraid. "Bodies clog the river like dragonflies." After seven days the flood ends and Atrahasis offers sacrifices. Enlil is furious, but Enki, the friend of mankind, defies him - "I made sure life was preserved" - and eventually Enki and Enlil agree on other measures for controlling the human population. The story also exists in a later Assyrian version.[20]
The story of Ziusudra is told in the Sumerian language in the fragmentary Eridu Genesis, which can be dated from its script to the late 17th century BC. It tells how Enki warns Ziusudra (meaning "he saw life," in reference to the gift of immortality given him by the gods), king of Shuruppak, of the gods' decision to destroy mankind with a flood—the passage describing why the gods have decided this is lost. Enki instructs Ziusudra to build a large boat—the text describing the instructions is also lost. After a flood of seven days, Ziusudra makes appropriate sacrifices and prostrations to An (sky-god) and Enlil (chief of the gods), and is given eternal life in Dilmun, the Sumerian Eden.[21]
The story of Utnapishtim (a translation of "Ziusudra" into Akkadian), an episode in the Babylonian Epic of Gilgamesh, is known from first millennium copies and is probably derived from the Atrahasis story.[22][23] Ellil, (the equivalent of Enlil), chief of the gods, wishes to destroy mankind with a flood. Utnapishtim, king of Shurrupak, is warned by the god Ea (equivalent to Enki) to tear down his house of reeds and use the materials to build an ark and load it with gold, silver, and the seed of all living creatures and all his craftsmen. After a storm lasting seven days, and a further twelve days on the waters, the ship grounds on Mount Nizir; after seven more days Utnapishtim sends out a dove, which returns, then a swallow, which also returns, and finally a raven, which does not come back. Utnapishtim then makes offerings (by sevens) to the gods, and the gods smell the roasting meat and gather "like flies." Ellil is angry that any human has escaped, but Ea upbraids him, saying, "How couldst thou without thought send a deluge? On the sinner let his sin rest, on the wrongdoer rest his misdeed. Forbear, let it not be done, have mercy, [That men perish not]." Utnapishtim and his wife are then given the gift of immortality and sent to dwell "afar off at the mouth of the rivers."[24]
In the 3rd century BC Berossus, a high priest of the temple of Marduk in Babylon, wrote a history of Mesopotamia in Greek for Antiochus Soter (323–261 BC). Berossus's Babyloniaka has not survived, but the 3rd/4th century Christian historian Eusebius retells from it the legend of Xisuthrus, the Greek version of Ziusudra, and essentially the same story. Eusebius concludes that the vessel was still to be seen "in the Corcyræan Mountains of Armenia; and the people scrape off the bitumen, with which it had been outwardly coated, and make use of it by way of an alexipharmic and amulet."[25]
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
b/c i said so. Seems to work for your opinions and what you say.
I'm not getting into this with you. I've told you places to look for information if you're really interested in it; I'm not getting sucked into another debate where we can find out who can cut and paste more, b/c you'll win that contest.
i told you.
This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
b/c i said so. Seems to work for your opinions and what you say.
I'm not getting into this with you. I've told you places to look for information if you're really interested in it; I'm not getting sucked into another debate where we can find out who can cut and paste more, b/c you'll win that contest.
Dude, I always back my posts up, you are the one that never answers my questions, lol.
Find yourself a mirror to bitch at.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
the writers themselves did. that was their original intention.
Really, well I've read the Bible and don't remember that. Certainly they lied about Noah's Ark, Adam and Eve, the Caduceus, etc..
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Dude, I always back my posts up, you are the one that never answers my questions, lol.
Find yourself a mirror to bitch at.
if you disagree with my answers it doesn't mean I don't answer them and sometimes I don't have time to go back to see if you've asked a question b/c quite frankly, this board and appeasing you isn't near the top of my priority list.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
if you disagree with my answers it doesn't mean I don't answer them and sometimes I don't have time to go back to see if you've asked a question b/c quite frankly, this board and appeasing you isn't near the top of my priority list.
I asked before how to you take literally the Noah's Ark story, when it's nearly identical to several stories prior to Christianity, dating back as far as 1800 B.C.E.
Honestly, if all these Gods flooded the earth, there wouldn't be much left.
Shit, the earth was flooded before Yahweh even created it.
I also aksed, if you have religious experiences, how do you know your not tryp'ing?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Really, well I've read the Bible and don't remember that. Certainly they lied about Noah's Ark, Adam and Eve, the Caduceus, etc..
if you've read it than you understand this simple little concept. it's not theology or anything.
read songs of solomons and you know that it's poetry. read i corinthians and you know that it is a letter. read revelations and you know that it is a prophetic book. read whatever your favorite book it is your reading and if it's about psychology. then what do you guess???? it's a book about psychology. go figure.
This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
if you've read it than you understand this simple little concept. it's not theology or anything.
read songs of solomons and you know that it's poetry. read i corinthians and you know that it is a letter. read revelations and you know that it is a prophetic book. read whatever your favorite book it is your reading and if it's about psychology. then what do you guess???? it's a book about psychology. go figure.
No way man, Solomon's song was a mycology guide for picking Fly Agarius a.k.a. Amanita Muscaria.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Actually I just finished St. Augustine On Free Choice of the Will. And it seems to be about rhetoric.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I asked before how to you take literally the Noah's Ark story, when it's nearly identical to several stories prior to Christianity, dating back as far as 1800 B.C.E.
Honestly, if all these Gods flooded the earth, there wouldn't be much left.
Shit, the earth was flooded before Yahweh even created it.
I also aksed, if you have religious experiences, how do you know your not tryp'ing?
I take it literally b/c I believe the Bible is true...again man, the questions you're asking are good questions, but I sleep, have to keep a girlfriend happy, and finish school, so I'm not going to get into a discussion when we CLEARLY WONT see eye to eye. Call it lazy, that's fine with me.
I guess you'd have to think if you are having a religious experience...i.e, god talking to you. You'd have to evaluate what that message is. If the message is clearly contrary to the preachign of the bible or against his character, it would prob not be god but be a mental disorder. You can't observe some things (i.e. religious experiences) b/c they are personal. So if you want science to explain it, you have to take it as some sort of chemical imbalance etc... If you dont' believe miracles can occur or religous experiences can occur, you have to rationalize them away chemically or by some other physical explanation. I also believe miracles are extremely extremely rare b/c if they happened very frequently it wouldn't be a miracle, rather it would be a possible outcome of some event.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
I take it literally b/c I believe the Bible is true...again man, the questions you're asking are good questions, but I sleep, have to keep a girlfriend happy, and finish school, so I'm not going to get into a discussion when we CLEARLY WONT see eye to eye. Call it lazy, that's fine with me.
I guess you'd have to think if you are having a religious experience...i.e, god talking to you. You'd have to evaluate what that message is. If the message is clearly contrary to the preachign of the bible or against his character, it would prob not be god but be a mental disorder. You can't observe some things (i.e. religious experiences) b/c they are personal. So if you want science to explain it, you have to take it as some sort of chemical imbalance etc... If you dont' believe miracles can occur or religous experiences can occur, you have to rationalize them away chemically or by some other physical explanation. I also believe miracles are extremely extremely rare b/c if they happened very frequently it wouldn't be a miracle, rather it would be a possible outcome of some event.
Do you think maybe the ancients couldn't explain it rationally, so they passed it off as miraculous?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Do you think maybe the ancients couldn't explain it rationally, so they passed it off as miraculous?
sure it's possible. But some things..i.e walking on water is clearly something that people wouldn't be confused about. People back 4000 years ago were just as intelligent as we are today, they just didn't have as much to be smart about. But they were perfectly capable thinking and analytic creatures. I went to an ancient egypt medical treatment display in NYC and some of the treatments they used (at least for musculoskeletal issues) were somewhat similar in theory to what we use today; we just have more at our disposal now. i have no idea where that bit came from
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
sure it's possible. But some things..i.e walking on water is clearly something that people wouldn't be confused about. People back 4000 years ago were just as intelligent as we are today, they just didn't have as much to be smart about. But they were perfectly capable thinking and analytic creatures. I went to an ancient egypt medical treatment display in NYC and some of the treatments they used (at least for musculoskeletal issues) were somewhat similar in theory to what we use today; we just have more at our disposal now. i have no idea where that bit came from
Yea, but Krishna and Horus also walked on water. The sun walks on water.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Yea, but Krishna and Horus also walked on water. The sun walks on water.
I guess it works out for me that i don't believe in those god's. The sun doesn't walk on water, it appears to drop in to water but we now know, thanks to science, that it doesn't.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
I guess it works out for me that i don't believe in those god's. The sun doesn't walk on water, it appears to drop in to water but we now know, thanks to science, that it doesn't.
No, I mean the light from the sun reflects or 'walks' on the water.
So, what you are suggesting, is that the people who observed Jesus walk on water were entirely sane, while those that observed Krishna and Horus walk on water were psychotic?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Comments
again, are you going to address what you're talking about or are you just going to post 666 in other languages?
As long as you are going to conveniently change words and pick and choose metaphors, then what I say is irrelevant.
Why are some passages metaphorical and others not?
Why is Noah a metaphorical story, but Christ is not?
"In an emergency department, you work like mad for half an hour on someone whose heart stopped, and finally someone says, 'I don't think we're going to get this guy back,' and then you just stop," Becker says. The body on the cart is dead, but its trillions of cells are all still alive. Becker wants to resolve that paradox in favor of life."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18368186/site/newsweek?GT1=9951
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
Make-out? You must be a woman. In which case, why not?
I don't believe the Noah story is metaphorical.
there are different types of book in the bible. There is history, poetry, prophetic literature contained in the bible. You have to read each individual book in the correct context and in the apporpriate genre. Again, that is why true Bible study is very difficult. It requires having other references to rely on to help with reading / interpreting.
Who makes these determinations? Why can't the whole damn thing be an anthropomorphism?
b/c i said so. Seems to work for your opinions and what you say.
I'm not getting into this with you. I've told you places to look for information if you're really interested in it; I'm not getting sucked into another debate where we can find out who can cut and paste more, b/c you'll win that contest.
7 days!
[edit] Mesopotamian flood stories
The majority of modern Biblical scholars accept the thesis that the Biblical flood story is linked to a cycle of Assyro-Babylonian mythology with which it shares many features. The Mesopotamian flood-myth had a very long currency—the last known retelling dates from the 3rd century BC. A substantial number of the original Sumerian, Akkadian and Assyrian texts, written in cuneiform, have been recovered by archaeologists, but the task of recovering more tablets continues, as does the translation of extant tablets.
The earliest of these extant tablets, the epic of Atrahasis, can be dated by colophon (scribal identification) to the reign of Hammurabi's great-grandson, Ammi-Saduqa (1646–1626 BC). Written in Akkadian (the language of ancient Babylon), it tells how the god Enki warns the hero Atrahasis ("Extremely Wise") of Shuruppak to dismantle his house (which is made of reeds) and build a boat to escape a flood with which the god Enlil, angered by the noise of the cities, plans to wipe out mankind. The boat is to have a roof "like Apsu" (the underworld ocean of freshwater of which Enki is lord), upper and lower decks, and must be sealed with bitumen. Atrahasis boards the boat with his family and animals and seals the door. The storm and flood begin. Even the gods are afraid. "Bodies clog the river like dragonflies." After seven days the flood ends and Atrahasis offers sacrifices. Enlil is furious, but Enki, the friend of mankind, defies him - "I made sure life was preserved" - and eventually Enki and Enlil agree on other measures for controlling the human population. The story also exists in a later Assyrian version.[20]
The story of Ziusudra is told in the Sumerian language in the fragmentary Eridu Genesis, which can be dated from its script to the late 17th century BC. It tells how Enki warns Ziusudra (meaning "he saw life," in reference to the gift of immortality given him by the gods), king of Shuruppak, of the gods' decision to destroy mankind with a flood—the passage describing why the gods have decided this is lost. Enki instructs Ziusudra to build a large boat—the text describing the instructions is also lost. After a flood of seven days, Ziusudra makes appropriate sacrifices and prostrations to An (sky-god) and Enlil (chief of the gods), and is given eternal life in Dilmun, the Sumerian Eden.[21]
The story of Utnapishtim (a translation of "Ziusudra" into Akkadian), an episode in the Babylonian Epic of Gilgamesh, is known from first millennium copies and is probably derived from the Atrahasis story.[22][23] Ellil, (the equivalent of Enlil), chief of the gods, wishes to destroy mankind with a flood. Utnapishtim, king of Shurrupak, is warned by the god Ea (equivalent to Enki) to tear down his house of reeds and use the materials to build an ark and load it with gold, silver, and the seed of all living creatures and all his craftsmen. After a storm lasting seven days, and a further twelve days on the waters, the ship grounds on Mount Nizir; after seven more days Utnapishtim sends out a dove, which returns, then a swallow, which also returns, and finally a raven, which does not come back. Utnapishtim then makes offerings (by sevens) to the gods, and the gods smell the roasting meat and gather "like flies." Ellil is angry that any human has escaped, but Ea upbraids him, saying, "How couldst thou without thought send a deluge? On the sinner let his sin rest, on the wrongdoer rest his misdeed. Forbear, let it not be done, have mercy, [That men perish not]." Utnapishtim and his wife are then given the gift of immortality and sent to dwell "afar off at the mouth of the rivers."[24]
In the 3rd century BC Berossus, a high priest of the temple of Marduk in Babylon, wrote a history of Mesopotamia in Greek for Antiochus Soter (323–261 BC). Berossus's Babyloniaka has not survived, but the 3rd/4th century Christian historian Eusebius retells from it the legend of Xisuthrus, the Greek version of Ziusudra, and essentially the same story. Eusebius concludes that the vessel was still to be seen "in the Corcyræan Mountains of Armenia; and the people scrape off the bitumen, with which it had been outwardly coated, and make use of it by way of an alexipharmic and amulet."[25]
Dude, I always back my posts up, you are the one that never answers my questions, lol.
Find yourself a mirror to bitch at.
Really, well I've read the Bible and don't remember that. Certainly they lied about Noah's Ark, Adam and Eve, the Caduceus, etc..
if you disagree with my answers it doesn't mean I don't answer them and sometimes I don't have time to go back to see if you've asked a question b/c quite frankly, this board and appeasing you isn't near the top of my priority list.
I asked before how to you take literally the Noah's Ark story, when it's nearly identical to several stories prior to Christianity, dating back as far as 1800 B.C.E.
Honestly, if all these Gods flooded the earth, there wouldn't be much left.
Shit, the earth was flooded before Yahweh even created it.
I also aksed, if you have religious experiences, how do you know your not tryp'ing?
read songs of solomons and you know that it's poetry. read i corinthians and you know that it is a letter. read revelations and you know that it is a prophetic book. read whatever your favorite book it is your reading and if it's about psychology. then what do you guess???? it's a book about psychology. go figure.
No way man, Solomon's song was a mycology guide for picking Fly Agarius a.k.a. Amanita Muscaria.
I take it literally b/c I believe the Bible is true...again man, the questions you're asking are good questions, but I sleep, have to keep a girlfriend happy, and finish school, so I'm not going to get into a discussion when we CLEARLY WONT see eye to eye. Call it lazy, that's fine with me.
I guess you'd have to think if you are having a religious experience...i.e, god talking to you. You'd have to evaluate what that message is. If the message is clearly contrary to the preachign of the bible or against his character, it would prob not be god but be a mental disorder. You can't observe some things (i.e. religious experiences) b/c they are personal. So if you want science to explain it, you have to take it as some sort of chemical imbalance etc... If you dont' believe miracles can occur or religous experiences can occur, you have to rationalize them away chemically or by some other physical explanation. I also believe miracles are extremely extremely rare b/c if they happened very frequently it wouldn't be a miracle, rather it would be a possible outcome of some event.
Do you think maybe the ancients couldn't explain it rationally, so they passed it off as miraculous?
no offense, but i hope i NEVER interpret Song of Solomon that way.
sure it's possible. But some things..i.e walking on water is clearly something that people wouldn't be confused about. People back 4000 years ago were just as intelligent as we are today, they just didn't have as much to be smart about. But they were perfectly capable thinking and analytic creatures. I went to an ancient egypt medical treatment display in NYC and some of the treatments they used (at least for musculoskeletal issues) were somewhat similar in theory to what we use today; we just have more at our disposal now. i have no idea where that bit came from
Yea, but Krishna and Horus also walked on water. The sun walks on water.
I guess it works out for me that i don't believe in those god's. The sun doesn't walk on water, it appears to drop in to water but we now know, thanks to science, that it doesn't.
No, I mean the light from the sun reflects or 'walks' on the water.
So, what you are suggesting, is that the people who observed Jesus walk on water were entirely sane, while those that observed Krishna and Horus walk on water were psychotic?